From owner-xj-digest-at-digest.net Thu Nov 4 21:15:54 2004 From: xj-digest xj-digest Friday, November 5 2004 Volume 01 : Number 1950 Forum for Discussion of XJ cherokees and wagoneers Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: xj: off topic: '80 triumph spitfire... pass the popcorn Re: xj: off topic: '80 triumph spitfire... pass the popcorn Re: xj: off topic: '80 triumph spitfire... pass the popcorn xj: Re: [db] Another car for John ;) xj: the strange twists and turns... xj: cute engines, Diesels and other distractions Re: xj: cute engines, Diesels and other distractions xj: RE: cute engines, Diesels and other distractions xj: Re: [db] Another car for John ;) xj: Re: RE: cute engines, Diesels and other distractions XJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeep/xj/ Send submissions to xj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to xj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to xj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 10:48:15 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: xj: off topic: '80 triumph spitfire... pass the popcorn On Thu, 4 Nov 2004, Aaron Storms wrote: >-->Where's the 4WD lever on that thing? ...:) Guess it depends on how bad you want yet another project John. I used to own an MG Midget back in college (real dependable transportation) and these little cars are fairly easy to work on and a blast when they run, which is usually about half the time you own one. The electrical system was designed by Lucas, the "Demon of Darkness" so might have a few quirks...:) Someone offered to give me one of these recently and I considered it, but turned them down since I have enough jeep projects to last a lifetime. The one you're looking at was sitting under a tarp at least! Have fun deciding, Aaron >--> yeah, trying to figure out how to put a lift kit on this thing... :) btw, isn't Lucas the "prince of darkness"? :) >--> john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 15:58:15 -0500 From: "Don Hansen" Subject: Re: xj: off topic: '80 triumph spitfire... pass the popcorn If its rusty it must have been run without any oil at all!!! - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john" To: Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 10:46 AM Subject: Re: xj: off topic: '80 triumph spitfire... pass the popcorn > On Thu, 4 Nov 2004, Don Hansen wrote: > > >-->LOTS of truth in that joke! I had a 70 MGB that did 2 qts. every 500 miles! > >-->Before I sold it I gunked the engine. The guy who bought it remarked on how > >-->nice and clean the motor was. I felt a bit of guilt.... > > it's funny, because this engine is one big chunk of rust. the rest of > the car isn't though... :) > > john > > >--> > >-->-Don > >--> > >-->----- Original Message ----- > >-->From: "Ed Kummel" > >-->To: > >-->Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 2:37 AM > >-->Subject: Re: xj: off topic: '80 triumph spitfire... pass the popcorn > >--> > >--> > >-->> I too always wanted a Triumph. Either the Spitfire or > >-->> the TR6. > >-->> I have three stories that may be relevant: > >-->> One is in the form of a joke; > >-->> Q: Why are there no British designed and manufactured > >-->> computers? > >-->> A: They couldn't figure out a way to get them to leak > >-->> oil. > >-->> > >-->> One day I was walking my dog and came across a > >-->> beautiful TR6. The owner was cleaning and polishing it > >-->> and I asked him how he keeps his car in such awesome > >-->> shape...He replied that he ownes 2...one to drive and > >-->> one for parts... > >-->> > >-->> I had a friend in College who had a Spitfire. an > >-->> incredible machine. We spent a miserable weekend > >-->> putting in an aftermarket car stereo...(no real room) > >-->> only to find that every time he shifted into certain > >-->> gears it would either turn off the radio, eject the > >-->> tape or change the station...the shifter is in the > >-->> dash directly under the radio... > >-->> Ed > >-->> web/gadget guru > >-->> > >-->> --- john wrote: > >-->> > >-->> > I'm being tempted by a non-running '80 Trimuph > >-->> > Spitfire... it doesn't > >-->> > run, but it's complete and in pretty decent shape > >-->> > over all. > >-->> > http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2004/Triumph-Spitfire/ > >-->> > > >-->> > >-->> > >-->> > So, dire warnings? Should I run or plunk down the > >-->> > initial $600 and > >-->> > keep shelling bills out until it's moving under it's > >-->> > own power or what? :) > >-->> > > >-->> > >-->> > >-->> ===== > >-->> "A democracy is a sheep and two wolves deciding on what to have for lunch. > >-->Freedom is a well armed sheep contesting the results of the decision." > >-->> - Benjamin Franklin > >-->> > >-->> > >-->> > >-->> __________________________________ > >-->> Do you Yahoo!? > >-->> Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. > >-->> www.yahoo.com > >--> > > ---- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** > Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 14:10:53 -0700 (GMT-07:00) From: Aaron Storms Subject: Re: xj: off topic: '80 triumph spitfire... pass the popcorn I guess that all depends on whether you're wrenching on the brit car in your comfy garage or stranded on the side of the road some cold night in the dark! Aaron btw, isn't Lucas the "prince of darkness"? :) >--> john ---- Gilpin County News PO Box 93 Black Hawk, CO 80422 303.582.0133 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 13:23:28 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: xj: Re: [db] Another car for John ;) a little "long" on the price for me... ;) if it was only a Diesel... ;) john On Thu, 4 Nov 2004, Jim Hoffman wrote: >-->http://www.specialtyauto.net/car_9314.htm >-->http://www.autoweek.com/docs/aw_913_27-30.pdf >--> >-->A picture of this machine is at the very bottom of the second link. >-->;) >-->Jim/ ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 15:43:22 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: xj: the strange twists and turns... the guy with the 300d just dropped the price and I think I bought it... it should follow me home ok on a tow strap... :) need to figure out why #1 & #2 have 0 psi compression... other cylinders at 380+psi... the gal with the spitfire was seeing if the original owner had the hardtop, if she does it will come with the car... anyone interested? :) john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 16:10:48 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: xj: cute engines, Diesels and other distractions there was a certain attraction to working under the hood of that little Spitfire... it would be amazingly easy to clean and detail that thing... a friend suggested the weber carb and manifold setup. If I had gotten it I might have looked at the 2.5L / AT out of an XJ... or a 240d setup.. But, I'm buying the '82 300D... the guy dropped the price a bunch... made me a deal I couldn't refuse... http://www.wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/CARS/82-300d-bad-engine/ it follows me home on Saturday. Not sure why he offered it to me for less than another guy had already offered him, but hey, works for me. Just need to figure out why #1 & #2 cylinders have no compression. A mechanic friend will be over this weekend, might just turn him loose on it. If we can't fix it I may just put the body on my GMC Jimmy... :) My son wants me to drop a V8 into it... well, I'm sorta doing that... after all the 6.2L Diesel IS a V8. ;) john On Fri, 5 Nov 2004, David Rubie wrote: >-->[deleted] >-->> >-->If you think an FSJ has rust problems, you have never had to deal >-->> >-->with a european sports car. Dollars to donuts it has >-->> "fred flintstone" >-->> >-->type floor pans. Lovely looking little car, but very little power >-->> >-->(tiny 1300 or 1500cc engine, pushrods, teensy carburettor etc). >-->> >-->> actually, this is Washington state... the floorboards are completely >-->> intact. I didn't crawl underneath but the gal's father had... (He's >-->> also originally from the midwest) and we were talking about that very >-->> issue. :) He checked it out and I could tell from the floorpan >-->> and trunk that there wasn't any rust down below... just on the >-->> end of a few places where the paint had chipped. >--> >-->Since it's the bodywork that eats most of the cash on a resto like that >-->you should be pretty safe. The '80 model Spitfire will have a 1500cc >-->engine in it although I can't remember if it's the same one as >-->the MG Midget (BMC A series) or the lesser respected triumph unit. >-->Dim memory suggests that both the MG Midget and the Spitfire ended >-->up with the 1500cc Triumph engine rather than the A series. Either >-->way they are mechanically very simple and cheap to refurbish >-->(half as many parts as a V8 :-) >--> >-->[deleted] >-->> >-->means anything. I can't remember whether the Spitfire is >-->> a unit body >-->> >-->or has a frame (i'm guessing it has at least a partial >-->> frame) which >-->> >-->> has a frame under the front... >--> >-->Have a really good look for rust in the suspension mounts at the >-->rear then. Being a late model, I think there was some thought put >-->into rust prevention (although nothing like modern cars). >--> >-->[deleted] >-->> >-->Hoods/trim etc. are probably all available in reproduction as the >-->> >-->pommies are nuts for fixing them up. >-->> >-->> pommies? :) >-->Sorry - Australian slang for somebody from the United Kingdom. >--> >-->> >-->> I would like to get a fiberglass top for it... it does rain a >-->> bit here. :) >-->I don't know how watertight the hoods are on Spitfires - maybe just >-->drive it on sunny days :-) The fibreglass tops for most of those >-->kinds of cars are (in my opinion) a pain. You can never get replacement >-->rubber seals for them as the manufacturers have all disappeared. >--> >-->Cheers, >--> >-->dave. >-->1983 Jeep Cherokee "Gaston" >-->1975 Alfa Spider Veloce "Rusty" >--> >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 17:59:49 -0700 (GMT-07:00) From: Aaron Storms Subject: Re: xj: cute engines, Diesels and other distractions Well, if it's any consolation, at least it'll "look" good for the neighbors sitting in your yard - as long as you close the bonnet! ...:) Now if it'd been a vintage flattie willys I could see the attraction! Aaron - -----Original Message----- From: john But, I'm buying the '82 300D... the guy dropped the price a bunch... made me a deal I couldn't refuse... http://www.wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/CARS/82-300d-bad-engine/ it follows me home on Saturday. Not sure why he offered it to me for less than another guy had already offered him, but hey, works for me. Just need to figure out why #1 & #2 cylinders have no compression. A mechanic friend will be over this weekend, might just turn him loose on it. If we can't fix it I may just put the body on my GMC Jimmy... :) My son wants me to drop a V8 into it... well, I'm sorta doing that... after all the 6.2L Diesel IS a V8. ;) john Gilpin County News PO Box 93 Black Hawk, CO 80422 303.582.0133 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 16:57:56 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: xj: RE: cute engines, Diesels and other distractions On Fri, 5 Nov 2004, David Rubie wrote: >-->> there was a certain attraction to working under the hood of >-->> that little Spitfire... >-->> it would be amazingly easy to clean and detail that thing... >-->> a friend suggested the weber carb and manifold setup. If >-->> I had gotten it I might have looked at the 2.5L / AT out >-->> of an XJ... or a 240d setup.. >--> >-->A diesel powered spitfire? The torque could be lots of fun >-->in such a light car... but it would have to have the hardtop... Diesel fumes would ruin the experience otherwise. :) it would be a lot of fun though... >-->> But, I'm buying the '82 300D... the guy dropped the price >-->> a bunch... made me a deal I couldn't refuse... >-->> http://www.wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/CARS/82-300d-bad-engine/ >-->> it follows me home on Saturday. >--> >-->I'm curious as to why you're so keen on the diesel mercedes? >-->Other than the fuel economy, aren't parts prices a real killer? no, not at all... the 123 series is the automotive equivalant to a Ford 8n tractor! I can get a water pump for that thing for $14!!! Brake caliper with pads for $49. the 123 chassis was in production from '75 until '85, millions produced and found worldwide. >-->> A mechanic friend will be over this weekend, might just >-->> turn him loose on it. If we can't fix it I may just >-->> put the body on my GMC Jimmy... :) My son wants me to >-->> drop a V8 into it... well, I'm sorta doing that... after >-->> all the 6.2L Diesel IS a V8. ;) >-->I've been reading your adventures in regard to fitting a diesel >-->to an FSJ - I'm considering it when the AMC V8 in my Cherokee dies, if >-->only because in Outback Australia the only reliably obtainable fuel is >-->diesel. cool... I bought my '83 Jimmy for the 6.2L Diesel, was going to put it in my J10 but my buddy and I talked me out of it. ;) You might also consider the 4.0L I-6 out of an XJ cherokee, extraordinary engine... long lived, economical, plenty of torque. I'm putting one in my '83 J10 Stepside. >-->What sort of fuel economy can you get out of the 6.2 litre >-->Chevy diesels? 19 to 20mpg. This is my second. It's actually a Detroit-Allison Diesel, NOT a Chevy... It's a decent Diesel, not extraordinary... it's 379 cubic inches. >-->I assume their chosen as there are readily available >-->adaptor kids for the AMC 727 and whatnot? I'd ditch that piece of crap 727 for a TH400 or a 700r4. I am so disappointed in "elephant power". Growing up in the '60's mopar trannies were bullet proof... but the ones they put in the big Jeeps are junk. I've burned up more than one... don't get me started on 727s... :) >-->Cheers, >-->dave. later, john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 18:57:07 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: xj: Re: [db] Another car for John ;) On Thu, 4 Nov 2004, Jim Hoffman wrote: >-->Convert it!! What a *frankendiesel* THAT would make!!! actually I'm thinking 300d on the Jimmy chassis... will have both here saturday... and a mechanic who is out of work. :) john >-->Jim/ >-->> a little "long" on the price for me... ;) >-->> if it was only a Diesel... ;) >-->> john >-->> >-->> On Thu, 4 Nov 2004, Jim Hoffman wrote: >-->> >-->> >-->http://www.specialtyauto.net/car_9314.htm >-->> >-->http://www.autoweek.com/docs/aw_913_27-30.pdf >-->> >--> >-->> >-->A picture of this machine is at the very bottom of the second link. >-->> >-->;) >-->> >-->Jim/ >--> >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 21:09:45 -0800 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: xj: Re: RE: cute engines, Diesels and other distractions A: First, Detroit Allison is a GM umbrella group company. Second, if it weren't for whiney babies that don't like a truck that shifts like a truck, the 727 in FSJs would last far longer. (I can still update them to handle the ponies, but will probably only do one more due to physical limitations that are creeping up on me. Doc thinks I tore the radius in my right shoulder and may need surgery soon) For OZ and NZ, I would go for LPG as fuel of choice, at least cost wise. On the Spitfire, I would consider a VW Rabbit diesel transplant. On Fri, 5 Nov 2004, David Rubie wrote: >-->> there was a certain attraction to working under the hood of >-->> that little Spitfire... >-->> it would be amazingly easy to clean and detail that thing... >-->> a friend suggested the weber carb and manifold setup. If >-->> I had gotten it I might have looked at the 2.5L / AT out >-->> of an XJ... or a 240d setup.. >--> >-->A diesel powered spitfire? The torque could be lots of fun >-->in such a light car... but it would have to have the hardtop... Diesel fumes would ruin the experience otherwise. :) it would be a lot of fun though... >-->> But, I'm buying the '82 300D... the guy dropped the price >-->> a bunch... made me a deal I couldn't refuse... >-->> http://www.wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/CARS/82-300d-bad-engine/ >-->> it follows me home on Saturday. >--> >-->I'm curious as to why you're so keen on the diesel mercedes? >-->Other than the fuel economy, aren't parts prices a real killer? no, not at all... the 123 series is the automotive equivalant to a Ford 8n tractor! I can get a water pump for that thing for $14!!! Brake caliper with pads for $49. the 123 chassis was in production from '75 until '85, millions produced and found worldwide. >-->> A mechanic friend will be over this weekend, might just >-->> turn him loose on it. If we can't fix it I may just >-->> put the body on my GMC Jimmy... :) My son wants me to >-->> drop a V8 into it... well, I'm sorta doing that... after >-->> all the 6.2L Diesel IS a V8. ;) >-->I've been reading your adventures in regard to fitting a diesel >-->to an FSJ - I'm considering it when the AMC V8 in my Cherokee dies, if >-->only because in Outback Australia the only reliably obtainable fuel is >-->diesel. cool... I bought my '83 Jimmy for the 6.2L Diesel, was going to put it in my J10 but my buddy and I talked me out of it. ;) You might also consider the 4.0L I-6 out of an XJ cherokee, extraordinary engine... long lived, economical, plenty of torque. I'm putting one in my '83 J10 Stepside. >-->What sort of fuel economy can you get out of the 6.2 litre >-->Chevy diesels? 19 to 20mpg. This is my second. It's actually a Detroit-Allison Diesel, NOT a Chevy... It's a decent Diesel, not extraordinary... it's 379 cubic inches. >-->I assume their chosen as there are readily available >-->adaptor kids for the AMC 727 and whatnot? I'd ditch that piece of crap 727 for a TH400 or a 700r4. I am so disappointed in "elephant power". Growing up in the '60's mopar trannies were bullet proof... but the ones they put in the big Jeeps are junk. I've burned up more than one... don't get me started on 727s... :) >-->Cheers, >-->dave. later, john ---- ------------------------------ End of xj-digest V1 #1950 *************************