From listmom-at-listserver.tehabi.com Tue Mar 11 09:55:29 1997 Return-Path: listmom-at-listserver.tehabi.com Received: from listserver.tehabi.com (listserver.tehabi.com [207.167.76.152]) by wagoneers.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA06197 for ; Tue, 11 Mar 1997 09:55:09 -0800 Received: from listserver.tehabi.com (207.167.76.152) by listserver.tehabi.com with SMTP (Apple Internet Mail Server 1.1.1); Tue, 11 Mar 1997 09:57:38 -0800 Sender: fsj-list-at-listserver.tehabi.com Errors-To: listmom-at-listserver.tehabi.com Reply-To: fsj-list-at-listserver.tehabi.com Message-Id: <1354048266-at-listserver.tehabi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" From: fsj-list-at-listserver.tehabi.com X-Listserver: Macjordomo - A Macintosh Listserver by Michele Fuortes Date: Tue, 11 Mar 1997 09:57:10 -0800 Precedence: Bulk To: Multiple recipients of Subject: FSJ-List-Digest - Number 218 Status: RO FSJ-List-Digest Tuesday, March 11, 1997 Issue 218 Today's Topics: Re: Nuther TH400 Question Re: interchange Re: Tires, Gears, a little paint, and a name Re: Custom bolt pattern wheel Sources? Re: Desktop Dyno and the 258 regional associations, business cards body mounts regional associations, business cards Re: Tow Hooks/Rings 258 Build-Up Teil Funf Re: Nuther TH400 Question Re: Desktop Dyno and the 258 rust free 89 GW has rough idle carb to be rebuilt Help!Stuck in Emergency Drive Custom bolt pattern wheel Sources? Re: Ford 300 rods in your 360 FW: Stupid Humans (humor) (fwd) Re: Tow Hook Installation Gord's Question: Parts from Cherokee to Wagoneer Rough Idling GW C6 Xmission questions Trivia: 4xfirsts... Re: regional associations, business cards Re: Gord's Question: Parts from Cherokee to Wagoneer RE: Tires, Gears, a little paint, and a name ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 09 Mar 1997 18:42:31 -0800 From: kenns Subject: Re: Nuther TH400 Question the vac can on the side of the AT is NOT for kickdown, it is only for the upshifts!! M_B_FEICK wrote: > > That's to cause the tranny to kickdown to a lower gear on hard > acceleration. I don't remember the exact numbers, but it's something > like this: if you're going over 45 mph and then you floor it, the switch > is activated, and the tranny downshifts from 3 to 2. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > It augments the vac. kickdown as well. > -- Sincerely kenneth e. wetherall If a Wagoneer can go where a kenns-at-concentric.net CJ can go, then it's a Super Wagoneer. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 Mar 1997 18:43:57 -0800 From: kenns Subject: Re: interchange u would have to call a yard and ask about their set of 'interchange' manuals. they would list the same info u seek!! Willie Pogue wrote: > > Since FSJ's are "obsolete" in the eyes of Chrysler and the aftermarket, what, > if any, parts on the "little" cherokees and grand cherokees interchange with > their bigger older siblings? I am thinking of those things manufacturers like > to use off-the-shelf such as power window motors and regulators , seat motors, > turn signal stalks etc. Does anyone have any info ? It would sure improve the > junkyard pickins if so! > Willie Pogue > wpogue-at-space.nrl.navy.mil > -- Sincerely kenneth e. wetherall If a Wagoneer can go where a kenns-at-concentric.net CJ can go, then it's a Super Wagoneer. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 Mar 1997 18:59:01 -0800 From: kenns Subject: Re: Tires, Gears, a little paint, and a name y didnt u go for the radial SS?? do u have somtihng to drive in for the trip down south?? -- Sincerely kenneth e. wetherall If a Wagoneer can go where a kenns-at-concentric.net CJ can go, then it's a Super Wagoneer. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 Mar 1997 19:05:24 -0800 From: kenns Subject: Re: Custom bolt pattern wheel Sources? stockten wheel, darn if i dont have the number. but its in the back of most 4x4 mags!! Allan Weidenheimer wrote: > > A while back, someone (Michael B?) posted the name/number > of a company that builds wheels in the bolt pattern/size > that you specify. Come whomever please re-post that info? > > Thanks, > Allan Weidenheimer > 84 GW > Sincerely kenneth e. wetherall If a Wagoneer can go where a kenns-at-concentric.net CJ can go, then it's a Super Wagoneer. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 97 21:39:42 EST From: rdmbfe-at-micro.lucent.com (M_B_FEICK) Subject: Re: Desktop Dyno and the 258 > ADVERTISED CAM SPECS INTAKE + EXHAUST DUR:280 LIFT448 BASED ON 1.6 ROCKER ARMS > Intake -4.0 ATDC open > 32.0 ABDC closes > Exhaust 40.0 BBDC open > -12.0 BTDC closes > Lobe Sep 112deg > > Duration -at-.050 I/E 208deg > Lobe Lift I/E .280 If using lobe center method, use intake centerline of 108deg Are these the seat-to-seat specs? >>>>>>> Sure looks that way... I don't think you want to see the results. Torque is up at 2000 rpm but drops like a stone above that and hp is lower across the board. >>>>>>> You're right I don't want to see that in fact, I hate that! Something has GOT to be wrong. It doesn't seem too likely to me that they could make such an oversight at Crower. If so, I'm going to send this sucker back. I'll call them tomorrow and see how they respond to this. Just for grins, do you think that if you plugged in 9:1 compression and/or headers would that change anything? I kind of doubt it... What is your impression of this? Is the program always accurate? Are any of you on the Jeep-L that can ask about any experience with Crower part # 44915 "Baja Beast"? Hmmm Brad Feick ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 1997 23:30:07 -0500 From: "Dennis M. \"Doc\" Fariello" Subject: regional associations, business cards I like what I'm seeing from you guys up in New England.... way to go... when y'all decide who's going to be the regional coordinator, contact person, etc, let me know and I'll post the pertinent info on the site. I think this is going to be great, guys... it's also going to help with the coordination of the mass exodus to Ouray in 2002. I think we're going to need some kind of "representative" or whatever for each major geographical area, whether it be a "regional association" or just a contact, or whatever. As a preliminary, let's look at what we've got so far: New England States - Mark Wallace, I guess... it was, after all, his idea, wasn't it? Southern States - Me, I reckon. Anybody else want it? One of you Texas guys, perhaps? Tom C? Pacific Northwest - John (my, my, I'm brave, ain't I? ) perhaps, or one of you guys in the area that isn't quite as busy as John if he doesn't want it? Ron? South West - One of you guys in CA, NV, or AZ? Ken or Mike? Sam? Midwest - Indy Joe, perhaps? Europe - whaddaya think, Frank? Canada - Ed? I believe just about all the Canadians we have are from BC, aren't y'all? Do we need to split Canada up? wait... Quebecans have been trying to do that for years... Here's what I've got in mind, for now and the near future: I'm in the process, as y'all know, of compiling the complete list of members for posting on the site... I'm thinking now of putting it up in a couple of formats... complete member list, and lists by region. Maybe with a little logo specific for each regional association? Just think, guys... MORE STICKERS! . One of the FSJ stickers, one for membership in the IFSJA, one for regional association, and I'm now starting preliminary design work on one for the Great Dinosaur Invasion itself... . Business cards... I guess nobody wants to do the designing? Ok, I'll do it, then. I'm telling y'all, though.... brace yourselves... . Anybody care to volunteer before I do? Too late! . check it out, let me know what y'all think... then we'll worry about getting them printed up............. | | | | | ============= | 0_| / \ |_o |_|_____----+-----____|_| |====|=====|=====|====| ||____|_____|_____|____|| \_____|___|DOC|___|_____/ |\/\/|--------\_/--|\/\/| ______|\/\/|_____________|\/\/|______ Home of the "Bottomless Transfer Case" _____________________________________ email: fariello-at-inspace.net http://www.inspace.net/~fariello/fsj _____________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 1997 23:30:27 -0500 From: "Dennis M. \"Doc\" Fariello" Subject: body mounts >"rubber body mounting cushions can be ordered from Metro Moulded Parts. >612 757- 0310. You will need the dimensions of your old parts. If you >get a catalogue, look on page#178." hmm... I wonder if they'd make poly bushings for us, too? | | | | | ============= | 0_| / \ |_o |_|_____----+-----____|_| |====|=====|=====|====| ||____|_____|_____|____|| \_____|___|DOC|___|_____/ |\/\/|--------\_/--|\/\/| ______|\/\/|_____________|\/\/|______ Home of the "Bottomless Transfer Case" _____________________________________ email: fariello-at-inspace.net http://www.inspace.net/~fariello/fsj _____________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 1997 23:31:29 -0500 From: "Dennis M. \"Doc\" Fariello" Subject: regional associations, business cards I like what I'm seeing up there in New England... cool idea, Mark. I've been thinking we're going to need to do something along those lines all over the country eventually, especially when it gets closer to time to start coordinating The Invasion, and it's nice to see you take the initiative and start doing so! Make it "official", design up a logo for yourselves if ya want, and I'll post it on the site, of course. So congratulations, Mark... you're the IFSJA's FIRST "official" REGIONAL COORDINATOR! Unless, of course, you manage to talk somebody else into it.... . Any volunteers for other areas of the country? They're already hanging together out there in the PacNW, I guess we can blame that on, er, stick, er, talk John into being the RC up there... This probably isn't really important yet, just something to keep in mind as we keep growing, I guess... Whaddaya all think of this breakdown, and possible RCs? New England - Mark Pacific North West - John? South West - Ken or Mike? Any of you CA/NV/AZ guys want it? South East - any volunteers? Or shall I? Europe - Frank? Sune? Ismo? Midwest - Indy Joe, perhaps? Canada - Ed? Do we need to split Canada up? Wait, Quebecans have been trying to do that for years......... Business cards... remember those? Welp, I finally tried my hand at designing some, see my final effort on the IFSJA site. If y'all like it, then we'll have to see about getting them printed up! | | | | | ============= | 0_| / \ |_o |_|_____----+-----____|_| |====|=====|=====|====| ||____|_____|_____|____|| \_____|___|DOC|___|_____/ |\/\/|--------\_/--|\/\/| ______|\/\/|_____________|\/\/|______ Home of the "Bottomless Transfer Case" _____________________________________ email: fariello-at-inspace.net http://www.inspace.net/~fariello/fsj _____________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 1997 23:33:13 -0600 From: "JenHen" Subject: Re: Tow Hooks/Rings Ron, I attached my tow hooks to the triangles that connect the parallel frame rails to the front crossmember on my '68. I had Buster McCusker weld a piece of rectangular stock ( about .75" to 1" deep, 2" wide, with the holes drilled and nuts welded in) right onto that triangle. The tow hooks then bolted up to the stock. They hang down just enough so that a winch cable or snatch strap will clear the bottom edge of the bumper on my '68. Not too noticeable, but very functional and doesn't look bad at all. Henry ---------- > From: Joe Sego > To: Multiple recipients of > Subject: Re: Tow Hooks/Rings > Date: Tuesday, March 11, 1997 5:10 AM > > > > >I don't think I want to attach it to the part of the frame that goes > >across the front ... do I? > > > >Ron > >76 Wagoneer > >Sea, WA > > > > > Ron, > No!! That piece is not stout enough. Believe me, I had > part of the snow plow attached to that on my J-10...ripped > right off, very thin metal. > > What we did on the plow setup on the Cherokee was extend the > main frame rails about 8". But the frame rails are kinda > thin too, we welded AND bolted the angle irons. To be such > heavy duty trucks..the frame seems like the weak link. > > I am having tow hooks bolted/welded to my plow mounts. > I'm thinking this is why Jeep never offered tow hooks > as an option. > > C'ya > Joe- > 79 Chief > > > > > --------------------------------------------------- > To Unsubscribe send email to macjordomo-at-listserver.tehabi.com with the command > "unsubscribe FSJ-List" in the body of the message. > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 97 23:25:50 EST From: rdmbfe-at-micro.lucent.com (M_B_FEICK) Subject: 258 Build-Up Teil Funf Hi guys- Today I was checking out the IFSJA site and noticed that Doc paid me the complement of putting these 258 series posts in the Tech area. Many thanks to you Doc! Because of this, I would like to start this next post by outlining a few parameters for this project, as I will make the assumption that some of you are following this mess, and Doc will continue to update the site. First and foremost, I am not an expert on the 258, or any other engine for that matter. I do however have a fair amount of hands-on experience with different flavors of GM musclecar and Harley engines. This is more of a group "learn-from-my-mistakes" type of thing, and anyone who would like to challenge my methodology or motives is more than welcome. I reserve the right to change my mind as better information and options become available to me. Secondly, this is not supposed to be a max-effort stompin' 258. My goals are to have a tight, reliable, well mannered engine that will start in the coldest weather. Keep in mind that I am located in the great NorthEast and as such am subject to brutally cold wind chills from time to time. I will sacrifice some performance for reliability, as this engine is going in an all purpose used-for-real type J series pickup-Mr. Beef. I am beginning to assemble the 258, and thus far have run into few potential problems. I started the reassembly by removing the rear main bearing cap and replacing the rear main seal. It helps to loosen all the bearing caps and lightly lift up on the crank to get the upper seal slipped around. Otherwise the block starts "shaving" the seal on the outer side of the seal. BTW-I followed the shop manual to the letter on the rear main seal install-went great. I then re-torqued all of the bearing caps and connecting rods to the factory in-service specs. I then took the cover off of the oil pump and inspected the gears-looked great with normal wear marks. I forced some break-in supplement into the pump and up into the block, so the pump forces that through everything first. I them coated all the contact and wear areas with break-in lube and reassembled the cover gasket with a light coating of Hi-Tack and torqued all oil-pump related fasteners. BTW- at this point I began playing with the pan seals and although not specifically addressed in the manual, it looks like the proper order of assembly with re. to the seals is as follows: inner rear main bearing cap (lower) seal flush with block/cork pan seal tabs set on top of lower seal tabs/outer rear main cap to pan seal set on top of cork tabs. It looks like RTV at the junctions just mentioned would be the way to go, with Hi-Tack brushed on to the cork gaskets prior to placing them on the block. Any input on any of this you guys? Anyway I'm getting ahead of myself-just fitting the gaskets and making a plan. I'm going to insert the cam next time with the pan off in order to support it while threading it through the block so's I don't nick the bearings or cam. This is of course provided that I actually USE my cam-there are some 11th hour reasons to doubt it's effectiveness. Brad Feick ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 97 23:35:03 EST From: rdmbfe-at-micro.lucent.com (M_B_FEICK) Subject: Re: Nuther TH400 Question the vac can on the side of the AT is NOT for kickdown, it is only for the upshifts!! >>>>>>>>> What WAS I thinking?? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 1997 21:10:46 -0800 From: Thomas Anhalt Subject: Re: Desktop Dyno and the 258 M_B_FEICK wrote: > > > ADVERTISED CAM SPECS INTAKE + EXHAUST DUR:280 LIFT448 > BASED ON 1.6 ROCKER ARMS > > > Intake -4.0 ATDC open > > 32.0 ABDC closes > > > Exhaust 40.0 BBDC open > > -12.0 BTDC closes > > > Lobe Sep 112deg > > > > Duration -at-.050 I/E 208deg > > > Lobe Lift I/E .280 > > You're right I don't want to see that in fact, I hate that! Something has GOT > to be wrong. It doesn't seem too likely to me that they could make such an > oversight at Crower. If so, I'm going to send this sucker back. I'll call > them tomorrow and see how they respond to this. Just for grins, do you think > that if you plugged in 9:1 compression and/or headers would that change > anything? I kind of doubt it... What is your impression of this? Is the > program always accurate? > Are any of you on the Jeep-L that can ask about any experience with Crower > part # 44915 "Baja Beast"? I think the boys at Crower have a little explaining to do. If we use the intake and exhaust timing numbers they gave you, it doesn't match the lobe separation or duration numbers they gave. Just to try something, I took the advertised lift, duration, and lobe separation angle and figured out the valve timing numbers that would match, and they are: Intake open 28 deg BTDC Intake close 72 deg ABDC Exhaust open 72 deg BBDC Exhaust close 28 deg ATDC I plugged these into the dyno and what you get is 20 ft-lbs lower torque -at- 2000 rpm and 10 less peak hp compared to the specs I have for the stock AMC cam that came in my '81 258. Just for comparison, those numbers are: Intake open 9 deg BTDC Intake close 73 deg ABDC Exhaust open 57 deg BBDC Exhaust close 25 deg ATDC Intake/Exhaust Duration 262 deg Overlap 34 deg Lobe Center Angle 114 deg Intake Centerline Angle 122 deg Cam Lobe lift .253 Lift -at- 1.6 ratio .404 As far as "is the program accurate?" goes, I just bought the companion book for the program it explains that the program is basically built around the valve timing and the fluid dynamics associated with it. I think it would be very accurate with respect to cam timing input. Here's the comparison of hp and torque of the stock cam vs the "Baja Beast" using the cam timing numbers they gave. stock "Baja Beast" rpm hp torque hp torque 2000 73 191 88 231 2500 91 192 105 221 3000 114 200 120 209 3500 132 198 119 179 4000 142 186 108 141 4500 142 166 86 100 5000 128 135 57 59 5500 110 105 24 23 6000 85 74 0 0 Actually, now that I have the numbers listed out here it doesn't look as bad as when you look at the curves plotted on top of one another. Also, the program starts at 2000 rpm (I wish it started at 1000, but the guy who wrote the software is into drag racing) and it looks like that cam makes all of it's torque below 2500 rpm. It looks like it basically gives up the peak horsepower for higher torque and hp below 3000 rpm which is what shorter durations should do. I guess I was wrong about the hp being down across the board, it's actually up below 3000 rpm. Since these engines don't see 4000 rpm very often, especially offroad, maybe this isn't so bad. Personally, I'd rather have a much flatter torque curve and have it extend up towards redline. One thing is for certain, from the numbers they gave you, the intake duration is 216 deg and the exhaust is 232 deg. Neither are the 280 that they told you. Must be a typo somewhere. Tom Anhalt '81 Cherokee Laredo ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Mar 1997 01:35:08 -0500 From: "Dennis M. \"Doc\" Fariello" Subject: rust free 89 GW has rough idle carb to be rebuilt I've forwarded your message to the list... guys, help these folks out, will ya? My own observations about the big jeeps is that indeed, MOST of the time strange ticking noises are usually something really silly and cheap to fix, usually exhaust leaks. I personally am suffering from this really really really obnoxious and scary sound coming from under the hood of Timex, but all it is is the bearing for the AC idler pulley is in need of replacement. Ah, but it's a six... . I've heard from others that there isn't much difference in performance between the 360 and the 258... I dunno 'bout that. Well, thinking about it, "Drippy" was quite speedy, but Timex DEFINITELY ain't... must have something to do with the 2.73 gears and 31" tires..... ya think? To subscribe to the list, email , leave the subject blank. In the body of the message, put "subscribe FSJ-List (your name, vehicle, where you live) and that'll do it. I recommend that you also go into digest mode, as sometimes the mailings get a little heavy. Volume-wise, that is. Nice to hear from you, and thanks! How come you didn't sign the guestbook? . >X-POP3-Rcpt: fariello-at-nebula >Return-Path: mlamm-at-iwaynet.net >Date: Sat, 08 Mar 97 21:43:45 -0800 >From: Mark and Lynne >To: fariello-at-inspace.net >Subject: rust free 89 GW has rough idle carb to be rebuilt > >i have an appt to get the carb rebuilt as this helped the idle and >driveability on my 82 258 powerwd truck alot. Ive replaced plugs,cap and >rotor,and will do wires in a week or so. the truck smooths out at speed >but misses slightly on acceleration from a stop. Also i heard that 360s >often have a minor valve tick is this true? I have a tick on the right >side of the motor but think it may be an exhaust leak which if I'm right >could account for the miss. I sold the 82 with 170,000 on it and have >kicked myself eversince as it was relitively rust free and ran very >well(the buyer is still driving it with no problems at 250,000 plus >miles). I love the 89 and love driving it, I would like to subscribe to >your pageif I can. The tick on the motor is slight but noticible do you >have any suggestions for me on this? I plan to have the carb guy look at >the motor to try to track down the tick. I dont think its a valve though >cause i ppulled the new plugs and found no signs of oil(none omn old ones >either just carbon fouled from rich mixture). the truck runs well and >starts well even in the cold but is getting single digit gas milage in >town and about 11-12 city hgwy mixed. I hope the carb job will help mpg as >I drive about 60 miles a day in the GW. I cant believe how favorably the >258 compares to the 360 in the power dept except for passing and it always >got about 18-21 mpg hgwy and 15-16 city. I added this as i saw the >question asked in the website ref engibe swap. the six was very strong low >end and ok midrange but reved alot and made a lot of noiese when kicked >down for not much gain in power. The 360 is great and passes very easily >without kicking down in my 89 whiich i like as the kick down is harsh in >my truck I think the linckage may nee adjusted. Well I hope this is not >too long htanks for any help you may have and I hope my info on 258 >performance was a hel p to somebody. > > > | | | | | ============= | 0_| / \ |_o |_|_____----+-----____|_| |====|=====|=====|====| ||____|_____|_____|____|| \_____|___|DOC|___|_____/ |\/\/|--------\_/--|\/\/| ______|\/\/|_____________|\/\/|______ Home of the "Bottomless Transfer Case" _____________________________________ email: fariello-at-inspace.net http://www.inspace.net/~fariello/fsj _____________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 1997 21:46:37 From: "Baxter Enterprises Inc. d.b.a. Baxter Advertising" Subject: Help!Stuck in Emergency Drive LHQT20A-at-prodigy.com (MR ROBERT A HOWELLS) writes: >> The light went off for a while but the QT was still engaged.Could my exhaust repair have effected the vacuum if so why can't I get it to shut off. << You could indeed affect the Q-T while doing exhaust work. Where the exhaust pipe passes inside the right frame rail and along the right-hand side of the t-case is where the diaphragm is located that controls the shifting. There are two vacuum ports on the diaphragm itslef. Two short rubber vac. lines connect the ports to metal tubes that run up along the firewall. It sounds like you knocked one of the rubber lines loose. They are often in not too good of condition and you should consider replacing both lines. I beleive those two lines go faster than any other vac. lines on the BW Q-T FSJs. -- Michael Baxter 74172.1164-at-Compuserve.com baxter-advertising-at-worldnet.att.net http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/MBaxter From Reno, NV USA ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 1997 21:47:37 From: "Baxter Enterprises Inc. d.b.a. Baxter Advertising" Subject: Custom bolt pattern wheel Sources? "Allan Weidenheimer" writes: >> A while back, someone (Michael B?) posted the name/number of a company that builds wheels in the bolt pattern/size that you specify. Come whomever please re-post that info? << Allan, it wasn't me but, I remember the post. I think it was Stockton Wheel in Stockton, CA? -- Michael Baxter 74172.1164-at-Compuserve.com baxter-advertising-at-worldnet.att.net http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/MBaxter From Reno, NV USA ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 1997 22:14:11 From: "Baxter Enterprises Inc. d.b.a. Baxter Advertising" Subject: Re: Ford 300 rods in your 360 kenns writes: >> what specs u need, i can look to other years and maybe the 170 200 or 250 ci I6's!!! << All of them....:-). The weight, rod length, the pin diameter, rod bearing diameter (less bearing) and the rod journal width would be nice. Hey, how about we reverse engineer this....I'll list he 258 & 304/360 rod specs. and you see if any of the Fords are close. I can't explain why I'm doing this exactly. It's not like anyone on this list is going to spin an AMC 258/304/360 to an RPM requiring forged rods! I think it's like saying "I have locked Dana 60." Makes others go "...OH!" Okay... the 258...Hey 1st; I had heard that the 258s rods and the 304/360s rods were interchangable. When I compared SuperKen's 300 rod specs. to the 258 - 360/304's rod specs. Ehhhhhhhh....thank you for playing. They are close but, they don't interchange: 258 (these are tight figures)" weight = 695 grams length = 5.873" pin bore = .9288" rod bore = 2.2085" journal width = 1.07" 304/360: weight = 681 grams length = 5.873" pin bore = .9288" rod bore = 2.0934" journal width = .999" If you were desperate, it looks like you could put 8 258 rods in a 304/360 with some machine work. -- Michael Baxter 74172.1164-at-Compuserve.com baxter-advertising-at-worldnet.att.net http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/MBaxter From Reno, NV USA ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Mar 1997 00:32:45 -0700 (MST) From: David Klingenberg Subject: FW: Stupid Humans (humor) (fwd) +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+ David Klingenberg Tip Training Team kling914-at-uidaho.edu Computer Lab Consultant http://www.uidaho.edu/~kling914 Community Enrichment Insructor Jeep Wagoneer Owner and Fanatic! _+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ ------- Forwarded Message Follows ------- >>Police in Wichita, Kansas, arrested a 22-year-old man at an airport >>hotel after he tried to pass two (counterfeit) $16 bills. >> >> ************************************************************ >>A man in Johannesberg, South Africa, shot his 49-year-old friend in >>the face, seriously wounding him, while the two practiced shooting >>beer cans off each other's head. >> >> ************************************************************ >>A company trying to continue its five-year perfect safety record >>showed its workers a film aimed at encouraging the use of safety >>goggles on the job. According to Industrial Machinery News, the >>film's depiction of gory industrial accidents was so graphic that >>twenty-five workers suffered minor injuries in their rush to leave >>the screening room. Thirteen others fainted, and one man required >>seven stitches after he cut his head falling off a chair while >>watching the film. >> >> ************************************************************ >>The Chico, California, City Council enacted a ban on nuclear >>weapons, setting a $500 fine for anyone detonating one within city >>limits. I realy love this one. :) >> >> ************************************************************ >>A bus carrying five passengers was hit by a car in St. Louis, but by >>the time police arrived on the scene, fourteen pedestrians had >>boarded the bus and had begun to complain of whiplash injuries and >>back pain. >> >> ************************************************************ >>Swedish business consultant Ulf af Trolle labored 13 years on a book >>about Swedish economic solutions. He took the 250-page manuscript to >>be copied, only to have it reduced to 50,000 strips of paper in >>seconds when a worker confused the copier with the shredder. >> >> ************************************************************ >>A convict broke out of jail in Washington D.C., then a few >>days later accompanied his girlfriend to her trial for robbery. At >>lunch, he went out for a sandwich. She needed to see him, and thus >>had him paged. Police officers recognized his name and arrested him >>as he returned to the courthouse in a car he had stolen over the >>lunch hour. >> >> ************************************************************ >>Police in Radnor, Pennsylvania, interrogated a suspect by placing a >>metal colander on his head and connecting it with wires to a >>photocopy machine. The message "He's lying" was placed in the >>copier, and police pressed the copy button each time they thought >>the suspect wasn't telling the truth. Believing the "lie detector" >>was working, the suspect confessed. >> >> ************************************************************ >>When two service station attendants in Ionia, Michigan, refused to >>hand over the cash to an intoxicated robber, the man threatened to >>call the police. They still refused, so the robber called the police >>and was arrested. >> >> ************************************************************ >>A Los Angeles man who later said he was "tired of walking," stole a >>steamroller and led police on a 5 mph chase until an officer stepped >>aboard and brought the vehicle to a stop. >> >> *********************************************************** ____________________ Tagline of the week: -------------------- "Is that seat saved?" "No, but we're praying for it!" Tim Valdez timv-at-uidaho.edu Help Desk Specialist 885-APAL(2725) (M-F 7am-6pm) University of Idaho Moscow ID 83844-3155 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Mar 1997 03:38:58 -0500 From: "Dennis M. \"Doc\" Fariello" Subject: Re: Tow Hook Installation >Date: Sat, 08 Mar 1997 15:10:00 -0800 >From: Ron Strouss >Subject: Tow Hook Installation > >I'm about ready to put 4 Tow Hooks on ... What's the best way to mount >them. I know they go on the frame, but ???. Does the bolt go thru two >sides of the frame or what? duh, I KNEW I should have done an article on that... . I put my two fronts on Timex on the brush guard, on the rear I have one, one bolt in the hole from the former spare tire carrier, one drilled in the frame rail. I used 1/2" grade 8 bolts throughout. The front ones I drilled holes in the factory brush guard for. I held the tow hook so it was in a pretty much horizontal plane, punched and drilled the holes right through the brush guard rails. I also use safety hooks on all three, although I admit that every time I use them I hate those safety clips, but then again I think of what it was like when I was clipless, and the strap or whatever wouldn't stay on. So now I like clips, even though they are a pain in the kronk. The rear, to clarify, is mounted to the BOTTOM of the frame rails. I've been planning for many, many years to put the hook on the right rear, but I still haven't done it. I do indeed have the tow clip and I think I still have the safety clip, I'm not real sure. | | | | | ============= | 0_| / \ |_o |_|_____----+-----____|_| |====|=====|=====|====| ||____|_____|_____|____|| \_____|___|DOC|___|_____/ |\/\/|--------\_/--|\/\/| ______|\/\/|_____________|\/\/|______ Home of the "Bottomless Transfer Case" _____________________________________ email: fariello-at-inspace.net http://www.inspace.net/~fariello/fsj _____________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Mar 1997 03:39:26 -0500 From: "Dennis M. \"Doc\" Fariello" Subject: Gord's Question: Parts from Cherokee to Wagoneer >I've come across an 81 (I think) WT Cherokee and wondering about purchasing >some parts off of it for my 81 Wagoneer. The body is toast so the guy can't >register it in BC but tells me the running gear is good. The parts I'm >curious about are: EVERYTHING except the axles are interchangeable. Actually, the axles are, too, but you'd have to cut the rear fenders or lift it. >Rear Springs. - mine are bent about six inches from the hanger. Any one >know if their the same length etc. yep. >Grill - mines cracked. I have horizontal slats while his has vertical slats >and JEEP across the top. Are these interchangeable? I always liked the JEEP >on these. yep. me too. >Plus it has a bunch of parts that I need that I know I can take like a >great bush guard, all those emission pieces I'm missing, etc. Just wish I >had a place to park it for a while. they'll all fit. >His transfer case lever show 2HI, 4HI, N and 4Lo. Plus he has manual hubs. >Did 81's have an option for a part time case? yep. NP208, same case I've got in Timex, same as Drippy had. Hey, if that Cherokee has a manual tranny (you didn't say, did you?), how much do you want for the 'case? >Anyone feel like springing some cash for a parts donor?? hmmm..... | | | | | ============= | 0_| / \ |_o |_|_____----+-----____|_| |====|=====|=====|====| ||____|_____|_____|____|| \_____|___|DOC|___|_____/ |\/\/|--------\_/--|\/\/| ______|\/\/|_____________|\/\/|______ Home of the "Bottomless Transfer Case" _____________________________________ email: fariello-at-inspace.net http://www.inspace.net/~fariello/fsj _____________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Mar 1997 07:16:22 -0600 From: "Jeff Gunn" Subject: Rough Idling GW Mark: I saw your post which Doc forwarded to the FSJ list, and thought I'd respond. I have a 1978 Cherokee with a 360 2-barrel and a rough idle. The most recent thing I have tried really helped alot at idle and at part throttle. I removed the bolts holding the ignition module on the firewall (over the driver's side wheel well on my truck) and used a wire wheel and a file to clean the area where the ignition box meets the wheel well. This improved the ground and made a NOTICEABLE imrovement in idle and part throttle operation. I also intend to rebuild me carb at some point, but this really helped me. Good luck! Jeff Gunn '78 Cherokee 360 2-barrel, TH400 Auto Trans, QuadraTrac transfer case 4-door, Levi's interior, Rusto Mucho! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Mar 97 07:54:02 -0500 From: "THOMAS E. TAYLOR SR." Subject: C6 Xmission questions I have seen Ford referenced several times here and would like to ask if there are any C-6 pros on the list? I am overhauling engine & transmission of my 79 supercab F 150 and have conflicting information between the manual and what actually is in my unit. I have overhauled this xmission before, but it has been a while and I don't do xmission work every day. Please reply privately unless you think the list would be interested. Thanks, Tom 65 J300 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Mar 97 09:24:08 CST From: trhanson-at-cimsys01.aud.alcatel.com (Tony Hanson) Subject: Trivia: 4xfirsts... Goin' thru my archives last evening (ie: boxes of old Fourwheeler and 4-wheel & off road.) some excerpts from March 89 4Wheel&Offroad... 4xFirsts. Commercial vehicles only, no pre war or prototypes... 1st Independent Front Suspension....1963 Jeep Wagoneer 1st Over head cam, 230 ci Tornado...1963 Jeep Wagoneer (they also mention it being used in some current Jeep models) 1st 4x4 4 wheel ABS (optional on '89 full time) The Jeep Wagoneer also boasted of having the first automatic transmission in a 4x4, sorry, that credit goes to the 1958 Studebaker 3/4 ton Transtar's optional 3spd Flightomatic... Jeep Wagoneer's claim to fame: (in 1989 anyway) It has endured the longest production run in automotive history without major redesign changes; most of its parts are interchangable among '63 to '89 models..... (?:Did they stop the full size in '93, the same year Chrysler killed the Ramcharger???) One other cool bit: In April 1959, Mitsubishi of Japan paid $1,790,000 for the rights to produce Jeeps in Japan. That year, Jeep out sold trucks worldwide, but here in the U.S., trucks were still top dog. Update on my '64 Wag, I spent this weekend checking out Wagoneers on the road and in the for sale section of the paper. Saw three, a '79 and a pair of '82s. My conclusion was the tail light lenses are the same, so I ordered a pair from Savannah Jones yesterday. Of course last nights newscast talked about an upcoming UPS contract negotiations and possible strike!!! XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX X Tony R. Hanson Alcatel Network Systems X X In the Heart of the Texas Telecom Corridor X X email:trhanson-at-aud.alcatel.com X XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Mar 1997 08:22:57 -0700 From: swhitney-at-presto.GIS.Pima.GOV. (Steve Whitney) Subject: Re: regional associations, business cards Cards look great Doc! c-ya, Whit. Steve Whitney, '78 Wag Tucson, AZ swhitney-at-gis.pima.gov > Business cards... I guess nobody wants to do the designing? Ok, I'll do > it, then. I'm telling y'all, though.... brace yourselves... . > Anybody care to volunteer before I do? Too late! . > check it out, let me know > what y'all think... then we'll worry about getting them printed > up............. > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Mar 1997 09:50:51 -0800 From: Gordon McKenzie Subject: Re: Gord's Question: Parts from Cherokee to Wagoneer Dennis M. "Doc" Fariello wrote: > > yep. NP208, same case I've got in Timex, same as Drippy had. Hey, if > that Cherokee has a manual tranny (you didn't say, did you?), how much do > you want for the 'case? > > Nope, it's an auto. > > >Anyone feel like springing some cash for a parts donor?? > > hmmm..... Course shipping from here could be a bit pricey ;-) > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Mar 1997 09:49:11 -0800 From: "Renshaw, Ken" Subject: RE: Tires, Gears, a little paint, and a name > > >y didnt u go for the radial SS?? The SX's have 2 steel belts, one poly belt, and the sidewall tread to die for. I'd rather have the sidewall tread than the BFG's Triguard sidewalls....although both would be nice! ;-) > >do u have somtihng to drive in for the trip >down south?? Yup..my wifes Camry! ;-( "Yeah, I think we can get it through....tie it onto the Jeep...." ;-) Say Ken, what gear/tire combo do you run? I have to make a choice in the next day or so as to whether I get 4.56's or 4.88's.....I know the 4.88's are low, but in the Big Picture I'll end up with an actual OD unit, a 700R4, or, if I get my way, an NV4500 with a transfer case that accepts a 4:1 low-range gearset. -Ken 1979 Wagoneer 'Babe' 360/ProJection/TH400/QT 36" SX's, 4.XX's Dana 44's, ARB's > ------------------------------ End of FSJ-List-Digest #218 ************************************ --------------------------------------------------- To Unsubscribe send email to macjordomo-at-listserver.tehabi.com with the command "unsubscribe FSJ-List" in the body of the message.