From owner-xj-digest-at-digest.net Wed Mar 26 13:44:46 2008 From: xj-digest xj-digest Wednesday, March 26 2008 Volume 01 : Number 2763 Forum for Discussion of XJ cherokees and wagoneers Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: xj: Weel berings Re: xj: Weel berings Re: xj: Weel berings xj: batteries xj: RE: battery rethink... Plan B. :) Re: xj: Weel berings xj: front wheel bearings Re: xj: front wheel bearings xj: batteries, plan C? XJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeep/xj/ Send submissions to xj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to xj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to xj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 14:08:04 -0700 From: Kevin Subject: Re: xj: Weel berings My younger brother's y2k gets 19.99999 on the highway, seems like about 14-15 around town. His is stock, with 3.55 gears, automatic, low pinion front, and (get this) 8.25 in the rear. Course, the last trip it was on, it made it about 600 miles burning no fuel. Blew a head gasket/cracked the head/something along those lines, so it's on my trailer behind the F250. If it is a cracked head, anyone got the skinny on the quadratec head that supposedly comes loaded ready to bolt on for $500? On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 12:20:29AM -0700, ernest breakfield wrote: > depending on where you drive, how you do it, what kind of gas you get > where you are, how your rig is set up and what kind of tune it's in, a > little over 14 isn't surprising. we figure 15MPG when estimating on > trips, and that's about what we average in mixed city/hwy driving. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 20:43:20 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: Re: xj: Weel berings Did you get the 3 hub bolts on the back? (IIRC, they are 1/2" or 13MM 12 point)Then get a couple with the same thread, but longer and screw them in a long ways, and pound them with a hammer to knock the hub unit loose. PS: Don't forget to loosen the axle shaft nut before pulling! From: Moontanman-at-aol.com Subject: Re: xj: Weel berings In a message dated 3/23/2008 7:19:01 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, hanseda-at-verizon.net writes: Pretty easy to change. Caliper off and 3 bolts from the back. Back the bolts out s bit and tap them with a hammer to get the ass'y started out of the hole. I couldn't get the assembly to budge. I mean we really tried and no joy at all! Michael _________________________________________________________________ How well do you know your celebrity gossip? http://originals.msn.com/thebigdebate?ocid=T002MSN03N0707A ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 23:53:23 EDT From: Moontanman-at-aol.com Subject: Re: xj: Weel berings In a message dated 3/24/2008 11:43:46 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, carnuck-at-hotmail.com writes: Did you get the 3 hub bolts on the back? (IIRC, they are 1/2" or 13MM 12 point)Then get a couple with the same thread, but longer and screw them in a long ways, and pound them with a hammer to knock the hub unit loose. PS: Don't forget to loosen the axle shaft nut before pulling! So what you are saying is that they are not pressed into place? My Cherokee is a 91 if that makes a difference. I got the three bolts out (and the axle nut) but the hub didn't budge. My friend who was doing most of the work told me he thought they needed to be pressed out by a hydraulic press. Screw the longer bolts in and pound them with a hammer to loosen the hub? Cool idea, I never thought of that. Michael **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home. (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 22:02:22 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: xj: batteries what's the largest battery I could fit in about 24" long, by say 10" by 8" :) Rather than having two batteries with about 700CCA each, why not one that's 1400 CCA? :) would simplify this project a bit... :) john ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2008 23:27:28 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: xj: RE: battery rethink... Plan B. :) re: 6.2L Diesel into '91 Grand Wagoneer... still trying to get the fuel system working properly and the excessive cranking etc and a bad 200A manual starter/charger caused a battery to explode http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/03-Mar-22-SnowGeese-battery-mtns-spring/6.2L-Battery-Injectors/ALL.html Plan B... rather than trying to mount TWO batteries under the jeep... I found that a commercial 4D or 8D will fit on the passenger side... about 20" long, 8 to 11" wide, and about 10" tall, about the same as the two MPT-91 european style top posts I have. I'm not sure what the original requirements were for the 6.2L Diesel, something like 500CCA for each stock battery. So if I go with 1100 CCA in one large battery close to the starter I should be ok. I am going to mount my gel cell under the hood and use it for my driving lights/headlights... I'll run the glow plugs off of it as well. This will give me extra reserve for cranking if needed. Will setup an isolator and the gel cell in about the stock location, will cut the inner passenger fender and recess the gel cell or suspend it so it clears the air muffler and front tire. (with 3" of body lift and 2 to 3 inches of spring lift with only 235's clearance won't be a problem) the only minor issue is that a 4D or 8D will weigh about 100 to 120lbs. the stock batteries are in the 35 to 40lb range each for about 80lbs, but if you factor in the overbuilt battery shelves made out of heavy gauge metal that adds about twenty pounds or so. I'll use one of the brackets and modify it to hold a longer battery... will add a bracket on the bottom of the frame to support the weight in addition. one set of heavy cables going to the starter, two lighter cables going to the glow plugs and so on from the gel cell. Did this same setup on my '85 Cherokee XJ TD and it worked out well. here's the most likely battery: Workaholic - 1000 CCA (4D-XHD) Home > Product Search: 1200 CCA > SPECIFICATIONS Weight: 101.10 pounds Length: 20.75 inches Width: 8.25 inches Height: 9.63 inches Cranking Amps: 1250 Cold Cranking Amps: 1000 Voltage: 12 I like the idea of isolating the battery from vibration as David suggested... a link to the search. http://www.interstatebatteries.com/estore/search.asp?details=1&mscssid=1SQSK7KJ1X399LXLAPLTBGLEEJ6J8T3D&Ns=product+Type%7C0%7C%7CRank%7C1&Ntt=1200+CCA&N=0&Dx=mode+matchallany&part_number=4D%2DXHD&Nty=0&Nao=50&D=1200+CCA&Nu=Part+Number&Ntx=mode+matchallany&part_desc=Workaholic+%2D+1000+CCA&searchtype=Y&Ntk=SearchGroup&js=1 a site that had the major groupings of batteries. http://electrobattery.com/commercial.htm BTW, I took the 200A starter/manual charger back to pep boys and got the more expensive 120A AUTOMATIC charger so I don't pop any more batteries... I think that the 200A failed trying to keep the 6.2L cranking, we smelled fried electrics in that thing... glad the weather is getting nicer and the days longer... was out wrenching until 10pm. :) I may be able to resume cranking tomorrow night... the idea of one battery came to me while laying under the jeep tonight... some of my best thinking happens there... :) john http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2008/03-Mar-22-SnowGeese-battery-mtns-spring/6.2L-Battery-Injectors/ALL.html ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Mon, 24 Mar 2008, David Ashby wrote: # You might want to put the batteries on some sort of thin rubber/elastomer # pad (1/4" or less) to absorb some of the vibration to make these last even a # bit longer. Yes I know you are going to a gel-cell but even that can't # appreciate the vibrations of the frame rail very well. Pieces of an inner # tube work well for a few years. # # Dave # ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 06:15:09 -0400 From: "Don Hansen" Subject: Re: xj: Weel berings 13mm 12 point. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Blair" To: Sent: Monday, March 24, 2008 11:43 PM Subject: Re: xj: Weel berings > Did you get the 3 hub bolts on the back? (IIRC, they are 1/2" or 13MM 12 > point)Then get a couple with the same thread, but longer and screw them in > a > long ways, and pound them with a hammer to knock the hub unit loose. PS: > Don't > forget to loosen the axle shaft nut before pulling! > > > From: Moontanman-at-aol.com > Subject: Re: xj: Weel berings > > In a message dated 3/23/2008 7:19:01 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, > hanseda-at-verizon.net writes: > > Pretty easy to change. Caliper off and 3 bolts from the back. Back the > bolts > out s bit and tap them with a hammer to get the ass'y started out of the > hole. > > > > I couldn't get the assembly to budge. I mean we really tried and no joy > at > all! > > Michael > _________________________________________________________________ > How well do you know your celebrity gossip? > http://originals.msn.com/thebigdebate?ocid=T002MSN03N0707A ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 08:58:19 -0400 From: KLuebs-at-washgas.com Subject: xj: front wheel bearings I have a "sacrificial" socket just for this job. Back off the 3 bolts that hold the bearing assembly on from the back, put the sacrificial socket on one of the bolts (which ever one is the most accessible), then smack the crap out of it with a heavy hammer. Once it moves a little, then put the socket on one of the other bolts and smack it until it moves a little, then go to the third and repeat......Keep going a little at a time on each of the 3 bolts and eventually it will come out. I've done it several times, on older XJ's it can take a fair amount of hammering, but it will come out... - --Kurt ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 11:49:47 EDT From: Moontanman-at-aol.com Subject: Re: xj: front wheel bearings In a message dated 3/25/2008 8:58:45 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, KLuebs-at-washgas.com writes: I have a "sacrificial" socket just for this job. Back off the 3 bolts that hold the bearing assembly on from the back, put the sacrificial socket on one of the bolts (which ever one is the most accessible), then smack the crap out of it with a heavy hammer. Once it moves a little, then put the socket on one of the other bolts and smack it until it moves a little, then go to the third and repeat......Keep going a little at a time on each of the 3 bolts and eventually it will come out. I've done it several times, on older XJ's it can take a fair amount of hammering, but it will come out... - --Kurt Thanks to everyone for their help, I will be giving it another go before I take it to a "real" mechanic. Michael Hissom aurea mediocritas **************Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home. (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom00030000000001) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2008 13:43:39 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: xj: batteries, plan C? ok... the guy at interstate battery talked me out of the 4d or 8d truck battery. he has a sale on group 31s, bunch of blems for $38 each... a great buy, problem is the custom tray I have won't hold a 13" long battery, and I'd have to lower it below the frame rail to fit the height... I can build a shield/skid plate for the batteries if they're no lower than the frame. Interstate in Everett has been a great source of info and parts! So, the current frankenstein plan is to (subject to change without notice): - move the driver's side battery tray to the passenger side (tandem setup) - move the passenger's side battery tray back to allow a nerf bar mount - continue cleaning up the acid damage and protect area with rust converter and bed liner - install a stock battery tray under the hood (anyone have one I can borrow/buy or have donated?) the stock tray was removed and it's probably in centralia with the rest of my parts. :) will either eliminate or modify the air intake muffler, that's the next major redesign... dual ram air setup.... :) (step one, get it running... step two comes later) - in the stock tray will put my 800 CCA Optima gel cell off of a 95A isolater, it will run the glow plugs and all lights and accessories. This will allow for cold weather starting confidence and provide a dual system for failover... (not sure why, but I just have to design for failure modes... ;) - in the two trays on the frame rail, pass side, the batteries will ONLY power the starter. - each of the MPT-91, european recessed top post, has about 700 CCA: Group Size Interstate Type CCA1 CA/ MCA2 RC3 (Min.) Warranty (Months) Dimensions (inches) L x W x H Posts 91 (48) MTP-91 700 875 120 85 11-3/8 x 6-7/8 x 7-1/5 - will connect a ground to the battery tray bracket/frame, will run another cable from there to the engine by the starter, may provide a connection between the two trays as well, this will ensure minimal resistance and full current capability from batteries to starter - on the positive cable from the back battery I will run it to the top post of the forward battery and then run one large cable directly to the starter. - the 95A isolater will sit on the pass side inner fender... I'm thinking about adding a relay to bypass the isolator and connect the alternator and both sets of batteries together for "jump starting" purposes... of course it'll be easy enough to have a jumper wire available to connect all three terminals in the event of failure... (wonder if the gel cell and the mpt-91s will all charge properly if connected together???) - will connect a ground cable from frame to front fender/body on both sides. So, at this point I need some hardware, a few cables and a battery tray... A few have commented about the name Omega... trust me, this is my LAST full size Jeep project, well, except for superdawg if he doesn't move to Australia. ;) the next project will likely be an XJ with a Mercedes Diesel... or something along those lines... I may just buy something already running as a 4x4 Diesel and call it good... ya just never know... :) john ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of xj-digest V1 #2763 *************************