From owner-fsj-digest@digest.net Sun Sep 9 16:40:00 2012 From: fsj-digest To: fsj-digest@digest.net Date: Sun, 09 Sep 2012 23:39:45 +0000 Subject: fsj-digest V1 #3965 fsj-digest Sunday, September 9 2012 Volume 01 : Number 3965 Forum for Discussion of Full Sized SJ Series Jeeps Brian Colucci Digest Coordinator Contents: fsj: Saturday's fun fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance fsj: AMC Clips And Fasteners fsj: Re: xj: 85 mph speed limit? :) Re: fsj: 85 mph speed limit? :) Re: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance RE: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance Re: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance FSJ Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/jeeps/fsj/ Send submissions to fsj-digest@digest.net Send administrative requests to fsj-digest-request@digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to fsj-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2012 18:29:02 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: fsj: Saturday's fun Just got back from my cabin and the weather was sunny 48th day in a row Almost a Seattle record!) We had the road committee meeting this AM then I tried to do some stuff up at my place (the plan was to meet with my neighbor and set up a day for him to run a trencher for our well) He was too ill to do much from the heat (i have AC in my van and the cabin is cool as a cucumber if the door is kept closed) Even though only 1 handed I was able to load my van with stuff to come back to town with. The heat and humidity was oppressive but I still puttered through. I brought back my big parts shelf (7' tall, 4 feet deep and about 8 feet long) that takes pallets. I didn't find the assembly hooks yet, but know I have them and I'll post it on CL once I find those. (I had about 2 tons on it) I also brought back my yard sale tables. I'm hoping to have a day or two of nice weather to have a sale before the end of the month and maybe reduce my parts collection before the snow flies. If anyone is interested in the stuff I'm setting up, check out jimsclads on http://photobucket.com/jimsclads for stuff (kind of a jumble being posted as I pull them out) This will be my last sale of stuff before I recycle when scrap goes back up (went from $300 a ton to $65 because of the upcoming election uncertainty) I can't drive the 5 ton IH on the highway right now (it's a 5 speed Clark stick with 2 speed diff and my broken left hip makes it hard to maneuver 1 footed and 1 armed but at least it's power steering and brakes which need fixed too) but I'll sort and load stuff a bit at a time. I can back it up to the fifth wheel full of parts and throw everything on the truck from the steps. It'll just be real slow going and I don't know yet if I need surgery for my shoulder or my hip yet (I have a fantastic Chinese masseuse who was able to work my hip and shoulder back into position so they don't hurt as much and the nerves aren't pinched) I'm even able to fight the pain now with just some ibuprofen and ice along with the anti-pain meditation I learned years ago, rather than mega pain drugs. Sorry to Ramble(r) on so much, but it was nice to do something serious for the first time since my accident 2 weeks ago (stupid green tree!) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 Sep 2012 18:30:26 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance Making my list of tasks for my '83 Jeep J10. This is a list for me to go shopping, and of course for any suggestions... the leak by the heater/vents is one area I will need some help with info on... I may hire a friend to do the rear brakes/axle seals... we'll see... I broke even on the sale of the Suburban... but my Jetta needs a number of things as well... hard to justify paying another mechanic when I are one. ;) COOLING - - flush radiator - - replace water pump ________________ - - replace upper and lower rad hoses ________________ - - replace heater hoses ________________ ENGINE - - replace distributer cap and rotor ________________ - - check plugs, replace if needed ________________ - - pop valve covers off, check rocker arms, adjust - paint valve covers - - replace all vacuum lines ________________ - - install hood insulation that arrived today from BJ's Offroad - - install hood release cable that arrived today from BJ's Offroad - - remount trans cooler using something other than plastic ties EXHAUST - - pop exhaust manifolds off, install gaskets, tighten with locktite ______________ - - snug up downpipe connection - - add mufflers in line - suspect mufflers are gutted... ______________ BRAKES - - check front brake pads and calipers - - repair rear brakes - get parking brake working ___________ - - possible rear seal leak - DS ___________ BODY - - apply tailgate decals (black - on white) that arrived today from BJ's Offroad - - install leather steering wheel - to go in Superdawg - - replace liftgate shocks for canopy ___________ - - fix leak from vent area - find article... it's not from the windshield... - - fix turn signal and gear shift handles so they don't come off - - clean up and paint hitch - get new bolts - wire up trailer lights - this goes on Superdawg - - remove old fog light bolts from front bumper, or mount fog lights - - consider installing brushguard - paint - not sure if it'll work - tow hooks welded... - for superdawg - - consider using side steps - for superdawg ELECTRICAL - - run ground wire to fuel tank - - adjust fuel gauge - - clean up wiring under dash - - reinstall stereo - - install speakers behind seats - - fix or install dome light in cab - - run wiring to bypass amp gauge, use relay to bypass - use NC relay, enable to view AMPs... need 60A relay I found some lightly used (maybe) Hankok studded tires 225/75-15 for $235, will mount them on the extra set of rims for Superdawg - this time I won't run them in hot weather... :) http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/1983-J10-white/2011-04-08-sunshine/ALL.html ----- - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -o|||||o- Linux: the choice of a GNU generation http://WAGONEERS.COM Snohomish, WA- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ...shop AMSOIL directly at: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "A thorough knowledge of the Bible is worth more than a college education" Theodore Roosevelt (26th President (1901-09), 1858-1919) RTM: TRSTGZS - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 16:31:53 +0000 From: john@wagoneers.com Subject: fsj: AMC Clips And Fasteners Wow, what a great source. Thanx Dave A. http://www.clipsandfasteners.com/AMC_Clips_And_Fasteners_s/69.htm __john_at_http://wagoneers.com__ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 13:04:59 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: fsj: Re: xj: 85 mph speed limit? :) The Speedometer in my J10 goes to 160, but I don't think the tires would handle getting up to that speed (Michelin Humvee tires) and I'm not sure the 300 ft/lbs of torque would be enough to push that brick that fast. Probably 120 max, but quite the conversation piece! Written laws are like spiders' webs, and will like them only Entangle and hold the poor and weak, while the rich and powerful will easily break through them ANACHARSIS Scythian philosopher (fl. 600 BC) From: barbierij@optonline.net Subject: Re: xj: 85 mph speed limit? :) John, if anybody could get more MPGs at higher speeds I bet two of my jeeps it would be you. not really. i only have two left.Just to let you know, I have seen a police XJ that the speedometer went to 125mph (125 where 85 is on ours)oh, btw...would i still get pulled over for thishttp://jessebarbieri.tripod.com/Cherokee/89speedo.jpgit was on I-90 outside of chicopee,ma. Steering wheel was to the side because i didnt align it right. I was 19, give me a break.----- Original Message -----From: john Date: Saturday, September 8, 2012 1:45 amSubject: xj: 85 mph speed limit? :)To: undisclosed-recipients: ;> http://www.komonews.com/news/national/Texas-to-open-fastest-US-> highway-with-85-mph-limit-168914446.html> > I might consider relocating now... what's the price of Diesel > and regular unleaded down there? :)> > > > - - -----> -----------------------------------------------------------------> - - -----------> -o|||||o- Linux: the choice of a GNU generation> http://WAGONEERS.COM Snohomish, WA- where Jeeps don't > rust, they mold> ...shop AMSOIL directly at: > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461-------------------------> - - ---------------------------------------------------> "A thorough knowledge of the Bible is worth more than a > college education"> Theodore Roosevelt (26th President (1901-09), 1858-1919) RTM: > TRSTGZS----------------------------------------------------------> - - ------------------> Jesse BarbieriA+, Network+, MCP, MCDSTThe Computer Works(518) 755-9625Rosendale, NY 12472 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 21:54:25 +0000 From: john@wagoneers.com Subject: Re: fsj: 85 mph speed limit? :) France has always been restricted to 120-130kph, nederland/belgium 120. Germany and austria were the only wide open roads and not in builtup areas like frankfurt/hamburg/munchen. Italy was confusing, I think it was limited by hp, but I drove like it was the autobahn with my mustang and even passed a polizia when he was driving along with his blue lights on. :). I mean he was only doing 70 mph in the slow lane in that fiat 124 sedan. I was on a self-imposed (by my wife) limit of 95 mph. :) __john_at_http://wagoneers.com__ - -----Original Message----- From: Michel Balea Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 10:11:24 To: john Subject: Re: fsj: 85 mph speed limit? :) The 100+ mph in europe is over. In France it is a mere 80ish, and 70ish if raining.... As the freeways are toll road... they have your time of entrance... and when you exit.... it calculate the average speed.... Add the automated speed traps.... You are better off using the train... Michel On Sat, Sep 8, 2012 at 10:15 AM, john wrote: > I've driven all over Europe, sometimes averaging 115 mph... people will learn... > > > > ----- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -o|||||o- Linux: the choice of a GNU generation > http://WAGONEERS.COM Snohomish, WA- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > ...shop AMSOIL directly at: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > "A thorough knowledge of the Bible is worth more than a college education" > Theodore Roosevelt (26th President (1901-09), 1858-1919) RTM: TRSTGZS > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > On Sat, 8 Sep 2012, Michel Balea wrote: > > # After a few deadly accidents, the limit will be lowered. When I see > # how close people drive at 75ish, you have to be worried about their > # reaction time. > # We have a few miles of 75mph in the bay area.... and of course posted > # and real speed limit.... is a factor of 10ish at least in Kali. 65 is > # 73ish.... and the 75 is 80ish. > # Michel > # > # On Fri, Sep 7, 2012 at 10:45 PM, john wrote: > # > http://www.komonews.com/news/national/Texas-to-open-fastest-US-highway-with-85-mph-limit-168914446.html > # > > # > I might consider relocating now... what's the price of Diesel and regular > # > unleaded down there? :) > # > > # > ----- > # > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > # > -o|||||o- Linux: the choice of a GNU generation > # > http://WAGONEERS.COM Snohomish, WA- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > # > ...shop AMSOIL directly at: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 > # > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > # > "A thorough knowledge of the Bible is worth more than a college education" > # > Theodore Roosevelt (26th President (1901-09), 1858-1919) RTM: TRSTGZS > # > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > # ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 22:33:01 +0000 From: john@wagoneers.com Subject: Re: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance Well, to be honest I don't think they are adjustable like the 289, but I hear a noise on the back cylinder that sounds like a tappet, could be exhaust leak. :). Maybe I'll install an exhaust gasket first. :) __john_at_http://wagoneers.com__ - -----Original Message----- From: Michel Balea Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 10:31:23 To: john Subject: Re: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance How do you check rocker arm? curious! The other is the valve seal replacement, how do you install the tool to release (L arm). May be a useful links w images.... from the other site # Bolt the spring compressor on the stud over the first valve. Important: make sure to use your ratchet to get a few turns on the stud, as just "hand-tight" may not thread the nut enough to keep it on the stud when you compress the spring. If the nut lets go, you may tear up your threads and have to replace the stud. Cheers Michel On Sat, Sep 8, 2012 at 6:30 PM, john wrote: > Making my list of tasks for my '83 Jeep J10. > > This is a list for me to go shopping, and of course for any suggestions... > the leak by the heater/vents is one area I will need some help with info > on... I may hire a friend to do the rear brakes/axle seals... we'll see... I > broke > even on the sale of the Suburban... but my Jetta needs a number of things as > well... hard to justify paying another mechanic when I are one. ;) > > > COOLING > - flush radiator > - replace water pump ________________ > - replace upper and lower rad hoses ________________ > - replace heater hoses ________________ > ENGINE > - replace distributer cap and rotor ________________ > - check plugs, replace if needed ________________ > - pop valve covers off, check rocker arms, adjust - paint valve covers > - replace all vacuum lines ________________ > - install hood insulation that arrived today from BJ's Offroad > - install hood release cable that arrived today from BJ's Offroad > - remount trans cooler using something other than plastic ties > EXHAUST > - pop exhaust manifolds off, install gaskets, tighten with locktite > ______________ - snug up downpipe connection > - add mufflers in line - suspect mufflers are gutted... ______________ > BRAKES > - check front brake pads and calipers > - repair rear brakes - get parking brake working ___________ > - possible rear seal leak - DS ___________ > BODY > - apply tailgate decals (black - on white) that arrived today from BJ's > Offroad > - install leather steering wheel - to go in Superdawg > - replace liftgate shocks for canopy ___________ > - fix leak from vent area - find article... it's not from the windshield... > - fix turn signal and gear shift handles so they don't come off > - clean up and paint hitch - get new bolts - wire up trailer lights - this > goes on Superdawg > - remove old fog light bolts from front bumper, or mount fog lights > - consider installing brushguard - paint - not sure if it'll work - tow > hooks welded... - for superdawg > - consider using side steps - for superdawg > ELECTRICAL > - run ground wire to fuel tank > - adjust fuel gauge > - clean up wiring under dash > - reinstall stereo > - install speakers behind seats > - fix or install dome light in cab > - run wiring to bypass amp gauge, use relay to bypass - use NC relay, enable > to view AMPs... need 60A relay > > I found some lightly used (maybe) Hankok studded tires 225/75-15 for $235, > will mount them on the > extra set of rims for Superdawg - this time I won't run them in hot > weather... :) > > http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/1983-J10-white/2011-04-08-sunshine/ALL.html > > ----- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -o|||||o- Linux: the choice of a GNU generation > http://WAGONEERS.COM Snohomish, WA- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > ...shop AMSOIL directly at: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > "A thorough knowledge of the Bible is worth more than a college education" > Theodore Roosevelt (26th President (1901-09), 1858-1919) RTM: TRSTGZS > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 16:15:54 -0700 From: Jim Blair Subject: RE: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance Just use a piece of vacuum hose to your ear to see where it's coming from. AMC rockers aren't really adjustable. Usually it's lifter or rocker arm wear if not the exhaust leak Written laws are like spiders' webs, and will like them only Entangle and hold the poor and weak, while the rich and powerful will easily break through them ANACHARSIS Scythian philosopher (fl. 600 BC) > Subject: Re: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance > To: michelbalea@gmail.com; fsj@digest.net > From: john@wagoneers.com > Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 22:33:01 +0000 > > Well, to be honest I don't think they are adjustable like the 289, but I hear a noise on the back cylinder that sounds like a tappet, could be exhaust leak. :). Maybe I'll install an exhaust gasket first. :) > __john_at_http://wagoneers.com__ > > -----Original Message----- > From: Michel Balea > Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 10:31:23 > To: john > Subject: Re: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance > > How do you check rocker arm? curious! > > The other is the valve seal replacement, how do you install the tool > to release (L arm). May be a useful links w images.... > > from the other site > > # Bolt the spring compressor on the stud over the first valve. > Important: make sure to use your ratchet to get a few turns on the > stud, as just "hand-tight" may not thread the nut enough to keep it on > the stud when you compress the spring. If the nut lets go, you may > tear up your threads and have to replace the stud. > > Cheers > > Michel > > > > On Sat, Sep 8, 2012 at 6:30 PM, john wrote: > > Making my list of tasks for my '83 Jeep J10. > > > > This is a list for me to go shopping, and of course for any suggestions... > > the leak by the heater/vents is one area I will need some help with info > > on... I may hire a friend to do the rear brakes/axle seals... we'll see... I > > broke > > even on the sale of the Suburban... but my Jetta needs a number of things as > > well... hard to justify paying another mechanic when I are one. ;) > > > > > > COOLING > > - flush radiator > > - replace water pump ________________ > > - replace upper and lower rad hoses ________________ > > - replace heater hoses ________________ > > ENGINE > > - replace distributer cap and rotor ________________ > > - check plugs, replace if needed ________________ > > - pop valve covers off, check rocker arms, adjust - paint valve covers > > - replace all vacuum lines ________________ > > - install hood insulation that arrived today from BJ's Offroad > > - install hood release cable that arrived today from BJ's Offroad > > - remount trans cooler using something other than plastic ties > > EXHAUST > > - pop exhaust manifolds off, install gaskets, tighten with locktite > > ______________ - snug up downpipe connection > > - add mufflers in line - suspect mufflers are gutted... ______________ > > BRAKES > > - check front brake pads and calipers > > - repair rear brakes - get parking brake working ___________ > > - possible rear seal leak - DS ___________ > > BODY > > - apply tailgate decals (black - on white) that arrived today from BJ's > > Offroad > > - install leather steering wheel - to go in Superdawg > > - replace liftgate shocks for canopy ___________ > > - fix leak from vent area - find article... it's not from the windshield... > > - fix turn signal and gear shift handles so they don't come off > > - clean up and paint hitch - get new bolts - wire up trailer lights - this > > goes on Superdawg > > - remove old fog light bolts from front bumper, or mount fog lights > > - consider installing brushguard - paint - not sure if it'll work - tow > > hooks welded... - for superdawg > > - consider using side steps - for superdawg > > ELECTRICAL > > - run ground wire to fuel tank > > - adjust fuel gauge > > - clean up wiring under dash > > - reinstall stereo > > - install speakers behind seats > > - fix or install dome light in cab > > - run wiring to bypass amp gauge, use relay to bypass - use NC relay, enable > > to view AMPs... need 60A relay > > > > I found some lightly used (maybe) Hankok studded tires 225/75-15 for $235, > > will mount them on the > > extra set of rims for Superdawg - this time I won't run them in hot > > weather... :) > > > > http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/1983-J10-white/2011-04-08-sunshine/ALL.html > > > > ----- > > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -o|||||o- Linux: the choice of a GNU generation > > http://WAGONEERS.COM Snohomish, WA- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > > ...shop AMSOIL directly at: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 > > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > "A thorough knowledge of the Bible is worth more than a college education" > > Theodore Roosevelt (26th President (1901-09), 1858-1919) RTM: TRSTGZS > > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 23:39:31 +0000 From: john@wagoneers.com Subject: Re: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance Considering that the PO treated this like a ford, there is a good chance they messed with the rockers. :) __john_at_http://wagoneers.com__ - -----Original Message----- From: Jim Blair Sender: owner-fsj@digest.net Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 16:15:54 To: john@wagoneers.com; ; FSJ@digest.net Reply-To: Jim Blair Subject: RE: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance Just use a piece of vacuum hose to your ear to see where it's coming from. AMC rockers aren't really adjustable. Usually it's lifter or rocker arm wear if not the exhaust leak Written laws are like spiders' webs, and will like them only Entangle and hold the poor and weak, while the rich and powerful will easily break through them ANACHARSIS Scythian philosopher (fl. 600 BC) > Subject: Re: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance > To: michelbalea@gmail.com; fsj@digest.net > From: john@wagoneers.com > Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 22:33:01 +0000 > > Well, to be honest I don't think they are adjustable like the 289, but I hear a noise on the back cylinder that sounds like a tappet, could be exhaust leak. :). Maybe I'll install an exhaust gasket first. :) > __john_at_http://wagoneers.com__ > > -----Original Message----- > From: Michel Balea > Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 10:31:23 > To: john > Subject: Re: fsj: 1983 J10 - scheduled maintenance > > How do you check rocker arm? curious! > > The other is the valve seal replacement, how do you install the tool > to release (L arm). May be a useful links w images.... > > from the other site > > # Bolt the spring compressor on the stud over the first valve. > Important: make sure to use your ratchet to get a few turns on the > stud, as just "hand-tight" may not thread the nut enough to keep it on > the stud when you compress the spring. If the nut lets go, you may > tear up your threads and have to replace the stud. > > Cheers > > Michel > > > > On Sat, Sep 8, 2012 at 6:30 PM, john wrote: > > Making my list of tasks for my '83 Jeep J10. > > > > This is a list for me to go shopping, and of course for any suggestions... > > the leak by the heater/vents is one area I will need some help with info > > on... I may hire a friend to do the rear brakes/axle seals... we'll see... I > > broke > > even on the sale of the Suburban... but my Jetta needs a number of things as > > well... hard to justify paying another mechanic when I are one. ;) > > > > > > COOLING > > - flush radiator > > - replace water pump ________________ > > - replace upper and lower rad hoses ________________ > > - replace heater hoses ________________ > > ENGINE > > - replace distributer cap and rotor ________________ > > - check plugs, replace if needed ________________ > > - pop valve covers off, check rocker arms, adjust - paint valve covers > > - replace all vacuum lines ________________ > > - install hood insulation that arrived today from BJ's Offroad > > - install hood release cable that arrived today from BJ's Offroad > > - remount trans cooler using something other than plastic ties > > EXHAUST > > - pop exhaust manifolds off, install gaskets, tighten with locktite > > ______________ - snug up downpipe connection > > - add mufflers in line - suspect mufflers are gutted... ______________ > > BRAKES > > - check front brake pads and calipers > > - repair rear brakes - get parking brake working ___________ > > - possible rear seal leak - DS ___________ > > BODY > > - apply tailgate decals (black - on white) that arrived today from BJ's > > Offroad > > - install leather steering wheel - to go in Superdawg > > - replace liftgate shocks for canopy ___________ > > - fix leak from vent area - find article... it's not from the windshield... > > - fix turn signal and gear shift handles so they don't come off > > - clean up and paint hitch - get new bolts - wire up trailer lights - this > > goes on Superdawg > > - remove old fog light bolts from front bumper, or mount fog lights > > - consider installing brushguard - paint - not sure if it'll work - tow > > hooks welded... - for superdawg > > - consider using side steps - for superdawg > > ELECTRICAL > > - run ground wire to fuel tank > > - adjust fuel gauge > > - clean up wiring under dash > > - reinstall stereo > > - install speakers behind seats > > - fix or install dome light in cab > > - run wiring to bypass amp gauge, use relay to bypass - use NC relay, enable > > to view AMPs... need 60A relay > > > > I found some lightly used (maybe) Hankok studded tires 225/75-15 for $235, > > will mount them on the > > extra set of rims for Superdawg - this time I won't run them in hot > > weather... :) > > > > http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/1983-J10-white/2011-04-08-sunshine/ALL.html > > > > ----- > > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > -o|||||o- Linux: the choice of a GNU generation > > http://WAGONEERS.COM Snohomish, WA- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > > ...shop AMSOIL directly at: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 > > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > "A thorough knowledge of the Bible is worth more than a college education" > > Theodore Roosevelt (26th President (1901-09), 1858-1919) RTM: TRSTGZS > > - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of fsj-digest V1 #3965 **************************