From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Mon Nov 6 22:05:04 2000 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Monday, November 6 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1095 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: Webers for Jeep fsj: Click & Clack fsj: Re: fuel delivery Re: [fsj: Click & Clack] fsj: Uncle Al's pricing fsj: early Wagoneer at Olympic 4x4 in Snohomish, WA fsj: Jensen grilles... fsj: vacuum gauges... fsj: Re: concrete, mud, and planks... stories... fsj: Re: [1FSJ] early Wagoneer at Olympic 4x4 in Snohomish, WA fsj: Re: [1FSJ] early Wagoneer at Olympic 4x4 in Snohomish, WA fsj: Re: xj: ATF +3 - is it OK? Re: fsj: New member fsj: Re: Jeep Wagoneer fsj: fuel systems... 258 fsj: CALL FOR HIGH RESOLUTION FSJ IMAGES fsj: Nov 11th is coming fsj: RE: [1FSJ] vacuum gauges... fsj: RE: [1FSJ] vacuum gauges... Re: fsj: Re: Jeep Wagoneer FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 11:55:32 -0600 From: "Landon Tesar" Subject: fsj: Webers for Jeep Still amazed that there aren't sidedrafts available for the Jeep 6. Much better performance, but not the economy. One less 90 deg. turn for the airflow. Does anyone know of such an adaptation, any other maillist I can query ? Of course, for fuel economy and low end response, SU should be investigated. - - Landon - ----------------------------------- Thanx for your endorsement of the Weber. I've found one for $339 on sale http://www.quadrajet.com/Weber/weber6.asp and another one on ebay for $309... new, dutch auction... and there is a used one on ebay I may bid on. I wonder what the differences are between the various 32/36's... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 12:07:58 -0600 From: "Landon Tesar" Subject: fsj: Click & Clack Hi, wondering about a clicking sound coming from the left front wheel well. My guess is it's the U-Joint between the front axleshaft and the wheel. Click-click-click. pretty constant speed, though doesn't seem related to road speed. Goes away when I apply the brakes. Goes away when applying a load via a rt hand turn. There doesn't seem to be a way to grease this u-joint w/o removing it. Is it time to replace ? Is this the kind of sound that would alert me to impending failure here ? I remember to be careful to not let the end bushing fall off of the inner axleshaft when removing. >From the Haynes manual, this looks like a pretty involved activity. Thanks for pointers. - - Landon '89 GW with higher problem arrival than service velocity. Austin, TX ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 10:20:18 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: fuel delivery At 09:58 PM 11/5/00 -0800, James Blair wrote: >A: You are REALLY dreaming if you think hooking up the motor system out >of an XJ or ZJ that new will be easy! Take a look at all the compu junk >in them! Even the headlights go out if (when) the computer dies! >EVERYTHING runs through that box and a replacement in the middle of >nowhere, when you can't see what caused the problem in the first place >would be expensive and foolhardy! (plus the later model EFI gets WORSE >economy than your '88!) > >John wrote: >My carb on Superdawg (4.2L, 258 I-6) is acting up again at idle... So, >the plan is to replace it with something better. >options: rewiring doesn't worry me... getting all the pieces needed does... this is why I asked the question. :) thanx for the info, looking forward to more... looks like the least painless approach right now is a Weber 32/36 carb. :) john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: 6 Nov 00 11:56:39 MST From: Michael Shimniok Subject: Re: [fsj: Click & Clack] How weird. I'm getting a very similar noise on the LF side, and was wondering what the cause was. Hub? Axle shaft u-joint? It sounds just like a big nail in the tire, but didn't see anything big enough to be causing the noise (louder than most nails). Varies with tire speed, not engine speed. It was happening with the hubs unlocked. Goes away when I swing the wheel a bit to the right, comes back with the wheel pointed straight or left. Braking has no effect. I'm baffled. Not sure if it makes the noise with hub engaged (will find out). TIA, Michael "Landon Tesar" wrote: > Hi, > > wondering about a clicking sound coming from the left front wheel well. > My guess is it's the U-Joint between the front axleshaft and the wheel. > > Click-click-click. pretty constant speed, though doesn't seem related > to road speed. > > Goes away when I apply the brakes. > > Goes away when applying a load via a rt hand turn. > > There doesn't seem to be a way to grease this u-joint w/o removing it. > Is it time to replace ? > Is this the kind of sound that would alert me to impending failure here > ? > > I remember to be careful to not let the end bushing fall off of the > inner axleshaft when removing. > > From the Haynes manual, this looks like a pretty involved activity. > > Thanks for pointers. > > - Landon > '89 GW with higher problem arrival than service velocity. > Austin, TX - --- Michael E. Shimniok - KC0EKI - Michael.Shimniok-at-usa.net "For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong." - H. L. Menken ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 11:24:05 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Uncle Al's pricing This mainly affects those of us up in the Everett, Washington area... (sorry) I bought some gauges at Evergreen Speed on Saturday... Nice units, excellent condition, AutoMeter/AutoGauge units... problem is "uncle" Al uses creative pricing techniques... he doesn't mark stuff on the shelf, you ask him and he comes up with a number. Most of the time you pay the current retail, or maybe, just maybe, a little less. I bought a 6,000rpm Mini-tach... he charged me $80. I checked the retail price: $49.99. I called him this morning, he said that was the right price. I said how about if I buy a new one and return it. He says, ok, I'll give you a CREDIT (at the store) for it. Ok, so now, to save $30 I shouldn't have had to pay, I'm going to order one from Summit or Jegs to return. :) He's an ok guy, and knows his stuff... but this kind of pricing technique will really bite you if you haven't shopped ahead of time. I found his new location, but quite frankly I don't think I'll be returning too often. If you do shop there, know the prices of the stuff before you get there. I paid the correct prices on the other two gauges... actually about a buck more than listed in other catalogs, but since I had the gauges in my hands right away, it was worth it. :) More on gauges later... john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 11:26:54 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: early Wagoneer at Olympic 4x4 in Snohomish, WA I was at Olympic 4x4 in Snohomish on Saturday... they just got a white 65 Wagoneer in... straight body... I'm pretty sure it's got the 230 in it. (In response to our new lister with the Kaiser... ;) It's not likely they'll sell just the valve cover at this point, but they'll have a line on a supply for one. Someone might try to rescue the entire wag... the lot guy suggested I make them an offer... but with 6 rigs right now that would not be an acceptable thing to do a few days from my 25th wedding anniversary... ;) Olympic is closed Sun/Mon... john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 11:29:16 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Jensen grilles... Paul... I'd thought you'd already gotten a set... I saw some in the back of one of the wags at olympic on saturday... one was good, the other had a driveshaft sitting on it... they weren't nutmeg, but were the next color in darkness down... forget which one it was in, it didn't have a back tailgate on it... white one I think... john >Date: Sun, 05 Nov 2000 22:42:14 -0800 >From: Paul & Megan Kershner >Subject: fsj: Front door grills > >Hello listers. > >I am looking for the factory "Jensen" front door grills for a Grand >Wagoneer. My '84 GW had the plastic louvered "Ford" type grills, but I >would like to get the "Jensen" grills off of a later model. I believe >1986 and later had these grills. The color I need is the "Nutmeg" or >sometimes described as "Rust." My second choice is a set of clean - not >cracked - louvered grills in the right color. > > >Thanks, >pk - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 11:38:43 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: vacuum gauges... My son convinced me of the merits of a vacuum gauge. So I picked one up on Saturday... and of course Mark has had fun criticizing my driving techniques. :) And EXACTLY what is WRONG with 0" of vacuum on starting off??? rofl... ;) So, now I'm driving around, one eye on the mirror, one eye on the vac gauge, one eye on the speedo, one eye on the tach... rofl... (helps when you wear bifocals... ;) Used to be I'd get the speedo to the limit asap. Guess that's not the way to get fuel economy. :) Question is this. If I switch my 258 over to a TBI or Mopar Fuel Injection, would the vacuum gauge work the same? Along the same line, would a vacuum gauge work as expected on a 4.0L in my xj? Hoping for better economy... (and hoping no one is behind me...) john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 12:03:28 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: concrete, mud, and planks... stories... well, I don't have planks, but I've got conveyer belts as a floor... however, getting concrete means making it level... the benefit of having it level... well, don't know if you remember the time that Old Blue tried to escape out the back... luckily I had the wheel off and he dragged his brake drum on the ground... :) crushed the floor jack... I've also had my trailer get away and go over the bank into the blackberries... Made for interesting extraction... Old Blue connected to the trailer, a chain going through the carport to the little wagoneer with my 14 year old son driving for the first time in the little wagoneer.... :) 'twas interesting... what a way to learn how to drive? Extracting the old man and his toys out of the blackberries. john At 02:55 PM 11/6/00 -0500, you wrote: >In a message dated 11/6/00 11:45:17 AM Pacific Standard Time, >john-at-virtual-cafe.com writes: > > > carport... plans for garage were scrapped... wife spent too much on the > > kitchen. :( > >Sounds familiar. Besides, compared to the mud any concrete slab at all will >be a huge improvement. In Maine I had a one car garage with a 100 year old >wood plank floor supported by posts. It made things interesting. > >Ben - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 15:28:53 -0500 From: "Ray (lists)" Subject: fsj: Re: [1FSJ] early Wagoneer at Olympic 4x4 in Snohomish, WA > Someone might try to rescue the entire wag... the lot guy suggested > I make them an offer... but with 6 rigs right now that would not > be an acceptable thing to do a few days from my 25th wedding anniversary... ;) Tell your dear wifie that you want it for your anniversary present :-) (but be prepared to come up with something equally nice for her) Ray ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 12:31:22 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: [1FSJ] early Wagoneer at Olympic 4x4 in Snohomish, WA At 03:28 PM 11/6/00 -0500, Ray (lists) wrote: > > be an acceptable thing to do a few days from my 25th wedding >anniversary... ;) > >Tell your dear wifie that you want it for your anniversary present :-) > >(but be prepared to come up with something equally nice for her) >Ray ur such a romantic... ;) john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 12:32:09 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: xj: ATF +3 - is it OK? Subject: Re: xj: ATF +3 - is it OK? it's just the latest spec on ATF. Normally it's safe to use a newer spec rating. Shouldn't be a problem. You can get into problems with some systems that have a special rating, like honda power steering units, and Turbo Diesels. But for ATF and regular gas engines, newer is better. :) of course Amsoil synthetic ATF exceeds the new spec... john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 17:17:47 EST From: BWFerg-at-aol.com Subject: Re: fsj: New member hey... welcome to the group. i have a quick non-fsj related question for ya. WPI.eud, as in worcester polytech? if so, its good to have a fellow "east coaster" join the list. bryan 83 wag ltd. ps. worcester poly tech means "my boy's wicked smaht" (a joke which only new england area people, or fans of "Good Will Hunting" will get...oh well") ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:02:01 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: Jeep Wagoneer At 06:53 PM 11/6/00 -0500, Derek Owens wrote: >John, > I own a 1989 mid-size Jeep Wagoneer Limited....I was looking at > your web site and couldn't help but notice the grill differences. I was > wondering if it was the original or if you put another Jeep's grill on > yours? Another question...have you put any lift kits on your Jeep, > cause it appears to be higher of the ground than mine and if so, what > would you suggest I do to get mine higher, I have a limited income > because I am in College right now, how would I get a couple extra inches > of ground clearance for my Jeep? > >Thanks! > >Fellow Jeep enthusiast, >Derek Owens grilles are interchangeable. :) my 81 Wag ltd had an 86 grille... didn't realize it until after I had it for a while. my '83 J10 has an '83 Cherokee grille. :) guys have put the old style grilles on the newer wags and vice versa. I got springs from on older wagoneer and put 'em on mine to get more lift, along with a set of rancho helper springs. inexpensive way of getting a few inches. :) john ====================================================================================== To subscribe to a list on digest.net, EMAIL majordomo-at-digest.net, no subject needed, in the body: subscribe [ fsj | xj | diesel-benz ] end (note: select only one of the options in the brackets) You will need to reply to an authentication message. Add a "-digest" to any of the lists to subscribe in the digest mode (messages are grouped, less traffic). Please do not send HTML, special characters, images, SPAM, attachments or stylized text to the lists. The "FOUR" List Rules: 1) NO flames. 2) NO foul language. 3) keep it Family oriented. 4) keep the subject list oriented. to post, email [xj | fsj | diesel-benz]-at-digest.net to unsubscribe, email majordomo-at-digest.net in the message: unsubscribe (list name) (your email) end ====================================================================================== john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com/john/book-info.html http://www.wagoneers.com/BIBLE ====================================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 16:07:54 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: fuel systems... 258 Ok, I've got this narrowed down to one of two choices: 1) new Weber 32/36 DGEV - found one for $309 or 2) Howell EFI - kit price $995 plus shipping... (there are two used Webers out there... unknown age/condition, one for $100 (w/o air cleaner) and the other for $167... ) I haven't priced the Mopar kit for MPI, but it's close to $2,000... Any experiences with the Howell kit? It uses GM parts... thanx, john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 20:46:46 EST From: RMSquaredJeeps-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: CALL FOR HIGH RESOLUTION FSJ IMAGES I was in OfficeMax today and they have a special offer going on right now for two calendars for $40. You supply them with 13 images and they supply you with a two calendars 24 hours later from their CopyMax printing centers. I was thinking of producing as a sample to see what it might look like, an FSJ calendar. I haven't decided if I want to limit it to just Wagoneer or be all-inclusive with all different SJs. I haven't decided if I wanted to limit it to essentially stock vehicles like my Super Wagoneer or have modified Jeeps with some in off road situations. Besides my own Super Wagoneer, I already have photography of the M725 that appeared earlier this year in JP along with the J4000 that will appear in the next issue of JP. (Has anyone received it yet if you subscribe? I haven't gotten my copy.) I also have another Cherokee wide track photo portfolio from a story that I haven't finished yet. Here's my plan, since the local CopyMax said that they would work from digital images. I want to assemble 13 high-quality, high resolution images, burn it to CD-ROM, then give them the CD-ROM to produce the calendar. If you would like to participate in this project (the deadline for the price break is 11/11), is for you to send me a high quality image of your FSJ and if I select it for my calendar, I'll send you a copy of the CD-ROM so that you can get your own calendar produced locally. I'm looking for really sharp, clear images, minimum file size of 1 MB, bigger is better since it seems that the images will be about 8.5 x 11. If you give me a crisp, sharp color image, it should be OK, especially since I've learned how to use the Genuine Fractuals program that came with my Nikon Coolpix 990. If you have a clear print, I can try to scan it but I think that if you have access to a current generation 2- or 3-megapixel digital camera, that will give the best results. Don't be afraid to send multiple images, I'll pick the one I think is best. I'm curious to what others of you out there think of the idea...have any of you ever thought about doing something similar? Looking forward to hearing back from many of you - let me see some great shots of your rig. Richard Truesdell Contributing editor, JP Magazine ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 19:47:46 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: fsj: Nov 11th is coming http://www.museum.guelph.on.ca/mccraeflanders.htm ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10 EFax:603-215-1688 http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html ************************************** http://www.museum.guelph.on.ca/mccraeflanders.htm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 20:00:01 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: fsj: RE: [1FSJ] vacuum gauges... A: One thing to keep in mind though. In the EFI set up, RPMs are what you need to control, not manifold vacuum! It makes far less difference because injection isn't as affected by the change as a carb. Lindel wrote: Sure thing, John, manifold vacuum is manifold vacuum. As long as you're using the same reference source (ie, manifold vacuum), then all is well. Lindel - -----Original Message----- From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] Sent: Monday, November 06, 2000 1:39 PM To: Recipient list suppressed Subject: [1FSJ] vacuum gauges... My son convinced me of the merits of a vacuum gauge. So I picked one up on Saturday... and of course Mark has had fun criticizing my driving techniques. :) And EXACTLY what is WRONG with 0" of vacuum on starting off???   rofl... ;) So, now I'm driving around, one eye on the mirror, one eye on the vac gauge, one eye on the speedo, one eye on the tach... rofl... (helps when you wear bifocals... ;)   Used to be I'd get the speedo to the limit asap. Guess that's not the way to get fuel economy. :) Question is this. If I switch my 258 over to a TBI or Mopar Fuel Injection, would the vacuum gauge work the same? Along the same line, would a vacuum gauge work as expected on a 4.0L in my xj? Hoping for better economy... (and hoping no one is behind me...) john ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10 EFax:603-215-1688 http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Nov 2000 20:16:46 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: RE: [1FSJ] vacuum gauges... >A: One thing to keep in mind though. In the EFI set up, RPMs are what >you need to control, not manifold vacuum! It makes far less difference >because injection isn't as affected by the change as a carb. ok, so explain the relationship between vacuum and rpm... and what's the best for fuel economy. :) thanx, john >Lindel wrote: >Sure thing, John, manifold vacuum is manifold vacuum. As long as you're >using the same reference source (ie, manifold vacuum), then all is well. >Lindel - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2000 20:17:29 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: Re: Jeep Wagoneer A: Um, John, you may want to rethink your answer! I'm pretty sure he means your '88 Wagoneer with the Cherokee-cuz-it-hit-a-tree- grill! ROFL!! At 06:53 PM 11/6/00 -0500, Derek Owens wrote: John,                 I own a 1989 mid-size Jeep Wagoneer Limited....I was looking at your web site and couldn't help but notice the grill differences. I was wondering if it was the original or if you put another Jeep's grill on yours?   Another question...have you put any lift kits on your Jeep, cause it appears to be higher of the ground than mine and if so, what would you suggest I do to get mine higher, I have a limited income because I am in College right now, how would I get a couple extra inches of ground clearance for my Jeep? Thanks! Fellow Jeep enthusiast, Derek Owens grilles are interchangeable. :) my 81 Wag ltd had an 86 grille... didn't realize it until after I had it for a while. my '83 J10 has an '83 Cherokee grille. :) guys have put the old style grilles on the newer wags and vice versa. I got springs from on older wagoneer and put 'em on mine to get more lift, along with a set of rancho helper springs. inexpensive way of getting a few inches. :) john ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10 EFax:603-215-1688 http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html ************************************** ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #1095 **************************