From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Fri Jul 6 21:24:43 2007 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Saturday, July 7 2007 Volume 01 : Number 2881 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: failure on the fourth... RE: fsj: OT? need vehicle, <2K - Seattle fsj: timing chains fsj: RE: timing chains RE: fsj: OT? need vehicle, <2K - Seattle fsj: RE: timing chains RE: fsj: OT? need vehicle, <2K - Seattle fsj: RE: timing chains fsj: '68 M715 for sale in CA for $45000 (not mine) FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 5 Jul 2007 22:51:37 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: failure on the fourth... found out what caused my daughter's car to die on the 4th... timing chain broke... jim blair just came over and we pulled the valve cover and confirmed it... and here I thought it had a timing gear set and not a chain... good news... unless of course the '91 2.5 tech 4 is an interference motor... still might be ok... wasn't going very fast and there were no catastrophic sounds... :) john ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2007 09:22:31 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: RE: fsj: OT? need vehicle, <2K - Seattle I'm about 80% sure the timing chain dropped in that car and wrapped around the crank (hopefully it's not an interference motor) The Tech 4 has a reputation for dropping chains. Other vehicles have similar headgasket issues (Dodge Neon for one) but cracking heads are the worst (Mitsubishi with 2.6 and most Ford fwd 1.9L 4 cyls) One car that seems to be underated is the Dodge Shadow and Plymouth Acclaim. The 2.2 with 3 speed auto seems to be pretty well put together. Hondas and most Toyotas that aren't beat upon by kids prior to buying seem very good too. Young people are image conscious.... so the maverick may not be too hip..... The kids are the one spending $250 and more on designer's jeans..... $600 on cell phones.... and so on.... the maverick was a very good vehicle... a friend used one for a year before saving enough money for a better ride : a toyota pick up truck.... the only problem being when being rear ended.. your head will hit the back window.... Peugeot are/were good... but parts may be an issue..... John is right.... staying away from the ford failing cooling-headgaskets on the taurus and alike, or ill-fated ford autotrannies. I have been thinking about better mileage vehicles..... tough one.... if the mileage is good... then the potential replacement parts are not Get a model that you are familiar w is the best tip...... Michel _________________________________________________________________ http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_2G_0507 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 09:35:25 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: timing chains non-interference motor... checked... thanx for helping jim... need to get it replaced... tow bill to everett, tow rope up the hill, or wait for one very good, but unreliable mechanic friend, he finally answered email... said he'll call... I feel like I'm in flake central... trying to get a rockery built... trying to get my daughter's car fixed... trying to get my jeeps reassembled... trying to get my homework done... argghhhh... people don't respond or commit. can't trust anyone at their word any more... even written contracts are useless... take a flake to court, what do you get? a court order for them to repay or complete? good luck collecting... people just don't care... never really serious enough to go to court, and the flakes know it... caveat empator... ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Fri, 6 Jul 2007, Jim Blair wrote: # I'm about 80% sure the timing chain dropped in that car and wrapped around # the crank (hopefully it's not an interference motor) The Tech 4 has a # reputation for dropping chains. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 12:36:55 -0500 From: "Richard K. Means" Subject: fsj: RE: timing chains Good news, it's repairable and let it be a lesson to us all: you can count on your friends so work to keep them. the world is full of jerks and the jerks who survive to perpetuate their jerkiness know just how much they can screw others without having to pay a big penalty. You can spot them a mile away. They are the ones who often brag how they are cheating on their wife, stealing from their company. When you spot one, run the other way. I bet your unreliable mechanic friend is a good guy who does good work for a fair price but is overcommitted because he can't say "no." Be a good friend to him by helping him manage his time better and learning to say "no" when saying "yes" will get him in trouble. Rich - ------------------------------------ Means Law Offices Richard K. Means Attorney at Law rmeans-at-richardmeans.com 806 Fair Oaks Avenue Oak Park, Illinois 60302 tel: 708.386.1122 fax: 708.383.2987 mobile: 312.391.8808 www.richardmeans.com AIM: rmeans Skype ID:richardkmeans - ------------------------------------ - -----Original Message----- From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of john Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 11:35 AM To: Jim Blair Cc: mbalea-at-hotmail.com; fsj-at-digest.net Subject: fsj: timing chains non-interference motor... checked... thanx for helping jim... need to get it replaced... tow bill to everett, tow rope up the hill, or wait for one very good, but unreliable mechanic friend, he finally answered email... said he'll call... I feel like I'm in flake central... trying to get a rockery built... trying to get my daughter's car fixed... trying to get my jeeps reassembled... trying to get my homework done... argghhhh... people don't respond or commit. can't trust anyone at their word any more... even written contracts are useless... take a flake to court, what do you get? a court order for them to repay or complete? good luck collecting... people just don't care... never really serious enough to go to court, and the flakes know it... caveat empator... ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Fri, 6 Jul 2007, Jim Blair wrote: # I'm about 80% sure the timing chain dropped in that car and wrapped around # the crank (hopefully it's not an interference motor) The Tech 4 has a # reputation for dropping chains. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2007 17:42:43 +0000 From: "michel balea" Subject: RE: fsj: OT? need vehicle, <2K - Seattle From: "Jim" Hondas and most Toyotas that aren't beat upon by kids prior to buying seem very good too. Re: pretty amazing that those engines runs after a while..... as for John's issue for people not holding their contracts.... always keep a 15% or 10% of the total until final inspection..... It is amazing how they are eager to finish the job.... Michel ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 10:58:38 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: RE: timing chains On Fri, 6 Jul 2007, Richard K. Means wrote: # Good news, it's repairable and let it be a lesson to us all: yes, my daughter is quite relieved... this will buy her more time and with a running car as a trade in she'll be able to find a nicer vehicle. she's a good kid, works hard and pays her own way. She's going to borrow a friend's car so my wife gets her Jeep back. # # you can count on your friends so work to keep them. absolutely... even flakey friends... :) My non-flakey friends are usually too busy to be real friends thinking about it... given the choice between a friend who can be a friend and a friend who doesn't have time, guess I'll take a little flakiness... :) and they really mean well... # the world is full of jerks and the jerks who survive to perpetuate their # jerkiness know just how much they can screw others without having to pay a # big penalty. You can spot them a mile away. They are the ones who often # brag how they are cheating on their wife, stealing from their company. When # you spot one, run the other way. yep. it's always entertaining to have a rental... see folks that should be nominated for an oscar... there is a BIG difference between flakes and jerks. another clue is when a jerk will just say, so sue me... he obviously knows what it costs and doesn't care... A flake, as you mention below, usually overestimates their time, or underestimates the work or task... or is just unreliable and not up to the pressures of keeping a schedule... a flake usually doesn't try to screw you, and as mentioned, does things at a very fair price, or a downright bargain... which means you get what you pay for... and often we live with the delays because they often produce excellent work, just takes longer, but again... they don't overcharge and usually come through in the end... it's the pushing, nudging and constant pestering involved that gets old. :) Question is, where is the line between a flake and a jerk? :) Maybe I guess the flake will come through... even if it takes years to get them to finish something or repay a debt... a jerk just blows you off... # I bet your unreliable mechanic friend is a good guy who does good work for a # fair price but is overcommitted because he can't say "no." Be a good friend oh yeah, he's one of the best... he impresses me most of the time. he's been let go from a number of shops because he's unreliable... a flake, wants to be a firefighter, not a mechanic(he's burned out on it actually)... so he blows off work to go fight forestfires and comes back to no job... I'll hire him to do any job though where I can wait, he's a master mechanic and as long as I'm not in a hurry it's fine. He did a great job of putting my cj-2a together... took him from August until June to do it though... but he charged about 60% of what it would have cost me to have it done... I love working with really good mechanics... I always learn a new trick or two... # to him by helping him manage his time better and learning to say "no" when # saying "yes" will get him in trouble. he's trying to say no right now... :) so I've upped my offer... his time is valuable... offered to pay him shop rates instead of hourly rate... will save my daughter another tow bill... and put some extra jingle in his pocket. :) How's your new toy working out? My wife is still thinking I'll get rid of my 124 when my Grand Wagoneer is done, but all it takes is a minor breakdown of one vehicle and the entire world is turned upside down... when you live in the country you really need three vehicles for two drivers, even if only one of the drivers has a regular job... I'm hoping that my wife will use the Benz for grocery and errands... only problem will be hauling home plants and such... she makes use of the WJ Grand Cherokee's cargo area. :) thanx for the reality check... now, if the rockery guy will call or show up I'll feel better... ;) BTW, I'm thinking of three options if my Grand Wag project doesn't work out... getting a Cherokee and stuffing in a Mercedes Diesel, getting a Liberty Diesel and changing the design parts I don't like (seats/front axle) or getting a Dodge Cummnins... wondering if I could shorten the wheelbase... ;) let's hope Omega works out... ;) I'm not crazy about the white paint, but a Wagoneer makes more sense than a J10, sad to say... I really liked my J10 and if could have an extended cab on it that would have been perfect... but it's beyond my budget and skill of me and my friends... just got a call from my mechanic friend, he's running a milling machine and can't do it... he's helping a friend catch up on work... john # # Rich # # ------------------------------------ # Means Law Offices # Richard K. Means # Attorney at Law # rmeans-at-richardmeans.com # 806 Fair Oaks Avenue # Oak Park, Illinois 60302 # tel: 708.386.1122 # fax: 708.383.2987 # mobile: 312.391.8808 # www.richardmeans.com # AIM: rmeans # Skype ID:richardkmeans # ------------------------------------ # # -----Original Message----- # From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of john # Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 11:35 AM # To: Jim Blair # Cc: mbalea-at-hotmail.com; fsj-at-digest.net # Subject: fsj: timing chains # # non-interference motor... checked... # # thanx for helping jim... # # need to get it replaced... tow bill to everett, tow rope up the hill, or # wait for one very good, but unreliable mechanic friend, he finally answered # email... said he'll call... # # I feel like I'm in flake central... trying to get a rockery built... trying # to get my daughter's car fixed... trying to get my jeeps reassembled... # trying to get my homework done... # argghhhh... people don't respond or commit. can't trust anyone at their # word any more... even written contracts are useless... take a flake to # court, what do you get? # a court order for them to repay or complete? good luck collecting... people # just don't care... never really serious enough to go to court, and the # flakes know it... caveat empator... # # ----- # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # On Fri, 6 Jul 2007, Jim Blair wrote: # # # I'm about 80% sure the timing chain dropped in that car and wrapped # around # # the crank (hopefully it's not an interference motor) The Tech 4 has a # # reputation for dropping chains. # # ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 10:59:41 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: RE: fsj: OT? need vehicle, <2K - Seattle holding money back doesn't always help... much. ;) ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- On Fri, 6 Jul 2007, michel balea wrote: # From: "Jim" # Hondas and most Toyotas that aren't beat upon by kids prior to buying seem # very good too. # # Re: pretty amazing that those engines runs after a while..... # # as for John's issue for people not holding their contracts.... always keep a # 15% or 10% of the total until final inspection..... It is amazing how they # are eager to finish the job.... # # Michel # ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Jul 2007 14:00:46 -0500 From: "Richard K. Means" Subject: fsj: RE: timing chains You're right, flakes aren't jerks. We can love flakes, just not trust them too far. I guess we are all a little flakey, each in our own way. I'm flakey in that I . . . (decided not to brag about it). The old toy is the '85 GW which I named Moby Dick because he was a great white whale and because I loved him, hated him, was obsessed by him, and because he can't be killed. He still lives, is now dead solid reliable and is only used when family and friends need some heavy duty hauling or in heavy snow. He can't be sold for anything what I've put into him so he hangs around, licensed and insured, ready for the kind of action that an old city lawyer doesn't need much. The new toy is the '06 Toyota Solara Convertible which does attract the chicks (until they see who's driving it). He's named Huey P. Newton because he's a black panther: fast, lithe and pretty. He performs darned near as well as my '70s European sports cars (BMW and FIAT) did but (like Newton in his old age) is surprisingly reliable and docile. I guess I'm just getting old. (That's what the grandchildren think anyway.) Best wishes, Rich - ------------------------------------ Means Law Offices Richard K. Means Attorney at Law rmeans-at-richardmeans.com 806 Fair Oaks Avenue Oak Park, Illinois 60302 tel: 708.386.1122 fax: 708.383.2987 mobile: 312.391.8808 www.richardmeans.com AIM: rmeans Skype ID:richardkmeans - ------------------------------------ - -----Original Message----- From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 12:59 PM To: Richard K. Means Cc: 'Jim Blair'; mbalea-at-hotmail.com; fsj-at-digest.net Subject: RE: timing chains On Fri, 6 Jul 2007, Richard K. Means wrote: # Good news, it's repairable and let it be a lesson to us all: yes, my daughter is quite relieved... this will buy her more time and with a running car as a trade in she'll be able to find a nicer vehicle. she's a good kid, works hard and pays her own way. She's going to borrow a friend's car so my wife gets her Jeep back. # # you can count on your friends so work to keep them. absolutely... even flakey friends... :) My non-flakey friends are usually too busy to be real friends thinking about it... given the choice between a friend who can be a friend and a friend who doesn't have time, guess I'll take a little flakiness... :) and they really mean well... # the world is full of jerks and the jerks who survive to perpetuate their # jerkiness know just how much they can screw others without having to pay a # big penalty. You can spot them a mile away. They are the ones who often # brag how they are cheating on their wife, stealing from their company. When # you spot one, run the other way. yep. it's always entertaining to have a rental... see folks that should be nominated for an oscar... there is a BIG difference between flakes and jerks. another clue is when a jerk will just say, so sue me... he obviously knows what it costs and doesn't care... A flake, as you mention below, usually overestimates their time, or underestimates the work or task... or is just unreliable and not up to the pressures of keeping a schedule... a flake usually doesn't try to screw you, and as mentioned, does things at a very fair price, or a downright bargain... which means you get what you pay for... and often we live with the delays because they often produce excellent work, just takes longer, but again... they don't overcharge and usually come through in the end... it's the pushing, nudging and constant pestering involved that gets old. :) Question is, where is the line between a flake and a jerk? :) Maybe I guess the flake will come through... even if it takes years to get them to finish something or repay a debt... a jerk just blows you off... # I bet your unreliable mechanic friend is a good guy who does good work for a # fair price but is overcommitted because he can't say "no." Be a good friend oh yeah, he's one of the best... he impresses me most of the time. he's been let go from a number of shops because he's unreliable... a flake, wants to be a firefighter, not a mechanic(he's burned out on it actually)... so he blows off work to go fight forestfires and comes back to no job... I'll hire him to do any job though where I can wait, he's a master mechanic and as long as I'm not in a hurry it's fine. He did a great job of putting my cj-2a together... took him from August until June to do it though... but he charged about 60% of what it would have cost me to have it done... I love working with really good mechanics... I always learn a new trick or two... # to him by helping him manage his time better and learning to say "no" when # saying "yes" will get him in trouble. he's trying to say no right now... :) so I've upped my offer... his time is valuable... offered to pay him shop rates instead of hourly rate... will save my daughter another tow bill... and put some extra jingle in his pocket. :) How's your new toy working out? My wife is still thinking I'll get rid of my 124 when my Grand Wagoneer is done, but all it takes is a minor breakdown of one vehicle and the entire world is turned upside down... when you live in the country you really need three vehicles for two drivers, even if only one of the drivers has a regular job... I'm hoping that my wife will use the Benz for grocery and errands... only problem will be hauling home plants and such... she makes use of the WJ Grand Cherokee's cargo area. :) thanx for the reality check... now, if the rockery guy will call or show up I'll feel better... ;) BTW, I'm thinking of three options if my Grand Wag project doesn't work out... getting a Cherokee and stuffing in a Mercedes Diesel, getting a Liberty Diesel and changing the design parts I don't like (seats/front axle) or getting a Dodge Cummnins... wondering if I could shorten the wheelbase... ;) let's hope Omega works out... ;) I'm not crazy about the white paint, but a Wagoneer makes more sense than a J10, sad to say... I really liked my J10 and if could have an extended cab on it that would have been perfect... but it's beyond my budget and skill of me and my friends... just got a call from my mechanic friend, he's running a milling machine and can't do it... he's helping a friend catch up on work... john # # Rich # # ------------------------------------ # Means Law Offices # Richard K. Means # Attorney at Law # rmeans-at-richardmeans.com # 806 Fair Oaks Avenue # Oak Park, Illinois 60302 # tel: 708.386.1122 # fax: 708.383.2987 # mobile: 312.391.8808 # www.richardmeans.com # AIM: rmeans # Skype ID:richardkmeans # ------------------------------------ # # -----Original Message----- # From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of john # Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 11:35 AM # To: Jim Blair # Cc: mbalea-at-hotmail.com; fsj-at-digest.net # Subject: fsj: timing chains # # non-interference motor... checked... # # thanx for helping jim... # # need to get it replaced... tow bill to everett, tow rope up the hill, or # wait for one very good, but unreliable mechanic friend, he finally answered # email... said he'll call... # # I feel like I'm in flake central... trying to get a rockery built... trying # to get my daughter's car fixed... trying to get my jeeps reassembled... # trying to get my homework done... # argghhhh... people don't respond or commit. can't trust anyone at their # word any more... even written contracts are useless... take a flake to # court, what do you get? # a court order for them to repay or complete? good luck collecting... people # just don't care... never really serious enough to go to court, and the # flakes know it... caveat empator... # # ----- # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # http://freegift.com ** http://wagoneers.com ** # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # # On Fri, 6 Jul 2007, Jim Blair wrote: # # # I'm about 80% sure the timing chain dropped in that car and wrapped # around # # the crank (hopefully it's not an interference motor) The Tech 4 has a # # reputation for dropping chains. # # ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Jul 2007 21:17:40 -0700 From: "Jim Blair" Subject: fsj: '68 M715 for sale in CA for $45000 (not mine) http://www.partsmike.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4220 Its a '68 Kaiser M715 with original 6cyl 230 ohc motor and stock trans & t.c. This was an ex-USFS truck, It will run and drive with charged batteries and fresh fuel. This has clean pinkslip and is on non-op. I have a complete set of spare rolling axle housings front and rear with stock military tires and rims. Extra windshield with new front glass, soft top bows, spare left and right doors, and extra BED to boot. This is all stock.... military light switches, interior dash and floorboard. It does need a little TLC... the brakes leak out if sits too long & has a small fuel leak in gas tank. $4500 obo Scout254-at-sbcglobal.net Located in Chico, CA Will not ship. _________________________________________________________________ http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_2G_0507 ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #2881 **************************