From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Sun Sep 19 16:16:06 2004 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Sunday, September 19 2004 Volume 01 : Number 2251 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup fsj: Tranny shift points Re: fsj: Vince moving soon fsj: J20 Spring Rates Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup fsj: Re: [FSJeeps] Fuel Problems Re: fsj: Vince moving soon fsj: Re: Tranny shift points fsj: Re: xj: Re: Briarwood Re: fsj: Vince moving soon FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 12:01:34 CDT From: Dan Black Subject: Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup Diana Eichert said: {- I saw one on Saturday morning going westbound on I-40 through Albuquerque {- while I was going eastbound. I could see some ranchers or horse haulers {- buying one to tow the big horse trailers around, some of them have been {- using custom semi rigs already. You saw one in person? Cool. The thing I'm wondering -- and maybe this info is out there somewhere -- is what the clearance and available tires are like, and whether it's 4wd. Is this capable off-road, or only for hauling on the road? I'm guessing they won't bother with the off-road angle when it's that big -- too tall and too long a wheelbase (and probably too tippy -- high center of gravity) to take on serious trails. But I'll bet it could also pull a stump like no other... if you can get to the stump. (OTOH, it's only 2" longer than the F350, and the picture is off-road and makes it look like decent clearance. Hope it has skid plates for those gas tanks and other vulnerable parts. I lost the address of International's stats page, but I did notice that it did NOT tell the size of the bed. I suppose the people using semi rigs to pull those big car or horse trailers doesn't need the bed much, but a lot of people who want that big a pickup want the full 6'x8' bed. BTW, on the opposite end of the spectrum, CNN's news site also has an article on the Smart cars and their potential (or current lack of...) in America: http://money.cnn.com/2004/09/09/pf/autos/smart/index.htm Saw a lot of those in Europe, esp. Berlin (go fig); got several pics. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I think; therefore, I'm single. -- Liz Winston - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 12:32:58 -0500 From: "Vince Orr" Subject: Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup Only if they bring the beer.... :) - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan Black" To: "Full Size Jeeps" Sent: Sunday, September 19, 2004 11:44 AM Subject: Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup > "Vince Orr" said: > {- If I had that kind of money, I always wanted one of those stretch FSJ's > with > {- the hot tub. Heck, I'd even hire a team of FSJ guys to continually > modify > {- it.....then we'd do the same thing with a brand new Cherokee....but > with a > {- diesel engine of course! ;) We'd hire it out and charge absolutely > absurd > {- prices....and laugh all the way to the bank... > > Yeah, but you'd give a discount to all your FSJ friends, right?!? > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > "Wreckless driving"... You'd think that would be a *good* thing. > > -- Chris Sampson > -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- > dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 12:44:41 -0500 From: Jeep Nut Subject: Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup It is indeed AWD (All Wheel Drive) Its an overgrown Subaru. :-D ...is all-wheel drive, uses air brakes for unmatched stopping ability and offers towing, dumping and tilt bed capability. I suppose it would be handy for the right person... but I'd never be able to fund a vehicle like that... OR an H1. Or a new Grand Cherokee ... ;-) JeepNut Dan Black wrote: >Diana Eichert said: >{- I saw one on Saturday morning going westbound on I-40 through Albuquerque >{- while I was going eastbound. I could see some ranchers or horse haulers >{- buying one to tow the big horse trailers around, some of them have been >{- using custom semi rigs already. > >You saw one in person? Cool. > >The thing I'm wondering -- and maybe this info is out there somewhere -- >is what the clearance and available tires are like, and whether it's >4wd. Is this capable off-road, or only for hauling on the road? I'm >guessing they won't bother with the off-road angle when it's that big -- >too tall and too long a wheelbase (and probably too tippy -- high center >of gravity) to take on serious trails. But I'll bet it could also pull >a stump like no other... if you can get to the stump. (OTOH, it's only >2" longer than the F350, and the picture is off-road and makes it look >like decent clearance. Hope it has skid plates for those gas tanks and >other vulnerable parts. > >I lost the address of International's stats page, but I did notice that >it did NOT tell the size of the bed. I suppose the people using semi >rigs to pull those big car or horse trailers doesn't need the bed much, >but a lot of people who want that big a pickup want the full 6'x8' bed. > > >BTW, on the opposite end of the spectrum, CNN's news site also has an >article on the Smart cars and their potential (or current lack of...) in >America: > http://money.cnn.com/2004/09/09/pf/autos/smart/index.htm >Saw a lot of those in Europe, esp. Berlin (go fig); got several pics. > >------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > I think; therefore, I'm single. > -- Liz Winston >-------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- > > > - -- "Microsoft Certified Professionals are to the computing industry what McDonalds Certified Food Specialists are to gourmet restaurants." -Michael Bacarella 00Mar15 - ---------------------------------------------------------- '87 Street Comanche #24/100 '88 Grand Wagoneer ...and they say there's only one... '92 Cherokee Laredo - ---------------------------------------------------------- Registered Linux user #287453 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 11:22:58 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup that, my dear JeepNut friend, is why Jeeps are BUILT, not bought. ;) rofl... we can add tilt bed and trailer packages and hydraboost to our Jeeps... ;) john Jeep Nut wrote: > It is indeed AWD (All Wheel Drive) Its an overgrown Subaru. :-D > ...is all-wheel drive, uses air brakes for unmatched stopping ability > and offers towing, dumping and tilt bed capability. > > I suppose it would be handy for the right person... but I'd never be > able to fund a vehicle like that... OR an H1. Or a new Grand Cherokee > ... ;-) > > JeepNut > > > Dan Black wrote: > >> Diana Eichert said: >> {- I saw one on Saturday morning going westbound on I-40 through >> Albuquerque >> {- while I was going eastbound. I could see some ranchers or horse >> haulers >> {- buying one to tow the big horse trailers around, some of them have >> been >> {- using custom semi rigs already. >> >> You saw one in person? Cool. >> >> The thing I'm wondering -- and maybe this info is out there somewhere -- >> is what the clearance and available tires are like, and whether it's >> 4wd. Is this capable off-road, or only for hauling on the road? I'm >> guessing they won't bother with the off-road angle when it's that big -- >> too tall and too long a wheelbase (and probably too tippy -- high center >> of gravity) to take on serious trails. But I'll bet it could also pull >> a stump like no other... if you can get to the stump. (OTOH, it's only >> 2" longer than the F350, and the picture is off-road and makes it look >> like decent clearance. Hope it has skid plates for those gas tanks and >> other vulnerable parts. >> >> I lost the address of International's stats page, but I did notice that >> it did NOT tell the size of the bed. I suppose the people using semi >> rigs to pull those big car or horse trailers doesn't need the bed much, >> but a lot of people who want that big a pickup want the full 6'x8' bed. >> >> >> BTW, on the opposite end of the spectrum, CNN's news site also has an >> article on the Smart cars and their potential (or current lack of...) in >> America: >> http://money.cnn.com/2004/09/09/pf/autos/smart/index.htm >> Saw a lot of those in Europe, esp. Berlin (go fig); got several pics. >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> I think; therefore, I'm single. >> -- Liz Winston >> -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org >> -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 11:24:02 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup discounts? we don't need no steenkin' discounts... ;) remember, you have money. ;) john Vince Orr wrote: > Only if they bring the beer.... > :) > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan Black" > To: "Full Size Jeeps" > Sent: Sunday, September 19, 2004 11:44 AM > Subject: Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster > pickup > > >> "Vince Orr" said: >> {- If I had that kind of money, I always wanted one of those stretch >> FSJ's with >> {- the hot tub. Heck, I'd even hire a team of FSJ guys to continually >> modify >> {- it.....then we'd do the same thing with a brand new Cherokee....but >> with a >> {- diesel engine of course! ;) We'd hire it out and charge >> absolutely absurd >> {- prices....and laugh all the way to the bank... >> >> Yeah, but you'd give a discount to all your FSJ friends, right?!? >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> "Wreckless driving"... You'd think that would be a *good* thing. >> >> -- Chris Sampson >> -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org >> -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 11:26:10 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup maybe they should do a crash test between one of these pickups and one of those smart cars... I think we should get volunteers from the democratic party that are promoting the environment at the expense of our property rights to demonstrate the benefits of the smart cars in america... Dan Black wrote: > Diana Eichert said: > {- I saw one on Saturday morning going westbound on I-40 through Albuquerque > {- while I was going eastbound. I could see some ranchers or horse haulers > {- buying one to tow the big horse trailers around, some of them have been > {- using custom semi rigs already. > > You saw one in person? Cool. > > The thing I'm wondering -- and maybe this info is out there somewhere -- > is what the clearance and available tires are like, and whether it's > 4wd. Is this capable off-road, or only for hauling on the road? I'm > guessing they won't bother with the off-road angle when it's that big -- > too tall and too long a wheelbase (and probably too tippy -- high center > of gravity) to take on serious trails. But I'll bet it could also pull > a stump like no other... if you can get to the stump. (OTOH, it's only > 2" longer than the F350, and the picture is off-road and makes it look > like decent clearance. Hope it has skid plates for those gas tanks and > other vulnerable parts. > > I lost the address of International's stats page, but I did notice that > it did NOT tell the size of the bed. I suppose the people using semi > rigs to pull those big car or horse trailers doesn't need the bed much, > but a lot of people who want that big a pickup want the full 6'x8' bed. > > > BTW, on the opposite end of the spectrum, CNN's news site also has an > article on the Smart cars and their potential (or current lack of...) in > America: > http://money.cnn.com/2004/09/09/pf/autos/smart/index.htm > Saw a lot of those in Europe, esp. Berlin (go fig); got several pics. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > I think; therefore, I'm single. > -- Liz Winston > -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 14:17:46 -0500 From: Jeep Nut Subject: fsj: Tranny shift points OK, new topic. I don't think this was happening at first, but it's so smooth it's hard to notice... just noticed last week when I "punched it" that the tranny doesn't kickdown by itself. I know it WAS doing it, at least once in a while, because the day I opened it up going out the 4 lane from town, when I goose it, it jumped and roared off. But now it seems to not kickdown at all. So I started paying really close attention and realized that when in Drive, it runs up to about 20 then shifts, 1-2, then 2-3 right away. Very little or no delay in 2nd before going into 3rd. If you drive it normally this double-shift is so smooth, I didn't really even notice it. Consulted the manuals, reset the linkage as described, but this created more questions... 1. Every manual I have (and I have many) says to "raise the rear wheels:" as one of the first steps to the procedure of setting the throttle linkage to the tranny. WHY? Nowhere does it describe putting the tranny in gear, nor even starting the motor. Indeed the adjustment is made at WOT. Why in the world would you jack up the truck? 2. The couple of refs I have which talk specifically about kickdown adjustment mention the switch under the accelerator pedal. What? I can find no switch anywhere near the accelerator pedal, rods, linkages,... Isn't this done with the adjustment rod on the throttle? In any case, I opened the throttle all the way and pushed the linkage back to seat against the nylon spacer, tightened up and checked it again. Same thing. 1-2, 2-3 right away. Any ideas? JeepNut - -- "Microsoft Certified Professionals are to the computing industry what McDonalds Certified Food Specialists are to gourmet restaurants." -Michael Bacarella 00Mar15 - ---------------------------------------------------------- '87 Street Comanche #24/100 '88 Grand Wagoneer ...and they say there's only one... '92 Cherokee Laredo - ---------------------------------------------------------- Registered Linux user #287453 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 16:17:11 EDT From: Smokey99908-at-aol.com Subject: Re: fsj: Vince moving soon In a message dated 9/18/2004 8:51:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time, carnuck1-at-msn.com writes: > Got a CJ5 with four wheel drive and Smokie on my tail!" > > "Can you dig it Smokie?" > umm HUH? ;) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 13:40:21 -0700 (PDT) From: elliott sydnam Subject: fsj: J20 Spring Rates Does anyone know what the spring rates are for the J20 Trucks with 8,400 GVWR? TIA Elliott __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 21:25:58 +0000 From: v.orr-at-comcast.net Subject: Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster pickup Man, I know I bring home some money every two weeks but I have no idea where it all goes! - --Vince - -------------- Original message -------------- > discounts? we don't need no steenkin' discounts... ;) > > remember, you have money. ;) > > john > > Vince Orr wrote: > > Only if they bring the beer.... > > :) > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dan Black" > > To: "Full Size Jeeps" > > Sent: Sunday, September 19, 2004 11:44 AM > > Subject: Re: fsj: Re: MSNBC.com Article: Truck maker unveils a monster > > pickup > > > > > >> "Vince Orr" said: > >> {- If I had that kind of money, I always wanted one of those stretch > >> FSJ's with > >> {- the hot tub. Heck, I'd even hire a team of FSJ guys to continually > >> modify > >> {- it.....then we'd do the same thing with a brand new Cherokee....but > >> with a > >> {- diesel engine of course! ;) We'd hire it out and charge > >> absolutely absurd > >> {- prices....and laugh all the way to the bank... > >> > >> Yeah, but you'd give a discount to all your FSJ friends, right?!? > >> > >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> > >> "Wreckless driving"... You'd think that would be a *good* thing. > >> > >> -- Chris Sampson > >> -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org > >> -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 14:26:45 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: Re: [FSJeeps] Fuel Problems A: Here is the gas tank "sock" that people have trouble with on many AMCs (which is why I'm including a lot of other lists in this reply) http://www.bjsoffroad.com/cartgenie/prodInfo.asp?pid=310&cid=5 available at http://www.bjsoffroad.com along with new sending units and other FSJ items of interest. (I have no stock in the company! I just shop there. ) Before ripping the sender out to check the sock (MTBE that is in most state's gasoline because of CARB and EPA but it's poisoning the groundwater and turning fuel hoses and the sock in the tank to mushy messes or splitting them open), I would first attempt to put vacuum to the fuel line with a hand pump (and the other end plugged of course!) to see if it holds vacuum. If it doesn't, the line has a small fracture somewhere or a rust hole (I pulled 3 from other FSJs that looked like piccolos!) If that passes inspection, then open the tank top and check the sender lines and sock. (I took the sock off mine and replaced it with a see thru filter just before my fuel pump where I have easy access. The problem with that is any large debris in the tank clogs the end of the steel line. I recently had what looked like a clump of pet hair in my external filter! There is also the possibility of breaking the glass filter when offroading, but this is my highway tow rig.) Jen, You are correct, my 89 has a mechanical fuel pump. When the gas stopped flowing that was the first thing I suspected and replaced it. Also put new hoses on. I lifted the back seat, found the plate and checked things out. The hoses seem to be in good condition. I disconnected them both at the tank end and at the front before I disconnect the hoses at the end of the metal hose/tubes to the rear of the fuel pump. I blew air through both hoses and had someone check the other end. Air flowed through both so there was no obstruction in the lines from the fuel tank forward. New rubber hoses from metal lines to new fuel pump, and from from fuel pump to new fuel filter, and to carb. No gas flowing. I have read in several places about a "sock" in the tank. Haven't a clue about this. Not bad gas as I have filled the Jeep and my other car at the same station at the same time. Where is the fuel pump relay? I thought this was a mechanical system? There are two wires that go into the fuel tank but assumed that these were for the fuel gauge. There are no wires that go to the fuel pump. Appreciate any advice on how to proceed from here. I think I am way passed my ability. Only thought now is the "Shop" and that will kill the budget for a long time. This is the best vehicle we have ever had and the kids love it. I really want to get it running and dependable and head for the mountains and enjoy riding in them. Hope you can help. Malcolm ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 21:32:28 +0000 From: v.orr-at-comcast.net Subject: Re: fsj: Vince moving soon Aw geeze Jim, you never heard that CW McCall song? It should be the anthem for all Jeepers everywhere! At the end it says Smokie was mired in 14 feet of mud so he radioed ahead. I got racing stripes and dual pipes and Smokie's got a ford, Got a mill with a 4 pot carb ya know but Smokie's stroked and bored, Well the race was on but I had the edge with a rig that would never fail. Got a CJ5 with four wheel drive, sittin' out back of the jail.... Man, this is sad.....am I the only one who remembers this song? - -------------- Original message -------------- In a message dated 9/18/2004 8:51:17 PM Eastern Daylight Time, carnuck1-at-msn.com writes: Got a CJ5 with four wheel drive and Smokie on my tail!" "Can you dig it Smokie?" umm HUH? ;) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 14:48:12 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: Re: Tranny shift points A: I just adjust the rod longer till it shifts right. If it doesn't, even with the rod fully extended, then the lever inside the trans has come off (happened to me a couple times when racing. Took 20 minutes to fix with air tools and practice back then!) OK, new topic. I don't think this was happening at first, but it's so smooth it's hard to notice... just noticed last week when I "punched it" that the tranny doesn't kickdown by itself. I know it WAS doing it, at least once in a while, because the day I opened it up going out the 4 lane from town, when I goose it, it jumped and roared off. But now it seems to not kickdown at all. So I started paying really close attention and realized that when in Drive, it runs up to about 20 then shifts, 1-2, then 2-3 right away. Very little or no delay in 2nd before going into 3rd. If you drive it normally this double-shift is so smooth, I didn't really even notice it. Consulted the manuals, reset the linkage as described, but this created more questions... 1. Every manual I have (and I have many) says to "raise the rear wheels:" as one of the first steps to the procedure of setting the throttle linkage to the tranny. WHY? Nowhere does it describe putting the tranny in gear, nor even starting the motor. Indeed the adjustment is made at WOT. Why in the world would you jack up the truck? 2. The couple of refs I have which talk specifically about kickdown adjustment mention the switch under the accelerator pedal. What? I can find no switch anywhere near the accelerator pedal, rods, linkages,... Isn't this done with the adjustment rod on the throttle? In any case, I opened the throttle all the way and pushed the linkage back to seat against the nylon spacer, tightened up and checked it again. Same thing. 1-2, 2-3 right away. Any ideas? JeepNut ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 14:55:39 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: Re: xj: Re: Briarwood A: The ZJ "Grand Wagoneer" Briarwood was in '93/'94 only AFAIK. I see a green (YEEECH!) one once a month or so around here. From: john meister Subject: xj: Re: Briarwood Stef, It looks like the Cherokee Briarwood was only offered in 1991 and 1992. It replaced the little Wagoneer. The book I have only goes to '93 so it may have been offered again later. john meister Stef wrote: > John, > You know much from FSJ's i read on your site that you write a book, tell > me be there > ever a Wagoneer named Briarwood ? > > > Regards > Stef Sliedrecht > +31 316 332278 > http://www.fsjworld.com/nightrider > http://www.WAGONEERS.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 19 Sep 2004 15:15:31 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: Re: fsj: Vince moving soon A: I started, but ran out of daylight! so, do you have a list of cars? my son wants me to create a page for him too... :) john ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #2251 **************************