From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Tue Mar 19 09:28:54 2002 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Tuesday, March 19 2002 Volume 01 : Number 1594 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: fsj: Exhaust Re: fsj: Exhaust fsj: Exhaust gaskets don't work...use RTV fsj: Re: Exhaust/headers/etc. fsj: rebuilt transfer cases ... anybody work with transfercases.com ? fsj: 4 aluminum wheels with RWB caps Re: fsj: Exhaust fsj: 63 Willys - More Progress Re: fsj: Exhaust gaskets don't work...use RTV fsj: Exhaust fsj: TH400 info fsj: Re: parts Re: fsj: Exhaust fsj: how to seal exhaust manifolds??? FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 23:43:28 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: Exhaust From: "Brian Turner" Ok on the exhaust how is the best way to fix stock eshust problem with the heart riser problem? How do you replace the riser with out spenting 85 bucks on a new one. And if you do remove how do you seal the exhaust with a flat gasket? Do you braze in the old one with out guts or gasket? Is there a replacement part that takes its place with out guts? Have to take the Jeep back in a couple of days to get done. Because the next progect is the flex plate, which involese dropping the exhaust to get to the tranny and transfer case. Have to move them to replace the flex plate. Right now the flex plate sound better than a machine gun. So it is only a mover in the drive way. Brian 73 Wag 78 Cherokee & Nephew's 79 Wag A: The heat riser can be replaced with a solid open piece or weld up the holes where the old hinge came through. It just makes your motor run rougher cold. ************************************* JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 MJ http://www.geocities.com/eaglemania2002/ Black Jack's before pic: http://wagoneers.com/JEEPS/FESTS/Snohomish-April2-2000/PIC00004.JPG ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 07:55:20 CST From: Dan Black Subject: Re: fsj: Exhaust Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) said: {- From: "Brian Turner" {- Ok on the exhaust how is the best way to fix stock eshust problem with {- the heart riser problem? How do you replace the riser with out spenting {- 85 bucks on a new one. And if you do remove how do you seal the exhaust {- with a flat gasket? Do you braze in the old one with out guts or gasket? {- Is there a replacement part that takes its place with out guts? Have to {- take the Jeep back in a couple of days to get done. {- {- A: The heat riser can be replaced with a solid open piece or weld up the {- holes where the old hinge came through. It just makes your motor run {- rougher cold. I just had mine done; they replaced it with a spacer piece of some sort. I think it's starting to click a little more again, but I'm sure that's just the local Tuffy's -- they can't seem to get anything right on the first try since their best mechanic left. Anyway, that's definitely what I'd suggest. I've never seen a working heat riser on these things, so I'm fully convinced all they do is break and make noise. Not worth replacing with another, that's for sure. And what Jim said about making your motor "run rougher cold" -- that's only if the heat riser was working in the first place. I think if it's making noise, it's probably broken and non-functional, so it's not helping you when the engine's cold now anyway. I'd wager the vast majority of FSJ owners who have a factory heat riser won't see any cold-engine difference by taking it out of the equation (because they're already not working). - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You look like a million dollars. All green and wrinkled. - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 06:44:45 -0800 (PST) From: Greg Loxtercamp Subject: fsj: Exhaust gaskets don't work...use RTV WRT to RJ's thread. Don't use gaskets when putting the stock exhaust manifolds on. On my '79 360, I tried and tried and tried to get the head <-> manifold to seal with the gaskets. It would work for a couple of months, but then...tick,tick,tick. I used the gaskets with and without RTV. I don't know, the NAPA gaskets just didn't seem to fully line up. Finially, I used high-temp RTV without the gaskets...I can't remember, either the copper or the orange stuff...it's the one with the dude applying it to the headers. This seem to work much better, but I think it still eventually made some noise...or was it the manifold <-> pipe connection...that always caused grief too. If I had to do it over again (I currently don't have a Jeep), I would get the mating surface of the manifold machined, then use hi-temp RTV only...applying it correctly (whatever that means...curing first?). Are there special bolts that you should use??? I think mine were hollow...I suspect this helped with the expansion, right? BTW, the factory service manual doesn't say to use anything...if I recall correctly... Just my $.02 worth...Greg Yahoo! Sports - live college hoops coverage http://sports.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 11:02:26 -0700 From: Tesar Landon-r16884 Subject: fsj: Re: Exhaust/headers/etc. Hi all, I've been through this thing with the heat riser. Yes, the later models, '89+ at least, do not have the donut gasket, but I don't think it matters. I suggest you pull off the heat riser, pull out the guts, tap the holes, find two stubby bolts, and JB Weld them in place. Install with new set of stock for your year gaskets. Did mine about a year ago, and no complaints, though I do have to start twice on cold mornings (TX - it ain't cold, so YMMV) Did get a quote from crazyjeepman-at-aol.com that he had several for $20 + shipping. And you should consider the impact of your individual rich exhaust impact to the environment. This was all made easier by having removed the exhaust manifolds and having new studs installed at a muffler shop some time before. You may have to do this. Thanks, P'Blaster for dissolving what was left of the threads. - - Landon ============================================= Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2002 23:36:56 -0800 From: "Brian Turner" < brian10070-at-earthlink.net > Subject: fsj: Exhaust Ok on the exhaust how is the best way to fix stock eshust problem with the heart riser problem? How do you replace the riser with out spenting 85 bucks on a new one. And if you do remove how do you seal the exhaust with a flat gasket? Do you braze in the old one with out guts or gasket? Is there a replacement part that takes its place with out guts? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 10:56:06 -0800 From: cyrus-at-badfuton.cncdsl.com Subject: fsj: rebuilt transfer cases ... anybody work with transfercases.com ? my '86 gw needs a new transfer case ... i live here in no.cal, was thinking of having transfer case express rebuild my np208 ... anybody have experience with these guys ?? thanks, c.s. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 12:37:50 -0800 From: "Jim B" Subject: fsj: 4 aluminum wheels with RWB caps These are the slotted ones like I had on Elmo ('83 Cherokee) and they are nearly showroom condition. There are 4 non-descript 235/75 15 tires on them that I can have removed (got rid of my tire machine a little too soon!) I'm open to offers and they can be shipped UPS (probably cost -at- $60 for shipping in US) I'll be going to BC on thursday the 21st (Mission in particular, by way of Aldergrove) so if someone up there is interested, let me know. I'd like to keep them, but I already have 4 16" aluminum rims with brand new 255/85/16 Avon tires on that I paid a grand for (haven't even turned once. I put them on Elmo for pics that used to be on %^&**# Photopoint) unless someone wants to buy them for what I paid for them (they are 33/10.5/16 equivalent) so I can put bigger tires on? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 15:18:10 -0600 From: "R.J. Baynum" Subject: Re: fsj: Exhaust That is all the Heat riser was for,.. is to let the warm air rise to get to the carb in the automatic choke, temp sensor coil, as it warms the coil spring it backs down the auto choke.. right? R.J. James Blair wrote: > From: "Brian Turner" > > Ok on the exhaust how is the best way to fix stock eshust problem with > the heart riser problem? How do you replace the riser with out spenting > 85 bucks on a new one. And if you do remove how do you seal the exhaust > with a flat gasket? Do you braze in the old one with out guts or gasket? > Is there a replacement part that takes its place with out guts? Have to > take the Jeep back in a couple of days to get done. Because the next > progect is the flex plate, which involese dropping the exhaust to get to > the tranny and transfer case. Have to move them to replace the flex > plate. Right now the flex plate sound better than a machine gun. So it > is only a mover in the drive way. Brian > 73 Wag > 78 Cherokee > & Nephew's 79 Wag > > A: The heat riser can be replaced with a solid open piece or weld up the > holes where the old hinge came through. It just makes your motor run > rougher cold. > > ************************************* > JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 MJ > http://www.geocities.com/eaglemania2002/ > Black Jack's before pic: > http://wagoneers.com/JEEPS/FESTS/Snohomish-April2-2000/PIC00004.JPG > ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 13:36:02 -0800 From: "Faith Jeff" Subject: fsj: 63 Willys - More Progress Got some cool stuff done to the Wagoneer this weekend. Now that I have the new axles, I'm getting ready for my new springs. Had been spraying penetrating oil on the nuts and bolts for a few days. On Sunday I unbolted the u-bolts etc from the rear Dana44 axle and rolled it out of the way...never to go back on the jeep. after that I took off the rear leaf springs. After I got them off I discovered one of the old spring packs had 2 broken springs! Spring removal went okay, nothing broke, snapped nor bent. All the bolts and nuts came out with some effort, and a long handled ratchet driver. Took all of 2 hours I think for both springs. Two jack stands, and a floor jack and my big brother were all that I used for support. I also removed the big-ass headers that had the psgr side one in the way of my (yet to be installed) front driveshaft. Swapped them out for smaller ones that were made for a GM-350 into a CJ. Fit is good, and they're a bit quieter running open....still need to run exhaust in this thing. Later, Jeff This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, contains information from Prescription Solutions which may be confidential or privileged. The information is intended to be for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify the sender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy all electronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 15:45:59 -0600 From: "R.J. Baynum" Subject: Re: fsj: Exhaust gaskets don't work...use RTV really , why not use both? then again.. I could why.. or maybe graphite gasket because it's stronger, I am assuming? I don't think there is any special bolts.. But I did use some alum metallic greasy stuff that you paint on, it's a silver colored anti size lube, you can put it on the bolts or what ever you don't want to lock up on you, even with stands high temps.. My friend " Don Hodges" the Mechanic uses this, and makes a point to be on all things that tend to seize up or rust up from heat or what ever, so it does not have to be short of a bear fight, to get it to come off, when and if, he ever needs to next time.. I think I will take of both sides and check, even though the left is not leaking, or leave the left alone? But, they say if it's not broke, don't fix it.. hmmm.. we will see.. They might be hollow.. I was thinking about buffing the metal with sandpaper, to get a good grip with the RTV gasket Goop, what kind of sand paper should I use? R.J. 80 J-10 Honcho Greg Loxtercamp wrote: > WRT to RJ's thread. Don't use gaskets when putting the stock exhaust manifolds > on. On my '79 360, I tried and tried and tried to get the head <-> manifold to > seal with the gaskets. It would work for a couple of months, but > then...tick,tick,tick. I used the gaskets with and without RTV. I don't know, > the NAPA gaskets just didn't seem to fully line up. > > Finially, I used high-temp RTV without the gaskets...I can't remember, either > the copper or the orange stuff...it's the one with the dude applying it to the > headers. This seem to work much better, but I think it still eventually made > some noise...or was it the manifold <-> pipe connection...that always caused > grief too. > > If I had to do it over again (I currently don't have a Jeep), I would get the > mating surface of the manifold machined, then use hi-temp RTV only...applying > it correctly (whatever that means...curing first?). Are there special bolts > that you should use??? I think mine were hollow...I suspect this helped with > the expansion, right? > > BTW, the factory service manual doesn't say to use anything...if I recall > correctly... > > Just my $.02 worth...Greg > Yahoo! Sports - live college hoops coverage > http://sports.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 15:21:36 -0800 From: "Brian Turner" Subject: fsj: Exhaust Got my old stock exhaust manifolds out and looked at them. So, it looks like I am going to buy new studs and then have the riser brazed up when at the muffler shop. Then a new pipe for about a foot to meet the new exhaust. This way I can pull the exhaust to fix the machine gunning flex plate. The fun part is not getting to town, it is down hill. But getting back. Came up the hill to the house at about 2 mph last time. Ran solid, just noisy. Have the new flex plate and front tranny seal all ready to go. Also going to use the anti seize and I use the 1 inch brass nuts. They do a really good job on the tail pipe and can be removed because the brass does not rust with the stud. Brian 73 Wag 78 Cherokee & Nephews 79 Wag ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 16:57:38 -0800 From: "Phillips, Scott" Subject: fsj: TH400 info I've got a '76 Wag with the 401/TH400/Quadratrac combo in it. I've got a line on a nice CJ Dana 300 and was wondering if it will bolt up to the TH400? (I don't know if the bolt patterns are the same or if I'll need an adapter for the 300 to bolt up to the 400). Anyone who can let me know I'd appreciate it. Thanks! Scott ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 22:41:51 -0600 From: "Vince Orr" Subject: fsj: Re: parts Brian: How about a crate motor? I'm going to order one soon myself. Long block 360. Check out this link: They replace pushrods and rocker arms and the price is very affordable. Not sure if they charge for shipping. http://www.citymotorsupply.com/ - --Vince '81 Wagoneer '99 TJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Turner" To: "Full Size Jeep" Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2002 9:32 PM Subject: fsj: parts > Just went to autoparts.com and was looking at there site. Does any one know > anything about them? Is it a waste of time or can you get parts for amc? The > reason I ask is because they ask for the card. Am leary of giving it out. So > if the site is well worth it, I will. Would like any feed back. Thanks. > > On a second note, started looking into the cost of rebuilding the 360 in the > 78 Cherokee. By my estimate it is going to be around a twelve hundred to > fifteen hundred. This is with me pulling the motor and tearing down, shipping > out for the machine work and putting back together. And all the other little > things that go along, like rebuild carb, new water pump/distributor and all > the other little goodies. Going to school full time and working part time, > could pull this off but would stretch the pocket book. Does any one know of a > good running 360/401 they are will to sell (live in Wash state). This one has > a bad crank, sometime about running it without oil. But all the other parts > are ok (will well worn but useable). If I fix the motor and something else > goes out would not have the bucks to fix. If any one has any ideas or leads, > please let me know. Brian > > 73 wag > 78 Cherokee ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2002 23:07:02 -0600 From: "Vince Orr" Subject: Re: fsj: Exhaust Do you need a heat riser on a fuel injected motor? - --Vince '81 Wag '99 TJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "R.J. Baynum" To: "James Blair" Cc: Sent: Monday, March 18, 2002 3:18 PM Subject: Re: fsj: Exhaust > That is all the Heat riser was for,.. is to let the warm air rise to get to the > carb in the automatic choke, temp sensor coil, as it warms the coil spring it > backs down the auto choke.. > right? > > R.J. > > James Blair wrote: > > > From: "Brian Turner" > > > > Ok on the exhaust how is the best way to fix stock eshust problem with > > the heart riser problem? How do you replace the riser with out spenting > > 85 bucks on a new one. And if you do remove how do you seal the exhaust > > with a flat gasket? Do you braze in the old one with out guts or gasket? > > Is there a replacement part that takes its place with out guts? Have to > > take the Jeep back in a couple of days to get done. Because the next > > progect is the flex plate, which involese dropping the exhaust to get to > > the tranny and transfer case. Have to move them to replace the flex > > plate. Right now the flex plate sound better than a machine gun. So it > > is only a mover in the drive way. Brian > > 73 Wag > > 78 Cherokee > > & Nephew's 79 Wag > > > > A: The heat riser can be replaced with a solid open piece or weld up the > > holes where the old hinge came through. It just makes your motor run > > rougher cold. > > > > ************************************* > > JimBlair, Seattle,WA '84 J10, '86 MJ > > http://www.geocities.com/eaglemania2002/ > > Black Jack's before pic: > > http://wagoneers.com/JEEPS/FESTS/Snohomish-April2-2000/PIC00004.JPG > > ************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2002 07:12:55 -0800 (PST) From: Greg Loxtercamp Subject: fsj: how to seal exhaust manifolds??? > really , why not use both? The gasket acts as an insulator between the head and the manifold. With the gasket, the manifold temps at the mating surface will increase over that found without a gasket. If you put RTV on the manifold side of the gasket, the heat will burn away the RTV. So, if you choose to use both, I would suggest only putting RTV on the head side. I would think that a machined manifold against a head with only hi-temp RTV would be best. When I did it, the RTV that squeezed out was still plyable after a year. I also think retorquing the manifold bolts every so often is also a good idea. Also, anyone have any thoughts on the hollow exhaust manifold bolts vs standard bolts? Also, would you recommend anti-sieze on the bolts? These, of course, are just my thoughts...Greg Yahoo! Sports - live college hoops coverage http://sports.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #1594 **************************