From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Sun Aug 22 16:22:50 2004 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Sunday, August 22 2004 Volume 01 : Number 2224 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: Sweet car show in Everett, WA! Re: fsj: j-truck cabs Re: fsj: the "H" word - was... now another swap story... Re: fsj: j-truck cabs Re: fsj: j-truck cabs Re: fsj: AMC/Rambler show and swap meet Sat 8/21 in Everett, WA Re: fsj: AMC/Rambler show and swap meet Sat 8/21 in Everett, WA Re: fsj: AMC/Rambler show and swap meet Sat 8/21 in Everett, WA fsj: 76 J10 with Buick 350 for sale (not mine) fsj: '91 GrandWagoneer fsj: Suicide doors fsj: compression and rebuilds Re: fsj: j-truck cabs fsj: horsepower ratings Re: fsj: Suicide doors Re: fsj: Suicide doors fsj: Re: horsepower ratings Re: fsj: AMC 360 / '91 GrandWagoneer FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:07:46 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: Sweet car show in Everett, WA! A: Yesterday, I went to the Everett, WA AMC show and there was a VERY decent turnout! I arrived late (-at-1PM) because a fellow named Larry from someplace in Oregon with a blue and white Nash Metro had a connecting rod escape from his block, just a few miles from my place. (and I stopped to pick up an AMC 20 for my Comanche. For those at the show, my truck was the red lifted Sport truck shortbox with 33" tires and the American flag sunvisors/headliner and a Model 20 in the box) He was worried about leaving it on the side of I-5, so we pulled it back to my place. (good thing I had my towbar with me!) Darn it though, in all the excitement, I forgot my camera pack when we went back and I didn't even get pics of Larry's car! (By the time I got home, he'd already had someone pick it up) It had a Nissan motor transplant, so it wasn't original anyway, but it still, it's a shame. There were at least 7 Marlins still when I got there. There were the most AMXs and Javelins, plus Nashes, Ramblers and a few nice Mopars so that it almost felt like we were on an AMC dealer lot! A towing guy brought in a 770 2 dr with 196 (had a blown headgasket and was missing a few minor bits) project rig for $350 (no noticeable rust and only 1 dent in the left rear corner) If I already didn't have so many projects (and no towbar) I just might have grabbed it. The clouds were threatening and I guess some heard weather reports of the coming rain storm, so many were leaving as I arrived. (I forgot the info as to where the show back at home along with my camera, and spotted a RWB Javelin as it was leaving) I was hoping there would be more of a swapmeet than there was. (not surprisingly it was mostly Rambler stuff and only Brian Johnston from this list had any major mechanical goodies along) I still need to get some 3.73 gears for my "new" M20 (and Moser axles with 5 bolt XJ/MJ pattern, but that comes later. I may just do a '80 up full size D44 front swap) I figure if the M20 is good enough for a Humvee then it's good enough for my "little" (4 1/2" currently lifted, soon to be 6") After the rain started pouring, pretty much everyone left (except me and a couple other guys who sat around yakking about AMCs and Jeeps till we were soaked) I heard there was a get together in the '50s restaurant in the mall, but by the time I got inside, seemed like everyone was gone. I grabbed a bite to eat and went on to a couple yard sales. Not much Jeep stuff at them, but lots of junk I got to bring home (A HUUGE heavy handmade Oak TV/VCR/Stereo+ cabinet, a dogloo and an old wooden toy chest) and that was pretty much it for my saturday. Today, I'm going to scrap out the hydraulic lift since no-one came to get it (I'll keep some of the hydraulics and the steel pipes will work for bumpers on my son's '83 Cherokee WT pop top) Time to find my rain gear and head out to get'er done! (well, maybe in a little bit. Still waking up!) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 12:46:19 -0400 From: "Neal Hoover" Subject: Re: fsj: j-truck cabs ok, so some frame width changes, but body parts stayed the same? Neal A. Hoover Project '76 J-10 Project '96 XJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john meister" To: "Neal Hoover" Cc: Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2004 12:14 AM Subject: Re: fsj: j-truck cabs > there were some changes in the width and such... I have it documented for > the book... just forgot the details... and where I put it... :) > > Maybe once I get settled into a normal day job I might have the time to > start back on the book. :) > > john > > Neal Hoover wrote: > > thanks, john. > > i guess all body lines should meet up? > > curiously, tho, what frame changes occured in '76? was it just the rear > > suspension mounts? > > > > Neal A. Hoover > > Project '76 J-10 > > Project '96 XJ > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "john meister" > > To: "Neal Hoover" > > Cc: > > Sent: Saturday, August 21, 2004 7:25 PM > > Subject: Re: fsj: j-truck cabs > > > > > > > >>shouldn't be a problem... the frame changes occurred in '76 and then again > >>in about '81, but even then the cab mounts should be pretty close from > > > > prior > > > >>and later years... > >> > >>john > >> > >>Neal Hoover wrote: > >> > >>>hey, all- > >>> > >>>does anyone know if there are any differences i should be worried about > > > > with > > > >>>regard to body parts between '76 and '79 model j-truck cabs? i think i > > > > may > > > >>>have found a cab from a '79 model to use in place of my '76 cab (less > > > > the > > > >>>front clip). > >>>any insight would be appreciated. > >>>thanks! > >>> > >>>Neal A. Hoover > >>>Project '76 J-10 > >>>Project '96 XJ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 12:48:58 -0400 From: "Neal Hoover" Subject: Re: fsj: the "H" word - was... now another swap story... hee-hee. that post was the true definition of a jeep-aholic's mad life of acquiring more and more parts until nothing ever gets built. i like it! Neal A. Hoover Project '76 J-10 Project '96 XJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john meister" To: "Neal Hoover" Cc: "Dan Black" ; "Full Size Jeeps" ; "'dbl'" ; "xj" Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2004 12:27 AM Subject: Re: fsj: the "H" word - was... now another swap story... > my XJ has over 251,000 miles on it, and oversize tires with 3.55 gears... > it's not really happy about my new toy. :) > > I'm sure the 6.2L won't give a rip if I tow my entire fleet behind me. > I towed a uhaul back from South Dakota with my '83 Jimmy in '94 and > hardly noticed it back there... > > looks like I'll be running the Jimmy down to the monster garage next weekend... > > got my eye on that '81 300sd down there... part of the swap/parts bartering > will end me up with a Willys Wagon or Pickup I hope... this whole superdawg > project has taken a major turn for the bizarre. :) > > I'll take the '83 Jimmy down to Centralia, then either ride back with curtis > towing a Cadillac that I'll dismantle for him, or I'll drive the 300SD if > I win it on ebay... then if curtis comes up we'll head over and get my > '79 J10 Golden Eagle and he'll run that down to the monster garage... we > need the front axle to mate up to the GMC driveline... Then we'll take the > 4.0L driveline and drop it into the '79 J10 Golden Eagle... unless my > friend at work buys it for his '59 Willys project... Then I'll take the > GMC Jimmy body and bring it to my friend where I got the J10 GE and give > it to him where he'll drop the driveline out of a gas 'Burb that has a > useless body... and I'll get one of his Willys Wagons or Pickups... > > I figure that we'll never really build another running vehicle again, neither > curtis or me or my other Jeep buddy tom... tom and I have been swapping parts > and Jeeps since about 1986... he's still got three of my old Jeeps in his > field... :) > > I do hope to get SuperDawg together though... and a nice Turbo Diesel Willys > would be pretty cool too... I'll be doing that one up here though... need to > let Curtis get to Rocky and Rambo after SuperDawg is done. :) > > it's a wild, crazy and strange world up here in the pacific northwest... :) > > BTW, after towing that 1,990 lb trailer all over Seattle today it sure was > nice to get in Shadowfox and drive around... :) Went looking for a new coffeemaker/ > espresso machine... I should have just bought one and brought it home... no, I had > to get my wive involved... :) of course she did say I ain't putting some ugly > looking appliance in "her" kitchen... I left my laptop in the kitchen and she > pulled my "in-n-out" and FSJ stickers off the back of it... :) > > > > > Neal Hoover wrote: > > kewl! > > no problem on the weight, john. i routinely tow anywhere from 5500 - 6500 > > lbs with my XJ on a daily basis. wouldn't see where towing a lighter load > > with a j-truck with a 6.2L diesel would be any problem at all. > > > > Neal A. Hoover > > Project '76 J-10 > >>> > >>> http://host1.cj-8.com/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 12:54:51 -0400 From: "Neal Hoover" Subject: Re: fsj: j-truck cabs ok, elliot- lemme see if i get your response straight.. is the only difference between my '76 and the '79 i'm looking at the size of the cab mount holes? are the locations the same, just different size? that i can live with. the speak about the kaiser trucks shouldn't affect me, should it? i'm mainly trying to make sure i don't have to relocate cab mounts. different hole sizes i can easily deal with.. thanks! Neal A. Hoover Project '76 J-10 Project '96 XJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "elliott sydnam" To: Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2004 10:02 AM Subject: Re: fsj: j-truck cabs > The difference betwee the '76 and later cab will be > the size of the hole in the mount for the bushing. The > '76 will be 1 1/4" and the '79 is 1 1/2". > > Earlier Kaiser trucks used a mount that had a hole > size of 3/8", and were mounted 3/8" above the frame > -vs- 1/2" below the frame on a '79, foward to rear > centers were also different being ~41 1/8" -vs- 44 1/2 > on a '79. > > > > >>Neal Hoover wrote: > > >> > > >>>hey, all- > > >>> > > >>>does anyone know if there are any differences i > > should be worried about > > > > > > with > > > > > >>>regard to body parts between '76 and '79 model > > j-truck cabs? i think i > > > > > > may > > > > > >>>have found a cab from a '79 model to use in place > > of my '76 cab (less > > > > > > the > > > > > >>>front clip). > > >>>any insight would be appreciated. > > >>>thanks! > > >>> > > >>>Neal A. Hoover > > >>>Project '76 J-10 > > >>>Project '96 XJ > > > > > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! > http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 09:52:27 -0700 (PDT) From: elliott sydnam Subject: Re: fsj: j-truck cabs Frame width remained the same, just forward to rear locations changed between the Kaiser and AMC rigs, your's will be fine... shouldn't be any complications as long as you use your old bushings or buy new ones (the '79s could probably be used to). Elliott - --- Neal Hoover wrote: > ok, so some frame width changes, but body parts > stayed the same? > > Neal A. Hoover > Project '76 J-10 > Project '96 XJ > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "john meister" > To: "Neal Hoover" > Cc: > Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2004 12:14 AM > Subject: Re: fsj: j-truck cabs > > > > there were some changes in the width and such... I > have it documented for > > the book... just forgot the details... and where I > put it... :) > > > > Maybe once I get settled into a normal day job I > might have the time to > > start back on the book. :) > > > > john __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 10:53:32 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: Re: fsj: AMC/Rambler show and swap meet Sat 8/21 in Everett, WA A: A few noticed my Comanche. I guess the XJs are just too ordinary. I forgot to mention there was about a dozen FSJs when I got there. drove by it this morning... would guess around 40 cars, some nice looking ones... took a few pictures... no one noticed my '87 xj with the '75 J10 dump trailer... john Jim Blair wrote: > AMC/Rambler show and swapmeet Sat 8/21 at Everett Mall parking lot $15 > to > show, but free to the public. Open at 8AM for info phone Bob 360-657-7282, > John (who I work with at NAPA), 206-243-5403, or Ron 425-743-0353 > > > I'm going to try to get there early (taking my AMC built '87 Comanche, but > not > going to show it) and then go sign our refinance papers nearby. (My son > will > be cleaning the yard and working on his '83 Cherokee monster truck) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 11:19:50 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: fsj: AMC/Rambler show and swap meet Sat 8/21 in Everett, WA there was one nasty looking MJ there, trailer behind it... no FSJs or XJs... they had a few Mopars out there too... darts and such... couple of nice metros and marlins... I liked the older cars that were down on the end, and of course the sports car thing, what was that a nash/healy or something? john Jim Blair wrote: > A: A few noticed my Comanche. I guess the XJs are just too ordinary. I > forgot to mention there was about a dozen FSJs when I got there. > > > drove by it this morning... would guess around 40 cars, some > nice looking ones... took a few pictures... no one noticed > my '87 xj with the '75 J10 dump trailer... > > john > > Jim Blair wrote: > >> AMC/Rambler show and swapmeet Sat 8/21 at Everett Mall parking lot $15 >>to >>show, but free to the public. Open at 8AM for info phone Bob 360-657-7282, >>John (who I work with at NAPA), 206-243-5403, or Ron 425-743-0353 >> >> >>I'm going to try to get there early (taking my AMC built '87 Comanche, but >>not >>going to show it) and then go sign our refinance papers nearby. (My son >>will >>be cleaning the yard and working on his '83 Cherokee monster truck) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 11:25:37 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: Re: fsj: AMC/Rambler show and swap meet Sat 8/21 in Everett, WA A: The Jeeps must have shown up after you left. I talked with 3 of the owners. ('84 GW owned by Dennis of the Snort board, and I didn't quite catch the names of the other 2 guys. There was a light blue J10 on 33" tires. One other FSJ owner with a '79 Golden Eagle that had his dist gear lunch the day before joined in the conversation) They were parked almost in the next lot over (behind the portapotty, past the ambo wagon) The Nash Healy was a Pina Farinna and yes, it was sweet! there was one nasty looking MJ there, trailer behind it... no FSJs or XJs... they had a few Mopars out there too... darts and such... couple of nice metros and marlins... I liked the older cars that were down on the end, and of course the sports car thing, what was that a nash/healy or something? john Jim Blair wrote: > A: A few noticed my Comanche. I guess the XJs are just too ordinary. I > forgot to mention there was about a dozen FSJs when I got there. > > > drove by it this morning... would guess around 40 cars, some > nice looking ones... took a few pictures... no one noticed > my '87 xj with the '75 J10 dump trailer... > > john ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 11:54:29 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: 76 J10 with Buick 350 for sale (not mine) http://fsjworld.tenmagazines.com/forums/topic.ten-id-51780-s-76_j10_for_sale ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 16:49:02 -0400 From: Tim Allen Subject: fsj: '91 GrandWagoneer For anyone in the Louisville area stay away from B&R Speed Shop in Fairdale; I had to reject two cranks from them (then finally bought a crank kit from somewhere else) and now it appears that they didn't do a valve job. That said, I did have it running relatively smoothly until the catalytic plugged yesterday; this'll be the third one! I suspect the Chrysler catalytics suck. I just converted it to fuel injection (CustomEFIS) and it was running rich before I got the lambda sensor in. BTW Anyone know where I can lay my hands on the diverter valve assembly for the air pump? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 13:55:59 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: Suicide doors While doing some research (trying to find a pic of a '68 Cougar with suicide doors like I used to own) I found out I found out that I can get a kit for my full size Jeep too! Too much work, but an interesting thought nonetheless! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 14:16:41 -0700 From: Tesar Landon-r16884 Subject: fsj: compression and rebuilds Hi Tim, I did a compression check on my tired 360, got 120 psi cold on most cylinders, except one was down at 105. This was with the throttle closed, so note Jim's advice... I guess I'm sorry to hear that you got a rebuilt engine without new pistons, I'd ask them what the piston to wall clearance was, but it's probably a waste of tiime. I hope you can get the compression up, my engine has blowby after being rebuilt about 60K miles ago, probably without new pistons. On the other hand, the oil pressure is fine, so the bottom end is holding together.(Shell Rotella is helping, I think) How easy it is for you to check the results of the rebuild! Quality assurance at that machine shop sounds questionable. - - Landon 89 GW Tim Allen wrote: > I have just reinstalled the AMC 360 in my 91' GrandWagoneer. I have a > intermittent misfire at idle. I ran a compression test, I'm not > thrilled with the results. > > cyl psi > 1 104 > 2 104 > 3 115 > 4 110 (once got 120) > 5 114 > 6 100 (twice got 95, once got 104) > 7 112 > 8 110 > > Are these good enough. I'm concerned about the (possibly intermittent) > low reading on 6, could that be the source of my intermittent misfire > at idle? I don't have a whole lot of faith in the shop I used, I had > to reject two cranks (damaged radiuses and a nick on the real main > seal surface). The receipt shows a major kit w/o pistons does that > include valves? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 18:06:34 -0400 From: "Neal Hoover" Subject: Re: fsj: j-truck cabs thanks for clearing that up! Neal A. Hoover Project '76 J-10 Project '96 XJ - ----- Original Message ----- From: "elliott sydnam" To: Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2004 12:52 PM Subject: Re: fsj: j-truck cabs > Frame width remained the same, just forward to rear > locations changed between the Kaiser and AMC rigs, > your's will be fine... shouldn't be any complications > as long as you use your old bushings or buy new ones > (the '79s could probably be used to). > Elliott > > --- Neal Hoover wrote: > > > ok, so some frame width changes, but body parts > > stayed the same? > > > > Neal A. Hoover > > Project '76 J-10 > > Project '96 XJ > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "john meister" > > To: "Neal Hoover" > > Cc: > > Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2004 12:14 AM > > Subject: Re: fsj: j-truck cabs > > > > > > > there were some changes in the width and such... I > > have it documented for > > > the book... just forgot the details... and where I > > put it... :) > > > > > > Maybe once I get settled into a normal day job I > > might have the time to > > > start back on the book. :) > > > > > > john > > > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! > http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 17:08:46 -0500 From: Jeep Nut Subject: fsj: horsepower ratings Just browsing an Owners manual from the '87 and it reports the "taxable" Horsepower (licensed) as 53.27. Say what? It's not that low is it? sheesh I thought it was about 170hp and that's anemic enough. Anyone explain "taxable hp" ? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 17:17:27 -0500 From: Jeep Nut Subject: Re: fsj: Suicide doors Now Jim you KNOW you can't tease us like that and just walk away without a link or something to look at. :-) A '68 Cougar with suicide doors? '68 Cougar only came as a coupe didn't it? You sure you're not misremembering a '68 TBird. I thought those were the last production vehicles with suicide doors. That was BEFORE the car fell on your head now, right?... ;-) Still like to see a the link you found re: the FSJ kit. Just curiosity... Jim Blair wrote: >While doing some research (trying to find a pic of a '68 Cougar with suicide >doors like I used to own) I found out I found out that I can get a kit for >my full size Jeep too! Too much work, but an interesting thought >nonetheless! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 15:23:53 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: Re: fsj: Suicide doors A: I don't have a link for 1 on FSJs. It was for a universal kit for any vehicle. '68 Tbird was not the last ('71 Tbird was) and I have links and pics to prove that. My ex-wife destroyed all my car pics or I would have one of the Coug still. (It may have been a Canadian model only, like the Mercury pickups. There were also '71 up 4 dr Cougs) Now Jim you KNOW you can't tease us like that and just walk away without a link or something to look at. :-) A '68 Cougar with suicide doors? '68 Cougar only came as a coupe didn't it? You sure you're not misremembering a '68 TBird. I thought those were the last production vehicles with suicide doors. That was BEFORE the car fell on your head now, right?... ;-) Still like to see a the link you found re: the FSJ kit. Just curiosity... Jim Blair wrote: >While doing some research (trying to find a pic of a '68 Cougar with >suicide >doors like I used to own) I found out I found out that I can get a kit for >my full size Jeep too! Too much work, but an interesting thought ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 15:28:20 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: Re: horsepower ratings http://www.webcalc.net/calc/0763.php has a calculator. Taxable Horsepower = (bore2 * cylinders) / 2.5 is the equation. Taxable horsepower is determined by the following formula, which was put into effect by the British Government around 1921 to raise revenue (to build and maintain roads?) according to a bit of research. Some old timers on this site might remember seeing taxable horsepower listed in the NADA used car price books, as well as elsewhere. The formula is: Bore squared (B^2) times the number of cylinders divided by 2.5 (N/2.5) -- That means an eight cylinder engine has twice the taxable horsepower of a four cylinder of the same bore. The formula ignores crankshaft stroke and total displacement. This formula would rate a 383 at more taxable horsepower than a 413! (A 383 "B not "RB," that is) It appears the expression "Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go?" has more than one meaning and has been around for quite some time. Have fun with your calculators! PS - AMA is indeed Automobile Manufacturers Association as some one pointed out, referencing the 1957 Racing Ban. http://www.forwardlook.net/archived-exhaust/_exhaust/000007ed.htm (Speaking of 383 RB, I had one in a '61 Fargo with Hemi heads) Just browsing an Owners manual from the '87 and it reports the "taxable" Horsepower (licensed) as 53.27. Say what? It's not that low is it? sheesh I thought it was about 170hp and that's anemic enough. Anyone explain "taxable hp" ? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2004 15:18:10 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: Re: fsj: AMC 360 / '91 GrandWagoneer A: The pieces from the cat WILL clog the muffler and make your rig not move! (just happened to my Comanche and my '91 E350 cutaway. Shop said the motor was blown and I figured clogged cat. Dropped the pipe and nothing inside! Tried an air hose with a rag into the muffler and it pumped pressure instantly! if you have a top speed of 50mph it does indeed sound like a clogged cat... and that could explain the melted diverter... as a temporary measure drop the converter at the flange and ram a rod up there until it breaks through so the engine can breath, then order a high flow cat from JC Whitney, around $100 or so... john Tim Allen wrote: > I was recently driving on the highway when I smelled burning plastic, I > pulled over and found that part of my air-pump system (the diverter) had > melted. I replaced the check valves. Also I have no power above about 50 > Mph. I suspect that the check valves were not working for some time and > that recently the catalytic plugged raising exhaust pressure high enough > to send hot exhaust gasses into my air pump system. Anybody agree, > disagree? I don't wanna pull it (I hate exhaust work) if it's okay! ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #2224 **************************