From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Tue Apr 5 16:24:06 2005 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Tuesday, April 5 2005 Volume 01 : Number 2407 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: Jeep Commander Re: fsj: Jeep Commander fsj: another XJ fsj: Re: Jeep Commander fsj: Re: Re: parts and info needed fsj: Re: Anyone need project parts in Florida? Re: fsj: Re: Jeep Commander fsj: Re: Re: parts and info needed Re: fsj: Re: Jeep Commander Re: fsj: Re: parts and info needed fsj: np208 input gear swap and clocking? fsj: np208c input gear in an np219? FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 04 Apr 2005 22:54:37 -0500 From: JeepNut Subject: fsj: Jeep Commander I've been looking/lusting at the new Commander, but I don't see much traffic on the list about it... I WANT to like it just based on the pics. I NEED a big truck with 3 teenagers to haul around... the problem is the dad-blamed gas.... but looka that windshield will ya?! Sits almost vertical! COOL!! That's what I hate most about everything else I see nowadays. I can't stand having the A pillar leaning in toward my forehead.... Saw the inside of a late model Camaro for the first time recently. The dash in that thing is like a football field. I guess it works OK for sitting fast food all over the dash... Anybody found any estimated mileage info yet on this beast? Anybody yet have a MOPAR with that hemi that drops half the cylinders at no load? How does that do on mileage? (it's becoming an issue, as much as I HATE it. Just get to a point in my life where I can almost AFFORD my habit... and now it now costs me $43.00 every 3 days to fill up the GWag just to get b/f to work...grrr....) I'm starting to think in terms of an Odessy van... (OH NO!) Somebody stop me! - -- "Microsoft Certified Professionals are to the computing industry what McDonalds Certified Food Specialists are to gourmet restaurants." -Michael Bacarella 00Mar15 - ---------------------------------------------------------- '87 Street Comanche #24/100 '88 Grand Wagoneer ...and they say there's only one... '92 Cherokee Laredo - ---------------------------------------------------------- Registered Linux user #287453 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2005 01:13:49 -0400 (EDT) From: john Subject: Re: fsj: Jeep Commander my dear, dear friend... take a deep breath... and consider the big D. yes my friend... Rudolf's invention... :) my '91 300D with a puny little 2.5L turbo gets 30 to 32.5 mpg IN TOWN. Dang near 40 on the freeway... my big bad ugly GMC with a slipping transmission pulling over 2,000lbs of overbuilt J10 trailer still gets 18mpg... yes EIGHTEEN... so I'm going to rip the heart out of the GMC and put it in Superdawg. :) so, be strong... avoid the minivan and consider vegetable oil. BTW, if you get a chance, check out the article on the WK in FSJ mag this issue... Rube Goldberg would be proud of that so-called Hemi contraption. :) john On Mon, 4 Apr 2005, JeepNut wrote: > -->I've been looking/lusting at the new Commander, but I don't see much traffic > -->on the list about it... > -->I WANT to like it just based on the pics. I NEED a big truck with 3 > -->teenagers to haul around... the problem is the dad-blamed gas.... but looka > -->that windshield will ya?! Sits almost vertical! COOL!! That's what I hate > -->most about everything else I see nowadays. I can't stand having the A > -->pillar leaning in toward my forehead.... Saw the inside of a late model > -->Camaro for the first time recently. The dash in that thing is like a > -->football field. I guess it works OK for sitting fast food all over the > -->dash... > --> > -->Anybody found any estimated mileage info yet on this beast? > -->Anybody yet have a MOPAR with that hemi that drops half the cylinders at no > -->load? > -->How does that do on mileage? > -->(it's becoming an issue, as much as I HATE it. Just get to a point in my > -->life where I can almost AFFORD my habit... and now it now costs me $43.00 > -->every 3 days to fill up the GWag just to get b/f to work...grrr....) > -->I'm starting to think in terms of an Odessy van... (OH NO!) > -->Somebody stop me! > --> > -->-- > -->"Microsoft Certified Professionals are to the computing > -->industry what McDonalds Certified Food Specialists are to > -->gourmet restaurants." -Michael Bacarella 00Mar15 > -->---------------------------------------------------------- > -->'87 Street Comanche #24/100 > -->'88 Grand Wagoneer ...and they say there's only one... > -->'92 Cherokee Laredo > -->---------------------------------------------------------- > -->Registered Linux user #287453 > --> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2005 12:09:53 -0400 (EDT) From: john Subject: fsj: another XJ another XJ joins the clan... my daughter decided to let me buy the '92 in need of repair... :) will be selling her '91 Grand Am http://www.JohnMeister.com/CARS/91-grand-am/ john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2005 10:54:55 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: Re: Jeep Commander Trust me, you don't want the Oddity van! If anything, Honda's new pickup truck looks promising. Ever drive one of those space shuttle Lumina vans? Made me car sick taking it for a test drive! I've been looking/lusting at the new Commander, but I don't see much traffic on the list about it... I WANT to like it just based on the pics. I NEED a big truck with 3 teenagers to haul around... the problem is the dad-blamed gas.... but looka that windshield will ya?! Sits almost vertical! COOL!! That's what I hate most about everything else I see nowadays. I can't stand having the A pillar leaning in toward my forehead.... Saw the inside of a late model Camaro for the first time recently. The dash in that thing is like a football field. I guess it works OK for sitting fast food all over the dash... Anybody found any estimated mileage info yet on this beast? Anybody yet have a MOPAR with that hemi that drops half the cylinders at no load? How does that do on mileage? (it's becoming an issue, as much as I HATE it. Just get to a point in my life where I can almost AFFORD my habit... and now it now costs me $43.00 every 3 days to fill up the GWag just to get b/f to work...grrr....) I'm starting to think in terms of an Odessy van... (OH NO!) Somebody stop me! - -- "Microsoft Certified Professionals are to the computing industry what McDonalds Certified Food Specialists are to gourmet restaurants." -Michael Bacarella 00Mar15 - ---------------------------------------------------------- '87 Street Comanche #24/100 '88 Grand Wagoneer ...and they say there's only one... '92 Cherokee Laredo - ---------------------------------------------------------- Registered Linux user #287453 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2005 10:57:46 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: Re: Re: parts and info needed A: I'm going to double check with Zack (former New Venture engineer) but I was told that's all they did in the plant. so, if I take the input gear out of my GMC 208 and put it into my J10 208 it'll work??? john On Mon, 4 Apr 2005, Jim Blair wrote: >-->A: Use a NP208J with the input gear from the Chev trans. I'm looking at >-->doing the opposite. I may have a front axle for a J10 soon. Still trying >to >-->decide whether to part the other J10 (with 401) or sell it whole. The >J20 >-->(with J10 axle setup) will probably get my flatdeck. Still waiting for >-->paperwork on the FSJ camper. >--> >--> >-->From: john >-->Subject: parts and info needed >--> >-->I'm in need of a J10 front axle with a passenger side drop >-->and disc brakes, preferrably with 4.10 gears. I'm kicking >-->myself quite hard right now because I gave away the one I >-->had from the J10 that turned trailer... and I gave away the >-->Golden Eagle J10... which also had 4.10's... >--> >-->Either that or I need a newer transfer case for my '83 700R4 >-->so I can use the driver's side drop. >--> >-->As far as info, need to know what kind of heat exchangers >-->I can setup on that auxillary tank for vegetable oil. >--> >-->Decided to sell our '99 WJ 4.0L Laredo... new rear brake >-->calipers, new water pump, new fan/clutch, excellent condition, >-->74,000 miles, like new tires... super clean... >--> >-->john >--> >--> >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2005 11:02:54 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: Re: Anyone need project parts in Florida? A: Just so people know, they are MUCH wider than MJ axles. Grand Wagoneer axles are closer. 6 on 5.5" bolt pattern. From: "C.Barone" Cabz-at-comcast.net Subject: Anyone need project parts? I picked up a 79 J10 to part out, It has d44's with 3.54 ratios. also a 360 v8 turbo 400 trans an quadratrac T case . The truck is located in central fl. So if you where thinking about building a beast of an MJ nows your chance. Carmine B ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2005 14:12:28 -0400 (EDT) From: john Subject: Re: fsj: Re: Jeep Commander On Tue, 5 Apr 2005, Jim Blair wrote: >-->Trust me, you don't want the Oddity van! If anything, Honda's new pickup >-->truck looks promising. Ever drive one of those space shuttle Lumina vans? >-->Made me car sick taking it for a test drive! same thing happened to me with the beetle... that windshield setup made my stomach upset... :) john >--> >--> >--> >--> >--> >-->I've been looking/lusting at the new Commander, but I don't see much >-->traffic on the list about it... >-->I WANT to like it just based on the pics. I NEED a big truck with 3 >-->teenagers to haul around... the problem is the dad-blamed gas.... but >-->looka that windshield will ya?! Sits almost vertical! COOL!! That's >-->what I hate most about everything else I see nowadays. I can't stand >-->having the A pillar leaning in toward my forehead.... Saw the inside of >-->a late model Camaro for the first time recently. The dash in that thing >-->is like a football field. I guess it works OK for sitting fast food all >-->over the dash... >--> >-->Anybody found any estimated mileage info yet on this beast? >-->Anybody yet have a MOPAR with that hemi that drops half the cylinders at >-->no load? >-->How does that do on mileage? >-->(it's becoming an issue, as much as I HATE it. Just get to a point in >-->my life where I can almost AFFORD my habit... and now it now costs me >-->$43.00 every 3 days to fill up the GWag just to get b/f to work...grrr....) >-->I'm starting to think in terms of an Odessy van... (OH NO!) >-->Somebody stop me! >--> >-->-- >-->"Microsoft Certified Professionals are to the computing >-->industry what McDonalds Certified Food Specialists are to >-->gourmet restaurants." -Michael Bacarella 00Mar15 >-->---------------------------------------------------------- >-->'87 Street Comanche #24/100 >-->'88 Grand Wagoneer ...and they say there's only one... >-->'92 Cherokee Laredo >-->---------------------------------------------------------- >-->Registered Linux user #287453 >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2005 14:13:01 -0400 (EDT) From: john Subject: fsj: Re: Re: parts and info needed that would solve a lot of problems for me if that's all we have to do! john On Tue, 5 Apr 2005, Jim Blair wrote: >-->A: I'm going to double check with Zack (former New Venture engineer) but I >-->was told that's all they did in the plant. >--> >--> >-->so, if I take the input gear out of my GMC 208 and >-->put it into my J10 208 it'll work??? >--> >-->john >--> >--> >-->On Mon, 4 Apr 2005, Jim Blair wrote: >--> >-->>-->A: Use a NP208J with the input gear from the Chev trans. I'm looking at >-->>-->doing the opposite. I may have a front axle for a J10 soon. Still trying >-->>to >-->>-->decide whether to part the other J10 (with 401) or sell it whole. The >-->>J20 >-->>-->(with J10 axle setup) will probably get my flatdeck. Still waiting for >-->>-->paperwork on the FSJ camper. >-->>--> >-->>--> >-->>-->From: john >-->>-->Subject: parts and info needed >-->>--> >-->>-->I'm in need of a J10 front axle with a passenger side drop >-->>-->and disc brakes, preferrably with 4.10 gears. I'm kicking >-->>-->myself quite hard right now because I gave away the one I >-->>-->had from the J10 that turned trailer... and I gave away the >-->>-->Golden Eagle J10... which also had 4.10's... >-->>--> >-->>-->Either that or I need a newer transfer case for my '83 700R4 >-->>-->so I can use the driver's side drop. >-->>--> >-->>-->As far as info, need to know what kind of heat exchangers >-->>-->I can setup on that auxillary tank for vegetable oil. >-->>--> >-->>-->Decided to sell our '99 WJ 4.0L Laredo... new rear brake >-->>-->calipers, new water pump, new fan/clutch, excellent condition, >-->>-->74,000 miles, like new tires... super clean... >-->>--> >-->>-->john >-->>--> >-->>--> >-->>--> >--> >--> ---- >--> >-->------------------------------------------------------------------------- >--> ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** >--> Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. >-->------------------------------------------------------------------------- >--> >--> >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 05 Apr 2005 13:20:39 CDT From: Dan Black Subject: Re: fsj: Re: Jeep Commander "Jim Blair" said: {- Ever drive one of those space shuttle Lumina vans? {- Made me car sick taking it for a test drive! Never drove one, but rode shotgun in one (former roommate's parents' van). Didn't make me carsick, but like the Camaro he described, we played a quick game of flag football on the dash. {- I WANT to like it just based on the pics. I NEED a big truck with 3 {- teenagers to haul around... the problem is the dad-blamed gas.... but {- looka that windshield will ya?! Sits almost vertical! COOL!! That's {- what I hate most about everything else I see nowadays. I can't stand {- having the A pillar leaning in toward my forehead.... I love the steep windshields, too, but that's directly one of the things that makes the mileage so bad. So you hit the pro and the con in the same breath. {- Anybody found any estimated mileage info yet on this beast? I thought it said, somewhere on those sheets... I was thinking the standard for large SUVs these days, in the 17/19 range. But that could be entirely my imagination. As for the 8/6/4 cylinder HEMI, yeah, that's nice that they have it working now, but I seriously wouldn't exepect more than a mpg or so out of that. There's simply not much you can do with current engine technology to increase the mileage of trucks with that shape and weight. When Honda and the other mileagemobile manufacturers started making the big SUVs (the Pilot, Armada, etc.), they suddenly discovered what everyone else already knew, and they're stuck in the mid- to high-teens for mileage just like everybody else that size. It's a direct trade-off; if you want that size and power, you _will_ pay for it at the pump. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- We really oughta spend the rest of this week coming up with an elaborate way to kill those two. -- Brad - -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2005 13:11:53 -0700 (PDT) From: Brad Seevers Subject: Re: fsj: Re: parts and info needed You are going to bolt the Jeep NP208 up to a GM 700R4? Other than the input gear Jim mentions, there may be clocking issues. Not sure, but something to check. - -brad - --- john wrote: > so, if I take the input gear out of my GMC 208 and > put it into my J10 208 it'll work??? > > john > > > On Mon, 4 Apr 2005, Jim Blair wrote: > > >-->A: Use a NP208J with the input gear from the > Chev trans. I'm looking at > >-->doing the opposite. I may have a front axle for > a J10 soon. Still trying to > >-->decide whether to part the other J10 (with 401) > or sell it whole. The J20 > >-->(with J10 axle setup) will probably get my > flatdeck. Still waiting for > >-->paperwork on the FSJ camper. > >--> > >--> > >-->From: john > >-->Subject: parts and info needed > >--> > >-->I'm in need of a J10 front axle with a passenger > side drop > >-->and disc brakes, preferrably with 4.10 gears. > I'm kicking > >-->myself quite hard right now because I gave away > the one I > >-->had from the J10 that turned trailer... and I > gave away the > >-->Golden Eagle J10... which also had 4.10's... > >--> > >-->Either that or I need a newer transfer case for > my '83 700R4 > >-->so I can use the driver's side drop. > >--> > >-->As far as info, need to know what kind of heat > exchangers > >-->I can setup on that auxillary tank for vegetable > oil. > >--> > >-->Decided to sell our '99 WJ 4.0L Laredo... new > rear brake > >-->calipers, new water pump, new fan/clutch, > excellent condition, > >-->74,000 miles, like new tires... super clean... > >--> > >-->john > >--> > >--> > >--> > > ---- > > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** > http://freegift.net ** > Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't > rust, they mold. > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2005 16:19:11 -0400 (EDT) From: john Subject: fsj: np208 input gear swap and clocking? so, how hard is that to resolve? can I use my driver's side drop front axle with the np208/700r4 even though in the jimmy it's pass side now? john On Tue, 5 Apr 2005, Brad Seevers wrote: >--> >-->You are going to bolt the Jeep NP208 up to a GM 700R4? >--> Other than the input gear Jim mentions, there may be >-->clocking issues. Not sure, but something to check. >--> >-->-brad >--> >-->--- john wrote: >-->> so, if I take the input gear out of my GMC 208 and >-->> put it into my J10 208 it'll work??? >-->> >-->> john >-->> >-->> >-->> On Mon, 4 Apr 2005, Jim Blair wrote: >-->> >-->> >-->A: Use a NP208J with the input gear from the >-->> Chev trans. I'm looking at >-->> >-->doing the opposite. I may have a front axle for >-->> a J10 soon. Still trying to >-->> >-->decide whether to part the other J10 (with 401) >-->> or sell it whole. The J20 >-->> >-->(with J10 axle setup) will probably get my >-->> flatdeck. Still waiting for >-->> >-->paperwork on the FSJ camper. >-->> >--> >-->> >--> >-->> >-->From: john >-->> >-->Subject: parts and info needed >-->> >--> >-->> >-->I'm in need of a J10 front axle with a passenger >-->> side drop >-->> >-->and disc brakes, preferrably with 4.10 gears. >-->> I'm kicking >-->> >-->myself quite hard right now because I gave away >-->> the one I >-->> >-->had from the J10 that turned trailer... and I >-->> gave away the >-->> >-->Golden Eagle J10... which also had 4.10's... >-->> >--> >-->> >-->Either that or I need a newer transfer case for >-->> my '83 700R4 >-->> >-->so I can use the driver's side drop. >-->> >--> >-->> >-->As far as info, need to know what kind of heat >-->> exchangers >-->> >-->I can setup on that auxillary tank for vegetable >-->> oil. >-->> >--> >-->> >-->Decided to sell our '99 WJ 4.0L Laredo... new >-->> rear brake >-->> >-->calipers, new water pump, new fan/clutch, >-->> excellent condition, >-->> >-->74,000 miles, like new tires... super clean... >-->> >--> >-->> >-->john >-->> >--> >-->> >--> >-->> >--> >-->> >-->> ---- >-->> >-->> >-->------------------------------------------------------------------------- >-->> ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** >-->> http://freegift.net ** >-->> Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't >-->> rust, they mold. >-->> >-->------------------------------------------------------------------------- >-->> >--> >--> >--> >-->Yahoo! Personals - Better first dates. More second dates. >-->http://personals.yahoo.com >--> >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2005 16:20:54 -0400 (EDT) From: john Subject: fsj: np208c input gear in an np219? On Tue, 5 Apr 2005, Brad Seevers wrote: >-->You are going to bolt the Jeep NP208 up to a GM 700R4? >--> Other than the input gear Jim mentions, there may be >-->clocking issues. Not sure, but something to check. >-->-brad I wonder if the np208c input gear could be used in the np219... but if I have to use the stock jeep np208 and hubs that's fine with me... the least expense and troubles the better, I need to get my truck back on the road... it's been four long years already... having serious fsj withdrawals that cause spastic jeep purchases... ;) john >--> >-->--- john wrote: >-->> so, if I take the input gear out of my GMC 208 and >-->> put it into my J10 208 it'll work??? >-->> >-->> john >-->> >-->> >-->> On Mon, 4 Apr 2005, Jim Blair wrote: >-->> >-->> >-->A: Use a NP208J with the input gear from the >-->> Chev trans. I'm looking at >-->> >-->doing the opposite. I may have a front axle for >-->> a J10 soon. Still trying to >-->> >-->decide whether to part the other J10 (with 401) >-->> or sell it whole. The J20 >-->> >-->(with J10 axle setup) will probably get my >-->> flatdeck. Still waiting for >-->> >-->paperwork on the FSJ camper. >-->> >--> >-->> >--> >-->> >-->From: john >-->> >-->Subject: parts and info needed >-->> >--> >-->> >-->I'm in need of a J10 front axle with a passenger >-->> side drop >-->> >-->and disc brakes, preferrably with 4.10 gears. >-->> I'm kicking >-->> >-->myself quite hard right now because I gave away >-->> the one I >-->> >-->had from the J10 that turned trailer... and I >-->> gave away the >-->> >-->Golden Eagle J10... which also had 4.10's... >-->> >--> >-->> >-->Either that or I need a newer transfer case for >-->> my '83 700R4 >-->> >-->so I can use the driver's side drop. >-->> >--> >-->> >-->As far as info, need to know what kind of heat >-->> exchangers >-->> >-->I can setup on that auxillary tank for vegetable >-->> oil. >-->> >--> >-->> >-->Decided to sell our '99 WJ 4.0L Laredo... new >-->> rear brake >-->> >-->calipers, new water pump, new fan/clutch, >-->> excellent condition, >-->> >-->74,000 miles, like new tires... super clean... >-->> >--> >-->> >-->john >-->> >--> >-->> >--> >-->> >--> >-->> >-->> ---- >-->> >-->> >-->------------------------------------------------------------------------- >-->> ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** >-->> http://freegift.net ** >-->> Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't >-->> rust, they mold. >-->> >-->------------------------------------------------------------------------- >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #2407 **************************