From owner-xj-digest-at-digest.net Mon Dec 11 09:38:51 2000 From: xj-digest xj-digest Monday, December 11 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1015 Forum for Discussion of XJ cherokees and wagoneers Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: xj: Will Trade Bass Boat for stock 80-84 CJ7 Re: xj: Tire size questions... Re: xj: Tire size questions... xj: Parts Donor Found / Misc Issues xj: Stereo wiring xj: stereo wiring Re: xj: Tire size questions... Re: xj: Tire size questions... Re: xj: Tire size questions... Re: xj: Parts Donor Found / Misc Issues xj: Pinging update - can U read these plugs. xj: no more happy dance. :( xj: Re: no more happy dance. :( Re: xj: Re: no more happy dance. :( Re: xj: Parts Donor Found/Misc Issues Re: xj: Tire size questions... xj: Aerial Recon Re: xj: Parts Donor Found/Misc Issues xj: 4.0L radiator in a 2.8L Re: xj: Tire size questions... xj: AW-4 stuck in first. Re: xj: AW-4 stuck in first. Re: xj: AW-4 stuck in first. xj: Re: AW-4 stuck in first. XJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeep/xj/ Send submissions to xj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to xj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to xj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 14:20:11 -0800 (PST) From: "Paul W." Subject: Re: xj: Will Trade Bass Boat for stock 80-84 CJ7 FWIW - If you want a stock Dana 44, that narrows your search down to just late '86 models. Paul Carl Goolsby wrote: > I'm looking for a new project and the wife wants the boat out of the > driveway. > > Would like to locate a stock 85-86 CJ7 with stock Dana 44, little to no rust > and minor to no body damage. Doesn't have to run after all its a project. > Must have title. > > Will trade 1988 16' Challenger Bass Boat with 84 Johnson 70hp outboard and > trolling motor on Shorelander Trailer. Ran good last time out but has been > stored for the past several years so motor will need a tuneup. > > Even trade, will deliver boat within 200 miles of Kansas City or we can > discuss other options for delivery of the vehicles. Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 14:23:14 -0800 (PST) From: "Paul W." Subject: Re: xj: Tire size questions... Well, stock rims come in 6" & 7" widths. IMHO, you can put 10.50's on either one though you may get a little crowning on 6" rims. As for me, I've run 12.50's on OEM 7" alloys with no troubles - and no blown beads either. :^D Paul "Phil M." wrote: > Yes, they'll fit. > Ask Paul W what size he has on his stock rims. :o) > Phil > > > ----Original Message Follows---- > From: cw21773-at-WCUVAX1.WCU.EDU > Hiyas again gang. > I know that you can fit 30X9.5's on stock rims on a stock XJ. What about > 30X10.5's? I imagine that ther would be rubbing during hard turns..what > else? Anyone try this yet > --Chris Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 14:25:57 -0800 (PST) From: "Paul W." Subject: Re: xj: Tire size questions... Oh, forgot to mention, ran 31x10.50's on 7's before too. You will get slight rubbing on the lower control arms, but if that bothers you (doesn't bother me), you can adjust the steering stops on the axle. Paul "Paul W." wrote: > Well, stock rims come in 6" & 7" widths. IMHO, you can put 10.50's on either > one though you may get a little crowning on 6" rims. As for me, I've run > 12.50's on OEM 7" alloys with no troubles - and no blown beads either. :^D > > Paul > > > "Phil M." wrote: > > Yes, they'll fit. > > Ask Paul W what size he has on his stock rims. :o) > > Phil > > > > > > ----Original Message Follows---- > > From: cw21773-at-WCUVAX1.WCU.EDU > > Hiyas again gang. > > I know that you can fit 30X9.5's on stock rims on a stock XJ. What about > > 30X10.5's? I imagine that ther would be rubbing during hard turns..what > > else? Anyone try this yet > > --Chris > Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. > http://shopping.yahoo.com/ Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 14:27:26 -0800 From: "Robert Glover" Subject: xj: Parts Donor Found / Misc Issues I found a donor vehicle to get some parts from for my '84 Cherokee (which has 205k miles, I saw today, now that I actually bothered to pay attention to the odometer). A friend has in their back yard an '85 Commanche with the 2.8 V6 and an automatic. I don't want the motor or trans; I just want the differential(s). Would this truck have a Dana 44 in it? Also, the neighbor who has been driving the Cherokee for the past few months (and is still driving it since I won't be working on it for a while, and her Accord is down needing a clutch) reports that it seems to have an intermittent electrical problem. Everything appears to be intermittent -- the A/C, the stereo, the rear wiper, etc. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. You could have the radio on and working and hit a bump and it'd go out. Or vice versa. So it sounds like a bad ground somewhere. Motor-wise, it seems to leak oil from just about everywhere. I think I read on the off-road.com site that this happens to the 2.5L once it gets enough miles on it. The idle is also erratic... it'll either idle way high, or it'll idle so low that it'll want to stall if you take your foot off the gas (even when driving). BTW, what are the odds that this thing might have a T-5 in it instead of an AX-5? Rob ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 14:57:32 -0800 From: "Phil M." Subject: xj: Stereo wiring Hey all, trying to wire in my new stereo without running new wires to the speakers and tracing everything back to their sources. History: My stereo was stolen and the theives cut the wires past the factory harness so I can't do the simple plug in wiring adapter. I have to hardwire the new one in. My Jeep is a 95 Sport (Chrysler) with a 4 speaker system. I found one place online but it didn't have the wiring for MY particular Jeep. I think the page had the earlier Jeep wiring. Any help anyone could give would be appreciated. Paul, how many months has it been since I haven't had tunes? I'm going crazy listening to myself sing. LOL Phil _____________________________________________________________________________________ Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 18:12:51 -0400 (EDT) From: cw21773-at-WCUVAX1.WCU.EDU Subject: xj: stereo wiring Here's a trick I used in my days as a stereo installer..If you have speakers installed you can use a 9v (or any battery but the 9v is easier to get to the poles) to find out which are speaker wires. If you touch a wire to each pole and you hear a pop from teh speaker you know that those two wires are for that speaker. There is 2 types of power supplied to your stereo. Continuous ans switched. You can use a test light to figure those out. These are the easiest to do so do them first. SOrry for the typos..trying to do this through a shell account. If you have any questions feel free to email me off list - --Chris ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 18:28:35 EST From: S1120-at-aol.com Subject: Re: xj: Tire size questions... In a message dated 12/10/2000 5:26:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, a4xnut-at-yahoo.com writes: << ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 18:28:26 EST From: S1120-at-aol.com Subject: Re: xj: Tire size questions... In a message dated 12/10/2000 5:26:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, a4xnut-at-yahoo.com writes: << you can adjust the steering stops on the axle. >> ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 18:29:52 EST From: S1120-at-aol.com Subject: Re: xj: Tire size questions... In a message dated 12/10/2000 5:26:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, a4xnut-at-yahoo.com writes: << you can adjust the steering stops on the axle. >> You can do that? How? Paul Bradway 86 Cherokee 72 LTD convertible 70 Mustang ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 18:33:00 EST From: S1120-at-aol.com Subject: Re: xj: Parts Donor Found / Misc Issues Check the fuse bow. It does have a standard trans right? If the clutch master cylinder leaks, it will drip on the fuse box, and melt the plastic. Paul Bradway 86 Cherokee 72 LTD convertible 70 Mustang ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 21:25:27 -0400 From: samfans Subject: xj: Pinging update - can U read these plugs. I pulled the plugs today and had a look. they were really wierd - seemed to be "normal" tan colour one side, but the other side had dry black "carbon" deposits, indicating a weak ignition - possibly. Here are the pics and the page from a manual showing what the 2 sides looked like (the top 2 pics on the page outline in red). Can anyone else get a better read on this? Why should the different sides be different? The diagnostic page is from a general type manual - so the diagnosis of weak ignition is not very specific or helpful. Could it be the coil at all? Too much or too little advance? Lack of proper distributor "indexing". It's supposed to be indexed, the guy showed me his cutaway cap, but who knows? The cap rotor plugs wires and distributor are all new, but the coil is old. I will try all the fuel adjustments recommended, but i honestly don;t think it's fuel issue. The plugs and stady vaccum fluctuation are leading me to think ignition - but what specifically i don't know. Bill http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=212612&a=10402131 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 17:40:05 -0800 From: john Subject: xj: no more happy dance. :( from the weather report: Well, looks like the little snow that was out there is over for almost everyone. The front really fell apart as it moved in, and while the door was open for some significant accumulations, we just couldn't get the moisture to go along with the cold air--a testament to just how hard it is to get snow around here. We did get some scattered snow reports around the area--our photographer took some pictures of a snowball fight in Sammamish and we got some other snow video from South Everett--but most other places had just a dusting if anything. __________------ I did get a picture of my Truck in the snow: http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/Dec10-2000-John-n-Marks-Jeeps/ http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/Dec10-2000-John-n-Marks-Jeeps/johnsjeeps-dec10-2000.jpg - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 19:40:52 -0600 From: "Dora, Let's Go Jeepin, Inc." Subject: xj: Re: no more happy dance. :( 8" of snow tomorrow in chicago, predicted. too bad im in front wheel drive with a true trac too :( Dora-ble 97 XJ and TJ Chicago http://www.letsgojeepin.com - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john" To: Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2000 7:40 PM Subject: xj: no more happy dance. :( > from the weather report: > > Well, looks like the little snow that was out there is over for almost > everyone. The front really fell apart as it moved in, and while the door > was open for some significant accumulations, we just couldn't get > the moisture to go along with the cold air--a testament to just how > hard it is > to get snow around here. We did get some scattered snow reports around > the area--our photographer took some pictures of a snowball fight in > Sammamish and we got some other snow video from South Everett--but > most other places had just a dusting if anything. > > __________------ > I did get a picture of my Truck in the snow: > http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/Dec10-2000-John-n-Marks-Jeeps/ > http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/Dec10-2000-John-n-Marks-Jeeps/johnsjeeps-d ec10-2000.jpg > ------------------------------------------------------ > http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ > Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... > jesus, don't leave life without him, please! > ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 20:47:14 -0600 From: Jeff Subject: Re: xj: Re: no more happy dance. :( Ya, Sure, I'm in snow land and all I ever hear lately is "oh, the front went SOUTH! We've got 10 below though. :~) Jeff "Dora, Let's Go Jeepin, Inc." wrote: > > 8" of snow tomorrow in chicago, predicted. > too bad im in front wheel drive with a true trac too :( > > Dora-ble > 97 XJ and TJ > Chicago > http://www.letsgojeepin.com > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "john" > To: > Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2000 7:40 PM > Subject: xj: no more happy dance. :( > > > from the weather report: > > > > Well, looks like the little snow that was out there is over for almost > > everyone. The front really fell apart as it moved in, and while the > door > > was open for some significant accumulations, we just couldn't get > > the moisture to go along with the cold air--a testament to just how > > hard it is > > to get snow around here. We did get some scattered snow reports around > > the area--our photographer took some pictures of a snowball fight in > > Sammamish and we got some other snow video from South Everett--but > > most other places had just a dusting if anything. > > > > __________------ > > I did get a picture of my Truck in the snow: > > http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/Dec10-2000-John-n-Marks-Jeeps/ > > > http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/Dec10-2000-John-n-Marks-Jeeps/johnsjeeps-d > ec10-2000.jpg > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ > > Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... > > jesus, don't leave life without him, please! > > ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 19:36:29 -0800 (PST) From: "Paul W." Subject: Re: xj: Parts Donor Found/Misc Issues Robert Glover wrote: > I found a donor vehicle to get some parts from for my '84 Cherokee (which > has 205k miles, I saw today, now that I actually bothered to pay attention > to the odometer). A friend has in their back yard an '85 Commanche with the > 2.8 V6 and an automatic. I don't want the motor or trans; I just want the > differential(s). Would this truck have a Dana 44 in it? '85 Comanche? Funny, they didn't come out until '86. Anyway, if it IS an '85, it wouldn't have a D44 in it since Jeep didn't start (re)installing D44 rear axles in ANYTHING until mid-86. MJ Comanches have D35 rear axles unless they have the Metric Ton option. Mid-86 up Metric Ton MJ's got the D44, earlier Metric Tons got the HD AMC Model 20 (similar to the ones used in Big Jeeps). > Also, the neighbor who has been driving the Cherokee for the past few months > (and is still driving it since I won't be working on it for a while, and her > Accord is down needing a clutch) reports that it seems to have an > intermittent electrical problem. Everything appears to be intermittent -- > the A/C, the stereo, the rear wiper, etc. Sometimes it works, sometimes it > doesn't. You could have the radio on and working and hit a bump and it'd go > out. Or vice versa. So it sounds like a bad ground somewhere. Yup, sure does. First one I'd check is the ground jumper from the engine to the chassis... if this one is bad (or missing) it will make all kinds of weird things happen. > Motor-wise, it seems to leak oil from just about everywhere. I think I read > on the off-road.com site that this happens to the 2.5L once it gets enough > miles on it. The idle is also erratic... it'll either idle way high, or > it'll idle so low that it'll want to stall if you take your foot off the gas > (even when driving). It has probably worn out all its seals. Fresh valve cover & oil pan gaskets and front and rear seals will probably go a long way to keeping the slick stuff on the inside - instead of the built-in, automatic anti-rust program it has now. > BTW, what are the odds that this thing might have a T-5 in it instead of an > AX-5? Probably pretty good... but you also stand a good chance of having a Peugeot BA-5. If the tranny case splits horizontally, you have the French Curse. Paul Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 19:38:11 -0800 (PST) From: "Paul W." Subject: Re: xj: Tire size questions... Unscrew them and put washer(s) on them and re-install... or put a longer bolt in with a jam nut. S1120-at-aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 12/10/2000 5:26:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, > a4xnut-at-yahoo.com writes: > > <> > > You can do that? How? > > Paul Bradway > 86 Cherokee > 72 LTD convertible > 70 Mustang Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 23:02:34 -0700 From: "Josh Ingram" Subject: xj: Aerial Recon This site was brought to my attention. I thought I'd pass it on. http://www.globexplorer.com/ Click on "Explore" in the upper right-hand corner. Some of the intel. is at least two years old. I suppose one could use it for scouting trails. jingram '01 & '89 XJs ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Dec 2000 23:05:49 -0800 From: "Robert Glover" Subject: Re: xj: Parts Donor Found/Misc Issues - ----- Original Message ----- From: > Check the fuse bow. It does have a standard trans right? If the clutch master > cylinder leaks, it will drip on the fuse box, and melt the plastic. They told me the fusebox got redone a while back, so that may have been part of it. I'll check it again though. From: "Paul W." > '85 Comanche? Funny, they didn't come out until '86. Just going by what they told me. Is there an identifying mark on the axle or anything I can check to verify? No point fooling with it if it doesn't, especially since odds are probably good that I'd have to redo the gears in it to match whatever I have in my front axle. Mine doens't even have a tach; I'll have to order one up. > It has probably worn out all its seals. Fresh valve cover & oil pan gaskets > and front and rear seals will probably go a long way to keeping the slick stuff > on the inside - instead of the built-in, automatic anti-rust program it has > now. How hard is it to replace the front and rear seals? And can the pan gasket be changed with the motor in it? (can't be done on an f-body without pulling the engine) > Probably pretty good... but you also stand a good chance of having a Peugeot > BA-5. If the tranny case splits horizontally, you have the French Curse. Horizontally... you mean I'd see it just by looking at the "side" of the trans? (like a clamshell sorta?) What about the AX-5 vs. the T-5? How do you tell those apart? Thanks again! Rob ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 01:00:39 -0800 (PST) From: Lutin Plunder Subject: xj: 4.0L radiator in a 2.8L Does anyone know if a radiator from a 87 4.0L will fit in a 86 with the 2.8L (yuck)? My friends GF has a one core in hers and mine is a 2 core and since I'm upgrading I thought we'd put the 2 core in hers. ===== Rob "Lutin Plunder" Dome; A+, Network+ 1987 Jeep Cherokee Utility Dana30-4.0L-BA10/5-NP231-Dana44 2" lift in front and 2.5" lift in the rear I swear by my life and my love of it that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine - Atlas Shrugged, Ayn Rand Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 03:52:27 -0800 From: "Phil M." Subject: Re: xj: Tire size questions... Do you recommend raspberry or strawberry? Phil :o) From: "Paul W." Unscrew them and put washer(s) on them and re-install... or put a longer bolt in with a jam nut. _____________________________________________________________________________________ Get more from the Web. FREE MSN Explorer download : http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 09:48:08 -0500 (EST) From: Michael A Cummings Subject: xj: AW-4 stuck in first. Hi list, A friend of mine has an '87 4.0 Cherokee with the AW-4 trans. and about 200,000 mi. The truck worked fine in the morning, but when he left work at night, the truck wouldn't shift out of 1st gear. He's convinced that the transmission needs to be replaced, but my initial thought was that the Transmission control Module. Since this never went bad on my rig, I don't even know where it is. Has anyone ever seen this happen before, and how did you remedy it? He removed the pan, and doens't see any serious problems with the fluid (not burnt) or any other problems. If anyone has any input, he's without wheels, and has to commute 100 miles each day. Thanks folks, mike ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 11:32:38 -0400 From: samfans Subject: Re: xj: AW-4 stuck in first. Check the TV cable: http://members.tripod.com/BillyXJ/trannytech/index.html and the TPS http://members.tripod.com/BillyXJ/SENSORS1/index.html Bill Michael A Cummings wrote: > Hi list, > > A friend of mine has an '87 4.0 Cherokee with the AW-4 trans. > and about 200,000 mi. The truck worked fine in the morning, but when he > left work at night, the truck wouldn't shift out of 1st gear. He's > convinced that the transmission needs to be replaced, but my initial > thought was that the Transmission control Module. Since this never went > bad on my rig, I don't even know where it is. Has anyone ever seen this > happen before, and how did you remedy it? He removed the pan, and doens't > see any serious problems with the fluid (not burnt) or any other problems. > If anyone has any input, he's without wheels, and has to commute 100 > miles each day. > > Thanks folks, > mike ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 10:08:32 -0600 From: Jeff Subject: Re: xj: AW-4 stuck in first. My friend Andreas recently had the same problem with his '88. He disconnected the TCU (under dash on passengers side) and it shifts fine in the manual mode. He then cleaned the connections and I believe it works again. Something to try anyway. Jeff Michael A Cummings wrote: > > Hi list, > > A friend of mine has an '87 4.0 Cherokee with the AW-4 trans. > and about 200,000 mi. The truck worked fine in the morning, but when he > left work at night, the truck wouldn't shift out of 1st gear. He's > convinced that the transmission needs to be replaced, but my initial > thought was that the Transmission control Module. Since this never went > bad on my rig, I don't even know where it is. Has anyone ever seen this > happen before, and how did you remedy it? He removed the pan, and doens't > see any serious problems with the fluid (not burnt) or any other problems. > If anyone has any input, he's without wheels, and has to commute 100 > miles each day. > > Thanks folks, > mike ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 08:43:08 -0800 From: "Robert Glover" Subject: xj: Re: AW-4 stuck in first. From: "Michael A Cummings" > A friend of mine has an '87 4.0 Cherokee with the AW-4 trans. > and about 200,000 mi. The truck worked fine in the morning, but when he > left work at night, the truck wouldn't shift out of 1st gear. He's > convinced that the transmission needs to be replaced, but my initial > thought was that the Transmission control Module. Since this never went > bad on my rig, I don't even know where it is. Has anyone ever seen this > happen before, and how did you remedy it? He removed the pan, and doens't > see any serious problems with the fluid (not burnt) or any other problems. > If anyone has any input, he's without wheels, and has to commute 100 > miles each day. Since he's had the pan off, I trust he's replaced the fluid and filter? One common problem that causes odd shifting is low fluid. This happened on my '96 RAM. In the mornings when cold out, it wouldn't want to shift out of first gear. Once the tranny and fluid heated up, though, it would work great. Two quarts of fluid later, it was working just great. Rob ------------------------------ End of xj-digest V1 #1015 *************************