From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Thu Jan 9 16:36:44 2003 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Wednesday, January 8 2003 Volume 01 : Number 1830 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: vac diagram fsj: RE: siping - DO IT! ;) fsj: Re: [WJ-Grand] RE: siping - DO IT! ;) Re: fsj: Need 88 Vacuum Diagram Help fsj: RE: wiring fsj: Re: Ken's project fsj: GM MPI conversion site fsj: insanity from DC fsj: Re: window seals FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 13:53:05 -0700 From: Tesar Landon-r16884 Subject: fsj: vac diagram Yeah, like the brake booster! sorry Jay no help. - - Landon '89 GW - ------------ Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 10:40:26 -0500 From: James Isennock Subject: fsj: Need 88 Vacuum Diagram Help I'm hoping someone can either provide or direct me to a vacuum diagram for my 88 Grand Wagoneer. I'm trying to correct all the problems with lines that are either plugged with bolts or are just sucking atmosphere and am at a loss as to how all this stuff gets connected. My service manual has what seems to be an 84 or 85 diagram but my '88 360 has several components that aren't shown on the earlier diagram. TEA Jay Isennock jisennock-at-cce-apg.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 13:04:52 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: RE: siping - DO IT! ;) At 03:34 PM 1/6/2003 -0500, Stitt, Mike wrote: >Thanks John, > >I'm about to change from "street" type Michelin's to BFG AT's. Would you >recommend having them siped...does this change the noise level on the road? absolutely NEEDED on the BFG AT's. The KO's are better, have more siping, but it's still a good idea. BFG AT's don't make that much noise and no, I think the siping will actually reduce any noise because the rubber "blocks" will be more flexible and contact the ground in smaller portions. :) It was with the terror of understeer and a locker on my BFG AT's that caused me to try the siping. And I'm totally sold out after seeing the immediate benefits first hand! :) john >Thanks, >Mike Stitt >-----Original Message----- >From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] >Sent: Monday, January 06, 2003 3:10 PM >To: Stitt, Mike; FSJ-List-at-yahoogroups.com; fsj-at-digest.net >Cc: njmc-at-earthlink.net; xj-at-digest.net >Subject: RE: siping - DO IT! ;) > > >At 03:04 PM 1/6/2003 -0500, Stitt, Mike wrote: > >What does "siped" mean??? > >siping is where the tire tread is cut so it's able to flex >and grab surfaces, it also releases water better... >commercially it's called safe-t-sipe or something like that. > >here's a picture of superdawg's brand new michelin's on >the machine getting the center tread siped/cut. > >improves ride, longevity of the tire and traction... not >all tires need it though, my LTX m/s don't, and neither did >my xv4's... but most tires will benefit from it if they don't >have a lot of good siping already. > >just make sure it's not done to the edges on a truck/suv tire >as it can result in the tire chunking off... you'll find a lot >of big gnarly mud tires up here in the PNW with the center siped! > >http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/tech/FSJ-tires/PB040016.JPG > > >john > > > >Thanks, > > > >Mike Stitt > >-----Original Message----- > >From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] > >Sent: Sunday, January 05, 2003 9:20 PM > >To: FSJ-List-at-yahoogroups.com; fsj-at-digest.net > >Cc: njmc-at-earthlink.net > >Subject: fsj: Re: DON'T DO IT!!!! > > > > > >Nick, > > > >Forget Coopers... don't even think about 'em. BFG's siped > >are good, but if you want ride and good wet weather get the > >Michelin's LTX's. I know it costs more, but the extra money > >you spend on either the BFGs (siped) or the Michelin's are > >MORE THAN WORTH IT. > > > >Don't try to save money on tires, brakes, steering or gaskets... ;) > > > >I've had terrible experiences with coopers... on a benz and > >on a couple of jeeps... > > > >the other tire I deplore are the les scwhab series... have > >a set on my '76 280z, they're all over the place when it rains, > >too hard of a compound. > > > >Goodyear tires would be fine if they'd last more then 20 or 30k. > > > >Dunlop's would be fine if the sidewalls weren't so wimpy and they > >didn't puncture on brush (I'm not kidding). > > > >Yokohoma's aren't too bad if you can find a set of old Super Digger IV's, > >the V's changed and aren't as good... they didn't last anyway... > > > >Pirellis... ok I guess... so so experiences with them... > > > >the only tires I've absolutely been satisifed with on car, truck or > >Jeep are the BFGs and the Michelin's. > > > >Costco has the Kirkland brand, basically made by and look like BFG. > > > >If you get the BFG AT's, GET THEM SIPED. They don't work well on wet > >road... Siping also makes them last longer... > > > >Discount Tire recommended siping my Michelin AT's that are on SuperDawg, > >works for me. My Michelin LTX M/S on my XJ and on my '99 WJ aren't siped > >and they're doing fine. > > > >If you want ride/wet weather traction, go for the Michelin. IF you > >want serious OFF_ROAD durability, go with the BFGs, but get 'em siped... > > > >john > > > >At 01:50 AM 1/6/2003 +0000, FSJ-List-at-yahoogroups.com wrote: > > >Message: 7 > > > Date: Sun, 05 Jan 2003 15:03:00 -0000 > > > From: "Nick McIntosh " > > >Subject: Tires? > > >My GW is in need of a new set of tires. I want BFG AT's but at $104 > > >each, I cannot afford them. So I was hoping you guys could help > > >suggest a nice set of less expensive tires. I found some Cooper's > > >for $72 each, but don't know about the quality. Any advice > > >appreciated. Thanks. > > >Nick McIntosh > > >88 Grand Wagoneer - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 14:20:46 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: [WJ-Grand] RE: siping - DO IT! ;) thanx Garrison, will pass this along to the folks I've been chatting with... I have seen the KO's and they are well siped... wasn't 100% sure though, but if you've had 'em on wet roads and they're ok, they'll probably be fine. I do know the old AT's were downright frightening on wet roads. later, john At 04:07 PM 1/6/2003 -0600, Garrison St.Clair wrote: >John, >Unless someone has some real old stock on had, the only BFG AT available >today is the KO which is factory sipped. I've had them on my YJ for about >2.5 years and they are excellent on wet roads. there is no room to add >additional siping. > >The BFG MT KM is the current version of the Mud Tire. That tire needs to be >siped. > >Hope this helps. > >Gunslinger > >Gunslinger's First Law: "No good deed goes unpunished." > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "john" >To: >Sent: Monday, 06 January, 2003 15:04 >Subject: [WJ-Grand] RE: siping - DO IT! ;) > > > > At 03:34 PM 1/6/2003 -0500, Stitt, Mike wrote: > > >Thanks John, > > > > > >I'm about to change from "street" type Michelin's to BFG AT's. Would you > > >recommend having them siped...does this change the noise level on the >road? > > > > absolutely NEEDED on the BFG AT's. The KO's are better, have more > > siping, but it's still a good idea. BFG AT's don't make that much > > noise and no, I think the siping will actually reduce any noise because > > the rubber "blocks" will be more flexible and contact the ground in > > smaller portions. :) > > > > It was with the terror of understeer and a locker on my BFG AT's that > > caused me to try the siping. And I'm totally sold out after seeing > > the immediate benefits first hand! :) > > > > john > > > > > > >Thanks, > > >Mike Stitt > > >-----Original Message----- > > >From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] > > >Sent: Monday, January 06, 2003 3:10 PM > > >To: Stitt, Mike; FSJ-List-at-yahoogroups.com; fsj-at-digest.net > > >Cc: njmc-at-earthlink.net; xj-at-digest.net > > >Subject: RE: siping - DO IT! ;) > > > > > > > > >At 03:04 PM 1/6/2003 -0500, Stitt, Mike wrote: > > > >What does "siped" mean??? > > > > > >siping is where the tire tread is cut so it's able to flex > > >and grab surfaces, it also releases water better... > > >commercially it's called safe-t-sipe or something like that. > > > > > >here's a picture of superdawg's brand new michelin's on > > >the machine getting the center tread siped/cut. > > > > > >improves ride, longevity of the tire and traction... not > > >all tires need it though, my LTX m/s don't, and neither did > > >my xv4's... but most tires will benefit from it if they don't > > >have a lot of good siping already. > > > > > >just make sure it's not done to the edges on a truck/suv tire > > >as it can result in the tire chunking off... you'll find a lot > > >of big gnarly mud tires up here in the PNW with the center siped! > > > > > >http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/tech/FSJ-tires/PB040016.JPG > > > > > > > > >john > > > > > > > > > >Thanks, > > > > > > > >Mike Stitt > > > >-----Original Message----- > > > >From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] > > > >Sent: Sunday, January 05, 2003 9:20 PM > > > >To: FSJ-List-at-yahoogroups.com; fsj-at-digest.net > > > >Cc: njmc-at-earthlink.net > > > >Subject: fsj: Re: DON'T DO IT!!!! > > > > > > > > > > > >Nick, > > > > > > > >Forget Coopers... don't even think about 'em. BFG's siped > > > >are good, but if you want ride and good wet weather get the > > > >Michelin's LTX's. I know it costs more, but the extra money > > > >you spend on either the BFGs (siped) or the Michelin's are > > > >MORE THAN WORTH IT. > > > > > > > >Don't try to save money on tires, brakes, steering or gaskets... ;) > > > > > > > >I've had terrible experiences with coopers... on a benz and > > > >on a couple of jeeps... > > > > > > > >the other tire I deplore are the les scwhab series... have > > > >a set on my '76 280z, they're all over the place when it rains, > > > >too hard of a compound. > > > > > > > >Goodyear tires would be fine if they'd last more then 20 or 30k. > > > > > > > >Dunlop's would be fine if the sidewalls weren't so wimpy and they > > > >didn't puncture on brush (I'm not kidding). > > > > > > > >Yokohoma's aren't too bad if you can find a set of old Super Digger >IV's, > > > >the V's changed and aren't as good... they didn't last anyway... > > > > > > > >Pirellis... ok I guess... so so experiences with them... > > > > > > > >the only tires I've absolutely been satisifed with on car, truck or > > > >Jeep are the BFGs and the Michelin's. > > > > > > > >Costco has the Kirkland brand, basically made by and look like BFG. > > > > > > > >If you get the BFG AT's, GET THEM SIPED. They don't work well on wet > > > >road... Siping also makes them last longer... > > > > > > > >Discount Tire recommended siping my Michelin AT's that are on >SuperDawg, > > > >works for me. My Michelin LTX M/S on my XJ and on my '99 WJ aren't >siped > > > >and they're doing fine. > > > > > > > >If you want ride/wet weather traction, go for the Michelin. IF you > > > >want serious OFF_ROAD durability, go with the BFGs, but get 'em >siped... > > > > > > > >john > > > > > > > >At 01:50 AM 1/6/2003 +0000, FSJ-List-at-yahoogroups.com wrote: > > > > >Message: 7 > > > > > Date: Sun, 05 Jan 2003 15:03:00 -0000 > > > > > From: "Nick McIntosh " > > > > >Subject: Tires? > > > > >My GW is in need of a new set of tires. I want BFG AT's but at $104 > > > > >each, I cannot afford them. So I was hoping you guys could help > > > > >suggest a nice set of less expensive tires. I found some Cooper's > > > > >for $72 each, but don't know about the quality. Any advice > > > > >appreciated. Thanks. > > > > >Nick McIntosh > > > > >88 Grand Wagoneer > > > > >To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: >WJ-Grand-unsubscribe-at-egroups.com > > > >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 16:55:11 -0800 From: john Subject: Re: fsj: Need 88 Vacuum Diagram Help how about this: http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/tech/MR253/MR253-8cyl-vacuum.jpg http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/tech/Engines/Vacuum/ http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/tech/Engines/Vacuum/360-V8-vaccum-diagram.JPG john meister At 09:10 PM 1/6/2003 +0000, fsj-digest wrote: >Date: Mon, 6 Jan 2003 10:40:26 -0500 >From: James Isennock >Subject: fsj: Need 88 Vacuum Diagram Help > >I'm hoping someone can either provide or direct me to a vacuum diagram for >my 88 Grand Wagoneer. I'm trying to correct all the problems with lines that >are either plugged with bolts or are just sucking atmosphere and am at a >loss as to how all this stuff gets connected. My service manual has what >seems to be an 84 or 85 diagram but my '88 360 has several components that >aren't shown on the earlier diagram. > > >TEA > >Jay Isennock >jisennock-at-cce-apg.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 06 Jan 2003 17:11:10 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: RE: wiring At 08:06 PM 1/6/2003 -0500, Stitt, Mike wrote: >By the way...I have a problem with my rear running lights and break lights >not working and the cruise control stopped working at the same time. Do you >have any idea what I should look at to resolve the problem? wiring harness connectors... check 'em at the firewall... there is a connector that drops down and heads back along the frame right by the master cylinder... john >Thanks, > >Mike Stitt - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 00:23:08 -0800 From: "Jim B" Subject: fsj: Re: Ken's project A: I would get a modified HEI dist from DUI (Davis Unified Ignition if they have cured the cam eating bugs) rather than chance wiping out your cam gear. One of the guys on the big list lost $5000 in his motor he worked on twice because some little thing was not right and it tanked the whole 401! From: john >From: Ken Gaines tamucc.edu> Hi >there fellow Jeepers... I hope everyone >had a great Christmas and New Year >holiday season. Sorry I haven't posted >in a LONG while. School, a new job, and >kids keep me REALLY busy. My CJ7 project >is finally finished...I'll send a pic to >Master John if he will post it. Now I >have an entirely new project with a >whole new set of ideas. I need a little >advice from the masters of FSJ world... >I have managed to acquire a 1989 GW in >pretty good shape. A little minor body >work will get it looking good. It DOES, >however, need an engine...not a >difficult task in and of itself. I have >a couple of ideas that may not set too >well with the purists, but I believe >that they are at least worthy of some >checking out so to speak... Of course, I >will start with the basic AMC 360 block >and heads that I already have. A 0.030 >bore and a cleanup job on the heads will >start the project off nicely, I think. >Now for the neat parts. First, in the >last several weeks, I have been doing a >lot of thinking about a retrofit GM MPI >system. There are two ways to go about >this: 1.) Build the system myself >(believe it or not, I think I could pull >it off; I have a design drawn up and >all if anyone is interested). 2.) Buy a >custom made MPI from CustomEFIs.com for >about $1800. Next idea, and I think this >has been tossed around a bit in the >past, a modified GM HEI distributor >(coil-in-cap) to go with the GM MPI. >Using a GM distributor would allow the >engine to take advantage of the >pre-programmed timing curves on the ECM >chip (with the MPI system). So, what do >you guys think about the MPI system >ideas? Either way, an MPI will run me >about $1800-$2200. Will it produce >enough torque for a Waggy? I want to use >the Summit cam/lifter kit (SUM-K8600) >with this engine build-up because it >seems to have the type of profile that >would fit an MPI-equipped engine. Thanks >in advance for any advice and/or >experiences you guys may have. Keep on >Jeepin'!!! >O)||||||(O Ken _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2003 15:08:07 GMT From: Ken Gaines Subject: fsj: GM MPI conversion site Here is a link to the site that I found concerning the GM retrofit. http://www.mm4x4center.com "Life is a journey that's measured not in miles or years, but in experiences" - -Jimmy Buffett "A Pirate Looks at Fifty" 1998 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 10:24:51 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: insanity from DC total insanity from the folks that dropped the SJ and XJ... a motorcycle to match the "toon town" liberty. ;) adds new meaning to the lyrics in the old steppenwolf song... ...suicide machine... http://www.car-truck.com/chryed/buzz03/b010603a.htm john >From: "Meister, John" >Subject: RE: now this is a bike!! >Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2003 10:14:21 -0800 > >no, that's a suicide machine... :) > >now, what they should do is put that V10 into a Durango or Grand Cherokee... > >THEN they'd have something... ;) > >john > >======================================================================== > > Subject: now this is a bike!! > > > > http://www.car-truck.com/chryed/buzz03/b010603a.htm > > - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Jan 2003 00:02:33 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: window seals passing some info to the fsj digest and the parts list... john At 12:08 PM 1/7/2003 +0000, FSJ-List-at-yahoogroups.com wrote: Date: Tue, 07 Jan 2003 01:21:40 -0800 From: Dick Ballard Subject: Side Window Wiper Seals? OK, you asked for it. The listed quantities are for 4 side doors w/channels, and for tailgate window w/o channel. Cost is per item. You get to figure out the nomenclature! Only thing I can figure is that some positions have a different mounting tab pattern, even though the lengths are the same as another location. As I said, I have not installed the side door seals or channels yet. I don't know what the 230 series numbers mean. 2 EA J5761982 SEAL WEATHER 23043024 15.54 2 EA J5761983 SEAL WEATHER 23043024 15.54 2 EA J5761984 WEATHERST RI 23063033 12.29 1 EA J5761985 WEATHERST RI 23063033 12.29 1 EA J5761986 WEATHERST RI 23063033 14.24 1 EA J5751070 CHANNEL 23009052 15.86 1 EA J5751071 CHANNEL 23009052 15.86 1 EA J0957853 CHANNEL DR 23009052 17.49 1 EA J0957854 CHANNEL DR 23009052 17.49 4 EA J5469513 CUSHION 20IN 23030007 4.55 1 EA J5462332 SEAL WEATHER 23043024 38.35 1 EA 55052566 W/STRIP TAIL 23063033 32.76 Dick Ballard - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #1830 **************************