From owner-xj-digest-at-digest.net Mon Dec 25 18:39:49 2000 From: xj-digest xj-digest Monday, December 25 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1029 Forum for Discussion of XJ cherokees and wagoneers Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: xj: Cold Starts..... xj: Re: fsj: impending projects... xj: Re: TPS and AW4 Re: xj: Idle... ... problems xj: Re: impending projects... xj: Re: foaming oil = bad head gasket xj: For Sale-'91 Cherokee Laredo xj: sludge, yech... more work... :( Re: xj: Scout regrets??? xj: Re: TPS and AW4 [none] xj: Re: JCW/RC lift xj: Re: fsj: Re: TPS and AW4 xj: Re: jc whitney lift xj: pudding gone... which tranny? XJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeep/xj/ Send submissions to xj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to xj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to xj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 10:39:18 -0500 From: "Art Triggs" Subject: xj: Cold Starts..... Hi All, I'm new here so be gentle ;-)>, I have a 96xj that does not start whenever the outside air temp gets below about 25 degrees, turns right over any other time, I have a new fuel filter, cps,plugs, wires, cap&rotor (needed it bad), it cranks just fine, but won't start, is there some way to test for no fuel, I think at this point I'm getting a spark, but no fuel. Of cousre if I wait long enough and let it sit in the sun till it warms up, it will start, most times it's not an option though. Any fresh Ideas would really be helpful. Thanks, and Happy Holidays Art Triggs 96xj Rusty's air tubew/K&N, Flowblaster, other stuff, just won't run when it's cold. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 08:27:57 -0800 From: john Subject: xj: Re: fsj: impending projects... merry christmas to you Jimmy B!!! thanx! You are an inspiration to me on this Christmas Eve. First the hope of an AW4, now this... I'm off this week, if that axle for Paul is ready I can run down and get it before I start dismantling SuperDawg... or did you already get it to him? ;) :) john At 01:44 AM 12/24/00 -0800, James Blair wrote: >http://www.partsamerica.com >Your Search Results for 80775 >B & M 80775 $99.99 > 80775 B&M UNIMATIC SHIFTER >Order from partsamerica and have it sold to you through the store up the >hill from you > >************************************* >JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 Comanche >http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html >************************************** - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 08:25:36 -0800 From: john Subject: xj: Re: TPS and AW4 At 01:34 AM 12/24/00 -0800, James Blair wrote: >A: From wrecking yards mostly (I gave John the one from my Eagle awhile >back. Hope you didn't give it away!) should still have it... >[PS to John: since the TBI system you bought has a TPS, you will be able >to hook up an AW4 tranny!] James, do tell me more! I have an AW4 core here now. :) So, I'd need to use the flex plate from a 4.0L, right? What else do I need? Is the AW4 the same length as the 727 or my T-5? This would be awesome if I could use the 4speed auto. These trannies are awesome. Remember I've got the shift lever and console from that '89 we parted out too... Are you sure the Howell has a TPS? I'll have to read the instructions again... wow, this is good news. I've got to replace the injectors in my '83 300SD and then I'm going to take SuperDawg off line for the TBI setup, and might as well do the AW4 at the same time. Please, if you can, list everything I would need to do to make this work... oh, wait. It'll have to be a '93 or up AW4, 23 splines, right? That's why I didn't use the AW4 I had... it was 21 spline. This is good news... Remember I bought driveshafts from a J10 with an NP229, so I have different length driveshafts I can use so I can keep my NP208... or, get another NP242... of course then I'd need to do a SYE (slip yoke eliminator)... I'm willing to spend the money to do it right... The '83 300SD is for sale... but I'll need it for the upgrades to the '83 J10... :) Of course I can always swipe the wife's Jeep... :) hey, I put together some Christmas pictures, http://www.wagoneers.com/FOTOS/Christmas-2000-pictures/all-pix.html or pick and choose: http://www.wagoneers.com/FOTOS/Christmas-2000-pictures/ heading to church in a few minutes, ttyl, john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 08:52:50 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: xj: Idle... ... problems A: There is a 3 way wire connector "tee" above the brake booster that needs to be taken apart and cleaned up. Do that before replacing the other stuff (even the oil pressure sending unit) Then check the oil pressure with a mechanical gauge. From: samfans REccommend clean and check IAS. Check and adjust/replace TPS clean Throttle body well with combustion chamber cleaner and a toothbrush - also spray some in while running. Bill K BOCK wrote: All right   88 MJ with 4.0L ext. 139,000 ... first problem I am getting a fast Idle even after the engine is warmed up ..(here comes the kicker) ... its intermittent. example.. been driving for 30 min.. pull up to a light .. in D .1000 rpms. slip it up to N 1500 rpms to 2000 rpms second problem oil press... 60-80 psi ... all the time should it be much lower taking the miles and age into considerations. here is what I have done . 1st cps sensor 2nd thermostat 3rd oil pressure sending unit 4th general tune up.. plugs wires cap ect... ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 Comanche http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 08:57:46 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: xj: Re: impending projects... A: God Bless us, every one! (my best Tiny Tim imitation) The tube is in the back of my pickup, but I will be taking the van to my parents for Christmas dinner, so I'll see if I can get it in and wrapped up. U: merry christmas to you Jimmy B!!!       thanx! You are an inspiration to me on this Christmas Eve. First the hope of an AW4, now this... I'm off this week, if that axle for Paul is ready I can run down and get it before I start dismantling SuperDawg... or did you already get it to him? ;) :) john At 01:44 AM 12/24/00 -0800, James Blair wrote: http://www.partsamerica.com Your Search Results for 80775 B & M 80775 $99.99     80775 B&M UNIMATIC SHIFTER Order from partsamerica and have it sold to you through the store up the hill from you ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 Comanche http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 08:55:11 -0800 From: john Subject: xj: Re: foaming oil = bad head gasket At 10:07 AM 12/24/00 -0600, Doug wrote: >John, > The oil in the crank case is brown creamy colored and >when starting the engine, it goes hot all the sudden. I believe the >water in the radiator doesn't keep. That could be because of leak in >radiator, RIGHT?? Which solution could be STOP LEAK,RIGHT?? no, sounds like a bad head gasket. Stop Leak can be tried, but it may not help. Don't run it very long in this condition. I wasn't sure what kind of engine we were talking about. Head gaskets aren't usually a problem on Jeep or Mercedes engines. My mental database didn't even register head gasket. >The Auto is 1989 Buick 3.8 liter moter with >188.000 good miles. This has been very dependable for us. One thing I >know that I should have done is winterize the car with anifreeze which I >haven't done. I live in the mid south where it hasn't gooten below 37 >degrees for a long time for long periods of time. Stupid me. shouldn't make a difference. Antifreeze is also antiboil. >And another thing,haven't change oil has frequently as should be. Just >about ever 5 months or more. That 's gonna change for now. well... with the mileage and prolonged use with water in the oil, your best bet is to have the engine gone through. I've run a engine with a bad head gasket for a while and wore out the rings... :( >I hope it's not too late and we can keep the car for another 7 months at >lease. What do you think?? It's not likely to have a catastrophic failure in this condition unless you let the water get too low, in which case it'll over heat and possibly seize. Try the leak stop first. You could run the car with the radiator cap off, that prevents the pressure from building and forcing water into the engine... problem is you'll probably overheat. >Do you believe and (be honest with me) that we have any serious problems >on our hands?? The head gasket replacement isn't too hard. Gaskets are cheap. My daughter's '88 Buick 2.8L Regal had an external intake/head gasket antifreeze leak, used the ALUMNISEAL stuff, fixed it. Try it. Can't hurt. :) The stuff is amazing. Just watch the coolant level. :) john - ---------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com Snohomish, WA, where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... Real FREEDOM comes through knowing Jesus http://www.wagoneers.com/Christmas-message.html - ---------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 15:42:22 -0800 From: Bill Hanchett Subject: xj: For Sale-'91 Cherokee Laredo Hi all, My daughter is returning to school and needs to sell her Jeep. It is a stock 4.0L High Output, and is Red. New Goodyear M&S on one axle. I have driven it the last couple of weeks, and it runs and looks great. She purchased this from a Lexus dealer about a year ago. We have had to put in a new radiator and new power steering hose. High Blue Book is $7800 so we thought a price around $6800 would be about right.. but we will take a look at all offers.. so she can afford the tuition and books. A picture of the Jeep is at http://photos.classifieds2000.com/photos/internet/sportutility/88/193988.jpg Oh, and it has 119,000 miles and a JVC AM/FM/CD and new speakers too. Bill ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 18:29:14 -0800 From: john Subject: xj: sludge, yech... more work... :( After answering an email about foaming oil... I decided to take a look at mine... Superdawg has a carb problem, the typical BBD problem (problems with the idle circuit, dumps gas down the carb), even after a good rebuild... and the vent tube had clogged... and the tstat is too low... (fwiw, the foaming oil in the email was most likely caused by a bad head gasket) what I saw on the dipstick reminded me of custard... (ever mixed synthetic oil with gasoline and water? try it... ;) So, now I'm thinking... do I want to install the TBI on this engine and go through the trouble of switching it to an Automatic???? I don't know how much internal rust and wear has occurred. The prior owners didn't take superb care of things... The old carb was really bad. I suppose I could run a compression test... But, I may be better off to get a 93 or up XJ 4.0L with Aisin Warner 4spd Auto and keep my xfr case... (23 spline output shaft). That way I get multipoint fuel injection and the overdrive auto all coupled together properly... don't have to mix n match parts. :) When I do an engine/trans swap I try to keep the xfr case in the original position, that way I only have to reengineer motor mounts, and usually not by much. Keeping the xfr case in place eliminates problems with the driveshafts. :) If I do the swap I can easily sell my brand new Howell TBI kit for what I bought it for... I'm kind of bummed. I've got to replace the injectors on my Benz before I can park SuperDawg... I guess the 300SD is gonna be my primary wheels for several months if I start this engine swap project. I am very fond of the 4.0L engine, I'd rather do a Diesel conversion, but the hassles with emissions and such makes it less desireable. Not to mention that Diesel prices are close to $2.00 while unleaded is closer to $1.50. (one texaco, diesel 1.95, unleaded 1.56...) I just tanked up SuperDawg at 1.49 at the Shell in Mill Creek (bothell-everett highway and 180th, fyi). I'm getting tired of working on cars, but just can't see my way clear to take on more debt with a car payment... besides I really like my J10. And upgrading the engine and trans to a fresh XJ setup will improve power and economy and keep it Jeep. Guess I'll give Olympic a call and see what they want for an engine/trans setup. Once I get the 4.0L/aW4 installed I'll be selling the Howell TBI kit, the 258 and YES RAY, the T-5. ;) I'm not sure which project to start first... fixing to head out to a friend's house for Christmas eve, and of course tomorrow is Christmas... I might have time in the afternoon to fix my Benz, which will make me feel much better. I need to get that picket fence installed, storage areas created and extend the garage and get the concrete work done before I pull the engine... hey, I've got a week off... ;) In the grand scheme of things we are so incredibly blessed. :) My problems are ridiculous in light of others. ;) Whine, whine, whine, eh? :) Y'all have a great Christmas. :) Don't forget that Jesus is the reason for this season, and he's coming back... and I'm looking forward to it too, hope you are too. :) later, john - ---------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com Snohomish, WA, where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... Real FREEDOM comes through knowing Jesus http://www.wagoneers.com/Christmas-message.html - ---------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 18:43:02 -0800 (PST) From: "Paul W." Subject: Re: xj: Scout regrets??? > Yea - you did the right thing. It was a great truck, but you wouldn't have > been able to live with yourself if you'd beaten up the sole survivor. > Sometimes it hurts to do the right thing eh! Yup... and on rare occasion, you get to make a nice profit, too. :) Usually I end up buying high and selling low though. > > BTW - I did buy a regular Scout II a few months ago for only $350... but > > it's old enough that it doesn't have a D44 front axle, but a drum braked > > D30 instead... but the later disc braked D44 does bolt right in... > > So, exacly how many vehicles do you have at any one time ? Too many! Let's see, right now there's: 1994 Geo Tracker 4WD Convert 1990 Holiday Rambler AlumaLite 25' Class A m/h 1989 Chevy Astro 1986 Jeep Cherokee AKA "The Wrinkled Indian" 1986 Jeep Cherokee (parts rig) 1986 Honda Spree scooter 1981 Olds Omega (needs work) 1978 Ford F-250 4WD p/u 1976 Anderson Marine Sidewinder ski boat 1973 IH Scout (or is it a 72? I'd have to look at the papers) 1971 Jeep CJ-5 ...and the boat is on a trailer and I have a frame and pair of axles waiting for me to get off my ash and turn into a flatbed for rig haulin' > I was in the dealership talking to the guy who used to own the Mopar muscle > car that Don Johnson drives in his new show - apparently it's worth 200,000 > or something now ! Isn't that a '71 Plymouth Hemi Cuda? Was watchin the show the other day and he was chasing his car's clone in lime green & hardtop... the bad guy drove his under a semi trailer and turned it topless. What a shame! I'm sure they used a plain Cuda and just did it up to look like a Hemi Cuda (with the overdone graphics), but still... At $200K I can think of a FLEET of rigs _I_ would buy... :) Paul Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 18:40:18 -0800 From: john Subject: xj: Re: TPS and AW4 Yes, the Howell TBI kit does have a TPS. I just read the instruction manual. Also, Jim says '91 and up has the 23 spline output shaft. Anyway, after discovering sludge I may be better off to go with the MPI 4.0L/AW4 setup. I think it'll be easier since there is a size difference in the transmissions (see below). 2" won't be a problem, plenty of clearance in the front of my engine. :) So, my XJ friends, are there any "bad" years of 4.0L's in the '91 and up range? I don't want to do this twice and I don't want to make a stroker... I want it stock for reliability, parts and economy. Wiring doesn't frighten me... I have a spare Renix computer, but that probably won't do me any good... I've also got most of the wiring harness from an '88. What differences happened after '91 besides computer change, HO and 23 splines? :) later, john At 09:14 AM 12/24/00 -0800, James Blair wrote: > U: James, do tell me more! I have an AW4 core here now. :) > >A: You need the starter and flex plate from an XJ, the TPS you're >getting put on is for AT, not MT right? (makes life easier) I got the >explanation of how to wire the brake light switch in from the guy that >does those shift kit things for the XJ, and FRank said you need to add >the TPS to the circuit. > >U: So, I'd need to use the flex plate from a 4.0L, right? What else do I >need? > >A: Or redrill the converter holes in a 727 plate. I was going to say you >could use the old starter, but it won't work in a AW4 bellhousing. They >will vice versa (weird, huh?) > >U: Is the AW4 the same length as the 727 or my T-5? >A: 2.5" longer. (I'm using a 2" shorter rear shaft from a V8 NP229 with >7' box if I can find one. If not, I'll cut mine down, but I need to make >a front one ) > >U: This would be awesome if I could use the 4speed auto. These trannies >are awesome. Remember I've got the shift lever and console from that '89 >we parted out too... Are you sure the Howell has a TPS? I'll have to read >the instructions again... wow, this is good news. > >A: AFAIK, the TBI has to have a TPS to work right. (one of the AMC-list >guys was doing the Howell kit in his Eagle) > >U: ... oh, wait. It'll have to be a '93 or up AW4, 23 splines, right? >That's why I didn't use the AW4 I had... it was 21 spline. > >A: '91 and up. Put an ad in the paper and online for a core to get the >output shaft. >U: This is good news... Remember I bought driveshafts from a J10 with an >NP229, so I have different length driveshafts I can use so I can keep my >NP208... or, get another NP242... of course then I'd need to do a SYE >(slip yoke eliminator)... >A: I'll know better when I tear into mine. - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 19:17:38 -0800 From: "Jason Wolfe" Subject: [none] I just recieved a jcwhitney/rc lift for christmas. yippee. Is there anything about the lift that I need to know before putting it on? Thanks Jason Wolfe Lake Stevens, WA '89 XJ Limited Mainly stock w/ the exception of a 2nd gear switch and homemade quick disco's, Kenwood CD player and speakers, and a JCWhitney/RC lift waiting to be put on. http://hookedonjeeps.freeyellow.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 19:29:16 -0800 (PST) From: "Paul W." Subject: xj: Re: JCW/RC lift Not really... pretty straight forward - as long as you can get all the stock fasteners loose. Got penetrating oil? If not, I recommend having some handy. Paul Camano Is. (Used to live by LSMS...) - --- Jason Wolfe wrote: > I just recieved a jcwhitney/rc lift for christmas. yippee. Is there anything > about the lift that I need to know before putting it on? Thanks > > > > Jason Wolfe > Lake Stevens, WA > '89 XJ Limited > Mainly stock w/ the exception of a 2nd > gear switch and homemade quick disco's, > Kenwood CD player and speakers, and a JCWhitney/RC lift waiting to be put on. http://hookedonjeeps.freeyellow.com Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Dec 2000 20:02:07 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: xj: Re: fsj: Re: TPS and AW4 A: The wiring is totally different from Renix to HO (the whole HO system is under the hood and very few sensors swap. Especially not the CPS!) My stroker will be VERY reliable, since it's built with all the same parts used to build 272 cu in motors in many AMC or VAM built for Mexico City cars. LPG is just the crowning touch! John wrote: Yes, the Howell TBI kit does have a TPS. I just read the instruction manual. Also, Jim says '91 and up has the 23 spline output shaft. Anyway, after discovering sludge I may be better off to go with the MPI 4.0L/AW4 setup. I think it'll be easier since there is a size difference in the transmissions (see below). 2" won't be a problem, plenty of clearance in the front of my engine. :) So, my XJ friends, are there any "bad" years of 4.0L's in the '91 and up range? I don't want to do this twice and I don't want to make a stroker... I want it stock for reliability, parts and economy. Wiring doesn't frighten me... I have a spare Renix computer, but that probably won't do me any good... I've also got most of the wiring harness from an '88. What differences happened after '91 besides computer change, HO and 23 splines? :) later, john ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 Comanche http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 25 Dec 2000 08:43:26 EST From: S1120-at-aol.com Subject: xj: Re: jc whitney lift In a message dated 12/24/2000 10:21:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, smokyxj-at-yep.com writes: << >> I just recieved a jcwhitney/rc lift for christmas. yippee. Is there anything about the lift that I need to know before putting it on? Thanks<< Is this the 3" lift for around $100.00? I am thinking of getting the same one. Does it come with add-a-leifs, or blocks? U-bolts? Hardware? I got a small amount of jeep cash [I have SO many projects, that none get to much funds] and need a little boost. Paul Bradway 86 Cherokee 72 LTD convertible 70 Mustang ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 25 Dec 2000 17:42:39 -0800 From: john Subject: xj: pudding gone... which tranny? Now I'm really perplexed... Yesterday I checked the oil on my 4.2L J10... it was really nasty, rust on the dipstick, grey/cream and sludge up the stick... I drove it to do some shopping yesterday, parked it, moved it into the carport where I'm replacing the injectors on my Benz, popped the hood to help retain some warmth in there... and decided to check the oil... it's black. (BTW, I am taking pictures of the injector swap) I'm trying to decide what to do on the J10. I really like it and want to do it right, but don't have my shop built right now... I guess with that said my first option is to drive it until I get the shop done... but then I'll need to decide which option to pursue. I need all the help I can on this one. OPTIONS: 1) replace 4.2L & T-5 with 4.0L and Aisin Warner 4spd auto (motor mounts will move forward 2", maybe, complete rewiring) 2) replace T-5 with 727 and install Howell TBI (no mount changes, but the 727 is a 3spd.) or 3) replace T-5 with AW4 and install Howell TBI (problem: engine mounts will need to move 2" forward) (I'd love to drop a 6.5L Turbo Diesel in, but I'm going to keep it Jeep. The 4.0L is an awesome motor and the AW4 is a bullet proof tranny, IMO better than the 727.) hope you had a nice Christmas. so, 1, 2 or 3? :) john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of xj-digest V1 #1029 *************************