From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Tue Feb 22 10:22:46 2000 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Tuesday, February 22 2000 Volume 01 : Number 745 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: RE: Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 13:31:09 -0600 fsj: Re: 20 mpg and indexing Re: fsj: Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 13:31:09 -0600 fsj: Spark nock fsj: Propane AC Re: fsj: I-6 /V-8 Induction systems/mileage woes fsj: Re: I-6/V-8 Induction systems/mileage woes fsj: Re: LPG follow up fsj: Re: QT clunking... fsj: Re: Yer j-truck Re: fsj: Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 13:31:09 -0600 Re: fsj: Spark nock fsj: Re: (sans sujet) (FRENCH Cherokee site) fsj: Re: garage fsj: Re: Re: LPG follow up Re: fsj: Re: garage Re: fsj: is the starter supposed to do this?? fsj: 84 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 360 2v HP/torque fsj: 20 mpg and indexing fsj: ANother Stash Of Parts fsj: Feel The Power FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 12:58:51 -0700 From: "JC Jones" Subject: fsj: RE: Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 13:31:09 -0600 It sounds like you might be running a little rich. JC Jones :) - -----Original Message----- From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net]On Behalf Of TLynn Sent: Monday, February 21, 2000 12:38 PM To: FSJ DIGEST Subject: fsj: Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 13:31:09 -0600 Ok great list....I'm using all new MSD stuff and my new pluges got alot ofgreyish/black build up(carbon?)...the gap was at 35 so I went up to 45...does this sound right? Tim Lynn "ToolMan-JeepBum" "It's a Jeep Thing" ICQ 21916084 75' J-10(in restoration-unnamed) 96' XJ(Skinny) 74' Wag(parts) 77' J-10(Bull-Dawg) 401/TH400, QT, 4" lift, MSD6T & billet dist., 32x11.5 AT's, tlynn-at-sheltonbbs.com

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------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 16:41:28 -0800 From: Thomas Anhalt Subject: fsj: Re: 20 mpg and indexing fsj-digest wrote: > Subject: fsj: Re: 20 mpg and indexing > > Went to Napa to ask for indexing washers and the only thing they came up > with was a spark plug gapper.... must have been the french accent. > > The speed shop had them.... but they were speed shop price... do you want to > know.... seize dollars en francais! $16.... > > My qs are, do you keep the original spark plug crush washer or toss it.... > and the electrode should be away from the intake? so as not to hide the > intake > I kept the crush washer....It's a lot easier to deform than the indexing washers and should form a good seal. The tech at Jacobs told me to set them so that the GAP was pointing to 11 o'clock as you're looking at the passenger side of the engine. He said he had just did a jeep engine the week before so I believed him just a little more than I normally believe techs. Later, Tom ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 12:56:38 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 13:31:09 -0600 A:How long did the motor run the time before you pulled the plugs? If it didn't run long enough to kick the choke off, that's normal. What's your mileage like? If it's under 14 mpg, then you're running rich. Tim Lynn wrote: Ok great list....I'm using all new MSD stuff and my new pluges got alot ofgreyish/black build up(carbon?)...the gap was at 35 so I went up to 45...does this sound right? Tim Lynn ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ JimBlair, Seattle,WA 1983 4.2L Chero 4dr http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html Pics: http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=13998&Auth=false ================================= ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 18:25:33 -0500 From: "Borowski, Paul" Subject: fsj: Spark nock Just got my GrandWagoneer back from having the Carb rebuilt and a new Catalytic Converter added. At last it passed the Emissions test, now to get my tag. During all this I was told that I needed to have a "Fuel Service" to deal with carbon build up in the top of the cylinders, that is causing spark nock. What is this? I was told to use a higher octane gas until I had this done, any suggestions? Thanks Paul ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 17:50:32 -0600 From: "Landon Tesar" Subject: fsj: Propane AC Hi, .......where it gets so cold that people who depend on LPG for home heating have problems... So, if I put one of these propane tanks in the back of the Wagoneer, and pump the propane through a radiator, and blow air across the radiator, do I have an air conditioner without a compressor ? Substitute 'heat exchanger' for radiator if desired. Double whammy to improve mileage ! Of concern here in TX. - - Landon '89 GW ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 16:41:56 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: I-6 /V-8 Induction systems/mileage woes Kim wrote: 1.Been there, done that! Saved by my triple thick skull [it really is!]. A: I got a basal skull fracture, my right eye pushed out of socket, and everything blown out of my left ear because I couldn't get out from under a lowered honda on axle stands fast enough in an earthquake. 3.I doo live in that kind of climate!. So in addition to a block heater, add a tank warmer? BTW who is a good source for the parts for a propane conversion? A: It used to be OHG (over the hill gang) but I've been out of the conversion trade for almost 6 years now, and it changes pretty fast! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ JimBlair, Seattle,WA 1983 4.2L Chero 4dr http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html Pics: http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=13998&Auth=false ================================= ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 21:03:03 EST From: OrigamiTB-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: Re: I-6/V-8 Induction systems/mileage woes In a message dated 00-02-21 13:11:23 EST, John asked: > would the offenhauser setup get better mileage than stock? I think that's part of the idea behind the Dual-Port manifold. My little Jeep got pretty good mileage (about 19mpg) considering the fire-breathing V-6 and the 5.38 diffy gears (albeit with 30-inch Armstrongs and a Warn overdrive). I set it up using Offy's recommendations regarding carburetor jets and power valve, and only had to richen the secondaries one size (I had the 4150 kit) in order to get it *perfect*. One thing that was disappointing was the "off-road" carburetor inlet needles & seats from Holley. The needles have little springs inside them, so they stay seated when the vehicle is bouncing around; but they made the engine run very lean on the road, and I could never get the float-level adjusted right with them installed. Maybe they required more fuel pressure than the stock pump could provide? ++ Cornel Ormsby ++ spending Stormy Monday indoors ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 19:02:47 PST From: "michel balea" Subject: fsj: Re: LPG follow up here is one of the best links http://www.wps.com/LPG/LPG-book-final.html You can even buy the book Michel 74 wag ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 18:29:34 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: QT clunking... At 01:36 PM 2/21/00 -0500, Angelo Lembo wrote: > > >John, > >I was viewing your page and thought you might be able to diagnose a problem >I'm having with my '79 J10. It has a QT transfer case. Every time I >accelerate or go uphill, there's a loud clunking noise and it appears that >the rear diff. turns upwards from the torque. It's fine once I'm at speed >but I get no traction anywhere else. Is this "stick slip" condition or >something else? > >Thanks for your help. > >Angelo Lembo >Cleveland, GA >axl-at-fngp.com Two things, no, three things I'd check out first before blaming this on slip-stick, or whatever the internal binding of the clutch cones is called... :) 1) Transmission mount 2) front driveshaft double cardan joints (if this breaks it'll tear up your tranny) 3) rear driveshaft u-joings. You could also have a bad motor mount. My first guess would be the transmission mount, 2nd would be a u-joint... and then possibly an engine mount... It sounds like something ain't anchored. I think slip stick occurs while turning a circle... One of the tricks with a Qt is to turn figure 8's every know and then to keep things working properly. BTW, if you do the figure 8's and it solves the clunking, then it probably was slip stick... :) hope this helps, john - ----------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com ...don't leave life without Jesus, please! Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... - ----------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 18:36:18 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: Yer j-truck Yep, an 83... I knew it was a sportside... but it's definetly not a honcho. The sport thing was an add on decal... only managed to get one t off on the passenger side... so it's now a Spor. ;) It doesn't have the honcho markings, never did, this is the original paint. There was an option to buy the sportside without the honcho option. They resumed stepsides in 81 and ended them in 84. They are pretty rare. I had a 65 townside I think they called the stepside back then... as oppposed to fleetside. ;) At 02:50 PM 2/21/00 EST, Brazzadog-at-aol.com wrote: >Is it an '83? I can't remember. I picked this up on the other list. Maybe >you shouldn't have scraped off the "Sport"? > >Ben > >In a message dated 2/20/2000 9:20:31 AM Pacific Standard Time, >owner-fsj-list-at-moab.off-road.com writes: > >> This would be a J-10 Honcho Sportside ("sportside" was Jeep's >> name for the stepside bed; the Gladiator version was the >> "thriftside"). In 1983 this was the only J-truck with a sportside bed, >> and the only Honcho. (In previous years, the Honcho could have >> either the sportside or townside bed.) >> >> The Honcho was pretty popular, so I don't know how rare these are, >> although they (or any stepside) aren't common around here, where >> pickups tend to be used as working trucks. >> >> Bill Kelsey >> Aberdeen, South Dakota >> '79 widetrack Cherokee "S" >> '78 4-door Cherokee "S" > - ----------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com ...don't leave life without Jesus, please! Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... - ----------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 18:31:33 -0800 From: john Subject: Re: fsj: Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 13:31:09 -0600 greyish/black is ok... black is too rich. tan is the color of choice if memory serves correctly... :) Upping the gap with a higher voltage system is the plan... john At 02:38 PM 2/21/00 -0500, TLynn wrote: >Ok great list....I'm using all new MSD stuff and my new pluges got alot >ofgreyish/black build up(carbon?)...the gap was at 35 so I went up to >45...does this sound right? > > >Tim Lynn >"ToolMan-JeepBum" >"It's a Jeep Thing" >ICQ 21916084 >75' J-10(in restoration-unnamed) >96' XJ(Skinny) >74' Wag(parts) >77' J-10(Bull-Dawg) 401/TH400, QT, 4" lift, MSD6T & billet dist., 32x11.5 >AT's, >tlynn-at-sheltonbbs.com > > >
> >
>Click to subscribe to 1FSJ >
> > > - ----------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com ...don't leave life without Jesus, please! Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... - ----------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 18:46:29 -0800 From: john Subject: Re: fsj: Spark nock You could just steam clean your engine by slowly and carefully pouring some water down the carb while it's running... trickle it in and watch all the crud exit the tail pipe... you'll be impressed. :) john At 06:25 PM 2/21/00 -0500, Borowski, Paul wrote: >Just got my GrandWagoneer back from having the Carb rebuilt and a new >Catalytic Converter added. At last it passed the Emissions test, now to get >my tag. > >During all this I was told that I needed to have a "Fuel Service" to deal >with carbon build up in the top of the cylinders, that is causing spark >nock. What is this? I was told to use a higher octane gas until I had this >done, any suggestions? > >Thanks >Paul > - ----------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com ...don't leave life without Jesus, please! Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... - ----------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 19:20:17 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: (sans sujet) (FRENCH Cherokee site) At 05:11 PM 2/21/00 EST, Cherokeelst-at-aol.com wrote: >I created a link on your site which is very rich. >You can register in the gallery with your FSJ. it would be well. for the=20 >model, type and year, you could inform me because I do not know much the= FSJ >Your website is tr=E9s very nice... > >Gilbert Mochot in France.. Thank you. I really like the image of the Cherokee on your page, very beautiful. I like the way the word Jeep follows the mouse pointer. BTW, the image is broken on your page. http://members.aol.com/cherokeelst/ (you named the file fsj-link-john.jpg I had originally named it fsj-link.jpg ) Where are you in France? I lived in Germany for five years and visited France a few times. Beautiful countryside. john - ----------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com ...don't leave life without Jesus, please! Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... - ----------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 19:29:32 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: Re: garage At 06:42 PM 2/21/00 PST, michel balea wrote: >So i am lucky, i have a concrete driveway where i did the thrust bearing, 2 >years ago.... in November. The neighbors were thrilled - they always inquire >when i am getting a new one, it has done its time... - with the absence of >hood, then the tarp when it rained. The garage just fit the wag, but then >you cannot open the doors nor the hood. > >i tried to index those spark plugs... rats. Luckily i only had 2 bad ones #1 >and #5, electrode by the intake valve... but those washer were sort of >useless. Any of the 3 sizes put it to the same relation to the intake valve, >so i had to stack 2 of them. Will see in the am. They were 0.026, 0.054, and >0.100 supposed to give you 105, 210 and 320 degree of play. > >Cheers >>Michel >74 wag I've got one of those dinky little garages... I couldn't even get my GMC Jimmy into the door when we bought the place... My neighbor has a little mustang, she can barely open the doors in there. :) I turned mine into an office/computer lab. I've got to do something about it... In fact, I'm gonna go outside and measure if I can add to the front of the one I have... :) john - ----------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com ...don't leave life without Jesus, please! Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... - ----------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 21:43:21 -0700 From: "Kim Smith" Subject: fsj: Re: Re: LPG follow up Thanks Michel! Great site, great info. The URL for the whole site is: http://www.wps.com/LPG/index.html#INDEX I think I've found the way I want to go. Now to save my pennies... let's see, rebuild 360 with 12:1 compression, install LPG conversion, etc.... kim '80 Wagoneer "J0E", 360 v2,T-727,NP219 - ----- Original Message ----- From: "michel balea" To: Sent: Monday, 21 February, 2000 20:02 Subject: fsj: Re: LPG follow up > here is one of the best links > > > http://www.wps.com/LPG/LPG-book-final.html > > > You can even buy the book > > > Michel > 74 wag > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 23:09:11 From: Saltsgavers Subject: Re: fsj: Re: garage I am SOooooo glad to finally have 2 huge garages now to work on stuff. I've got the J-10 in one of them now as I try to fix the tranny (finally pulled the xfer case out tonight & the governor doesn't really seem to be stuck.....I'll now for sure tomorrow night). So far I've not found any broken parts....the bands are ok & no "chunks" of sprag clutch in the pan. The only other thing I can think of is a stuck valve in the valve body......never had that happen before, but it's possible I guess. The down side is since we've not started the complete move yet, only about half of my tools are at the new place.......you guessed it, whenever I need something, it's at the other place (about 20 miles away). I've got 8 buildings & 1 large old barn. It'll take years for me to fill them all up. One of them is a tall 45 x 45 morton building. I'd like to build a balcony in it to take advantage of the tall roof. We should be moving in the next few weeks & I'll be off line while we get our new phone lines & net provider. Mike S. At 07:29 PM 2/21/00 -0800, john wrote: >At 06:42 PM 2/21/00 PST, michel balea wrote: >>So i am lucky, i have a concrete driveway where i did the thrust bearing, 2 >>years ago.... in November. The neighbors were thrilled - they always inquire >>when i am getting a new one, it has done its time... - with the absence of >>hood, then the tarp when it rained. The garage just fit the wag, but then >>you cannot open the doors nor the hood. >> >>i tried to index those spark plugs... rats. Luckily i only had 2 bad ones #1 >>and #5, electrode by the intake valve... but those washer were sort of >>useless. Any of the 3 sizes put it to the same relation to the intake valve, >>so i had to stack 2 of them. Will see in the am. They were 0.026, 0.054, and >>0.100 supposed to give you 105, 210 and 320 degree of play. >> >>Cheers >>>Michel >>74 wag > >I've got one of those dinky little garages... I couldn't even get >my GMC Jimmy into the door when we bought the place... My neighbor >has a little mustang, she can barely open the doors in there. :) > >I turned mine into an office/computer lab. > >I've got to do something about it... In fact, I'm gonna go outside >and measure if I can add to the front of the one I have... :) > >john >----------------------------------------------------- > john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com > ...don't leave life without Jesus, please! > Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... >----------------------------------------------------- > > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 21:56:55 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: is the starter supposed to do this?? A: Sounds to me like the tranny shop bent the flexplate. (I did once, before I knew better) I have bent them back with vice grips but they aren't perfect. Tacoma=A0White wrote: I had the tranny rebuilt a few months ago, and when I got it back, noticed A. a ticking or rattling noise emanating from the area of the flexplate... (not a cracked flexplate, I watched them put the nice new one in, the old one WAS cracked.) and B. a very random grinding coming from the starter, as if it werent' engaging fully.A few tries and it would work right. I finally got some free time to check it out, and this is what I found. Ring gear is fine... a few spots on the forward face looked rubbed but not sure if it's old or not, as I never had reason to look before today...... The starter shows minor wear, but no bad rounding or anything. While I had it out, I checked it's operation, works fine. I did notice that the gear is free to push forward (towards the nose of the vehicle) for some reason. My GM starters do not share this feature. I had my wife come out and start the truck (breaking several safety rules at once hahah-- truck had 2 whls on a curb in case it took off though....) while I was under it and what I found was this: when the starter made this grinding noise, the teeth didn't appear to be touching the ring gear. No amount of shimming or manipulation seemed to remedy this. Also, the gear would move in or out a little and after a second stop spinning entirely-- so it couldn't have been touching the ring gear. =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0so-- new starter and everything is fine, or strange starter and some crazy Jeep trick??? =A0 =A0 I'm inclined ot say that starter is a little screwy, but I don't really know about Ford..uhmmm I meant Jeep starters. =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0any and all help is appreciated! Thanks in advance. in UT Tacoma ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ JimBlair, Seattle,WA 1983 4.2L Chero 4dr http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html Pics: http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=3D13998&Auth=3Dfalse =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 03:40:43 -0500 From: Michael Baxter Subject: fsj: 84 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 360 2v HP/torque Brazzadog-at-aol.com writes: >> So does the skirt keep the piston straight in the bore by acting as a counter balance or through actual contact with the cylinder? Seems like= that kind of contact would be a bad thing. That must be why the bore is more scuffed on the passenger side. I guess I answered my own question. = Doesn't seem like a very elegant solution. << Yup, you figured it out. The skirt makes contact with the cylinder wall from time to time. And it isn't very elegant but, in 100 years no one has= come-up with a better solution. There were a lot of people and Mazda to name one company who thought the rotary was the answer. Be interesting if= someone takes another crack at the rotary using today's technology. I believe all of its shortcomings were solved except for efficiency. Michael Baxter, MBaxter-at-Compuserve.com-OR-N7OVD-at-arrl.net http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/MBaxter From Reno, NV USA on 21-Feb-2000 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 03:40:42 -0500 From: Michael Baxter Subject: fsj: 20 mpg and indexing "michel balea" writes: >> My qs are, do you keep the original spark plug crush washer or toss it.... and the electrode should be away from the intake? so as not to hid= e the intake << Michel, Keep the crush washer. Make a mark on the insulator which corresponds to the direction the electrode points. Monkey around with shi= ms until you get the electrode pointing towards the exhaust valve. Michael Baxter, MBaxter-at-Compuserve.com-OR-N7OVD-at-arrl.net http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/MBaxter From Reno, NV USA on 21-Feb-2000 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 08:15:33 -0500 From: "B. COLUCCI" Subject: fsj: ANother Stash Of Parts Greetings To The FSJ World! Just received an E-Mail from Dr. Sam Wallace, "Old list member before his FSJ became a "carbique".) Anyway he found this site that looks like an interesting place. He tells me that they have some old 70's "Chero." bodies still in crates. Check it out for yourself. http://www.willysoverland.com/index.html Until The Next Dimension, Admiral "Coluch." ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 08:40:10 -0500 From: "B. COLUCCI" Subject: fsj: Feel The Power Greetings To The FSJ World! There was just nothing left. The original MOPAR battery that came with my 88 Dodge D150 finally just would not turn over the starter anymore. So I figure that 12 years was a decent service life. It just goes to show the quality of Chrysler products!!!!! (Our FSJ's are now part of this fine lineage; however I frequently remind the USS GW that it was an adopted child into the Chrysler family. This explains its tendency to have things regularly malfunction. OH I'm off subject again. Anyway I had seen an article in the Feb. 2000 issue of Popular Mechanics, on page 42 for a new battery offering by the Excide Company. So I went to the local parts store to pick one of these new batteries up. They are not cheap; mine was $99 on sale. This battery called the Orbital Select has a lot of special feature that make it different. - 84 month warranty -- 2 year no deductible replacement - 888 Cold cranking AMPS - Multiple top and side terminals to make your hook up life easier. & - No water or acid! According to the fellow at the parts store, he had just attended a class on these new batteries. The instructor with no explanation walks into the class and picks up the battery off of the table, and throws it at the concrete block wall. Then he walks over and picks up the battery and says, "relax there is no acid in this battery." Then he conducts the class using that same battery for all of his demonstrations. So it was a real working battery. Well this battery in the big Dodge is fabulous! I can not wait to get one in a few years for the USS GW. Mandatory FSJ content. It is good to have the big Dodge running again; it makes trips to the parts store for the USS GW easier. - -- Brian Colucci Operations Manager Magic Garden Products Company Kettering, Ohio (937)-433-2443 ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #745 *************************