From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Fri Jan 17 17:18:02 2003 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Friday, January 17 2003 Volume 01 : Number 1837 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: FW: Re: neutral safety switch fsj: Re: [FSJ-List] The Stealership strikes again! Re: fsj: neutral safety switch fsj: Re: Golden Eagle and the 35's (plus axles!) fsj: Re: Golden Eagle and the 35's (plus axles!) Re: fsj: Re: Golden Eagle and the 35's (plus axles!) fsj: Re: Howell TBI fsj: Re: [FSJ-List] Wrapped around the driveline fsj: Fwd: [FSJ-List] OT - another use for an old car fsj: DMV records fsj: Re: [FSJ-List] Wrapped around the driveline FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 14:29:15 -0500 From: James Isennock Subject: fsj: FW: Re: neutral safety switch In the event the switch or harness is damaged you can bypass it. It should be three wires to the connector. The center wire is a ground and the two outers are Neutral Safety and Reverse lights. To get her up and running just connect the ground to the wire that doesn't make the back-up lights come on and you should be good to go. Good luck. Jay Isennock - -----Original Message----- From: Vince Orr [mailto:vorr-at-attbi.com] Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 1:32 PM To: John Pettit; FSJ List Subject: fsj: Re: neutral safety switch John P: You may have just accidentally disconnected the harness. I had this happen when I did my engine overhaul. OR it may have just come unplugged. IF you can get to the access panel on the hump under the front carpeting, you can see this stuff real well from there. Otherwise, you need to get underneath. I have an '81 Wagoneer too so you should have the 727 transmission I guess. There are two connectors - one on the left (drivers) side of the tranny, near the linkage and one along the top that hooks to the transfer case (emergency drive switch for NP219 quadratrac). Make sure these are plugged in and do a wire check as best you can. Otherwise, behind the engine, as it snakes down over the top and passenger side of the tranny, there is a wire harness for these connectors. A master connector for the wire harness hangs about where the tranny and the engine mate up. It's a spot that is hard to see from anywhere. You might have to reach up from the bottom or through the access panel in the floor to feel it. It is like a simple two prong connector. If you have been messing with wires or the vacuum lines on top of or on the back side of the engine lately, I'd look at the connector just behind the engine first. It only takes a little tension to pop this one apart. If it still doesn't work. I'd take the connector apart, remove the harness, and check for continuity with a meter. You can probably make a harness but they may still sell these too. They are pretty simple affairs really. Hope it is just a simple disconnection! - --Vince Orr '81 Wagoneer (Rez Runner) '99 TJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Pettit" To: Sent: Wednesday, January 15, 2003 7:59 PM Subject: fsj: neutral safety switch Hey! I was wondering if it was possible to bypass the neutral safety switch on the transmission....I got stuck on a log and I believe that I damaged the switch/wire because it won't start unless I bypass the selonoid. The reverse lights don't work either, so I was wondering how I get her up and running for another adventure ASAP. It's supposed to snow tonight and I need to get it started! Also, I don't even know if I am looking in the right spot for the wire on the tranny. It's a 1981 Jeep Grand Wagoneer... thanks! John P. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 14:18:14 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: fsj: Re: [FSJ-List] The Stealership strikes again! check your grounds and fusible links... not sure if the '89 has the same blower setup on the firewall engine side as earlier ones or not, but I have one out of a '77... the a/c fan is under the dash, pass side, all the did in '86 was move the controls up top... not sure what this other fan is... should look at an '86 or up to see... john On Thu, 16 Jan 2003, George Milam wrote: >-->Hello: >--> >-->The other morning I get into the '89 GW and the defroster isn't blowing air >-->at all. No heat or anything. The air conditioner fan was still strong. >-->Anyhow I take it to the Stealership and they call me and tell me that the >-->blower moter is gone and it caused another moter to die as well. Tey tell >-->me I need both replaced because one is no good with out the other. Anyhow >-->this cost me $341.00 for the fix. Does this sound right?? >-->SECOND QUESTION: After I got about 5 miles down the road I realize that the >-->thermometer in the little ceiling unit storage thing is reading wrong by >-->like 25 degrees plus. Could this be related to something they may have >-->worked on with the blower motor? >--> >-->Any insight would be apreciated. >--> >-->Thanks, >--> >-->George >-->'89 GW "MOOSE" ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** john-at-wagoneers.com via PINE on Linux ** (plain text please!) ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. ...and remember, leaving life without Jesus just isn't recommended... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: 16 Jan 2003 21:36:39 -0800 From: "Jim B" Subject: Re: fsj: neutral safety switch Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 21:36:38 -0800 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed A: I already replied privately to John (I should have cc'd the list, but maybe he'll forward what I wrote) The neutral switch on the 727 trans ('80 and newer) is on the back of the trans on the driver's side (US) just above the pan lip. It has 3 prongs. The center one (that goes to the plug on the bottom of the solenoid) is grounded when the trans is in neutral or park. You can bypass this by grounding the plug on the bottom of the solenoid, but it will start in any gear afterwards. The backup lights are the other 2 prongs on the trans switch. They were made so it didn't matter which way you plugged them it would work. (the power just goes into the one and out the other to the backup lights) The other thing that can happen if the switch isn't unplugged or busted is the plastic piece inside that rotates with the shifter can break (after a lot of heat ups the plastic gets brittle) It won't work as it's supposed to if that's the case. In fact, the backup lights often come on in drive. All it takes is a bad bump to the pan to do it (like high centering) The piece is a slight pain to replace (requires dropping the valve body, so estimate 1 hour or even longer if you haven't done it before) but it's only a 2 banana job. (block wheels, shift to neutral, drain oil and drop trans pan, remove the 10 bolts holding the valve body and pull the linkage off the top, noting which way is up. I usually pressure wash that area first and sometimes it requires removal of the trans lines to make room to get at the linkage bolts. Then replace the plastic piece, miteaswell adjust the bands and put in a new filter. I put a clean chev small block outer edge headbolt into the top of the accumulator valve, which is above the big spring that sits on the valve body. This gives solider shifts) From: "John Pettit" Hey! I was wondering if it was possible to bypass the neutral safety switch on the transmission....I got stuck on a log and I believe that I damaged the switch/wire because it won't start unless I bypass the selonoid. The reverse lights don't work either, so I was wondering how I get her up and running for another adventure ASAP. It's supposed to snow tonight and I need to get it started! Also, I don't even know if I am looking in the right spot for the wire on the tranny. It's a 1981 Jeep Grand Wagoneer... thanks! John P. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 22:06:11 -0800 From: "Jim B" Subject: fsj: Re: Golden Eagle and the 35's (plus axles!) A: I know 33" will fit. I currently have 36" with 12.5" tread, but I am SOA on the front ('76 Blazer front axle, but the pumpkin is on RH which is the wrong side for my new transfercase, so it's for sale. D44 with 3.08 gears $100 with Jeep J10/Widetrack steering knuckles. Buy the 3.31 M20 from my '84 for $150 to go with that and I'll throw in the 3.31 D44 gears on the deal along with my old rear springs and blocks) OR if you have a J3000, I'm looking for a D60-2 with 4.10 gears (I don't need the shafts or brakes except for measurements for Moser replacements) and I am willing to talk swap for the newer axles. I also have a good used set of D44 4.10 and Model 20 3.54 and 3.08 gears. From: Ainfamous1-at-aol.com A question for you guys. I noticed the fenders are cut to accomodate these 35's. Is the truck lifted at all? Will 35's fit on a j-10 with a 3" lift without having to cut? Thanks Dixie dixiedogland.20m.com _________________________________________________________________ Help STOP SPAM: Try the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 22:08:35 -0800 From: "Jim B" Subject: fsj: Re: Golden Eagle and the 35's (plus axles!) Oh, in case anyone forgets, I'm in Seattle! (My son also has a 12 Bolt chev axle with 3.78 (IIRC) posi, but it's 5 bolt wheels and he has a SM465 2WD as well) _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Jan 2003 22:15:06 -0800 From: john Subject: Re: fsj: Re: Golden Eagle and the 35's (plus axles!) At 10:08 PM 1/16/2003 -0800, Jim B wrote: >Oh, in case anyone forgets, I'm in Seattle! how could we forget? john - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 09:16:28 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: Howell TBI I was going to do the Howell TBI on my 258 in SuperDawg, but found that #2 was bad so I decided to go MPI... complete with a 4.0L and 4 speed overdrive tranny... of course it's been over two years now... SuperDawg is still in pieces... was supposed be done by Labor Day 2001 but my friend had to move, then before Ouray 2002, not sure why that didn't happen, and now???? So, I've added a few things to the project, like extending the cab back a bit and shortening the stepside bed, dual batteries under the floor in the cab, rebuilding the 4.0L (only had 130k on it) and remote starter/alarm, etc. Still looking for heated leather seats... :) but that's something that can be added later. Anyway, the Howell TBI kit was pretty simple and used standard GM parts, very good way to go. I dislike most things Holley anyway. ;) john At 08:34 AM 1/17/2003 -0700, Ethan Brady wrote: >To: FSJ-List-at-yahoogroups.com >Subject: Re: [FSJ-List] Re: fuel pump help > > Awright! Another Howell TBI convert and fan! It was the best > chunk of >change I've ever spent on my Jeep. I've always liked GM cars, and now my >truck starts like one! (Wish Jeep had figured that out and TBI'd the 90's >FSJ's. Oh well...) > >Ethan Brady >88 GW SlushPuppy / 67 M-715 >CFSJA Member - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 11:05:18 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: [FSJ-List] Wrapped around the driveline I had the strap from my army rain coat get caught in the chain of my motorcycle... luckily the coat tore and I wasn't yanked off the bike... was only going 30mph when it happened too... a rather frightening episode. :) john At 10:02 AM 1/17/2003 -0800, Joe wrote: >When I was travelling on I-5 at 70MPH I had a ratcheting strap sitting >in the bed of my truck last summer wrap around the drive line. I >thought someone was shooting at me, because all I heard was a loud pop >and my back window shattered. > >I pulled over to find the strap melted to the drive line, a dent in the >cab below the window where the ratchet hit and broke the window. The was >a large crease in the back of the bed where the strap was pulled from >the drive line while the other end was still hooked to the bed. > >Scared the !-at-#$ outta me! > >Just make sure your straps aren't hooked when not in use! > >Joe Hughes >Everett, WA >'83 Wag Ltd. 360,727,20,44,229 > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Frank Donnelly [mailto:frankdo-at-txucom.net] > > Sent: Friday, January 17, 2003 9:35 AM > > To: FSJ-List-at-yahoogroups.com > > Subject: Re: [FSJ-List] Noise question > > > > > > Joe..That is the same thing that guy said in the note he > > left.. Frank in Texas > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Joe" > > To: > > Sent: Friday, January 17, 2003 11:25 AM > > Subject: RE: [FSJ-List] Noise question > > > > > Whoa, I'll have to be careful next time a do that. > > > > Joe H. > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: Dave [mailto:vwdoc2001-at-ameritech.net] > > > > Sent: Friday, January 17, 2003 6:30 AM > > > > To: FSJ-List-at-yahoogroups.com > > > > Subject: Re: [FSJ-List] Noise question > > > > > > > > > [Kalamazoo Gazette]: James Burns, 34, (a mechanic) of > > Alamo, Mich., > > > > was killed in March as he was trying to repair what > > police describe > > > > as a "farm type truck." Burns got a friend to drive the > > truck on a > > > > highway while Burns hung underneath so that he could > > ascertain the > > > > source of a troubling noise. Burns' clothes caught on something, > > > > however, and the other man found Burns "wrapped in the > > drive shaft." > > > > > > > > lets be careful out there > > > > later, > > > > dave > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Frank Donnelly" > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Friday, January 17, 2003 8:02 AM > > > > Subject: Re: [FSJ-List] Noise question > > > > > > > > > > > > Dave..Your posting reminds me of a story I read a while > > back where a > > > > guy had a friend (helper) hold on under his truck while he drove > > > > along in an effort to locate a noise prob..The guy under > > the truck > > > > got all wrapped up in the driveshaft and was > > killed..Think it is a > > > > true story.. Frank in Texas > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Dave" > > > > To: > > > > Sent: Friday, January 17, 2003 7:45 AM > > > > Subject: Re: [FSJ-List] Noise question > > > > > > > > > > > > > vibration or rubbing possibly? > > > > > did you check engine mounts and trans mount and exhaust? > > > > vacuum leak? > > > > > > > > > > Can you have a helper listen to pinpoint area of noise? > > > > > > > > > > just a thought! :-) > > > > dave > > > > > >> My beast has developed a new noise. Haven't looked into it > > > > > >> yet, but I think it just may be low on tranny fluid again. > > > > > >> > > > > > >> The noise is best described as the sound of a car horn > > > > from far far > > > > > >> away. Seems to only happen when idling in gear with foot > > > > on brake. > > > > > >> Out of gear > > > > > >> and foot on brake it doesn't do it. I will try to > > > > remember to check > > > > the > > > > > >> tranny fluid tomorrow, but thought I would ask anyway. > > > > > >> > > > > > >> Roland > > - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 11:11:00 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Fwd: [FSJ-List] OT - another use for an old car what to do with an old car: http://mbjork.home.cern.ch/mbjork/gase/events/saunaab_test/saunaab_test.htm >This has nothing to do with FSJs, but considering all the modified >vehicles we drive, and all the inventiveness FSJ owners display, as well >as our propensity for finding new uses for old iron, and for recycling, >I thought some on the lists might enjoy this read. > >http://mbjork.home.cern.ch/mbjork/gase/events/saunaab_test/saunaab_test.htm > >Basically, the article (includes pix, BTW) details the process of >converting an old SAAB to a combo sauna and barbeque. > >Enjoy, >Lee - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 11:15:30 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: DMV records got this from one of my computer lists: john Subject: Pearls: Allstate Insurance caught illegally snooping in DMV records [ To me the question with this story about Allstate Insurance and its illegal accessing of department of motor vehicle records is whether we should really be surprised or not? George Orwell (in "1984") wasn't the first to observe that power corrupts, and if you're poking around on the DMV computer every day, it's not too much of a shock that you might occasionally peek at the records of friends and family. An inevitable side-effect of the erosion of privacy and collection of more and more personal information by agencies. And it'll get worse: government agencies want to marry information from disparate database to build larger, more detailed profiles. This story is from the San Jose Mercury News - Dave, perl list ] Illegal snooping costs Allstate access to online DMV records By Deborah Lohse California's Department of Motor Vehicles has banned Allstate Insurance from checking driver records online after Allstate employees were caught illegally snooping through records of friends, family and others. In one case, an Allstate employee released a confidential home address that enabled an unidentified road-rage driver to send a written threat to another driver. After that incident, the threatened driver complained to DMV, which investigated. It did not learn the identity of the Allstate employee who facilitated the threat, but DMV did find 131 violations of confidentiality rules such as those requiring people who access the data to have individual passwords and sign confidentiality papers. Allstate employees in seven claims offices violated the rules, sometimes by sharing computer passwords on Post-it notes, in other cases by making up fake car-claim numbers to get into friends' or family members' DMV records, officials said. ``The violations were so egregious here, without an ironclad agreement in our hands that it wouldn't happen again . . . we had to pull the plug,'' said DMV Director Steven Gourley. A privacy group applauded DMV's ban on Allstate. ``Companies that have access to these sensitive databases like DMV must have ironclad electronic-audit trail capabilities in order to monitor how their employees use these databases,'' said Beth Givens, director of the Privacy Rights Clearinghouse. ``Otherwise there will be all too much abuse caused by inquisitive employees,'' Givens added. Allstate employees, along with workers for many other insurers, finance companies, law firms and others, are permitted access to driver records in order to verify new-customer driving records or investigate claims. But to do so, they sign contracts vowing to follow confidentiality procedures like safeguarding passwords and not disclosing home addresses. `Lax culture' Allstate -- the eighth largest car insurer in California -- not only violated privacy rules, it also resisted the agency's attempts to fix the problem. ``There was such a lax culture at Allstate that they didn't even know it was regulated,'' Gourley said. ``Sometimes they wouldn't let us in (to investigate) and in other cases they threw us out.'' Allstate spokesman Mike Trevino called the actions by an undisclosed number of Allstate claims employees a ``breach of internal policy'' that Allstate ``regrets.'' He added that Allstate had taken ``decisive action'' to make sure such breaches don't recur, but couldn't immediately say what those actions were. Allstate workers will still be able to get DMV records, but they will have to ask for them in writing and wait for written responses -- a change insurance experts said will delay new-customer applications and some claims. Allstate, which looks up 50,000 DMV electronic records a month at $2 apiece, can apply to have its access reinstated. But DMV will review its security procedures, a process that will take at least 60 days, said spokesman Bill Branch. Actress' death State officials are especially sensitive to the confidentiality of home addresses after Hollywood actress Rebecca Schaeffer was killed in 1989 by a stalker who had learned her address from DMV records, which were then public record. Schaeffer's death resulted in a federal law requiring that DMV home addresses be kept confidential. Now home addresses are part of DMV's electronic database, access to which is regulated, that includes a person's driving record and car registration information. Insurance companies, finance companies, and lawyers are among those granted access to those electronic records, but each is supposed to follow confidentiality procedures. The DMV also keeps records of drivers' mental and physical health history that might impair their driving, such as blackouts, seizures or inability to perform daily living functions. Doctors are required by law to submit such information to the DMV. But those records are kept on paper and aren't provided to parties outside of DMV, said John McClellan, deputy director for driver licensing. [[ online at http://www.siliconvalley.com/mld/siliconvalley/4965810.htm ]] - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Jan 2003 14:02:00 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: [FSJ-List] Wrapped around the driveline At 01:41 PM 1/17/2003 -0600, Frank Donnelly wrote: >That would have sent me immediately to church to give thanks John.. was already attending Seminary... ;) went I quit teaching electronics at ITT and started working for intel I sold the motorcycle... ;) my commute went from 3 miles to about 26... across portland... (motorcycles in the PNW aren't the best choice to begin with... ;) john >Frank in Texas > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "john" >To: ; >Cc: >Sent: Friday, January 17, 2003 1:05 PM >Subject: Re: [FSJ-List] Wrapped around the driveline > > > I had the strap from my army rain coat get caught in the > > chain of my motorcycle... luckily the coat tore and I > > wasn't yanked off the bike... was only going 30mph when it happened > > too... a rather frightening episode. :) > > > > john > > - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #1837 **************************