From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Mon Mar 20 20:48:13 2000 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Monday, March 20 2000 Volume 01 : Number 783 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: fsj: Re: QT vs. DANA 20 fsj: 2 FSJs are better than 1...right? fsj: that 77 Wagoneer... fsj: Advice Re: fsj: Advice Re: fsj: Advice fsj: RE: H-4 bulb discussion... fsj: jeep dealership Re: fsj: Re: QT vs. DANA 20 fsj: QT vs. DANA 20 fsj: Nice '90 GW for sale in Portland, OR on eBay fsj: Why you should always double-check your shop's work. fsj: Underhood insulation Re: fsj: jeep dealership Re: fsj: Underhood insulation fsj: Master cylinder Re: fsj: Underhood insulation FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 09:58:27 -0800 From: Thunderbird Subject: Re: fsj: Re: QT vs. DANA 20 Jamie.L.Phillips-at-us.ul.com wrote: > > Correct me if I am wrong. (making a few assumptions here) > > Doesn't the Quadra Trac transfer case use a band/chain while the DANA 20 > uses all gears? QT has chain D20 ? > Didn't this have something to do with the differentiation between the front > and rear wheel? huh? > The Quadra Trac was designed for full time four wheel drive, no 4 Hi, 4Lo > or 2 Hi. Some(all ?)did have a button/knob that allowed locking of > differentiation between the front and rear axles. No 2wd 4Hi 4Lo optional > Quadra Trac Vehicles, since they were full time 4WD, didn't have locking > hubs up front. Did vehicles with the DANA 20 have locking hubs? If so, > would this cause problems with swapping between the Quadra Trac and DANA > 20s? only from QT to D20. From D20 to QT...just keep them locked. > My J-4600 is automatic transmission with the Quadra Trac. The differential > in the rear axle is centered, but I have seen Wagoneers of the same year > (?) that had the rear differential off center. I wasn't able to crawl > under and take a look, but what is the deal on that? If you have a BW QT it was swapped in. They didn't come out until '74. The drive shafts both output to the side on the BW QT. I believe the NP QT (from the 80's) was center rear output. is there a noticable angle in the driveshaft? > Sorry to revisit this issue but I'm not sure what the final answer was on > the Quadra Trac Fluid. (Source) > Is it on the tech page? > > I also have a line on "NEW ORIGINAL EQUIPMENT TURBO 400 HYDROMATIC > TRANSMISSION WITH > CONVERTER... NEVER BEEN INSTALLED" > > Is it worth while to buy this as a back up to what I already have? What is > it worth? A rebuild will run you around $200-300 (or more depending on location) if you pull it. consider the value of not being without your truck for the duration of a rebuild and having to get it to the trany shop. What is it worth to you? Brian 78 J10-4 4bbl/360/TH400/PTQT/D44/D44 97 Thunderbird LX 4.6 V8/Sport "Four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo - use in that order." - --Ed Howdershelt ______________________________________________________ Get your free web-based email at http://www.xoom.com Birthday? Anniversary? Send FREE animated greeting cards for any occasion at http://greetings.xoom.com ------------------------------ Date: 20 Mar 00 14:20:46 MST From: Michael Shimniok Subject: fsj: 2 FSJs are better than 1...right? Well, I'd been planning it for some time, talking to the guy, and finally= cut the check and got the keys Saturday. I'm now the proud owner of a 1985 G= rand Wagoneer, my first being an 86 which I've been building and fixing since 1997. The new FSJ is charcoal metallic with woodgrain, wine interior, stock gold-n-silver aluminum wheels, 3" exhaust with flowmaster, recurved distributor, Warn premium locking hubs, NP229, 360 2v, D44/AMC20 with 3.3= 1's, 2" add-a-leaf lift, RS9000s, and 31" BFG AT's. 125k on the clock and it = still runs 30psi idle, 60psi highway and runs and accelerates real well which i= s a big change from the shot motor in my 86. TF 727 tranny is real crisp too= (unlike the other truck). Only problems are steering and brakes, minor electrical problems, and a q= uirky carb. Got some Raybestos superstop pads for it today and will get a stee= ring stabilizer and look into front end work and p/s box adjustment in the nea= r future. I got it from a fellow CFSJA member. Real nice ride. My game plan is to= make this my reliable, daily driver and pinch-hitter trail rig for the next 6-= 12 months while I build up my other truck to a decent level of performance a= nd reliability for on and off road. It's a fun truck! Drove it all over Denver metro this past weekend lovin= g every minute of it and drove it to work in the freezing rain/snow we're h= aving in Denver today... Michael - --- Michael E. Shimniok - KC0EKI - Michael.Shimniok-at-usa.net "For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong." - H. L. Menken ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=3D= 1 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 13:35:25 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: that 77 Wagoneer... ...turns out I'm gonna trade back into it and then sell it. He's gonna bring it back Sunday. I'm still on the title so it's not a problem. It's running good, I'll fix up the few odds and ends to make sure. I may even run it through emissions and put tabs on it so it's easier to sell. It's got dual tanks, rear carrier, new carb, and so on... QT, TH400, 360-4v. I'm gonna be asking $1,500 for it. I'm trading close to 2,500 worth of computer equipment for it... :) john - ----------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com ...don't leave life without Jesus, please! Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... - ----------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 16:49:41 -0500 From: "Borowski, Paul" Subject: fsj: Advice Fixed the spark-nock and the 88 GrandWagoneer is running great. Now looking at upgrading the lights, it has the stock headlights and no fog/running lights and it needs a rear roof light. Any suggestions to what would be the best combination of headlights and running lights to add? Thanks Paul > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net]On > Behalf Of Kim > Smith > Sent: Monday, March 06, 2000 5:51 PM > To: FSJ > Subject: fsj: Re: Salvage Yards :-( > > > This may be off the wall, but what size brakes and what lug > pattern did > those M-715 's use? Boyce Equipment > > http://www.boyceequipment.com/index.html > > has all kinds of mondo HD mil-surplus stuff. > > kim > '80 Wagoneer "J0E", 360 v2,T-727,NP219 > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Jamie.L.Phillips-at-us.ul.com > To: fsj-at-digest.net > Sent: Monday, 06 March, 2000 13:56 > Subject: fsj: Salvage Yards :-( > > > Well, I went looking for axles for my J-4000 this weekend. > (swap or just > brake backing plates) > > I must say it was a rather frustrating experience. > > The first place I went to I had called in advance to see if > they had any > Jeep Trucks and had been told yes. When I arrived, I told the person > behind the counter I was looking for parts for a Jeep Truck , > they just > said (in broken English) "Jeep, Truck????" > > I said, "Yes, a Jeep Truck...". > > It went down hill from there until he said, "No, we don't have any of > those." > > The next place I went I had a little more luck. No trucks, > but a couple of > Wagoneers to look at atleast. > > > > I have been hoping to find a Dana 53 axle to get the backing > plates for my > '73 J-4000. I am starting to think this axle was only used > on Jeep Trucks > before my '73 though and I am starting to have doubts of ever > finding one. > > I have also been considering swaping axles with something > else. The main > thing holding me back on this is that I have never swaped > axles before and > the cost. (is $250 an axle/transfer case usual?) > > I am not sure what to look for/check/measure to make sure > different axles > would work before dropping a load of cash and getting it > partially bolted > on before finding out it either wont work or it will cost > another load of > cash to get it to work. > > Any suggestions? > > > Later, > Jamie "I've got the 12" x 2" brake drum blues...." Phillips > > '73 J-4000 > '77 F250 > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 13:55:11 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: Advice A: I have a set of factory fog lights (1 lens was broken) with brackets and dash switch for $30. As for the headlights, I suggest the Sylvania? Xtravision lights. I still have the stockers in Elmo, but I will be switching up when I have time and $. Fortunately, I see well in the dark and my blue blockers work well in the fog! Paul wrote: Fixed the spark-nock and the 88 GrandWagoneer is running great. Now looking at upgrading the lights, it has the stock headlights and no fog/running lights and it needs a rear roof light. Any suggestions to what would be the best combination of headlights and running lights to add? Thanks Paul ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 14:00:59 -0800 From: john Subject: Re: fsj: Advice that's a great price on the foglights... I paid about $100 for mine at Olympic a couple years ago... I'd recommend the IPF conversions, the lens quality is phenomenal. If you can't find/afford the IPF then hellas or bosch are fine, either way, the H4 bulb set is so much better than what you can find at the parts store. john At 01:55 PM 3/20/00 -0800, James Blair wrote: >A: I have a set of factory fog lights (1 lens was broken) with brackets >and dash switch for $30. As for the headlights, I suggest the Sylvania? >Xtravision lights. I still have the stockers in Elmo, but I will be >switching up when I have time and $. Fortunately, I see well in the dark >and my blue blockers work well in the fog! > >Paul wrote: >Fixed the spark-nock and the 88 GrandWagoneer is running great. Now >looking at upgrading the lights, it has the stock headlights and no >fog/running lights and it needs a rear roof light. Any suggestions to >what would be the best combination of headlights and running lights to >add? >Thanks >Paul > > - ----------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com ...don't leave life without Jesus, please! Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... - ----------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 14:03:09 -0800 From: john Subject: fsj: RE: H-4 bulb discussion... At 02:56 PM 3/20/00 -0700, bradley.a.berry-at-lmco.com wrote: >John, > >Are these complete sealed beams, or would I need to retrofit a set of lenses >onto the Jeep which would take these bulbs? > They are lens that use H4 bulbs, so you can vary the wattage. They are not sealed beams. Hey, did you know I'll be down in your area April 15 through the 22nd? Heading down for an HP Linux class in Orlando... :) I'll be hanging out in Apopka with my folks Sat/Sun, gonna meet up with Doc that weekend, then class mon - wed. Thur/Fri and part of sat visit with my folks and maybe go over to Melbourne to see my sister. john >Brad >88 GW in the thriving metropolis of Titusville, almost in between Orlando >and Melbourne... > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: john [SMTP:john-at-virtual-cafe.com] >> Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2000 6:36 PM >> To: xj-list; full size jeep list >> Subject: fsj: H-4 bulb discussion... >> >> I'm late to respond. >> >> I'm running two different sets of the IPF bulbs, the marine blue in the >> little wagoneer, nice white crisp light, but not a lot of intensity. >> What is cool is when you turn off the lights they glow blue for about 10 >> minutes. >> Paul's kid really got a kick out of 'em Sunday night... >> >> The other set I'm running are the H4-83T, Super Jey Beam bulbs. >> They are rated at 12V 60/55W but produce 110/90 Watts of >> equivalent light. They do not require an upgrade to the wiring harness and >> >> provide an incredible amount of light over standard halogen lamp. >> >> Very, very nice... I recommend them highly. >> >> >> I'm gonna be installing the IPF headlight harness and playing around with >> brighter bulbs... will be writing it up... Parts due in in April. :) >> >> john >> >> ---- >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> john-at-wagoneers.com **** http://wagoneers.com >> don't leave life without Jesus, please... >> Snohomish, Washington USA >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> >> > - ----------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com ...don't leave life without Jesus, please! Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... - ----------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 15:55:27 -0600 From: "TLynn" Subject: fsj: jeep dealership If anyone is close to DesMoines Iowa, and may be able to help clearing out an old Jeep Dealership of there parts stock(helpers get choice picks) please call me at work at 870-762-5500 ext. 519 after 6:00 pm central. Tim Lynn "ToolMan-JeepBum" "It's a Jeep Thing" ICQ 21916084 75' J-10(in restoration-unnamed) 96' XJ(Skinny) 74' Wag(parts) 77' J-10(Bull-Dawg) 401/TH400, QT, 4" lift, MSD6T & billet dist., 32x11.5 AT's, tlynn-at-sheltonbbs.com

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------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 14:07:02 -0800 (PST) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: Re: QT vs. DANA 20 A: The QT is chain drive full time (okay for dry pavement except in Edrive). The D20 is part time gear drive (with the hubs locked, it's like Edrive in a QT) The D20 is direct drive with no difference or slippage between the front and rear. Is the New TH400 Chev or Jeep? I have a good used Chev TH400 I just posted for $200. Jamie wrote: Correct me if I am wrong. (making a few assumptions here) Doesn't the Quadra Trac transfer case use a band/chain while the DANA 20 uses all gears? Didn't this have something to do with the differentiation between the front and rear wheel? The Quadra Trac was designed for full time four wheel drive, no 4 Hi, 4Lo or 2 Hi. Some(all ?)did have a button/knob that allowed locking of differentiation between the front and rear axles. Quadra Trac Vehicles, since they were full time 4WD, didn't have locking hubs up front. Did vehicles with the DANA 20 have locking hubs? If so, would this cause problems with swapping between the Quadra Trac and DANA 20s? My J-4600 is automatic transmission with the Quadra Trac. The differential in the rear axle is centered, but I have seen Wagoneers of the same year (?) that had the rear differential off center. I wasn't able to crawl under and take a look, but what is the deal on that? Sorry to revisit this issue but I'm not sure what the final answer was on the Quadra Trac Fluid. (Source) Is it on the tech page? I also have a line on "NEW ORIGINAL EQUIPMENT TURBO 400 HYDROMATIC TRANSMISSION WITH CONVERTER... NEVER BEEN INSTALLED" Is it worth while to buy this as a back up to what I already have? What is it worth? Later, Jamie Phillips ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 20:41:08 -0500 From: Michael Baxter Subject: fsj: QT vs. DANA 20 Jamie.L.Phillips-at-us.ul.com writes: >> Doesn't the Quadra Trac transfer case use a band/chain while the DANA 20 uses all gears? << Yes Jamie. >> Didn't this have something to do with the differentiation between the front and rear wheel? The Quadra Trac was designed for full time four wheel drive, no 4 Hi, 4Lo= or 2 Hi. Some(all ?)did have a button/knob that allowed locking of differentiation between the front and rear axles. << The BW Q-T's modes are 4 Hi, 4 Hi lock and if equip'd with the low range unit (which bolts on the back of the case) it has 4 Lo and 4 Lo lock. Mos= t had the low range unit. Of course, lock mode is achieved with the E-Drive= switch in the glove box. The only way to get 2 Lo with the Q-T is to convert it to a part-time case using the Milemarker conversion kit. The BW Q-T utilizes a cone type limited-slip differential when not in E-Drive. >> Quadra Trac Vehicles, since they were full time 4WD, didn't have locking hubs up front. Did vehicles with the DANA 20 have locking hubs? = If so, would this cause problems with swapping between the Quadra Trac an= d DANA 20s? << It's easy to install manual hubs on the Q-T equip'd vehicles if convertin= g to a D-20 or converting the Q-T to part time. If an unconverted Q-T has hubs, they must be locked all the time unless the E-Drive is engaged. >> My J-4600 is automatic transmission with the Quadra Trac. The differential in the rear axle is centered, but I have seen Wagoneers of t= he same year (?) that had the rear differential off center. I wasn't able t= o crawl under and take a look, but what is the deal on that? << The J-trucks rear diffs. are offset to the passenger side somewhat as well from at least '73-'79. Since your J-20 has a Q-T, it should be offse= t too. It is just not obvious. The pre Q-T Wag's (pre-'73) are offset to th= e passenger side but, not as much as the '73-'79s were. The D-20 is not as "civilized" as the Q-T or any of the later NP cases. It only has a 2.03 reduction where the Q-T has a 2.57 reduction. At some point in a D-20's life it will start to pop-out of a particular range and= once this starts, it seems your in for a rebuild every few years from the= n on. If your Q-T is healthy, I recommend keeping it for the time being. There may come a time when you'll want to swap because some Q-T parts are= discontinued (mainly the sun gear) and no one has picked-up the slack in the aftermarket. I'm hoping Crown will start making the sun gear since th= ey support the Q-T with many parts already. >> Sorry to revisit this issue but I'm not sure what the final answer was= on the Quadra Trac Fluid. (Source) << - ------------------------------------------------------------------ FORWARDED MESSAGE - Orig: 29-Jun-96 06:37 Subject: Reply to: Re: Quadra Trac Fluid substitute From: Rich Holley INTERNET:RichHolley-at-aol.com To: Michael Baxter MBaxter-at-Compuserve.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------ Hi guys, sorry it has taken me so long to find the info on the QT replacement fluid, but here it is: The fluid is manufactured by Crown Automotive Sales company. They packag= e it under part number 8133854. It is called TCL-1, and is available at mo= st 4x4 shops that carry Crown products. Hope this helps... rich END I'll add that a lot of Jeep dealers carry Crown now as well. Michael Baxter, MBaxter-at-Compuserve.com-OR-N7OVD-at-arrl.net http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/MBaxter From Reno, NV USA on 20-Mar-2000 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 16:36:49 -0800 From: Clark Novak Subject: fsj: Nice '90 GW for sale in Portland, OR on eBay Check this one out! The mileage is up there (150k), but the thing looks great. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=288525262 Clark Novak 87 GW ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:48:14 -0800 From: Clark Novak Subject: fsj: Why you should always double-check your shop's work. Well, here's another reason why you should get underneath the hood after you get work done... I was replacing my cap, rotor & wires yesterday when I noticed a couple of weird things. over near the starter relay, there was a disconnected wire hanging from the harness. I traced it and found that the other end should have been connected to my AC compressor... Apparently when my shop replaced my water pump and heater hoses, they disconnected the compressor to work around the top heater hose better. And left it that way. Here I've been without AC for six months and thought the system was discharged, when really it was just sloppy work :) Not a bad surprise, I suppose. But from now on I'm making sure I double check everything. BTW, I changed The Judge over to a Ford-style cap and rotor, for a 460 engine. Combined with new 8mm Accel wires, it's an amazing performance boost! Clark Novak 87 GW ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 18:59:27 -0800 From: Clark Novak Subject: fsj: Underhood insulation Hey John, when you did the hood insulation for Superdawg, did you get die-cut pads, or did you use the cut-it-yourself stuff? Clark 87 GW ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 22:18:10 EST From: UrbFarmer-at-aol.com Subject: Re: fsj: jeep dealership When is this going down? I'm in Chicago but trying to buy a '77 J-10 back home in Iowa. I might be able to make a business trip and combine pleasure if it seems right. Drove right through Des Moines on I-80 with Rez just about 2 weeks ago. - --Vince '81 Wag (Rez Runner) In a message dated 3/20/00 4:03:15 PM Central Standard Time, tlynn-at-sheltonbbs.com writes: > If anyone is close to DesMoines Iowa, and may be able to help clearing out > an old Jeep Dealership of there parts stock(helpers get choice picks) please > call me at work at 870-762-5500 ext. 519 after 6:00 pm central. > > Tim Lynn > "ToolMan-JeepBum" > "It's a Jeep Thing" > ICQ 21916084 > 75' J-10(in restoration-unnamed) > 96' XJ(Skinny) > 74' Wag(parts) > 77' J-10(Bull-Dawg) 401/TH400, QT, 4" lift, MSD6T & billet dist., 32x11.5 > AT's, > tlynn-at-sheltonbbs.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 22:34:36 -0600 From: John Stevens Subject: Re: fsj: Underhood insulation Stand another dumb question? My underhood insulation is lying on the floor of my garage. Any reason to reinstall it? If issue is paint preservation, forget about it...my clearcoat shed like a lizard skin and the basecoat faded to black (originally blue). If there's a purpose let me know, please. Also, what adhesive is recommended? Thanks to all who helped me diagnose a sloppy steering problem in my '90 GW. Tried the simple stuff first, adjusting the steering box, tie rod ends, steering stabilizer. Ended up replacing the steering box and ball joints (upper and lower) to finally get it right. I've had it done for a while, finally got around to thanking all that offerred their thoughts.. Clark Novak wrote: > Hey John, when you did the hood insulation for Superdawg, did you get > die-cut pads, or did you use the cut-it-yourself stuff? > > Clark > 87 GW ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 23:36:06 EST From: Brazzadog-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: Master cylinder Anybody know what, if any, difference there might be between a '74 and '79 Wagoneer master cylinder? Ben Williams '71 Wagoneer '78 F-250 4x4 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 20:43:19 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: fsj: Underhood insulation On Mon, 20 Mar 2000, John Stevens wrote: >-->Stand another dumb question? My underhood insulation is lying on the >-->floor of my garage. Any reason to reinstall it? If issue is paint >-->preservation, forget about it...my clearcoat shed like a lizard skin and >-->the basecoat faded to black (originally blue). If there's a purpose let >-->me know, please. Also, what adhesive is recommended? helps it run quieter... holds the heat after running... I got the adhesive from jc whitney when I bought the insulation. >--> >-->Clark Novak wrote: >--> >-->> Hey John, when you did the hood insulation for Superdawg, did you get >-->> die-cut pads, or did you use the cut-it-yourself stuff? nah, I bought the big roll, glued it in place and cut it off, then tucked the edges under the hood support... john >-->> >-->> Clark >-->> 87 GW >--> >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-wagoneers.com **** http://wagoneers.com don't leave life without Jesus, please... Snohomish, Washington USA - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #783 *************************