From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Tue Dec 19 12:54:16 2000 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Tuesday, December 19 2000 Volume 01 : Number 1145 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: LPG and turbo (Fwd: [strokers] Re: Supercharger?) fsj: OX TRAX - cable driven OX Lockers and wheel spacers! fsj: Re: 1966 wagoneer fsj: The toy's home! fsj: Fsj in a commercial fsj: tranny and transfer? Re: fsj: Fwd: help on tranny (Any Bobtail owners with auto trans?) fsj: Rattle in rear of '84 GW Re: fsj: Fwd: help on tranny (Any Bobtail owners with auto trans?) Re: fsj: tranny and transfer? fsj: more Cherokee questions (a little lengthy) RE: fsj: RE: Re: [1FSJ] I need another Jeep now... fsj: RE: RE: RE: Re: [1FSJ] I need another Jeep now... Re: fsj: tranny and transfer? fsj: 86 GW Shop Manual fsj: Re: tranny and transfer? fsj: QT xfer case and stock locker FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 16:14:03 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: fsj: LPG and turbo (Fwd: [strokers] Re: Supercharger?) Received: from smtpin-102-5.bryant.webtv.net (209.240.198.31) by storefull-614.iap.bryant.webtv.net with WTV-SMTP; Fri, 15 Dec 2000 11:19:21 -0800 (PST) Received: by smtpin-102-5.bryant.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix) id B963F151; Fri, 15 Dec 2000 11:19:21 -0800 (PST) Delivered-To: carnuck-at-webtv.net Received: from ml.egroups.com (ml.egroups.com [208.50.144.77]) by smtpin-102-5.bryant.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix) with SMTP id 243C4162 for ; Fri, 15 Dec 2000 11:19:19 -0800 (PST) X-eGroups-Return: sentto-1399997-2057-976907937-Carnuck=webtv.net-at-return s.onelist.com Received: from [10.1.4.53] by ml.egroups.com with NNFMP; 15 Dec 2000 19:19:06 -0000 X-Sender: rbryce-at-ramsoft.bc.ca X-Apparently-To: strokers-at-egroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-6_3_1_3); 15 Dec 2000 19:18:57 -0000 Received: (qmail 59820 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2000 19:18:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.142) by l7.egroups.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2000 19:18:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ci.egroups.com) (10.1.2.81) by mta3 with SMTP; 15 Dec 2000 20:20:02 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: rbryce-at-ramsoft.bc.ca Received: from [10.1.2.56] by ci.egroups.com with NNFMP; 15 Dec 2000 19:18:47 -0000 To: strokers-at-egroups.com Message-ID: <91dqqc+kdrv-at-eGroups.com> In-Reply-To: <200012151246.HAA19651-at-an.bradford.ma.us> User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 X-Mailer: eGroups Message Poster X-Originating-IP: 24.67.214.252 From: "Robert Bryce" MIME-Version: 1.0 Mailing-List: list strokers-at-egroups.com; contact strokers-owner-at-egroups.com Delivered-To: mailing list strokers-at-egroups.com Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: Date: Fri, 15 Dec 2000 19:18:36 -0000 Reply-To: strokers-at-egroups.com Subject: [strokers] Re: Supercharger? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Doug, Yeah, I¡¦ve been lurking for a while, on quite a few lists. I¡¦m trying to budget my time better and do things like wrap up my Ph.D., while still working to pay the bills, and pay for building my Blazer. We¡¦re in the process of fighting to keep our local trails open, too, which is why any little spare time seems to go right now. Propane is essentially 110 octane, there are different #'s around, seems to depend on which measuring stick you use. You lose a bit of power, but you can make that up easily (and sometimes more) by bumping up the compression or turbo-ing or supercharging an engine. Some guys around here have race on propane. One street engine (Ford big-block in a 1-ton 4x4) is at 12.5:1 compression, propane, and putting out over 600 ponies and 700 ft-lbs torque, naturally aspirated! There are some distinct advantages to it as a fuel, the major disadvantage is availability, which isn¡¦t a problem around here. It¡¦s also half the price of premium ¡¥round here, too. You can either go dual fuel or straight propane, either will work. With EFI, dual fuel will work better than most ¡¥cause you can control the timing advance properly (a major problem with carb¡¦d dual fuel systems.) There are advantages to both. Conversion kits cost ¡¥round $1200US ¡¥round here. That¡¦s to put dual fuel on my pickup. I haven¡¦t got the list of requirements here in front of me, though. I saw some posts on the XJ list that we¡¦re on, and I think some things should be cleared up. This information is according to two turbocharging & supercharging books I¡¦ve read: - - both methods are just ways to force feed your engine with air - - both methods can be built to kick in at any RPM, and max out at a certain PSI. - - camshaft selection is important, at least for turbo. You want little overlap. Phone Crane to find out if your cam is okay, you may actually be told to go back to a smaller cam. - - turbo lag is by (poor) design, not something that has to be there - - superchargers use engine HP to run, so you need a bit of boost to make it worth-while. Turbochargers use the exhaust, so is ¡§free¡¨. It¡¦s a common misconception to think that the backpressure induced by the turbocharger affects hp, it doesn¡¦t (according to these books). But you still need a bit of boost to make the whole system worth- while. I don¡¦t think I¡¦ll tell Rick about this. At least, not yet. ^ú Other notes: - - Your engine has regular cast pistons and cast rings. The common story around here is that forged pistons make noise when they¡¦re cold (different clearances required?), and chrome or moly rings are harder to seat. That¡¦s why Rick assembled your motor with cast pistons. - - Your crank is cast, but these engines are so well designed, what with 7 main bearings, I can¡¦t see there being a strength issue at all. I wouldn¡¦t worry ¡¥bout it. Nor would I worry about having an engine with 60-overbore. If you can avoid a lean condition or a detonation condition, then your engine should do fine. But you may have to do something to deal with higher combustion temperatures, just exactly what I¡¦m not sure, though. - - Your AX-15 is another story. Expect its lifetime to be shortened big time. (My AX-15 is starting to make noises that it needs some TLC.) They are a superior transmission to the Peugot by a long shot, but they still aren¡¦t great. You may have to look at the NV3500 that is starting to show up in some Jeeps from factory to replace the AX- 15. The same goes for your T-case. Get a HD output shaft if you want to play hard regularly. Axle wrap will become an issue, too. - - Your 8.8¡¨ should hold up, but start playing with it in 4wd and expect to spin off some D30 axle shafts (who knows, maybe you could spin off a pinion shaft or some ring gear teeth if you try hard enough!) So you¡¦re going for SSR¡¦s? Mine are long gone, went back to SX¡¦s after cutting down 2 on the first 3 real trail rides. ^ü FYI, my Blazer project is coming together, too. The Caddy 472 is nearing completion. Only the heads and the rest of the top end to go on. 10.3:1 compression, Lunati cam, Edelbrock intake, etc. I¡¦ve also got the propane system for it already. TH400 trans is done, stage 2 shift kit, Wayne set it up to shift VERY hard ^ú. The (Ford) NP205 T-case is done, too. I have to start on NP203 that is going in between, now. And I picked up the axles for the project last weekend. I bought the tires (44¡¨ Gumbo Monster Mudders) about 3 weeks ago. Once the truck is on the road, I¡¦ll likely start building a big engine for it. ^ú (I was toying with twin turbo-ing this motor, but getting it to work and tuned right, etc. was going to be too much like work for now ¡V I want the big Blazer on the road sometime soon.) - --Rob (starting Christmas holidays¡Ktonight! ¡V so don¡¦t expect any email replies for a couple weeks) - -------------------------- eGroups Sponsor -------------------------~-~> eGroups eLerts It's Easy. It's Fun. Best of All, it's Free! http://click.egroups.com/1/9698/0/_/7777/_/976907937/ - ---------------------------------------------------------------------_-> ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 16:51:16 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: fsj: OX TRAX - cable driven OX Lockers and wheel spacers! ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 Comanche http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html ************************************** http://www.oxtrax.com/index.shtml ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 20:42:41 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: 1966 wagoneer At 10:03 PM 12/18/00 -0500, JFGrdovic-at-aol.com wrote: >help >I just bought a 1966 wagoneer and i need parts specifically brake drums any >sources links or info you can share will be greatly appreciated most any NAPA would have info and parts, or JC Whitney even. Standard drum brake parts, shouldn't be hard to locate. john - ------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2000 21:12:10 -0800 From: "Karl Kuehn" Subject: fsj: The toy's home! Well, I can look out the front door and see it. The '77 wag just sitting there, beckoning. I need a new tranny and front drive shaft, possibly other drive train stuff. I'm certain the motor's good ( a little dirty and ugly ), but the rest, ugh... I'm thinking what I'm gonna do is have it towed to a shop, have 'em yard the tranny, quadratrac, diff off, fix/replace it/them, go over the motor, rebuild, tighten, adjust stuff, replace gaskets, basically make that sucker purr and pass emissions. Wouldn't mind adding headers, glasspacks, rumblybump cam for 'coolness', Tammy would get a kick out of it. I imagine I'm gonna spend close to 4K getting all that done, and I anticipate a smooth running, reliable machine that I can trust to cart my family around in all the time. I don't mind spending the dough to make this happen, but I need to know that it's gonna be mechanically 'cherry' at the end, and then I can go into cosmetics/suspension (I want to raise it 6 inches and customize the whole thing), which I'll do myself. Here's my question: Any of you guys out there do this stuff for a living? I got the cash, and I don't mind spending it, but I'd just as soon give it to one of you instead of a shop. I'd expect a bit of a warrantee, and future support. Any takers? Time isn't too much of a crunch, as I expect it to take a couple months to get it where I want it. Lemme know! Thanks Karl ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 21:50:00 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Fsj in a commercial Hershey's pot of gold, the GW shudders to a stop... out of gas. The driver goes for gas while his passengers help themselves to aunty's gift. seen on a canadian cable channel, during the remake of the miracle on 34th st. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 22:35:53 -0800 From: "brian and molly johnson" Subject: fsj: tranny and transfer? which is better 727 or 400? my 8? has the 727 and the 79 i'm fixin to junk has the 400 if the 400 is better can i swap it in place of the 727 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 23:28:51 -0800 From: Paul & Megan Kershner Subject: Re: fsj: Fwd: help on tranny (Any Bobtail owners with auto trans?) Don't jump before you think! If he is that big of an enthusiast, let the dream of driving it again be his reason for rehabilitation and for getting a prosthesis. Look at Ronan Tynan - bilateral leg amputation, but he won several gold medals in paralympic competitions on prostheses for discus, shot put and high jump! Think hard about it before you take his pride and joy apart! pk jim blair wrote: > > A: I have heard of a few conversions, but I'm not on any SWB Jeep lists. > > From: "Dave Cotner Sr." > Hello my fellow listers. > I am in desperate need of some knowledge for my husband. He has had a > bad accident at work and will no longer be able to drive his restored 73 > cj5 jeep. Now this jeep is his baby and he has restored it from the > ground up.. It is currently a 3 speed transmission and I would like to > have it changed over to and automatic for him before he is released form > the hospital. It has a amc 360 motor and is really souped up and I need > to know what automatic transmission will fit in it as for he will be > missing his left leg from the knee down will not be able to operate a > clutch pedal. If you guys can help me I can have the work done at a > local shop. My husband says he will just have to sell the jeep, but I > know that this is his pride and joy for he has done all of the work > himself and it will break his heart if he sells it . Please help > Thankyou for your time .. > > ************************************* > JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10 4.6L, O/D auto on LPG, '86 Comanche with > AMC 4 cyl, 5 speed http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html > ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 23:48:42 -0800 From: Paul & Megan Kershner Subject: fsj: Rattle in rear of '84 GW As I drive down the street, sometimes I have heard this rattle that lasts maybe about 2 seconds and goes away. It sounded like it could have been the tire jack in the RR wheel-well or the rear window glass - metal to metal or glass to metal sound. Today on hte way to work, I heard it for a good 3-4 minutes and could not discern where it was coming from. I tried shifting into neutral and revving the engine, pushing the rear window up (it didn't move, so it was closed all the way), I tried rocking the car to check for loose universals, but nothing in particular would make it stop or start. After it stopped (by itself), I didn't hear it again until going home from work. Just a short rattle again... Any ideas what it may be? It doesn't seem to be speed related, but who knows??? Thanks, pk '84 GW ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 07:02:33 -0600 From: JeepNut Subject: Re: fsj: Fwd: help on tranny (Any Bobtail owners with auto trans?) jim blair wrote: > A: I have heard of a few conversions, but I'm not on any SWB Jeep lists. > > From: "Dave Cotner Sr." > Hello my fellow listers. > I am in desperate need of some knowledge for my husband. He has had a > bad accident at work and will no longer be able to drive his restored 73 > cj5 jeep. Now this jeep is his baby and he has restored it from the > ground up.. It is currently a 3 speed transmission and I would like to > have it changed over to and automatic for him before he is released form > the hospital. It has a amc 360 motor and is really souped up and I need > to know what automatic transmission will fit in it as for he will be > missing his left leg from the knee down will not be able to operate a > clutch pedal. If you guys can help me I can have the work done at a > local shop. My husband says he will just have to sell the jeep, but I > know that this is his pride and joy for he has done all of the work > himself and it will break his heart if he sells it . Please help > Thankyou for your time .. > > ************************************* > JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10 4.6L, O/D auto on LPG, '86 Comanche with > AMC 4 cyl, 5 speed http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html > ************************************** - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------- '87 Street Comanche #24/100 '88 Grand Wagoneer ...and they say there's only one... '92 Cherokee - ---------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 08:09:16 CST From: Dan Black Subject: Re: fsj: tranny and transfer? "brian and molly johnson" said: {- which is better 727 or 400? my 8? has the 727 and the 79 i'm fixin to junk {- has the 400 if the 400 is better can i swap it in place of the 727 Most people say they're virtually identical for quality, reliability, etc., and both are pretty solid. I've personally had several with 727s and can't remember having any major problems -- though I did have problems with transfer cases on one which had probably been abused by previous owners. Only have one TH400, and that's on my current '74. It seems a little slow and sloppy to shift, but it's only been a few hundred miles since the rebuild, so I can't fairly pass judgement yet. (IIRC, the previous owner had landed it on a rock or something and punched a hole in the case; at any rate, I don't think it was anywhere near standard use that required the rebuild. And it had over 100Kmi on it anyway.) Where are you? I have a 727 on an '85 that is probably still good. (That's the one with the toasted transfer case, but that's broken in half -- the transmission appears to be intact and is probably fine.) I'm in central Iowa. If you wanted to come do all the work to take it off, you could have it for free. (But I ain't doin' it.) It also has a 360 that should work -- but I'd recommend a rebuild to be safe. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If ignorance is bliss, why aren't more people happy? - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 10:19:42 -0500 From: "George, Frank" Subject: fsj: more Cherokee questions (a little lengthy) Its starting to look like my plans for a drivetrain swap are getting more difficult by the minute. Hmmm ... Decisions ... decisions. I've only had the two Chero's for a couple of weeks now. I sold a motorcycle in order find a toy I can share with my kids (they're too young to ride). The main issues I have with the 83 Selec-trac are (1) the front axle is vacuum actuated (how do I lock into 4WD? prev own removed vacuum lines and left it in 2WD :-( ); (2) The rear is an open differential. The 79 is limited slip. How difficult is a limited slip transplant? (or should I buy a locker?) (3) The tranny (727) is slipping bad when cold (plenty 'o fluid. mostly when using reverse. is it a band adjustment or rebuild?) and (4) There's some slop when I rotate the rear driveshaft by hand. U-joints? Diff? or is this a symptom of a loose chain in the xfer case? I'm waiting on my Service Manual to arrive, until then can someone clarify the Selec Trac system (NP208) for me. From looking up past FSJ digests and digging around under the truck, it looks like the NP208 is a full time unit and the 2WD mode is derived by a vacuum actuated disconnect on the front differential. In "HI" mode on the floor lever, I can rotate the front driveshaft by hand and no light illuminates on the dash. In "LO" mode on the floor lever, I cannot rotate the front driveshaft and the 4WD light illuminated on the dash. Also, there does not appear to be a neutral between the two modes. Like I said earlier, the P.O. removed the vacuum lines between the mode switch and the differential. I have 2 hoses and there appears to be 3 connections at the diff. Hmmm ... All answers are appreciated. A quick fix to the lock the front diff into 4WD is especially appreciated. We're due for a few inches of snow here in Virginia tonight and we all know that's the perfect excuse to play. Regards, Frank George Petersburg, VA 83 Cherokee Laredo Wide-Trac 79 Cherokee Chief (organ donor) 84 Ford Ranger (parts hauler) 93 Hyundai Scoupe Turbo (don't ask) 98 Subaru Outback (mama's ride) 91 Kawasaki Concours (pending sale) 83 Moto Guzzi LeMan III (italian mistress) 7 Vehicles ... 2 Drivers. The way life ought to be. ------------------------------ Date: 18 Dec 00 12:51:48 MST From: Michael Shimniok Subject: Re: [fsj: Re: jeep wagoneer (cherokee) questions] Yes, you'll need to swap both axles to 79 style, with passenger side offset. Is it worth the effort...? Up to you. I'm happy keeping my 727 but swapped the NP228 (86 GW) with an NP208. I hear tell a 727 can be rebuilt with HD components to the point where it's quite stout. When mine goes out I'll give that a go. Michael "George, Frank" wrote: <> Michael E. Shimniok - KC0EKI - Michael.Shimniok-at-usa.net "For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong." - H. L. Menken ------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 10:16:30 -0600 From: "Gaines, Kenneth L. MM2 (SIMA-ING)" Subject: RE: fsj: RE: Re: [1FSJ] I need another Jeep now... If it is in the truck, you can have it. I will look when I get home from work today and let you know. I haven't really taken inventory of what is in the truck's interior and what isn't. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 10:23:42 -0600 From: "Gaines, Kenneth L. MM2 (SIMA-ING)" Subject: fsj: RE: RE: RE: Re: [1FSJ] I need another Jeep now... I should know something in a day or two. I am looking into the Holley carb this afternoon and will know something by Thurs. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 09:06:36 -0800 From: "Karl Kuehn" Subject: Re: fsj: tranny and transfer? Actually, that would be sweet, because I think I need a TH400. Lemme know what you want for it, and also where you're at... - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan Black" To: "Full Size Jeeps" Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2000 6:09 AM Subject: Re: fsj: tranny and transfer? > "brian and molly johnson" said: > {- which is better 727 or 400? my 8? has the 727 and the 79 i'm fixin to junk > {- has the 400 if the 400 is better can i swap it in place of the 727 > > Most people say they're virtually identical for quality, reliability, > etc., and both are pretty solid. > > I've personally had several with 727s and can't remember having any > major problems -- though I did have problems with transfer cases on one > which had probably been abused by previous owners. Only have one TH400, > and that's on my current '74. It seems a little slow and sloppy to > shift, but it's only been a few hundred miles since the rebuild, so I > can't fairly pass judgement yet. (IIRC, the previous owner had landed > it on a rock or something and punched a hole in the case; at any rate, I > don't think it was anywhere near standard use that required the rebuild. > And it had over 100Kmi on it anyway.) > > Where are you? I have a 727 on an '85 that is probably still good. > (That's the one with the toasted transfer case, but that's broken in > half -- the transmission appears to be intact and is probably fine.) > I'm in central Iowa. If you wanted to come do all the work to take it > off, you could have it for free. (But I ain't doin' it.) > > It also has a 360 that should work -- but I'd recommend a rebuild to be > safe. > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ----- > If ignorance is bliss, why aren't more people happy? > -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 11:29:43 -0600 From: Brian Wall Subject: fsj: 86 GW Shop Manual As a new owner, I'm quickly discovering the value of having a factory shop manual. I remember seeing here previously a source for those. Can anyone again provide that info? Or, does someone have one for this model they'd consider letting go? B Wall '86 GW (no name yet - considering "mystery machine" given it's complex nature) OKC ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 09:02:42 -0800 From: "Karl Kuehn" Subject: fsj: Re: tranny and transfer? Uhhh, whichever one I don't need is the best one for you! hehe - ----- Original Message ----- From: "brian and molly johnson" To: Sent: Monday, December 18, 2000 10:35 PM Subject: fsj: tranny and transfer? > which is better 727 or 400? my 8? has the 727 and the 79 i'm fixin to junk > has the 400 if the 400 is better can i swap it in place of the 727 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Dec 2000 12:08:59 -0600 From: "Gaines, Kenneth L. MM2 (SIMA-ING)" Subject: fsj: QT xfer case and stock locker Fellow Jeepers, I have a question about the engine and tranny swap that I am about to perform. This concerns the use of the older model QT xfer case and the 1981 model QT xfer case. My current setup (in my 81 Wag with AMC 360) is the stock QT case and an apparrently stock rear lockup diff. I have just purchased a parts Wag (1979 model) to scavenge power train and other assorted parts (as you have all probably seen from my recent postings to the list). Well, as I was reading the 1979 Jeep TSM, I noticed that the 1979 QT case had the Emergency Drive feature that is not present in the 1981 model QT case. The 1979 Wag also had front and rear limited-slip diffs. The diffs in my 1981 Wag are setup with a rear locker and a front limited-slip. The question I have is this: if I put the 1979 QT case into the 1981 Wag with the rear locker, will I end up grenading the tranny and QT case if I use the Emergency Drive feature? Oh yeah, I almost forgot about this....I am swapping the transmission from the 1979 Wag (a TH400 box) into the 1981 Wag (OEM is a 727). I have the driveshafts that came with the 1979 Wag so that shouldn't be a problem. Are the bolt patterns on each end of the transmission different between the two years? I guess that a better wat of phrasing the last question would be this: did AMC change the bolt patterns on the back of the engine for each individual tranny? How about the bolt holes between the QT and the TH400 vs the TF727? I know that this probably won't present a problem because I am actually using the engine that came with the 1979 TH400, but I am a little concerned about the frame cross-members and the QT cases. I have both cross-members, but will the bolt holes in the 1979 cross-member line up with the bolt holes in the 1981 frame? Making this work isn't really a problem, but it would be nice to know what kind of work/materials will be required for the whole project. I am really afraid that the 2 QT cases will have different bolt patterns and that I will have to fabricate some kind of adapter kit to get the whole assembly to mate together. Anyway, if anyone has any info regarding this swap, I would appreciate it. If an adapter is required to make this work, would someone out there have a drawing from a previous swap like this? Hope everyone has a great Holiday Season. (only 5 shopping days left....) Ken ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #1145 **************************