From owner-fsj-digest-at-digest.net Wed May 10 15:50:59 2000 From: fsj-digest fsj-digest Wednesday, May 10 2000 Volume 01 : Number 844 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: color update... fsj: Re: an idea... fsj: Re:My Life in Hell fsj: $200.00 Wag in Witchita Re: [fsj: color update...] Re: fsj: $200.00 Wag in Witchita Re: fsj: Re:My Life in Hell Re: fsj: Oddities on the Wagoneer Re: fsj: Re: msg to the jeep nut: vacuum and juice fsj: Wiper Problem Re: fsj: Track Bar issues Re: fsj: Wiper Problem Re: fsj: Re: msg to the jeep nut: vacuum and juice fsj: Anyone need a tilt steering column? fsj: FRONT GRILL, DURABAK, ETC... FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 13:59:48 -0700 From: john Subject: fsj: color update... thanx michael for your comments on color... believe it or not the wife says "Black Cherry"... whatever that is. I think she liked the looks of Jim's Black J10... even though it has a rougher body than mine even... You can see the parts of the interior that have the copper brown metallic on it... under the windows, windshield posts, door jambs... : http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/J10s/johns-83-Stepside/interior/j10s-interior-pass- 00jan1.jpg Anyway... I may be changing the door panels to nutmeg as well. Having a light colored hood presents some challenges when the sun comes out though... :) We're not used to bright lights up here and having any kind of sunshine reflecting off that big old hood will blind me... ;) So, anybody know what color Black Cherry is? :) Sheesh... not sure I want to go with a dark color... oh, btw, Tan, Beige, Taupe and so on are ok... I was thinking the tan that jeep used, it's pretty bad... silver/gray maybe... I'm not into celery color or teal... I guess I'll know it when I see it. Black does look good on these trucks, but I'm afraid that it'll not only show every speck of dust, but every imperfection in the body... john - ------------------------------------------------------------- http://www.WAGONEERS.com/johnsjeeps.jpg SuperDawg, SuperPup (the little wagoneer), and the J3000 ...don't leave life without Jesus, please! Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... ------- ...be thou neither a sender nor a receiver of attachments... ...if thou usest a microsoft operating system or email program... ------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 17:18:26 EDT From: Brazzadog-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: Re: an idea... > Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 09:19:43 -0700 > From: john (snip) > Any thoughts, ideas or stuff for sale? ;) I've got a '71 grill I don't need. > FWIW, I get email from other places in the world where folks are > looking for older rigs to export. Not to mention the need for > various parts. I've been contacted by a few folks from Holland about my '71. Near as I can tell, they're all looking for $2000 pristine FSJs that they can drive across North America before they ship it home. Seems their gov't is subsidizing gross polluters or some such. If you find anybody who wants to give me $10K for my Wag, send them this way. Ben Williams '71 Wagoneer '78 F-250 4x4 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 17:59:27 -0400 From: M Subject: fsj: Re:My Life in Hell > Subject: fsj: My life in Hell Jim, Your comments cause me concern for you. The cryptic nature of your words says a lot about the difficulties you are experiencing. While one man's pain is not necessarily another man's consolation, do keep in mind that many of us out here have gone through times that most others would find hard to believe. Most importantly we have survived one way or another, maybe even thrived after a while. At this time you should know we are thinking of you, those of us not nearby helpless to assist from a distance, but we are sending you best wishes to find perspective, to retain your equilibrium and to remember there is light ahead through whatever belief system you have. I can only say hang in there, let some time clear your mind and let you see the problem clearly. Find your strength and use it. Lots of folks from your family to the FSJ family care about you as a person and are here for you as you might need. Mike 89GW > It appears that things have decided to get worse. My son is doing okay, > but the rest of my life has fallen apart. I probably won't even be > online much anymore or for very long looks like I may even move back to > Canada ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 15:00:26 -0700 From: Clark Novak Subject: fsj: $200.00 Wag in Witchita Recently listed on eBay... this guys has a '75 Wagoneer "kit." Body over here... motor over there... you haul it and mate the two: but it's only at $135 right now. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/ebayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=325939602& r=0&t=0 ...tempted? :) Clark Novak ------------------------------ Date: 9 May 00 17:02:49 MDT From: Michael Shimniok Subject: Re: [fsj: color update...] john wrote: >... > You can see the parts of the interior that have the copper > brown metallic on it... under the windows, windshield posts, > door jambs... : Huh, interesting color scheme, never seen a dash in that lighter tan colo= r before. I would think about doing some interior trim detail work using t= he exterior color. Maybe the tops of the doors and window frames, and maybe= a stripe or design below dash on that continuous strip. Might lend some continuity to the interior/exterior. Just a thought. Maybe too much of = a PITA to do. :) > Having a light colored hood presents some challenges when the sun > comes out though... :) We're not used to bright lights up here > and having any kind of sunshine reflecting off that big old hood > will blind me... ;) I know what you mean. The black cherry should help. I'm picturing it as= an extremely dark red. Like, the red equivalent of navy blue. You could pu= t some kind of dark graphic/stripe/block of color on the hood maybe. > pretty bad... silver/gray maybe... I'm not into celery color > or teal... I guess I'll know it when I see it. Yup, now you're talking. :) > Black does look good on these trucks, but I'm afraid that it'll > not only show every speck of dust, but every imperfection in the > body... Yup, sure will. Like any real dark color. The other problem with dark c= olors (as opposed to black) is that they all get mistaken for black. Two guys = in the group have very dark colored rigs, one navy blue, the other = super dark green, but both look black from 10' away. Ok, I just had this insane inspiration How about if you paint it a light= er tan/beige color, and use black and dark red and form a northwest territor= ies style native american design on the hood vaguely similar to the Jeep gold= en eagle. It'd be perfect for your locale, pays homage to the Jeep traditio= n, and would give you some huge blocks of dark color on the hood, would be p= retty unique and... maybe... would look cool. If only it were cheap, too. :) = Something like these: http://www.blacktusk.ca/artists/artwork/Tony_Hunt_Eagle.htm http://www.blacktusk.ca/artists/artwork/Heber_Reece_Raven.htm Michael - --- Michael E. Shimniok - KC0EKI - Michael.Shimniok-at-usa.net "For every complex problem, there is a solution that is simple, neat, and wrong." - H. L. Menken ____________________________________________________________________ Get free email and a permanent address at http://www.netaddress.com/?N=3D= 1 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 18:36:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: $200.00 Wag in Witchita A: Only trouble is, I'm not in Kansas, Toto! Besides, I like '80 and newer frame/axle setups! Clark Novak wrote: Recently listed on eBay... this guys has a '75 Wagoneer "kit." Body over here... motor over there... you haul it and mate the two: but it's only at $135 right now. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/ebayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=325939602&; r=0&t=0 ...tempted? :) Clark Novak ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ JimBlair, Seattle,WA 1983 4.2L Chero 4dr http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html Now appearing on allexperts.com Pics: http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=13998&Auth=false ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 May 2000 18:45:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: Re:My Life in Hell A: Last night I was soooo stressed over my son and lack of sleep, plus money worries that when I got that letter I kind of went off the deep end. When she came home from work we talked, and although we will be going our seperate ways, there is no animosity. We are going to sell the house, pay all our creditors, and maybe then she will be relaxed enough to start having a real relationship again. Mike wrote: Jim, Your comments cause me concern for you. The cryptic nature of your words says a lot about the difficulties you are experiencing. While one man's pain is not necessarily another man's consolation, do keep in mind that many of us out here have gone through times that most others would find hard to believe. Most importantly we have survived one way or another, maybe even thrived after a while. At this time you should know we are thinking of you, those of us not nearby helpless to assist from a distance, but we are sending you best wishes to find perspective, to retain your equilibrium and to remember there is light ahead through whatever belief system you have. I can only say hang in there, let some time clear your mind and let you see the problem clearly. Find your strength and use it. Lots of folks from your family to the FSJ family care about you as a person and are here for you as you might need. Mike 89GW It appears that things have decided to get worse. My son is doing okay, but the rest of my life has fallen apart. I probably won't even be online much anymore or for very long looks like I may even move back to Canada ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ JimBlair, Seattle,WA 1983 4.2L Chero 4dr http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html Now appearing on allexperts.com Pics: http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=13998&Auth=false ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 22:39:43 -0500 From: jeepnut Subject: Re: fsj: Oddities on the Wagoneer Thanks for the tips Mr. Black. Interesting call re: the humidity. It has been more humid in the mornings as well these past few weeks... spring, wet weather and all... Good tip about the distributor cap, I will check that just as a matter of course... good idea... And I suspect as you say that the carb will be/is due and is as likely as anything else as the cause for all I know. I've got an FSM so that's a big help. Having never been inside a carb, the detail there is nice. Not so sure I'm gonna jump right into that yet though I probably should. Steve Lett aka JeepNut Dan Black wrote: > jeepnut said: > {- Sitting at a light, once in a while, or sometimes while slowing as > {- you pull up to a light, the truck dies. Only happened very > {- occaisionally, but is getting more frequent. To the point that it is > {- happening nearly every day, driving in, but usually not driving home for > {- whatever reason. > [...] > {- And to go along with this, when it's raining, lights on, wipers on, > {- radio, fan on high to defrost, etc. and you pull up to a light even > {- without the above mentioned anomoly going on, the ammeter loads way > {- down, lights dim, fan slows, ... what causes this? > > This may not be it, but if it happens more when it's humid out, it could > be the classic ignition module -- about a $15 instant fix. They tend to > go out in the FSJs after about twelve years -- which means I better get > my spare; my current one is due any day... Anyway, these start out > gradually, then get worse, to the point where it dies driving through > fog or whatever, and they become difficult to restart in humid weather. > > Along the same lines, it could be a cracked distributor cap; this is > also about a $5-10 instant fix. You may be able to check that by > getting a plastic spray bottle ("spritzer") with water, running the > vehicle (in 'park', of course), and spraying water on the distributor > cap. If it dies when you do that, you win. > > Yet another possibility could be a bad carb... I don't know if they get > worse with age, but I can't imagine them getting better on their own. I > know my FSJ has had a dead spot in the accelerator since I got it, and > it seems to be worse in cold or humid weather -- which is most of the > year in Iowa (cold half the year, humid the other half). > > I'm not disputing other suggestions; I'm just mentioning more > posisbilities. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > "Trying" is the first step toward failure. > -- Homer Simpson > -------------- Dan Black ------------------------- dan-at-black.org -------------- - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------- '87 Street Comanche #24/100 '88 Grand Wagoneer ...and they say there's only one... '92 Cherokee - ---------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 22:55:07 -0500 From: jeepnut Subject: Re: fsj: Re: msg to the jeep nut: vacuum and juice Gotta get busy it sounds like... Trouble is I've got details to finish and a trip to get ready for (including oil changes, general maintenance etc for both the SJ and the XJ). Thanks for the ideas gents. I've got the FSM and it has great details, tho I've never really done a "proper" tune-up on a carb powered engine I guess. I'm not too comfortable on carbs. It seems odd saying that considering all the bizarre crap I HAVE done on cars & trucks... but that's probably where I should start. AFTER changing all the vacumn lines of course... Reading, tweaking, reading, tweaking... Thanks Kim for the tips on setting the idle and the solenoid. Are these 2150 carbs on the '88 known for being good or junk? AMC exclusive? Ford? My FSM shows 2150, but this manual is for '84 model year. A fair number of changes between there and '88 sometimes. And what is this with Whitney there John? You a Whitney Moonie or what!!! Why would those kits say that the lights dim "normally" with the HD Alternator? If the battery is up and a bone-stock load on it, why should things "dim" with the HD Alternator at idle? Steve Lett aka JeepNut Kim Smith wrote: > The idle solenoid activates when the ignition switch is "On". Its job is to > act as an anti-run-on device. That is why you set the idle with the > screw on the base of the linkage with the solenoid disconnected to > 550 RPM, then connect the solenoid and set the spec curb idle, > 650RPM for automatics, at the solenoid mount. The difference allows > the throttle to close slightly at shut down, keeping the engine from running > on. When the idle solenoid gets old and weak, the symptoms are exactly > as you describe. > > This doesn't mean that you shouldn't fix you vacuum leaks!!! I had > replaced all but two vac hoses, the Pwbrk and the cruise control, which > had passed the Monica test*. Still had vacuum of only 15.5 psi. > Bought an intake manifold gasket set, thought it HAD to be leaking. > Took a flyer on replacing the "OK" hoses. Guess what? Vacuum is > now 19.5 psi, with 133,000 miles on the engine, at 3000 feet altitude. > > kim > '80 Wagoneer "J0E", 360 v2,T-727,NP219 > *[Monica test: 1)Take hose loose. 2)Plug one end with finger. 3)Suck on > other end. 4)Insert tongue to hold vacuum. 5)Hose is USUALLY all right > if there is a "pop" when you remove your tongue.] > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "john" > To: "full size jeep list" > Sent: Monday, 08 May, 2000 23:45 > Subject: fsj: msg to the jeep nut: vacuum and juice > > > hey jeepnut, aka steve, > > > > sounds like a vacuum leak. > > To fix the vacuum leak just replace EVERY vacuum line under the hood, > tighten > > all the intake manifold bolts, and the carb base... while you're at it, > tighten > > the exhaust bolts too. you won't be sorry. > > I doubt it's your throttle solenoid, it only activates when you turn > > on the a/c. Cold idle speed is controlled by the choke and kicks off of > > fast idle pretty soon after starting. - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------- '87 Street Comanche #24/100 '88 Grand Wagoneer ...and they say there's only one... '92 Cherokee - ---------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 00:38:28 EDT From: DoctorNor-at-aol.com Subject: fsj: Wiper Problem I have an 88 FJS which I think is a great vehicle to have. Winter time came, no problem, nothing stopped this baby. It's fun to drive no matter what the road conditions. Anyway, the other day, as it was raining, my wipers hesitated briefly, and upon the next wipe, stopped all together. They stopped in mid wipe and would only move again if you pushed them, and then stuck in the middle again. Anyone know if this is the wiper motor kicking the bucket? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 23:45:23 -0500 From: jeepnut Subject: Re: fsj: Track Bar issues Thanks guys. I'm pulling mine too. I don't know how long it had been broken off again after the first time I had it welded back on. But it didn't last long. Like you say, I don't notice any handling issues, outside normal for a beastie this big so... off to the shed with it.... Steve akd JeepNut Bjersr5-at-cs.com wrote: > Mine did the same thing so I just took it off. I've seen no noticable > difference in handling or ride quility.I'm running 31X10.50 on stock alloy > wheels. > > Barry from Ga - -- - ---------------------------------------------------------------- '87 Street Comanche #24/100 '88 Grand Wagoneer ...and they say there's only one... '92 Cherokee - ---------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 12:08:35 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: Wiper Problem A: Sounds like a flat spot in the armature or the brushes are nearly gone. Try tapping the outside of the wipper motor gently and see if it temporarily cures the problem. Also make sure it has a good ground wire from the body to the motor or this will happen too. If that fails, then another motor is needed. Does anyone know if the motors changed from '84 ? I found that AMC Eagle motors are the same as my '83/'84 FSJs. DoctorNor wrote: I have an 88 FJS which I think is a great vehicle to have. Winter time came, no problem, nothing stopped this baby. It's fun to drive no matter what the road conditions. Anyway, the other day, as it was raining, my wipers hesitated briefly, and upon the next wipe, stopped all together. They stopped in mid wipe and would only move again if you pushed them, and then stuck in the middle again. Anyone know if this is the wiper motor kicking the bucket? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ JimBlair, Seattle,WA 1983 4.2L Chero 4dr http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html Now appearing on allexperts.com Pics: http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=13998&Auth=false ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 12:16:39 -0700 (PDT) From: Carnuck-at-webtv.net (James Blair) Subject: Re: fsj: Re: msg to the jeep nut: vacuum and juice A: Sublim answers ahead! Steve Lett wrote: =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0Gotta get busy it sounds like... =A0=A0=A0=A0Trouble is I've got details to finish and a trip to get ready for (including oil changes, general maintenance etc for both the SJ and the XJ). =A0=A0=A0=A0Thanks for the ideas gents. I've got the FSM and it has great details, tho I've never really done a "proper" tune-up on a carb powered engine I guess. I'm not too comfortable on carbs. It seems odd saying that considering all the bizarre crap I HAVE done on cars & trucks... but that's probably where I should start. AFTER changing all the vacumn lines of course... Reading, tweaking, reading, tweaking... Thanks Kim for the tips on setting the idle and the solenoid. =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0Are these 2150 carbs on the '88 known for being good or junk? AMC exclusive? Ford? My FSM shows 2150, but this manual is for '84 model year. A fair number of changes between there and '88 sometimes. A: AFAIK, it is the 2150 all the way to '91 with just external changes (vacuum ports, etc) from the Ford versions. =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0And what is this with Whitney there John? You a Whitney Moonie or what!!! =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0Why would those kits say that the lights dim "normally" with the HD Alternator? If the battery is up and a bone-stock load on it, why should things "dim" with the HD Alternator at idle? =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0Steve Lett aka JeepNut A: When your RPM drops, your peak voltage also drops, which results in dimmer headlights. The factory wiring moves the lighting harness away from the circuit with the most variations, so it is less noticeable. The HD alts pass on less voltage at idle than needed to keep the battery up with the lights on, so the top charge (I forget what it's called exactly) is quickly depleted. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ JimBlair, Seattle,WA 1983 4.2L Chero 4dr http://homepages.go.com/~carnuck/carnuck.html Now appearing on allexperts.com Pics: http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumList?u=3D13998&Auth=3Dfalse ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 07:29:17 -0700 From: Clark Novak Subject: fsj: Anyone need a tilt steering column? Full rebuild, guy's asking $150. Looks to be pre-'83? with the GM neutral switch. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/ebayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=328340440& r=0&t=0 Clark Novak ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 18:30:28 -0400 From: Mark Graves II Subject: fsj: FRONT GRILL, DURABAK, ETC... Hey All, I have an 81 J10 that is going through some major fixins. I have a = couple questions: 1. If I remove the existing grill, will a 60's grill fit over the = radiator hole, and vintage round lights fit in the existing (round) = holes? 2. Has anyone done their paint job in Durabak or Hurkuliner? If so, how = much did it take, what did it cost, and who did you buy it from? 3. The engine is a swapped in 360 from a 80 J10.. Can anyone give me the = right location for the motor mounts? I think the guy who did it mounted = it too far to the rear and too high in the engine compartment. Thanks for the help! - -Mark G ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #844 *************************