From owner-xj-digest-at-digest.net Mon Jan 16 22:13:13 2006 From: xj-digest xj-digest Tuesday, January 17 2006 Volume 01 : Number 2258 Forum for Discussion of XJ cherokees and wagoneers Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: xj: Re: RE: fsj: tires xj: Re: Re: fsj: tires Re: xj: Re: Re: fsj: tires Re: xj: Re: Re: fsj: tires Re: xj: Re: Re: fsj: tires xj: tire calculator Re: xj: tires xj: Re: [WJ-Grand] Re: fsj: tires XJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeep/xj/ Send submissions to xj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to xj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to xj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2006 07:03:09 -0500 From: "Don Hansen" Subject: xj: Re: RE: fsj: tires Jesus. I thought you were nuts before, but now you've solidified your position: A COMANCHE BENCH SEAT COMFORTABLE!!!!??? No, it isn't. - -Biff - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Blair" To: ; ; ; ; Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2006 9:11 PM Subject: xj: RE: fsj: tires > What I really liked was the Aquatread that was the rave -at-1999. Have them > on my wife's '84 Nissan Maxima wagon. We put 100,000 miles on that car > with only a set of tires, set of injectors, an alternator and front brakes > replaced although little things were starting to go bad since it had > 220,000 on it when we... or rather my wife, traded it in on a Ford. That > Ford turned out to be a wreck in disguise so we tried to take it back to > the dealer and they had already sold her car for $200 (someone got a > screaming deal!) > Had some hassle getting our money back (nothing that my loud voice in > the middle of a showroom floor didn't get taken care of quickly though!) > and went to a different Ford dealer and got the '99 Ranger 4x4 my wife > loved. Had it been an automatic, we'd still have it, but she traded that > on the '01 Subaru Legacy that has had minor brake probs (squeaks that > drove me nuts till I found out ANY pad other than factory will make that > noise!) and dumped it's trans yesterday. I think it's related to the > accident we had a couple months back when someone banged into the back of > the car while we were waiting for a light since it's AWD and the shop says > a torsen bearing was overly compressed and ate a planetary. If not, then > it may be a manufacturing defect and the car has less than 100,000 miles > on it. > It's going to cost $2400 to get the trans rebuilt the right way (they do > the rebuilds for the dealership and I'm getting it done for $1,000 or so > less than the dealer would charge) My wife is convinced not to keep the > car now (after all, it can't even go in and out of the driveway at our new > place in summertime without dragging the bottom!) > Once I find some better seats that we can both stand (I'm tempted to put > in a Comanche bench seat! Even the trip to Ouray was comfy in my old one) > and swap the 4.0L motor in the '93 Cherokee I bought (I have a new one > waiting to be assembled and a high miler but strong running used one > sitting in my '84 J10 I can access soon). Then the Subaru will be up for > sale. (we'll still owe $9,500 on it once we are done! At least the new > trans will have an ATRA lifetime warranty) > > build your truck right the first time! > > looking over the recommendation for tires for my '99 WJ it > seems that the Bridgestone Revo's are the best of all of them. > > http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Sizes.jsp?make=Bridgestone&model=Dueler+A%2FT+R evo > (only question is does Costco or Discount Tire carry them... will check it > out. > ;) > > The Michelin LTX's I've used on my XJ, other WJ and SJ don't rate as high. > I have a set of Michelin LTX A/T's on Superdawg, nice tires... on my > last Benz I replaced Michelin MXV4's with BFG Traction T/A's... I'm > thinking > that Michelin ain't what it used to be. > > Too bad the BF Goodrich Traction T/A's aren't available for larger > vehicles... > > The Avalon's I have on my other '99 WJ aren't even rated, they're ok, was > thinking about using them on mine, but these Revo's look superb. > > Thanx list(s) for the input. > > john > > _________________________________________________________________ > Don^Rt just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! > http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2006 07:09:00 -0500 From: "Don Hansen" Subject: xj: Re: Re: fsj: tires I have 2 sets of BFG Longtrails (225's) on 95+99 XJ's and love them. I don't do much off road, but haven't had a prob. on what I do do (sand+mud;) and they are great in SNOW (Doc? Oh, wrong list.) and quiet on the road. - -D. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john" To: "Damian Shaver" Cc: "full size jeep list" ; "xj-list" ; "diesel-benz list" ; Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2006 9:55 PM Subject: xj: Re: fsj: tires > I'm still being tempted by that coupon for the Michelin LTX's. > BFG AT's are ok, but a harsher ride than I'm looking for, also > wet roads aren't the best for them... better than the non-ko's. > > john > > On Sat, 14 Jan 2006, Damian Shaver wrote: > >>-->John, >>--> >>-->I stand by my recommendation of the BFG All-Terrain T/A's. Low road >>noise >>-->and fairly aggressive tread for some light/medium off-roading. Best of >>-->all...Costco has a coupon out now for $60 off any set of four MIchelin >>or >>-->BFG tires...installed. >>--> >>-->I got mine installed their four about $450 for the set of 4. >>--> >>--> >>-->On 1/14/06, john wrote: >>-->> >>-->> looking over the recommendation for tires for my '99 WJ it >>-->> seems that the Bridgestone Revo's are the best of all of them. >>-->> >>-->> >>-->> >>http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Sizes.jsp?make=Bridgestone&model=Dueler+A%2FT+Revo >>-->> (only question is does Costco or Discount Tire carry them... will >>check it >>-->> out. ;) >>-->> >>-->> The Michelin LTX's I've used on my XJ, other WJ and SJ don't rate as >>high. >>-->> I have a set of Michelin LTX A/T's on Superdawg, nice tires... on my >>-->> last Benz I replaced Michelin MXV4's with BFG Traction T/A's... I'm >>-->> thinking >>-->> that Michelin ain't what it used to be. >>-->> >>-->> Too bad the BF Goodrich Traction T/A's aren't available for larger >>-->> vehicles... >>-->> >>-->> The Avalon's I have on my other '99 WJ aren't even rated, they're ok, >>was >>-->> thinking about using them on mine, but these Revo's look superb. >>-->> >>-->> Thanx list(s) for the input. >>-->> >>-->> john >>-->> >>-->> ---- >>-->> >>-->> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>-->> ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** >>-->> Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold >>-->> ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** >>-->> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>-->> >>--> >>--> >>--> >>-->-- >>-->Later, >>--> >>-->Damian >>--> > > ---- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** > Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2006 09:03:52 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: xj: Re: Re: fsj: tires On Sun, 15 Jan 2006, Don Hansen wrote: > -->I have 2 sets of BFG Longtrails (225's) on 95+99 XJ's and love them. I don't > -->do much off road, but haven't had a prob. on what I do do (sand+mud;) and > -->they are great in SNOW (Doc? Oh, wrong list.) and quiet on the road. > -->-D. how are the long trails on wet road? do you have rain like seattle has rain? john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2006 11:53:34 -0500 From: "Don Hansen" Subject: Re: xj: Re: Re: fsj: tires Oh, we get rain. They're fine. Good on snow=Great on rain!!! - -Don - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john" To: Sent: Sunday, January 15, 2006 12:03 PM Subject: Re: xj: Re: Re: fsj: tires > On Sun, 15 Jan 2006, Don Hansen wrote: > >> -->I have 2 sets of BFG Longtrails (225's) on 95+99 XJ's and love them. I >> don't >> -->do much off road, but haven't had a prob. on what I do do (sand+mud;) >> and >> -->they are great in SNOW (Doc? Oh, wrong list.) and quiet on the road. >> -->-D. > > how are the long trails on wet road? do you have rain like seattle has > rain? > > john > > > ---- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** > Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2006 11:07:34 -0600 From: David Bierschank Subject: Re: xj: Re: Re: fsj: tires I also have long trails on my 87 XJ. I have had them about 2 years and they still look almost new. Not a lot of off road however, mostly city streets. They are real nice in the snow (when we get some) and they are great on rain..... we need some of that here in OK right now also. David On 1/15/06, Okiebinder wrote: > > Oh, we get rain. They're fine. Good on snow=Great on rain!!! > > -Don > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "john" > To: > Sent: Sunday, January 15, 2006 12:03 PM > Subject: Re: xj: Re: Re: fsj: tires > > > > On Sun, 15 Jan 2006, Don Hansen wrote: > > > >> -->I have 2 sets of BFG Longtrails (225's) on 95+99 XJ's and love them. > I > >> don't > >> -->do much off road, but haven't had a prob. on what I do do > (sand+mud;) > >> and > >> -->they are great in SNOW (Doc? Oh, wrong list.) and quiet on the road. > >> -->-D. > > > > how are the long trails on wet road? do you have rain like seattle has > > rain? > > > > john > > > > > > ---- > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** > > Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > > ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > - -- David Bierschank okc67mustang-at-gmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2006 15:00:27 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: xj: tire calculator this is an interesting tool... there are variations between mfr's though: http://www.discounttire.com/dtcs/infoTireMath.dos john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Jan 2006 19:00:02 -0500 From: Bob Subject: Re: xj: tires I have the Costco/BJ's/Sam's "house" tire made by Michelin, the "X Radial LT", on my '95 XJ, and have found it to be an excellent tire with regard to wear, balance, and wet roads....and while I've never had to give a second thought to snow with them, I too was thinking of something a little more aggressive for my '98 XJ and had decided the "Revo" might be the way to go. Of course I rarely do anything really "off road"......such as atempting to haul loaded trailers through the swampy backyards of Snohomish....... Bob in CT john wrote: > looking over the recommendation for tires for my '99 WJ it > seems that the Bridgestone Revo's are the best of all of them. > > http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Sizes.jsp?make=Bridgestone&model=Dueler+A%2FT+Revo > (only question is does Costco or Discount Tire carry them... will check it out. ;) > > The Michelin LTX's I've used on my XJ, other WJ and SJ don't rate as high. > I have a set of Michelin LTX A/T's on Superdawg, nice tires... on my > last Benz I replaced Michelin MXV4's with BFG Traction T/A's... I'm thinking > that Michelin ain't what it used to be. > > Too bad the BF Goodrich Traction T/A's aren't available for larger vehicles... > > The Avalon's I have on my other '99 WJ aren't even rated, they're ok, was > thinking about using them on mine, but these Revo's look superb. > > Thanx list(s) for the input. > > john > > ---- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** > Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 22:12:29 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: xj: Re: [WJ-Grand] Re: fsj: tires On Mon, 16 Jan 2006, David Jones wrote: >-->I looked for the LTX A/T and could not find them. I >-->Dave J the LTX are at both costco and discount I liked mine and they lasted a long, long time... had 'em on an '87 xj and a '99 wj ltd... so, it's down to: revo's, cross terrains, ltx and longtrails... thinking about fuel economy the michelin's are a proven by me on the '99 wj and the '87 xj... 21.3 and 21 (amsoil equipped of course)... that's something I just remembered... michelin is long lived too... currently flip-flopping among the following: - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- a/t revo's $138 each (50k warranty) $552-55.20= $496.80 +++ michelin cross terrain suv $147 each (65k warranty) $588-60-58.8= $469.20 +++ - --------------- michelin ltx $135 each (no mileage warranty) $540-60-54=$426 +++ bfg longtrails $101 each (no mileage warranty) $404-40.4= $363.60 +++ - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- a/t revo's $138 each (50k warranty) $552-55.20= $496.80 +++ max load max tread weight 245/70 SR16 106S SL 500 A B 2094 lbs. 44 psi 13/32" 36 lbs. sect width 9.8" tread width 7.2" overal diameter 29.6" http://www.tirerack.com/images/tires/bridgestone/bs_dueler_at_revo_wl_ci2_l.jpg - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- michelin cross terrain suv $147 each (65k warranty) $588-60-58.8= $469.20 +++ 245/70 SR16 106S SL 700 A B 2094 lbs. 35 psi 11/32" 31 lbs. 9.7" NA 29.5" http://www.discounttire.com/product/tires/mmira5.xl.jpg - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- michelin ltx m/s $135 each (no mileage warranty) $540-60-54=$426 +++ 245/70 SR16 106S SL 500 A B 2094 lbs. 35 psi 13/32" 35 lbs. 9.6" NA 29.1" http://www.discounttire.com/product/tires/mmira2.xl.jpg - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- bfg longtrails $101 each (no mileage warranty) $404-40.4= $363.60 +++ 245/70 TR16 106T SL 500 A B 2094 lbs. 35 psi 13/32" 36 lbs. 9.8" 7.2" 29.7" http://www.tirerack.com/images/tires/bfg/bfg_rdl_lg_trl_ta_owl_ci2_l.jpg - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- long link that compares the tires above: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Compare2.jsp?shipquote=N&RunFlat=null&autoMake=Jeep&autoModel=Grand+Cherokee+Laredo&autoYear=1999&autoModClar=&sortcode=&fromCompare1=yes&partNumber=&make=&model=&price=&prevprice=&discountPrice=&sidewall=&sidewallShown=&promoShortText=&promoUrl=&loadRating=&width=&ratio=&diameter=&speedRating=&qty=&stockMessage=&type=T&frontTire=&frontLeftTire=&rearTire=&rearLeftTire=&wantRHP=&RHPprice=&sortCode=&pre=&sumRating=&spec=&warranty=&comments=&tests=&surveys=&perf=&specCode=&promoLongText=&heatCycleAvail=&shaveAvail=&studAvail=&AddToUser=true&_47R6LONGTTAOWL_qty=4&_47SR6LTXOWL_qty=4&_47SR6ATREVOWL_qty=4&_47HR6CTSUV_qty=4&removeIndex=4%7C47SR6CTSUVOWL&_47SR6CTSUVOWL_qty=4&sortValue=0 ratings summary: longtrails ltx revo suv's $97.00 $129.00 $130.00 $135.00 (tirerack) HANDLING RATING 7.30 8.20 8.80 8.40 DRY TRACTION 8.2 8.9 9.4 9 WET TRACTION 7 8.1 9.2 8.4 SNOW TRACTION 6.7 7.8 9 7.7 RIDE COMFORT 8 8.5 8.8 8.8 NOISE COMFORT 7.8 8.5 8.6 8.6 WEAR 8.2 9 8.6 8.1 $363.60 $426 $496.80 $469.20 (add mount/balance/road hazard, etc... $$$) they're all pretty close in performance... and specs... the michelin cross terrain suv's are only 31 lbs... that will help economy... also have the highest tread life/warranty... well siped pattern too... solid outside supposedly quieter... the comparison shows some advantages in traction to the revo's... the suv's have the mileage and would suspect better economy than the revo's... these are discount tire prices (close to costco's), they offer the same $60 mail in rebate on michelin/bfg that costco has, PLUS, they'll match costco's price, PLUS they have 10% boeing discount... I've bought my tires at discount tires for about the last 20 years, always great service... costco is also a fine place to buy tires and they're open on sundays... :) if I go with the revo's I don't get the $60 rebate and I have to wait about a week to get them... but considering how highly they're rated, AND the fact that the bridgestone blizzak's I had on the Jimmy (still have them for superdawg) were very nice, I may depart from buying michelin/bfg this time around... The stock size for the WJ Laredo is 225/75 r 16, mine currently has 235/70r16's on it... the WJ Limited comes with 245/70r16s. I'm going to go with 245/70r16's, they're only slightly larger than the stock laredo size and more common... they are a bit wider, but that should help the look and ride a bit. The tires on there now are the reason my speedo is so optimistic... (says I'm going faster than I really am) Ok, so I'm thinking after all this research it's down to the Michelin Cross Terrain SUVs and the Bridgestone A/T Revos... mostly wet highway driving, very little snow... some performance driving but mainly interested in quiet and smooth ride and economy (yeah, that's why I got the V8. ;) Cross Terrains or Revo's? what's your thought? (I have had good history with both michelin and bridgestone, have both in the current fleet... superdawg has the michelin a/t's and a set of bridgeston blizzaks for winter...) thanx, john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of xj-digest V1 #2258 *************************