From owner-xj-digest-at-digest.net Wed Jun 25 09:44:13 2008 From: xj-digest xj-digest Wednesday, June 25 2008 Volume 01 : Number 2818 Forum for Discussion of XJ cherokees and wagoneers Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: xj: Airbag kit RE: xj: Fuel Pump question RE: xj: Fuel Pump question RE: xj: Fuel Pump question RE: fsj: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question xj: RE: fsj: weight info xj: RE: fsj: weight info RE: fsj: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question XJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeep/xj/ Send submissions to xj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to xj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to xj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 11:16:41 +0100 From: "Stephen Rigley" Subject: xj: Airbag kit Hi, Has anyone installed this kit? http://www.autoaccessconnect.com/jech19to20ai.html Am looking to help the rear springs a little to reduce sag + level side to side (oh.. and reduce "bounciness"). Looks like a better option than replacing the springs .. thoughts? Steve ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 08:45:40 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question Alcohol is indeed destroying fuel pumps because of it's low lubricity. (mechanical as well as electrical pumps) _________________________________________________________________ Earn cashback on your purchases with Live Search - the search that pays you back! http://search.live.com/cashback/?&pkw=form=MIJAAF/publ=HMTGL/crea=earncashbac k ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 08:48:48 -0700 From: "Tesar Landon" Subject: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question There must be a solution for this, as Brazil is using ethanol extensively... - - L - -----Original Message----- From: owner-xj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-xj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Jim Blair Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2008 10:46 AM To: xj-at-digest.net Subject: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question Alcohol is indeed destroying fuel pumps because of it's low lubricity. (mechanical as well as electrical pumps) _________________________________________________________________ Earn cashback on your purchases with Live Search - the search that pays you back! http://search.live.com/cashback/?&pkw=form=MIJAAF/publ=HMTGL/crea=earnca shbac k ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 08:57:02 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question the issue isn't lubricity, it's the fact that some o-rings and seals are attacked by either the alcholol or the methanol. if vitron seals are used they're fine... went through this with my benz... once the original seals / o-rings started leaking and were replaced all was fine... the flex fuel vehicles simply have compatible seals and o-rings... the other issue with ethanol is it tends to attract water which attracts rust which isn't something that makes pumps happy... john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://wagoneers.com john's 6.2L GW: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ SAVE FUEL use AMSOIL Synthetics: http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- On Wed, 25 Jun 2008, Tesar Landon wrote: # There must be a solution for this, as Brazil is using ethanol # extensively... # # - L # # -----Original Message----- # From: owner-xj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-xj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Jim # Blair # Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2008 10:46 AM # To: xj-at-digest.net # Subject: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question # # Alcohol is indeed destroying fuel pumps because of it's low lubricity. # (mechanical as well as electrical pumps) # # _________________________________________________________________ # Earn cashback on your purchases with Live Search - the search that pays # you # back! # http://search.live.com/cashback/?&pkw=form=MIJAAF/publ=HMTGL/crea=earnca # shbac # k # ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 09:02:27 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: RE: fsj: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question What I am seeing in comebacks is the fuel pump bearings are seized. They have no orings in them and rely on the fuel to cool and lube. Viton Orings were used from -at-'90 up in XJs yet they are springing leaks at an alarming rate over the past couple years (I fear a MAJOR carbque summer is coming! Already saw 4 on fire on the side of the highway just between Lynnwood and Bellevue) Adding some lube to the fuel seems to help. (be careful not to use anything with lead in it like 2 stroke oil or you can kill the O2 sensor in injected AND Carter BBD 6 cyl rigs) Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 > Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 08:57:02 -0700 > From: john-at-wagoneers.com > To: xj-at-digest.net > CC: diesel-benz-at-digest.net; fsj-at-digest.net > Subject: fsj: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question > > the issue isn't lubricity, it's the fact that some o-rings > and seals are attacked by either the alcholol or the methanol. > if vitron seals are used they're fine... went through this > with my benz... once the original seals / o-rings started > leaking and were replaced all was fine... the flex fuel > vehicles simply have compatible seals and o-rings... > > the other issue with ethanol is it tends to attract water > which attracts rust which isn't something that makes pumps happy... > > john > > ----- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > http://wagoneers.com john's 6.2L GW: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ > SAVE FUEL use AMSOIL Synthetics: http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > On Wed, 25 Jun 2008, Tesar Landon wrote: > > # There must be a solution for this, as Brazil is using ethanol > # extensively... > # > # - L > # > # -----Original Message----- > # From: owner-xj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-xj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Jim > # Blair > # Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2008 10:46 AM > # To: xj-at-digest.net > # Subject: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question > # > # Alcohol is indeed destroying fuel pumps because of it's low lubricity. > # (mechanical as well as electrical pumps) > # > # _________________________________________________________________ > # Earn cashback on your purchases with Live Search - the search that pays > # you > # back! > # http://search.live.com/cashback/?&pkw=form=MIJAAF/publ=HMTGL/crea=earnca > # shbac > # k > # _________________________________________________________________ The i^Rm Talkathon starts 6/24/08. For now, give amongst yourselves. http://www.imtalkathon.com?source=TXT_EML_WLH_LearnMore_GiveAmongst ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 09:04:17 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: xj: RE: fsj: weight info pretty much ANY Jeep made after '95 has TOO much plastic and gizmos in it for it's own good! Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 > Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 08:54:56 -0700 > From: john-at-wagoneers.com > To: mbalea-at-hotmail.com > CC: fsj-at-digest.net > Subject: RE: fsj: weight info > > http://wagoneers.com/JEEPS/jeep-model-codes.html > > ----- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > http://wagoneers.com john's 6.2L GW: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ > SAVE FUEL use AMSOIL Synthetics: http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > On Wed, 25 Jun 2008, michel balea wrote: > > # > # > # Thank you, too many 2 letter words to remember for my brain. > # > # M > # > # > Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 00:28:11 -0700 > # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com > # > To: mbalea-at-hotmail.com > # > Subject: RE: fsj: weight info > # > > # > > # > WJ is the best. > # > > # > zj has poor suspension, poor > # > fuel system and bad transmissiona, > # > and they're ugly too. > # > > # > :) > # > > # > ----- > # > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > # > http://wagoneers.com john's 6.2L GW: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ > # > SAVE FUEL use AMSOIL Synthetics: http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL > # > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > # > > # > > # > On Wed, 25 Jun 2008, michel balea wrote: > # > > # > # > # > # > # > # This is the funny part about US and euro specs... the GVWR (in the US) and the real weight (F) are in in the specs sheets, but not both.... I learn from our FSJ sites, that the real weight is about 4700-4800 lbs.... last month I had the 74 on the scales: a bit under 4600lbs (No A/C, so skid plates... the bare model) > # > # > # > # And now perusing thru sites.... learnt that the ZJ is about 1000lbs lighter. > # > # > # > # And again... what is the best GC, the ZJ or the WJ..... too many acronyms. Which one do you have again? > # > # > # > # Michel > # > # > # > # > # > # > # > # > Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 19:55:49 -0700 > # > # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com > # > # > To: > # > # > Subject: fsj: weight info > # > # > > # > # > was looking up how much a yard of gravel weighed and found this website: > # > # > > # > # > http://www.reade.com/Particle_Briefings/spec_gra2.html > # > # > > # > # > Density of gravel > # > # > > # > # > A cubic foot of dry, loose gravel with 1/4" to 2" stones is 105 pounds per cubic foot. > # > # > So, a cubic yard is that times 27, or 2835 lb. (There are 27 cubic feet in a cubic yard.) > # > # > > # > # > So, when I haul two yards of gravel in my J10 hydraulic dump trailer that weighs > # > # > 2,000lbs empty, I'm hauling 7,760 lbs... either behind my '91 Grand Wagoneer or > # > # > '99 Grand Cherokee... the GW weighs about 5,600lbs... the GC about 3,950. No > # > # > wonder the GC groans and creaks coming down the driveway... > # > # > > # > # > let's see... 5,600+7,760=13,270lbs or over 6.6 tons... I don't think I want > # > # > to drive very far with that kind of weight... > # > # > > # > # > I think I need to fix my surge brake controller. :) > # > # > > # > # > that raccoon I hit with just the grand wagoneer didn't like the 5,600lbs much, > # > # > first tire made a bit of jolt, second tire was barely a ripple... > # > # > > # > # > what is amazing is that the grand wagoneer actually got 24 mpg on the freeway... > # > # > got to love those Diesels. :) > # > # > > # > # > ----- > # > # > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > # > # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > # > # > http://wagoneers.com john's 6.2L GW: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ > # > # > SAVE FUEL use AMSOIL Synthetics: http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL > # > # > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > # > # > # > # _________________________________________________________________ > # > # The other season of giving begins 6/24/08. Check out the i'm Talkathon. > # > # http://www.imtalkathon.com?source=TXT_EML_WLH_SeasonOfGiving > # > # _________________________________________________________________ > # Need to know now? Get instant answers with Windows Live Messenger. > # http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/connect_your_way.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_ Refresh_messenger_062008 _________________________________________________________________ Need to know now? Get instant answers with Windows Live Messenger. http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/connect_your_way.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_ Refresh_messenger_062008 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 09:39:59 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: xj: RE: fsj: weight info they don't do well in fender benders either... they tend to fold up pretty easily... ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://wagoneers.com john's 6.2L GW: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ SAVE FUEL use AMSOIL Synthetics: http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- On Wed, 25 Jun 2008, Jim Blair wrote: # pretty much ANY Jeep made after '95 has TOO much plastic and gizmos in it for it's own good! # # Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 # # # > Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 08:54:56 -0700 # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com # > To: mbalea-at-hotmail.com # > CC: fsj-at-digest.net # > Subject: RE: fsj: weight info # > # > http://wagoneers.com/JEEPS/jeep-model-codes.html # > # > ----- # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # > http://wagoneers.com john's 6.2L GW: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ # > SAVE FUEL use AMSOIL Synthetics: http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- # > # > # > On Wed, 25 Jun 2008, michel balea wrote: # > # > # # > # # > # Thank you, too many 2 letter words to remember for my brain. # > # # > # M # > # # > # > Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 00:28:11 -0700 # > # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com # > # > To: mbalea-at-hotmail.com # > # > Subject: RE: fsj: weight info # > # > # > # > # > # > WJ is the best. # > # > # > # > zj has poor suspension, poor # > # > fuel system and bad transmissiona, # > # > and they're ugly too. # > # > # > # > :) # > # > # > # > ----- # > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- # > # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # > # > http://wagoneers.com john's 6.2L GW: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ # > # > SAVE FUEL use AMSOIL Synthetics: http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL # > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- # > # > # > # > # > # > On Wed, 25 Jun 2008, michel balea wrote: # > # > # > # > # # > # > # # > # > # This is the funny part about US and euro specs... the GVWR (in the US) and the real weight (F) are in in the specs sheets, but not both.... I learn from our FSJ sites, that the real weight is about 4700-4800 lbs.... last month I had the 74 on the scales: a bit under 4600lbs (No A/C, so skid plates... the bare model) # > # > # # > # > # And now perusing thru sites.... learnt that the ZJ is about 1000lbs lighter. # > # > # # > # > # And again... what is the best GC, the ZJ or the WJ..... too many acronyms. Which one do you have again? # > # > # # > # > # Michel # > # > # # > # > # # > # > # # > # > # > Date: Tue, 24 Jun 2008 19:55:49 -0700 # > # > # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com # > # > # > To: # > # > # > Subject: fsj: weight info # > # > # > # > # > # > was looking up how much a yard of gravel weighed and found this website: # > # > # > # > # > # > http://www.reade.com/Particle_Briefings/spec_gra2.html # > # > # > # > # > # > Density of gravel # > # > # > # > # > # > A cubic foot of dry, loose gravel with 1/4" to 2" stones is 105 pounds per cubic foot. # > # > # > So, a cubic yard is that times 27, or 2835 lb. (There are 27 cubic feet in a cubic yard.) # > # > # > # > # > # > So, when I haul two yards of gravel in my J10 hydraulic dump trailer that weighs # > # > # > 2,000lbs empty, I'm hauling 7,760 lbs... either behind my '91 Grand Wagoneer or # > # > # > '99 Grand Cherokee... the GW weighs about 5,600lbs... the GC about 3,950. No # > # > # > wonder the GC groans and creaks coming down the driveway... # > # > # > # > # > # > let's see... 5,600+7,760=13,270lbs or over 6.6 tons... I don't think I want # > # > # > to drive very far with that kind of weight... # > # > # > # > # > # > I think I need to fix my surge brake controller. :) # > # > # > # > # > # > that raccoon I hit with just the grand wagoneer didn't like the 5,600lbs much, # > # > # > first tire made a bit of jolt, second tire was barely a ripple... # > # > # > # > # > # > what is amazing is that the grand wagoneer actually got 24 mpg on the freeway... # > # > # > got to love those Diesels. :) # > # > # > # > # > # > ----- # > # > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- # > # > # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # > # > # > http://wagoneers.com john's 6.2L GW: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ # > # > # > SAVE FUEL use AMSOIL Synthetics: http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL # > # > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- # > # > # # > # > # _________________________________________________________________ # > # > # The other season of giving begins 6/24/08. Check out the i'm Talkathon. # > # > # http://www.imtalkathon.com?source=TXT_EML_WLH_SeasonOfGiving # > # # > # _________________________________________________________________ # > # Need to know now? Get instant answers with Windows Live Messenger. # > # http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/connect_your_way.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Refresh_messenger_062008 # # _________________________________________________________________ # Need to know now? Get instant answers with Windows Live Messenger. # http://www.windowslive.com/messenger/connect_your_way.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_Refresh_messenger_062008 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 09:40:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Ed Kummel Subject: RE: fsj: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question I remember years ago with an ageing '72 Cutlass 455ci motor, Marvel's Mystery Oil kept that old girl running far longer than it should have! Perhaps its time to begin adding it again to my vehicles! Ed web/gadget guru - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Never mind that we just had an incredibly cold winter in North America and huge record snowfalls across the continent. As Al Gore said to a bunch of us the other day, these record cold spells and record snowfalls are actually caused by global warming. To which Jerry York replied, "Jeez then I guess we better stop this global warming before we all f**king freeze to death, eh?" - - "Fake" Steve Jobs 3/24/08 blog entry - --- On Wed, 6/25/08, Jim Blair wrote: From: Jim Blair Subject: RE: fsj: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question To: "john" , xj-at-digest.net Cc: "full size jeep list" Date: Wednesday, June 25, 2008, 12:02 PM W some lube to the fuel seems to help. (be careful not to use anything with lead in it like 2 stroke oil or you can kill the O2 sensor in injected AND Carter BBD 6 cyl rigs) Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 > Date: Wed, 25 Jun 2008 08:57:02 -0700 > From: john-at-wagoneers.com > To: xj-at-digest.net > CC: diesel-benz-at-digest.net; fsj-at-digest.net > Subject: fsj: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question > > the issue isn't lubricity, it's the fact that some o-rings > and seals are attacked by either the alcholol or the methanol. > if vitron seals are used they're fine... went through this > with my benz... once the original seals / o-rings started > leaking and were replaced all was fine... the flex fuel > vehicles simply have compatible seals and o-rings... > > the other issue with ethanol is it tends to attract water > which attracts rust which isn't something that makes pumps happy... > > john > > ----- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > http://wagoneers.com john's 6.2L GW: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/Omega/ > SAVE FUEL use AMSOIL Synthetics: http://wagoneers.com/AMSOIL > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > On Wed, 25 Jun 2008, Tesar Landon wrote: > > # There must be a solution for this, as Brazil is using ethanol > # extensively... > # > # - L > # > # -----Original Message----- > # From: owner-xj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-xj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Jim > # Blair > # Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2008 10:46 AM > # To: xj-at-digest.net > # Subject: RE: xj: Fuel Pump question > # > # Alcohol is indeed destroying fuel pumps because of it's low lubricity. > # (mechanical as well as electrical pumps) > # > # _________________________________________________________________ > # Earn cashback on your purchases with Live Search - the search that pays > # you > # back! > # http://search.live.com/cashback/?&pkw=form=MIJAAF/publ=HMTGL/crea=earnca > # shbac > # k > # _________________________________________________________________ The im Talkathon starts 6/24/08. For now, give amongst yourselves. http://www.imtalkathon.com?source=TXT_EML_WLH_LearnMore_GiveAmongst ------------------------------ End of xj-digest V1 #2818 *************************