From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Tue Feb 18 23:56:27 2003 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Monday, February 17 2003 Volume 01 : Number 1864 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: Re: 31x10.5 x15 Michelin LTX's (on XJ rims) fsj: Re: 31x10.5 x15 Michelin LTX's (on XJ rims) Re: fsj: Optima Spiral Cell Batteries fsj: Re: 31x10.5 x15 Michelin LTX's (on XJ rims) Re: fsj: Coolant Trouble Re: fsj: Coolant Trouble fsj: th400 question, about the guts! Re: fsj: Re: steering box (wondering) fsj: Re: steering box (wondering) fsj: Re: steering box (wondering) Re: fsj: th400 question, about the guts! Re: fsj: th400 question, about the guts! fsj: Re: overdrive?? fsj: steering playfulness FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 18:06:11 -0600 From: "Vince Orr" Subject: fsj: Re: 31x10.5 x15 Michelin LTX's (on XJ rims) These should also fit on stock TJ's that were ordered with the wide (Canyon?) rims. I've already got new tires for mine and almost put 31's on. John, if you had only put these up a month ago....... - --Vince '81 Waggie '99 TJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john" To: Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 5:21 PM Subject: fsj: 31x10.5 x15 Michelin LTX's (on XJ rims) I'm looking at "downsizing" my tires on my '87 XJ. The 31's I have are awesome, but since they're four sizes bigger then the stock it's working this thing harder then I prefer... I'm still running 3.55 gears and this motor has 242,000 miles on it... I'd like to either sell these tires or trade for Michelin 235's or BFG 30x9's. Even when we sell the '99 WJ I won't have money to change the R&P to 4.10s... so smaller tires are the answer. These tires were originally purchased for SuperDawg and I ran them for a while but found the 258 working too hard, then my son used them for about a month on his J3000 and then I put them on this XJ. (I think that's the history... ;) I have a set of FSJ rims that they can be mounted on. IF these things have even 2,000 miles on them I'd be surprised. :) I paid close to $500 for them... make me an offer... only interested in trading for BFG's or Michelins, sorry, I'm quite fussy about my treads. Trying to get things "economized" a bit... trying to sell the '99 WJ and get that 190D home. My son's Ranger Diesel drove off with the new owner today, next we'll try to find a home for the Golden Eagle... :) Or he may keep it here (oh happy joy joy) when he goes off into the air force. john - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 16:47:08 -0800 From: "Jim B" Subject: fsj: Re: 31x10.5 x15 Michelin LTX's (on XJ rims) A: Hey John! Pop over to Pic-a-part in Everett (they have a couple FSJs too! MFSJC) and get axles from a 4 banger XJ. They are going to be either 4.10 or 4.56 ratio. (I'm looking for a pair of 4.56 for my Commanche if you find those. My current 4.10s are in good condition, but it's working the 2.54L motor more than I'd like on takeoff even with the 5 speed and I have to downshift from 5th on the hills now!) In fact, I'm putting my MJ up for sale for $2500 so I can finish my J10 project. (I'll include the canopy and NP208J along with the other spare parts. It just got 32" tires and 3" lift plus it was converted to 4x4 just before Ouray) I just had the wheels aligned, oil changed and it's passed emissions already. From: john Subject: 31x10.5 x15 Michelin LTX's (on XJ rims) I'm looking at "downsizing" my tires on my '87 XJ. The 31's I have are awesome, but since they're four sizes bigger then the stock it's working this thing harder then I prefer... I'm still running 3.55 gears and this motor has 242,000 miles on it... I'd like to either sell these tires or trade for Michelin 235's or BFG 30x9's. Even when we sell the '99 WJ I won't have money to change the R&P to 4.10s... so smaller tires are the answer. These tires were originally purchased for SuperDawg and I ran them for a while but found the 258 working too hard, then my son used them for about a month on his J3000 and then I put them on this XJ. (I think that's the history... ;) I have a set of FSJ rims that they can be mounted on. IF these things have even 2,000 miles on them I'd be surprised. :) I paid close to $500 for them... make me an offer... only interested in trading for BFG's or Michelins, sorry, I'm quite fussy about my treads. Trying to get things "economized" a bit... trying to sell the '99 WJ and get that 190D home. My son's Ranger Diesel drove off with the new owner today, next we'll try to find a home for the Golden Eagle... :) Or he may keep it here (oh happy joy joy) when he goes off into the air force. john - ------------------------------------------------------------------ Jim Blair, Seattle, WA '84 J10 Black Jack, '86 Comanche 4x4 _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 16:52:11 -0800 From: "Jim B" Subject: Re: fsj: Optima Spiral Cell Batteries A: Exide's equivalent the Orbital is what Black Jack is getting. From: john Subject: Re: fsj: Optima Spiral Cell Batteries I've been using these Optima's for a long time... can't remember when I got the first one, late 80's, early '90's??? SuperDawg has one. :) john Jim Blair, Seattle, WA '84 J10 Black Jack, '86 Comanche 4x4 _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 16:52:39 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: 31x10.5 x15 Michelin LTX's (on XJ rims) hey, I had a job a month ago and was going to go with nerf bars and 4.10's on the XJ... it's a sweet ride... one of the guys on the list took an interest in the wj, he has a newer xj... might work out if I sell my '87 and do the trade... won't pay as many bills off but it'll leave my wife with a much, much nicer Jeep then the 242,000 mile XJ. :) The Lord has amazing stuff in store... don't know where we're going, how we're getting there, but He's taking care of us... :) john At 06:06 PM 2/16/2003 -0600, Vince Orr wrote: >These should also fit on stock TJ's that were ordered with the wide >(Canyon?) rims. I've already got new tires for mine and almost put 31's on. >John, if you had only put these up a month ago....... >--Vince >'81 Waggie >'99 TJ > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "john" >To: >Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 5:21 PM >Subject: fsj: 31x10.5 x15 Michelin LTX's (on XJ rims) > > >I'm looking at "downsizing" my tires on my '87 XJ. The 31's I >have are awesome, but since they're four sizes bigger then the >stock it's working this thing harder then I prefer... I'm still >running 3.55 gears and this motor has 242,000 miles on it... I'd >like to either sell these tires or trade for Michelin 235's or >BFG 30x9's. Even when we sell the '99 WJ I won't have money to >change the R&P to 4.10s... so smaller tires are the answer. > >These tires were originally purchased for SuperDawg and I ran them >for a while but found the 258 working too hard, then my son used >them for about a month on his J3000 and then I put them on this >XJ. (I think that's the history... ;) > >I have a set of FSJ rims that they can be mounted on. > >IF these things have even 2,000 miles on them I'd be surprised. :) >I paid close to $500 for them... make me an offer... only interested >in trading for BFG's or Michelins, sorry, I'm quite fussy about my treads. > >Trying to get things "economized" a bit... trying to sell the '99 WJ >and get that 190D home. My son's Ranger Diesel drove off with the new >owner today, next we'll try to find a home for the Golden Eagle... :) >Or he may keep it here (oh happy joy joy) when he goes off into the air >force. > >john >------------------------------------------------------------------ > http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ > Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... > jesus, don't leave life without him, please! >------------------------------------------------------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 17:05:20 -0800 From: "Jim B" Subject: Re: fsj: Coolant Trouble A: I have had good luck with lowering the liquid level, cleaning the area where it's leaking (usually with paint thinner) and using regular black silicone on it. (I don't care for the "ultra" version) I used this trick on my plastic valve cover and it held enough pressure to cause the PCV to blow out! (breather was plugged) It may be just the bolt threads that are leaking (common on V8 AMCs) in which case thread sealer will stop it. From: "Vince Orr" Subject: fsj: Coolant Trouble Darn it....... Coolant leak in the Rez. I must have screwed up the installation of the timing cover gasket last summer 'cause it's leaking on the driver side, against the block, and I can see a piece of gasket blown out near where the long bolt threads into the block for the alternator bracket and timing cover. I tried tightening the bolts but no dice. Coolant comes out really frothy but I assume it is just mixing with air at the gap. Does anyone have an idea how I can fix this without complete teardown? I'm bummed out about all the work necessary. IE: Drain coolant, pull radiator, pull fan, pull belts, pull alternator, unbolt PS pump brackets, pull crank pully, pull dampener, undo countless bolts, pull distributor, (fuel pump arm cut off inside as I'm using an electric fuel pump) old one bolted on to plug the hole, pry off timing cover, clean, gasket - then reverse order........ Groan..... And always in the middle of winter...... I need a tip on applying the gasket, I must have done something wrong. I think I used high temp red silicone with a thin paper gasket.....that might be the problem. Appreciate any wisdom out there.... - - --Vince '81 Leaking Rez - no fun in snow today! '99 TJ - never leaks - perhaps some fun later.... Jim Blair, Seattle, WA '84 J10 Black Jack, '86 Comanche 4x4 _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 19:20:49 -0600 From: "Vince Orr" Subject: Re: fsj: Coolant Trouble Great advice Jim. Looks worth the try. So should I used the black silicone as a thread sealer or use loctite? - --Vince - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim B" To: Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 7:05 PM Subject: Re: fsj: Coolant Trouble A: I have had good luck with lowering the liquid level, cleaning the area where it's leaking (usually with paint thinner) and using regular black silicone on it. (I don't care for the "ultra" version) I used this trick on my plastic valve cover and it held enough pressure to cause the PCV to blow out! (breather was plugged) It may be just the bolt threads that are leaking (common on V8 AMCs) in which case thread sealer will stop it. From: "Vince Orr" Subject: fsj: Coolant Trouble Darn it....... Coolant leak in the Rez. I must have screwed up the installation of the timing cover gasket last summer 'cause it's leaking on the driver side, against the block, and I can see a piece of gasket blown out near where the long bolt threads into the block for the alternator bracket and timing cover. I tried tightening the bolts but no dice. Coolant comes out really frothy but I assume it is just mixing with air at the gap. Does anyone have an idea how I can fix this without complete teardown? I'm bummed out about all the work necessary. IE: Drain coolant, pull radiator, pull fan, pull belts, pull alternator, unbolt PS pump brackets, pull crank pully, pull dampener, undo countless bolts, pull distributor, (fuel pump arm cut off inside as I'm using an electric fuel pump) old one bolted on to plug the hole, pry off timing cover, clean, gasket - then reverse order........ Groan..... And always in the middle of winter...... I need a tip on applying the gasket, I must have done something wrong. I think I used high temp red silicone with a thin paper gasket.....that might be the problem. Appreciate any wisdom out there.... - - --Vince '81 Leaking Rez - no fun in snow today! '99 TJ - never leaks - perhaps some fun later.... Jim Blair, Seattle, WA '84 J10 Black Jack, '86 Comanche 4x4 _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 21:07:23 -0700 From: "Tacoma White" Subject: fsj: th400 question, about the guts! This list rules. I have a question about our th400's. Is anyone sure you can stick a Chevy shaft in there? I'd like to do so when I rebuild it, so I can throw the sweet twinstick 205 on there. Anyway, if anyone knows, tell me tell me hehehehe. Thanks again guys....... tacoma ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 22:08:36 -0600 From: JeepNut Subject: Re: fsj: Re: steering box (wondering) Just wondering if that is such a good idea? I've thought about replacing my leaker with a junkyard box, but wondered if it really made any sense? I mean, won't any junkyard box likely be at or near "leaking" also? Unless you found the rare "low milage" Waggie with a steering box.... Or maybe you can use a steering gear box off of something else that is low mileage? Are these the same as GM boxes or something? JeepNut Brazzadog-at-aol.com wrote: ... A good steering box can be had for less than $100 at a junkyard ($50 last I checked). ate: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 00:07:10 EST From: HouTexFrk-at-aol.com I was wondering if Grand Wagoneers have a problem with the streering. Mine wonders all over the road I read a tech tip on fsja about tightening the adjusting screw on the top of the steering box that helped a little but it still doesn't feel like a regular streering truck. I was just wondering if there are parts that wear out regularly. seems like the ball joints and wheels bearings are all in good shape. any inpu would help. I just what to get some info before i buy a 375 dollar steering box . thanks again 85 wagoneer - -- Registered Linux User #287453 In a world without walls and fences, who needs Windows or Gates? - ------------------------------------------------------------ '87 Street Comanche #24/100 '88 Grand Wagoneer '87 Grand Wagoneer '92 Cherokee ...and they say there's only one... - ------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 00:02:58 EST From: Brazzadog-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: Re: steering box (wondering) These power steering boxes are essentially the same ones used in GM cars and trucks. They were made by Saginaw who also made the steering columns and I believe was a subsidiary of GM. The only variation that won't be fairly obvious would be the internal ratio or valving. They might make the steering feel a little different but you probably wouldn't notice any difference. You'd want to make sure the replacement unit had the right number of mounting holes (either 3 or 4) and that the input and output shafts were the same. The input and output shafts might all be the same, but I don't know that for sure so it'd be better to check. In my experience junkyards either remove steering gears and put them in a pile that you can pick through or they leave them on the vehicle and you pull it yourself. I like to pull them myself so I can mark output shaft when the wheels are straight. Either way, you might find one that still had black paint on it. That would be a good sign. High-mileage vehicles often have low-mileage parts when they wind up in a junkyard. Saginaw steering gears are arguably the most durable ones ever made so chances of finding a good one usually aren't too bad. If a junkyard wouldn't exchange a bad one they'd sold me, I wouldn't do business there. Of course, then you're still out the time required to do the work. Ben Williams In a message dated 2/16/2003 8:11:52 PM Pacific Standard Time, jeepnut-at-bellsouth.net writes: >Just wondering if that is such a good idea? >I've thought about replacing my leaker with a junkyard box, but wondered if it >really made any sense? >I mean, won't any junkyard box likely be at or near "leaking" also? >Unless you found the rare "low milage" Waggie with a steering box.... >Or maybe you can use a steering gear box off of something else that is low > mileage? Are these the same as GM boxes or something? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 00:05:35 EST From: Brazzadog-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: Re: steering box (wondering) These power steering boxes are essentially the same ones used in GM cars and trucks. They were made by Saginaw who also made the steering columns and I believe was a subsidiary of GM. The only variation that won't be fairly obvious would be the internal ratio or valving. They might make the steering feel a little different but you probably wouldn't notice any difference. You'd want to make sure the replacement unit had the right number of mounting holes (either 3 or 4) and that the input and output shafts were the same. The input and output shafts might all be the same, but I don't know that for sure so it'd be better to check. In my experience junkyards either remove steering gears and put them in a pile that you can pick through or they leave them on the vehicle and you pull it yourself. I like to pull them myself so I can mark output shaft when the wheels are straight. Either way, you might find one that still had black paint on it. That would be a good sign. High-mileage vehicles often have low-mileage parts when they wind up in a junkyard. Saginaw steering gears are arguably the most durable ones ever made so chances of finding a good one usually aren't too bad. If a junkyard wouldn't exchange a bad one they'd sold me, I wouldn't do business there. Of course, then you're still out the time required to do the work. Ben Williams In a message dated 2/16/2003 8:11:52 PM Pacific Standard Time, jeepnut-at-bellsouth.net writes: >Just wondering if that is such a good idea? >I've thought about replacing my leaker with a junkyard box, but wondered if it >really made any sense? >I mean, won't any junkyard box likely be at or near "leaking" also? >Unless you found the rare "low milage" Waggie with a steering box.... >Or maybe you can use a steering gear box off of something else that is low > mileage? Are these the same as GM boxes or something? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 23:04:32 -0800 From: john Subject: Re: fsj: th400 question, about the guts! shoot yeah, just have the tranny split and the output shaft and tailcone swapped... cost me $100 (mind you that was a number of years ago) to do it on a TH350, and the TH400 ain't much different. the TH400s used with the QT have that long ugly 10 spline out put... but either way, just get the tailshaft and cone section from a chevy and have a shop do it... you might even be able to do it yourself... john meister At 09:07 PM 2/16/2003 -0700, Tacoma White wrote: > This list rules. I have a question about our th400's. Is anyone sure you >can stick a Chevy shaft in there? I'd like to do so when I rebuild it, so I >can throw the sweet twinstick 205 on there. Anyway, if anyone knows, tell me >tell me hehehehe. Thanks again guys....... > > tacoma - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 23:18:21 -0800 From: john Subject: Re: fsj: th400 question, about the guts! cool, lower first gear and overdrive??? if I understand what you just said... shoot, you'll have an XJ with an FSJ surrounding it. ;) that's why I'm going with the 4.0L and Aisin Warner 4 speed automatic out of an xj. :) john At 12:16 AM 2/17/2003 -0700, Tacoma White wrote: > John, > cool, I've been looking at the rebuild book, looks pretty easy. i'm >trying to round up th475 parts and a low 1st... and a huge cooler heheh.. > > and then we'll wind that puppy up and crawl away > > -Tacoma > >----- Original > > > the TH400s used with the QT have that long ugly 10 spline > > out put... but either way, just get the tailshaft and cone > > section from a chevy and have a shop do it... you might > > even be able to do it yourself... - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 16 Feb 2003 23:27:38 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: overdrive?? we built an adapter for my AW4 to mate to my NP219... curtis was going to machine it at my work, but he couldn't get up here during the week and we ended up hiring it out, cost about $250 to make the adapter... best of both worlds, xj reliability and economy with the durability of an FSJ fulltime xfr case. :) john At 12:29 AM 2/17/2003 -0700, Tacoma White wrote: > o/d would be great... but no plans for one... I've got a 700r4 but >they need some specialized tools. . I may just scrap the whole idea and buy >one from tci or Summit. The th475 parts alone are about 900bucks, sooo.... > > lot of options for around that price...... > > > tacoma - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 08:02:56 -0700 From: Tesar Landon-r16884 Subject: fsj: steering playfulness Umm, quick check, and this has made a difference for some people, is that the mounting bolts for the steering box itself are loose. This allows the pitman? arm to move a bunch before it actually pushes the wheels in any direction. My '89, for its weight and height, I consider 'tossable' Considering the vintage, I think it handles pretty well. The slalom is not its best event. When I have seen a suspension shop 'check out' the suspension, mostly the put a big-xxx screwdriver anywhere it will fit and start prying to find play. This takes about 10 minutes, and will usually be done for free. The tie-rod ends can wear an oblong hole in the arm they tie to, this connection should be kept tight. Hey, another one is to replace the sway bar bushings.... OK, that should hold you. - - Landon - ----------------------------------- Date: Sat, 15 Feb 2003 00:07:10 EST From: HouTexFrk-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: steering box (wondering) I was wondering if Grand Wagoneers have a problem with the streering. Mine wonders all over the road I read a tech tip on fsja about tightening the adjusting screw on the top of the steering box that helped a little but it still doesn't feel like a regular streering truck. I was just wondering if there are parts that wear out regularly. seems like the ball joints and wheels bearings are all in good shape. any inpu would help. I just what to get some info before i buy a 375 dollar steering box . thanks again 85 wagoneer ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #1864 **************************