Subject: fsj-digest V1 #2015 From: owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net (fsj-digest) Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 18:05:46 +0000 To: fsj-digest-at-digest.net fsj-digest Friday, September 19 2003 Volume 01 : Number 2015 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: overheating RE: fsj: overheating problems fsj: RE: overheating [none] Re: fsj: overheating problems RE: fsj: Colorado J10 Re: fsj: overheating problems fsj: removing body lift Re: fsj: removing body lift Re: fsj: removing body lift Re: fsj: removing body lift fsj: Brazzadog... AMC GM TH400 adaptor ring fsj: Off-topic truck accessory question FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 10:27:15 -0700 From: Tesar Landon-r16884 Subject: fsj: overheating Hi Charles, Mine is inching up, but not that hot! Anyway, I think it's the fan clutch. Mine is a little loose, yours maybe more so. I'm thinking the way to test this is to (with the motor hot and off) attempt to fling the fan blades in the opposite direction from the engine rotation, and see how quickly the fan stops. I don't think you should get more than a quarter turn out of it. Anyone else concur? - - Landon '89 GW that leaks trans fluid like a sieve. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 13:14:05 -0400 From: James Isennock Subject: RE: fsj: overheating problems The engineers for every internal combustion engine manufacturer on the planet design thermostats into the cooling systems. Removal of the thermostat will never solve a cooling system problem. I myself would first verify that the temp gauge was accurate (this IS and FSJ after all) before I did anything else. James Isennock - -----Original Message----- From: charles calire [mailto:fleagle_5-at-yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2003 1:15 PM To: James Isennock; 'Dan Black'; Full Size Jeeps Subject: RE: fsj: overheating problems James, I have heard it said there are two sides to every story. I guess this is one of those instances. I have heard several different reasons for taking out or leaving in the thermostat. What to do...What to do(sigh) - --- James Isennock wrote: >> Put a thermostat in. >> The cooling system needs a bit of restriction to >> slow down the water as it >> passes through the radiator so it has time to shed >> some heat. >> >> James Isennock >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Dan Black [mailto:dan-at-black.org] >> Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2003 9:58 AM >> To: Full Size Jeeps >> Subject: Re: fsj: overheating problems >> >> >> charles calire said: >> {- The water pump is new. Fresh off the shelf >> from >> {- Napa. >> >> I'm baffled, then. I had a problem once in an XJ >> where it kept slowly >> overheating (summer in Iowa didn't help). At the >> time, I was a student, >> and my dad was paying the mechanic's bills, so he >> kept deciding what to >> do, and they replaced the water pump and thermostat >> at least two or >> three times, but never the radiator. I kept telling >> him to have them >> check the radiator, but they always said water was >> flowing through it >> just fine. The trick was, they didn't have any way >> to see if it was >> actually cooling the water. It was actually >> somewhat plugged or had >> gunk built up on the sides or something, so the >> water wasn't really >> contacting much metal, and so it _wasn't_ >> distributing heat, despite >> flowing water through it. So when he finally had >> them core the radiator >> (after it was passed on to my sister), it fixed >> everything. Kinda >> frustrating incident, and with a newish radiator >> that shouldn't be the >> problem, but it did teach me there are only so many >> things that could >> possibly be wrong with the cooling system. >> >> Talking to a friend (whose dad went through two bad >> new water pumps on a >> '68 'Vette) suggested a collapsing hose or a shot >> head gasket. >> >> He says if the head gasket is making it leak inside >> the engine, check >> the oil to see if it measures too high (leaking into >> the oil), or watch >> for white smoke (leaking into the cylinder). He >> also says there would >> be quite a bit of it in the oil if that's where it's >> leaking, and points >> out water is heavier than oil, so if that's the >> case, if you let it sit >> a bit and pull the drain plug, the water will flow >> out first. (Still >> want to replace the oil after fixing the head >> gasket, I'm sure, maybe a >> couple times withing a few hundred miles, but you >> could at least tell >> if that's what's happening with the oil level and >> drain trick.) >> >> About collapsing hoses, he says: >> >> And the hose collapsing could happen only at >> higher speeds, >> especially since there's no thermostat so as he >> speeds up there is no >> restrictor to slow the water down. If the >> radiator can't match the >> flow, then it will suck the hose shut like a >> straw. That's part of >> the reason for the springs in some hoses. >> >> So one way to check that is see if it isn't >> overheating at idle, when >> you can see the hoses aren't collapsed. >> >> - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> --- >> Raising kids is like being pecked to death by >> a duck. >> -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- >> dan-at-black.org >> -------------- __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 10:44:57 -0700 From: "Faith Jeff" Subject: fsj: RE: overheating do you guys have shrouds for your fans?? and probably not as important as a shroud, but what about hood insulation? - -jeff so-cal This electronic message transmission, including any attachments, contains information from Prescription Solutions which may be confidential or privileged. The information is intended to be for the use of the individual or entity named above. If you are not the intended recipient, be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information is prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please notify the sender immediately by a "reply to sender only" message and destroy all electronic and hard copies of the communication, including attachments. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 11:19:03 -0700 From: "Jim B" Subject: [none] A: If this looks funny, it's because I am replying through Webtv (I'm waiting for my computer to finish deleting the 16 billion bytes that were stuck in the c:/_restore/temp file by hackers which is most likely porn of some kind. The new attack comes through the TCP/IP port where they set up a new user and password to keep getting into your computer) Anyways, They probably changed the motor mounts as well. (one side is different from 6 cyl to V8 and both sit in different spot) I have my 6 cyl out now so I can take pics and measurements of the frame mounts (the 4.0L I had in it is now in my '87 Commanche I'm selling) To change over a 4.0L to fit, you need to file the carb intake notches slightly and lengthen the EGR tube (use a Tubing cutter and tubing coupler to re-attach the tube, or even better, keep the 4.0L exhaust manifold and use the '81 up carb intake with it.) Then you need FSJ 6 cyl motor mount brackets (the rear hole on the driver's side requires drilling and a 12mm 1.5 pitch bolt IIRC to replace the knock sensor. If you go with Renix EFI, move the sensor to another hole ahead of the mount) You can use the 258 accessories on the 4.0L with the carb intake or use the EFI and 4.0L accessories (alternator is the only hard part besides changing the brake booster for clearance) XJ/MJ waterpump is different ('93 Cherokee 4.0L or 4 cyl pump will work along with the pulley to center the fan) All I have for now. From: Tesar Landon-r16884 This one in Colorado is tempting, manual trans and D20 and all. Gimme gears!! http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2432141427&category=6286 So what would it take to find a 6 cyl, 4.0 or 4.2, I don't care, and slap a carb on it, find an original driveshaft(s) and put this puppy on the road? - - - Landon _________________________________________________________________ Use custom emotions -- try MSN Messenger 6.0! http://www.msnmessenger-download.com/tracking/reach_emoticon ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 11:37:07 -0700 From: "Jim B" Subject: Re: fsj: overheating problems A: The thermostat out can mask a leaking, but not totally blown headgasket. I retorqued the 304 in my '73 J4000 and it stopped overheating. Do you have a fan shroud? (some poor quality rads can cause trouble too. The one I pulled from my '86 Commanche was 1 year old and the solder inside was plugging 1/2 the tubes!) From: charles calire Subject: fsj: overheating problems I'm having cooling problems with my '88 GW. I recently replaced the frost plug, water pump and several hoses. The radiator is only about 2 years old and seems to be in good shape. I did leave out the thermostat on the advice of a mechanic. I drive aprox 25 miles to work. The temperature gauge is reading about 230. It hasn't gone into the red zone yet, maybe because I'm driving with the heater on. There is nothing like driving in South Florida with your heater on:) I have no white smoke, no leaks, no antifreeze in my oil, so I think my head gasket is okay. I checked my radiator and it seems to be working as everything is swirling around when she idles. I really love this bucket of bolts but this is really driving me crazy. Any help would be appreciated Charles, list lurker '88 GW ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 11:33:10 -0700 From: "Jim B" Subject: RE: fsj: Colorado J10 A: They probably put Chev (or in this case Ford since it's post '80) axles, which are a couple inches wider, but not much (that's what I did!) From: john Subject: RE: fsj: Colorado J10 On Wed, 17 Sep 2003, Tesar Landon-r16884 wrote: >>-->I'm not trying to say it's a beatiful example, merely a way to get into a J-Truck without a bunch of rust, for not too much bucks. No question, POs leave something to be desired....is it salvageable? >>--> >>-->- L sure, anything is salvageable... the axle thing is weird... what were they thinking? john ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 14:05:27 CDT From: Dan Black Subject: Re: fsj: overheating problems James Isennock said: {- The engineers for every internal combustion engine manufacturer on the {- planet design thermostats into the cooling systems. Removal of the {- thermostat will never solve a cooling system problem. I myself would first {- verify that the temp gauge was accurate (this IS and FSJ after all) before I {- did anything else. ...assuming a functioning thermostat. Yes, as soon as the coolant in the engine reaches 180degF (or whichever thermostat you have), it's going to open and let water flow through. So if you're in a place so hot that it needs more cooling (probably not in Florida, though maybe sometimes in the desert SW), you need some better, heavier-duty type of radiator (or the whole cooling system in general). Taking out the thermostat _may_ help marginally, but I believe the design is such that the thermostat can flow as quickly as is useful. But if your thermostat's stuck and you're in the middle of nowhere, taking it out could be a good solution if you can get a good enough seal to prevent it from leaking where you put the hose back on. That didn't sound like it had anything to do with this situation, though. I'm just playing devil's advocate. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Reality can be a drag, but it's the only place that you can get a good steak. - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 22:41:16 -0400 From: "Neal Hoover" Subject: fsj: removing body lift i'll throw out another question to get batted around.... since i'm a long-time XJ guy, i obviously have no experience with body lifts. the '76 J-10 that i picked up has about a 3 inch body lift on it that i plan to remove in due time. my question is basically what do i need to look out for when removing it (which should also be the same as installing one ? anyway, it's an auto with the 360. i'm assuming that something would have to be done with the shifter linkage. but what about the steering wheel shaft? radiator/fan shroud? anything else? thanks. Neal Hoover Project '76 J-10 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2003 21:42:48 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: fsj: removing body lift the 3" body lift usually requires dropping the steering column a bit and moving the radiator... otherwise everything is fine. I've got a 2" body lift on my '83 J10. hardest part was getting the old bolts off. why do you want to remove the body lift? john On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Neal Hoover wrote: >>-->i'll throw out another question to get batted around.... >>-->since i'm a long-time XJ guy, i obviously have no experience with body >>-->lifts. the '76 J-10 that i picked up has about a 3 inch body lift on it >>-->that i plan to remove in due time. my question is basically what do i need >>-->to look out for when removing it (which should also be the same as >>-->installing one ? >>-->anyway, it's an auto with the 360. i'm assuming that something would have >>-->to be done with the shifter linkage. but what about the steering wheel >>-->shaft? radiator/fan shroud? >>-->anything else? >>-->thanks. >>--> >>-->Neal Hoover >>-->Project '76 J-10 >>--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. Suggestions: email in plain text w/o attachments, and trust Jesus. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- The revolt is underway, the penguin is coming... I can hear the slap of his little feet... and the squishing of worms and sco lawyers under them... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 07:19:08 -0400 From: "Neal Hoover" Subject: Re: fsj: removing body lift the rig came with a healthy suspension lift AND the 3" body lift. the guy had some 35" muds on it, too. i plan on fixing the body and whatever small drivetrain problems there are. i'll also sell the 35s and put on some 33s so i can use it to tow my utility trailer. in a nutshell, i don't think i'll need the body lift to run 33s and i've never really been a fan of body lifts in the first place. (no offense) AFA the steering column goes, how do you go about lowering it? (or in my case, raising it back up)? thanks! Neal A. Hoover Project '76 J-10 (on hiatus) Project '96 XJ (revived) - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john" To: "Neal Hoover" Cc: Sent: Friday, September 19, 2003 12:42 AM Subject: Re: fsj: removing body lift >> >> >> the 3" body lift usually requires dropping the steering >> column a bit and moving the radiator... otherwise >> everything is fine. I've got a 2" body lift on my >> '83 J10. hardest part was getting the old bolts off. >> >> why do you want to remove the body lift? >> >> john >> >> On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Neal Hoover wrote: >> > >>> >-->i'll throw out another question to get batted around.... >>> >-->since i'm a long-time XJ guy, i obviously have no experience with body >>> >-->lifts. the '76 J-10 that i picked up has about a 3 inch body lift on it >>> >-->that i plan to remove in due time. my question is basically what do i need >>> >-->to look out for when removing it (which should also be the same as >>> >-->installing one ? >>> >-->anyway, it's an auto with the 360. i'm assuming that something would have >>> >-->to be done with the shifter linkage. but what about the steering wheel >>> >-->shaft? radiator/fan shroud? >>> >-->anything else? >>> >-->thanks. >>> >--> >>> >-->Neal Hoover >>> >-->Project '76 J-10 >>> >--> > >> >> ---- >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** >> Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. >> Suggestions: email in plain text w/o attachments, and trust Jesus. >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> The revolt is underway, >> the penguin is coming... >> I can hear the slap of his little feet... >> and the squishing of worms and sco lawyers under them... >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 07:29:46 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: fsj: removing body lift On Fri, 19 Sep 2003, Neal Hoover wrote: >>-->the rig came with a healthy suspension lift AND the 3" body lift. the guy >>-->had some 35" muds on it, too. i plan on fixing the body and whatever small >>-->drivetrain problems there are. i'll also sell the 35s and put on some 33s >>-->so i can use it to tow my utility trailer. >>-->in a nutshell, i don't think i'll need the body lift to run 33s and i've >>-->never really been a fan of body lifts in the first place. (no offense) >>--> >>-->AFA the steering column goes, how do you go about lowering it? (or in my >>-->case, raising it back up)? just remove the spacers and attach it back to the dash... if it was lowered... john >>-->thanks! >>--> >>-->Neal A. Hoover >>-->Project '76 J-10 (on hiatus) >>-->Project '96 XJ (revived) >>-->----- Original Message ----- >>-->From: "john" >>-->To: "Neal Hoover" >>-->Cc: >>-->Sent: Friday, September 19, 2003 12:42 AM >>-->Subject: Re: fsj: removing body lift >>--> >>--> >>-->> >>-->> >>-->> the 3" body lift usually requires dropping the steering >>-->> column a bit and moving the radiator... otherwise >>-->> everything is fine. I've got a 2" body lift on my >>-->> '83 J10. hardest part was getting the old bolts off. >>-->> >>-->> why do you want to remove the body lift? >>-->> >>-->> john >>-->> >>-->> On Thu, 18 Sep 2003, Neal Hoover wrote: >>-->> >>-->> >-->i'll throw out another question to get batted around.... >>-->> >-->since i'm a long-time XJ guy, i obviously have no experience with body >>-->> >-->lifts. the '76 J-10 that i picked up has about a 3 inch body lift on >>-->it >>-->> >-->that i plan to remove in due time. my question is basically what do i >>-->need >>-->> >-->to look out for when removing it (which should also be the same as >>-->> >-->installing one ? >>-->> >-->anyway, it's an auto with the 360. i'm assuming that something would >>-->have >>-->> >-->to be done with the shifter linkage. but what about the steering >>-->wheel >>-->> >-->shaft? radiator/fan shroud? >>-->> >-->anything else? >>-->> >-->thanks. >>-->> >--> >>-->> >-->Neal Hoover >>-->> >-->Project '76 J-10 >>-->> >--> >>-->> >>-->> ---- >>-->> >>-->> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>-->> ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** >>-->> Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. >>-->> Suggestions: email in plain text w/o attachments, and trust Jesus. >>-->> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>-->> The revolt is underway, >>-->> the penguin is coming... >>-->> I can hear the slap of his little feet... >>-->> and the squishing of worms and sco lawyers under them... >>-->> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>-->> >>-->> >>-->> >>--> >>--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. Suggestions: email in plain text w/o attachments, and trust Jesus. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- The revolt is underway, the penguin is coming... I can hear the slap of his little feet... and the squishing of worms and sco lawyers under them... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 08:33:50 -0700 (PDT) From: elliott sydnam Subject: fsj: Brazzadog... AMC GM TH400 adaptor ring Isn't there an AMC to GM TH400 adaptor ring that was used in the first AMC motors before the bellhousings were adapted to fit AMC engines? What year engines did they come on? I know about the Buick and 327 rings, thought I'd seen one for an AMC and the ring was webbed and about 2" deep. Thanks, Elliott __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 11:04:46 -0700 (PDT) From: Alexander Wall Subject: fsj: Off-topic truck accessory question I'm looking for a good (read: inexpensive and customer-oriented) source for nerf-bars for my new truck. I can do an online search, but all that can tell me is prices. Does anyone have any suggestions from personal, or even second-hand expriences? Thanks, and sorry for the OT post - y'all just seem to have good info! Alex ===== Alexander Wall Mead, WA ======================================================================= "Before you attempt to beat the odds, be sure you can survive the odds beating you!" - E.L. Kersten, Ph.D. ======================================================================= __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #2015 **************************