From: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net (diesel-benz-digest) To: diesel-benz-digest-at-krusty-motorsports.com Subject: diesel-benz-digest V1 #136 Reply-To: diesel-benz-at-digest.net Sender: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Errors-To: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Precedence: bulk diesel-benz-digest Wednesday, May 12 1999 Volume 01 : Number 136 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles John Meister Digest Coordinator Contents: Assorted ramblings and rantings about cheap tires Losing the clear coat on my 85 300DT? Losing the clear coat on my 85 300DT? Assorted ramblings and rantings about cheap tires Assorted ramblings and rantings about cheap tires Re: Assorted ramblings and rantings about cheap tires manual Re: manual the new Wagoneer Re: the new Wagoneer Paint woes... Re: Losing the clear coat on my 85 300DT? 300D dodges a bullet, er...collision Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:05:25 -0500 From: Alec Cordova Subject: Assorted ramblings and rantings about cheap tires Maybe one day I'll figure out why I keep doing this to myself. I fought cheap tires again this weekend on my 85 300DT. For various reasons, I've been trying to get away with cheaper tires on Old Smokey for a while. I've gone through several options from Discount Tire here in the Austin, Texas, area. Tried the Arizonian, which I've seen mentioned in these lists before, then their Fisk Classic, for which they get almost as much as real tires (except when they're on sale, like when I got them). Both of those were just way too soft in the sidewall. I always had to plan ahead for turns, even sweeping highway turns, and take the "slack" out with a slight lean before I got any real response to the steering wheel. Then one of the Fisks developed a classic cheap tire condition, resulting in the embarrassing wobble in slow traffic, and just a general nasty shake at almost any speed. Just got a second pair of some offbeat Korean tires from them: Kumho 795 Touring All Season. Fairly cheap at about 51 bucks a piece, before all the nickel-and-dime stuff (stems, balance, environmental fee, etc.). Not having felt Michelins on this car recently enough to remember them, I have to say I really like these Kumhos. Steering response is orders of magnitude better, grip is fairly amazing for 195/70-14s, wet traction is impressive, their quieter than most other tires I pass on the road, and no wimpy high-pitched shrieks when I push them in the corners. I've heard better tires when pushed (had some Dunlops on an 85 944 that were great for this), but I've also heard MUCH worse, definitely including the Arizonians and the Fisks. They've also worn VERY evenly in front, even though I've got some suspension rubber that desperately needs replacing. I still don't have the confidence in these Kumhos that I do in Michelins, especially concerning how much abuse they'll take when they're worn kinda thin (Michelins have always impressed me in that regard), and the first pair I got have started riding a little rougher now that they have 10 or 15 thousand miles on them, but I do believe I've found a decent compromise between price and performance. Moral: If you don't want to worry about your tires, just spend the money for the Michelins. They easily live up to the loads this car puts on them. If funds are a little snug, Kumho 795 Tourings from Discount Tire (not the cheaper Kumhos they sell), aren't bad at all. Happy Benzing, Alec Cordova Taylor, Texas 85 300DT, <200K, fresh and freshly balanced rubber (ahhh!) 97 Z3 1.9, 57K, P8000 Vizzolas (STILL not even listed on Pirelli's web site), because the incredible OEM Michelin Pilot HX's last less than 20K miles. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:22:13 -0500 From: Alec Cordova Subject: Losing the clear coat on my 85 300DT? Looking for any input before I do something stupid and have to repaint the car. The finish on my 85 300DT, a Texas car all its life, is going downhill lately. It's that maroon or Cabernet metallic color, fairly nice if I look past the fact that I went to UT instead of Texas A&M, but I think the Texas sun, bird droppings, and tree sap have taken their toll on the clear coat. Let me try to describe it. In addition to a generally lightly cloudy finish, I have several areas where the cloudiness has gotten pretty heavy, with lots of little white circles or pits in the finish. The sunroof has it the worst, followed by large patches on the rest of the roof, and the trunk lid has three or four patches, roughly six or eight inches across. I took some mild polishing compound (NOT full rubbing compound) to the blight yesterday, and it seemed to make a barely noticeable impact on the trunk lid patches. On the sunroof, it definitely looked like I was taking away the clear coat, between the already eroded spots, and getting some color on the applicator from the maroon paint, like one used to get when waxing regular oxidized finishes. My concern now is that if I spend the time with this polish, which may take DAYS, that I will rub through the paint where it's already exposed before I get through all of the remaining patches of clear coat. This defeats my purpose, which is to avoid having to get the car repainted. If I can just get EVENLY past the clear coat, I will become as religious about waxing as I currently am about oil changes. Any tricks to get through the patchy clear coat without removing all of the paint? Any tricks to revive the clear coat without removing it? Any tricks to win the lottery? (I figured, while I'm asking...) Thanks, Alec Cordova Taylor, Texas 85 300DT, <200K, trying not to look like a leper 97 Z3 1.9, 57K, silver paint holding up remarkably well ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:22:13 -0500 From: Alec Cordova Subject: Losing the clear coat on my 85 300DT? Looking for any input before I do something stupid and have to repaint the car. The finish on my 85 300DT, a Texas car all its life, is going downhill lately. It's that maroon or Cabernet metallic color, fairly nice if I look past the fact that I went to UT instead of Texas A&M, but I think the Texas sun, bird droppings, and tree sap have taken their toll on the clear coat. Let me try to describe it. In addition to a generally lightly cloudy finish, I have several areas where the cloudiness has gotten pretty heavy, with lots of little white circles or pits in the finish. The sunroof has it the worst, followed by large patches on the rest of the roof, and the trunk lid has three or four patches, roughly six or eight inches across. I took some mild polishing compound (NOT full rubbing compound) to the blight yesterday, and it seemed to make a barely noticeable impact on the trunk lid patches. On the sunroof, it definitely looked like I was taking away the clear coat, between the already eroded spots, and getting some color on the applicator from the maroon paint, like one used to get when waxing regular oxidized finishes. My concern now is that if I spend the time with this polish, which may take DAYS, that I will rub through the paint where it's already exposed before I get through all of the remaining patches of clear coat. This defeats my purpose, which is to avoid having to get the car repainted. If I can just get EVENLY past the clear coat, I will become as religious about waxing as I currently am about oil changes. Any tricks to get through the patchy clear coat without removing all of the paint? Any tricks to revive the clear coat without removing it? Any tricks to win the lottery? (I figured, while I'm asking...) Thanks, Alec Cordova Taylor, Texas 85 300DT, <200K, trying not to look like a leper 97 Z3 1.9, 57K, silver paint holding up remarkably well ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:05:25 -0500 From: Alec Cordova Subject: Assorted ramblings and rantings about cheap tires Maybe one day I'll figure out why I keep doing this to myself. I fought cheap tires again this weekend on my 85 300DT. For various reasons, I've been trying to get away with cheaper tires on Old Smokey for a while. I've gone through several options from Discount Tire here in the Austin, Texas, area. Tried the Arizonian, which I've seen mentioned in these lists before, then their Fisk Classic, for which they get almost as much as real tires (except when they're on sale, like when I got them). Both of those were just way too soft in the sidewall. I always had to plan ahead for turns, even sweeping highway turns, and take the "slack" out with a slight lean before I got any real response to the steering wheel. Then one of the Fisks developed a classic cheap tire condition, resulting in the embarrassing wobble in slow traffic, and just a general nasty shake at almost any speed. Just got a second pair of some offbeat Korean tires from them: Kumho 795 Touring All Season. Fairly cheap at about 51 bucks a piece, before all the nickel-and-dime stuff (stems, balance, environmental fee, etc.). Not having felt Michelins on this car recently enough to remember them, I have to say I really like these Kumhos. Steering response is orders of magnitude better, grip is fairly amazing for 195/70-14s, wet traction is impressive, their quieter than most other tires I pass on the road, and no wimpy high-pitched shrieks when I push them in the corners. I've heard better tires when pushed (had some Dunlops on an 85 944 that were great for this), but I've also heard MUCH worse, definitely including the Arizonians and the Fisks. They've also worn VERY evenly in front, even though I've got some suspension rubber that desperately needs replacing. I still don't have the confidence in these Kumhos that I do in Michelins, especially concerning how much abuse they'll take when they're worn kinda thin (Michelins have always impressed me in that regard), and the first pair I got have started riding a little rougher now that they have 10 or 15 thousand miles on them, but I do believe I've found a decent compromise between price and performance. Moral: If you don't want to worry about your tires, just spend the money for the Michelins. They easily live up to the loads this car puts on them. If funds are a little snug, Kumho 795 Tourings from Discount Tire (not the cheaper Kumhos they sell), aren't bad at all. Happy Benzing, Alec Cordova Taylor, Texas 85 300DT, <200K, fresh and freshly balanced rubber (ahhh!) 97 Z3 1.9, 57K, P8000 Vizzolas (STILL not even listed on Pirelli's web site), because the incredible OEM Michelin Pilot HX's last less than 20K miles. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:05:25 -0500 From: Alec Cordova Subject: Assorted ramblings and rantings about cheap tires Maybe one day I'll figure out why I keep doing this to myself. I fought cheap tires again this weekend on my 85 300DT. For various reasons, I've been trying to get away with cheaper tires on Old Smokey for a while. I've gone through several options from Discount Tire here in the Austin, Texas, area. Tried the Arizonian, which I've seen mentioned in these lists before, then their Fisk Classic, for which they get almost as much as real tires (except when they're on sale, like when I got them). Both of those were just way too soft in the sidewall. I always had to plan ahead for turns, even sweeping highway turns, and take the "slack" out with a slight lean before I got any real response to the steering wheel. Then one of the Fisks developed a classic cheap tire condition, resulting in the embarrassing wobble in slow traffic, and just a general nasty shake at almost any speed. Just got a second pair of some offbeat Korean tires from them: Kumho 795 Touring All Season. Fairly cheap at about 51 bucks a piece, before all the nickel-and-dime stuff (stems, balance, environmental fee, etc.). Not having felt Michelins on this car recently enough to remember them, I have to say I really like these Kumhos. Steering response is orders of magnitude better, grip is fairly amazing for 195/70-14s, wet traction is impressive, their quieter than most other tires I pass on the road, and no wimpy high-pitched shrieks when I push them in the corners. I've heard better tires when pushed (had some Dunlops on an 85 944 that were great for this), but I've also heard MUCH worse, definitely including the Arizonians and the Fisks. They've also worn VERY evenly in front, even though I've got some suspension rubber that desperately needs replacing. I still don't have the confidence in these Kumhos that I do in Michelins, especially concerning how much abuse they'll take when they're worn kinda thin (Michelins have always impressed me in that regard), and the first pair I got have started riding a little rougher now that they have 10 or 15 thousand miles on them, but I do believe I've found a decent compromise between price and performance. Moral: If you don't want to worry about your tires, just spend the money for the Michelins. They easily live up to the loads this car puts on them. If funds are a little snug, Kumho 795 Tourings from Discount Tire (not the cheaper Kumhos they sell), aren't bad at all. Happy Benzing, Alec Cordova Taylor, Texas 85 300DT, <200K, fresh and freshly balanced rubber (ahhh!) 97 Z3 1.9, 57K, P8000 Vizzolas (STILL not even listed on Pirelli's web site), because the incredible OEM Michelin Pilot HX's last less than 20K miles. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 10:19:17 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: Assorted ramblings and rantings about cheap tires Alec, et al I did the Michelin MXV4 Energy tires... nice. However after less than 10K I'm noticing wear on the outside edges. Took it to the front end shop yesterday to get the little bit of right pull fixed. The specialist pointed out the edges on all tires. He recommended increasing the tire pressure. I admitted to taking curves kind of fast... The michelin's only have a 40 or 45K warranty from Discount Tire... For a lesser expensive tire that impressed me on a car of similar weight, actually heavier, was the Arizonian Silver Editions. My daughter just bought those Kuhmo tires for her car, and had them siped. Siping is a good thing for non-michelin tires. My BFG's on the little wagoneer are holding up quite nicely and wet traction improved significantly! john On Mon, 10 May 1999, Alec Cordova wrote: > Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 11:05:25 -0500 > From: Alec Cordova > To: "Diesel-Benz List (E-mail)" , > "Mercedes List (E-mail)" > Subject: Assorted ramblings and rantings about cheap tires > > Maybe one day I'll figure out why I keep doing this to myself. > > I fought cheap tires again this weekend on my 85 300DT. > > For various reasons, I've been trying to get away with cheaper tires on Old > Smokey for a while. I've gone through several options from Discount Tire > here in the Austin, Texas, area. Tried the Arizonian, which I've seen > mentioned in these lists before, then their Fisk Classic, for which they get > almost as much as real tires (except when they're on sale, like when I got > them). Both of those were just way too soft in the sidewall. I always had to > plan ahead for turns, even sweeping highway turns, and take the "slack" out > with a slight lean before I got any real response to the steering wheel. > Then one of the Fisks developed a classic cheap tire condition, resulting in > the embarrassing wobble in slow traffic, and just a general nasty shake at > almost any speed. > > Just got a second pair of some offbeat Korean tires from them: Kumho 795 > Touring All Season. Fairly cheap at about 51 bucks a piece, before all the > nickel-and-dime stuff (stems, balance, environmental fee, etc.). Not having > felt Michelins on this car recently enough to remember them, I have to say I > really like these Kumhos. Steering response is orders of magnitude better, > grip is fairly amazing for 195/70-14s, wet traction is impressive, their > quieter than most other tires I pass on the road, and no wimpy high-pitched > shrieks when I push them in the corners. I've heard better tires when pushed > (had some Dunlops on an 85 944 that were great for this), but I've also > heard MUCH worse, definitely including the Arizonians and the Fisks. They've > also worn VERY evenly in front, even though I've got some suspension rubber > that desperately needs replacing. > > I still don't have the confidence in these Kumhos that I do in Michelins, > especially concerning how much abuse they'll take when they're worn kinda > thin (Michelins have always impressed me in that regard), and the first pair > I got have started riding a little rougher now that they have 10 or 15 > thousand miles on them, but I do believe I've found a decent compromise > between price and performance. > > Moral: If you don't want to worry about your tires, just spend the money for > the Michelins. They easily live up to the loads this car puts on them. If > funds are a little snug, Kumho 795 Tourings from Discount Tire (not the > cheaper Kumhos they sell), aren't bad at all. > > Happy Benzing, > Alec Cordova > Taylor, Texas > 85 300DT, <200K, fresh and freshly balanced rubber (ahhh!) > 97 Z3 1.9, 57K, P8000 Vizzolas (STILL not even listed on Pirelli's web > site), because the incredible OEM Michelin Pilot HX's last less than 20K > miles. > ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-virtual-cafe.com **** Snohomish, Washington USA don't leave life without jesus, please... http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john http://wagoneers.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 13:25:00 -0400 From: "S.D.Byers" Subject: manual Does anybody have a manual for a 1975-75 W115 chassis 300D they would sell me? I just need the engine section. I have the Haynes "mercedes diesel" book and do not like it. Thanks, Simon Byers. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 11:28:45 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: manual I have an engine manual for this year, but I'm not interested in selling it. If you have something specific I might be able to get the info for you. Otherwise you might be able to buy this manual from IMPCO or the dealer. Having the factory manuals is worth the money... john On Tue, 11 May 1999, S.D.Byers wrote: > Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 13:25:00 -0400 > From: "S.D.Byers" > To: "Diesel-Benz List (E-mail)" > Subject: manual > > > Does anybody have a manual for a 1975-75 W115 chassis 300D they would sell > me? I just need the engine section. I have the Haynes "mercedes diesel" > book and do not like it. > > Thanks, > Simon Byers. > > ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-virtual-cafe.com **** Snohomish, Washington USA don't leave life without jesus, please... http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john http://wagoneers.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 16:16:28 -0400 From: "Evan Reisner" Subject: the new Wagoneer Wow! is that what 20 year old cars look like out there? Put out the welcome mat, I'm coming shopping! Find me a nice 258" w/a 4-speed! Preferably a 2 door Evan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 14:38:32 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: the new Wagoneer shoot yeah... there is a 77 Chero, wide-trac on Vancouver Island set up dual-fuel (propane) for about $2k US. :) Lots of rust free, but moldy cars out here. There is still that 61 MB Diesel for $2495 up in Clearview, no rust... :) john On Tue, 11 May 1999, Evan Reisner wrote: > Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 16:16:28 -0400 > From: Evan Reisner > To: diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net > Subject: the new Wagoneer > > Wow! is that what 20 year old cars look like out there? > > Put out the welcome mat, I'm coming shopping! > > Find me a nice 258" w/a 4-speed! > > Preferably a 2 door > > Evan > ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-virtual-cafe.com **** Snohomish, Washington USA don't leave life without jesus, please... http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john http://wagoneers.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 20:36:15 +0000 From: Tony Wirtel Subject: Paint woes... > > Looking for any input before I do something stupid and have to repaint the > car. > > In addition to a generally lightly cloudy finish, I have several areas where > the cloudiness has gotten pretty heavy, with lots of little white circles or > pits in the finish. The sunroof has it the worst, followed by large patches > on the rest of the roof, and the trunk lid has three or four patches, > roughly six or eight inches across. > > I took some mild polishing compound (NOT full rubbing compound) to the > blight yesterday, and it seemed to make a barely noticeable impact on the > trunk lid patches. On the sunroof, it definitely looked like I was taking > away the clear coat, between the already eroded spots, and getting some > color on the applicator from the maroon paint, like one used to get when > waxing regular oxidized finishes. > > My concern now is that if I spend the time with this polish, which may take > DAYS, that I will rub through the paint where it's already exposed before I > get through all of the remaining patches of clear coat. Alec- My '85 is in a slightly later stage than your car; the cloudiness is actually oxidation and will only get worse. I don't think these cars had clear coat from the factory, but it does give that appearance. I compounded mine, which made a difference, small but noticable. Did more, and found where the paint begins to end. Worst on the hood, a bit also on the tops of the front fenders. If like mine, it'll actually look better in the rain. Not only is a repaint inevitable, but you'll need to have the oxidizing parts stripped or it'll happen again. I've been torn on this because I've had a hard time finding a 'middle ground' between Maaco at $300 or most any other body shops at 3-4k. I love my car, but it does have some rust developing. Even with good remedial work done now, it WILL be back in 4-5 years and that makes the car not worth a 3k paint job. Because there is other stuff I'll want to do, I'm seriously considering doing the painting myself. I figure that if I take my time and can rent/borrow a good quality spray gun I'll have a good result. 80% of teh time will be prep anyway, and that doesn't include research time on proper technique. If I don't like a section, I'll just start over..Polish (my) labor is cheap!!! If you're looking for quick and dirty, you could use a spray can to simply cover it up. A quick fix. Good luck- Tony Wirtel ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 08:06:06 +0200 (MET DST) From: Jochen Witte Subject: Re: Losing the clear coat on my 85 300DT? hi, On Mon, 10 May 1999, Alec Cordova wrote: > The finish on my 85 300DT, a Texas car all its life, is going downhill > lately. It's that maroon or Cabernet metallic color, fairly nice if I look i'm just taking a semester at daimlerchrysler sindelfingen in the coatings department. to help you i'd need the exact color-number (you can find it on the printed shield near the motor should be a three digit number (mine is "champagner metallic" 473) and the month of build of your car. > In addition to a generally lightly cloudy finish, I have several areas where > the cloudiness has gotten pretty heavy, with lots of little white circles or > pits in the finish. The sunroof has it the worst, followed by large patches > on the rest of the roof, and the trunk lid has three or four patches, > roughly six or eight inches across. if the "cloudiness" is a porosity of the clear coat then you really have lost. the restore this you'd need to polish of exactly and *only* the clear coat - i'd say that this is impossible. if it's only a milky shine on the surface you could just polish it away - notive that the clear coat is 40 micrometers thick (40 micrometers is 40 thousands of a millimeter) - so you should be able to polish some microns away... from my personal experience i can say that you need to polish really, really hard over an extensive time to get through to the color coating "decklack". > > I took some mild polishing compound (NOT full rubbing compound) to the > blight yesterday, and it seemed to make a barely noticeable impact on the > trunk lid patches. On the sunroof, it definitely looked like I was taking > away the clear coat, between the already eroded spots, and getting some > color on the applicator from the maroon paint, like one used to get when > waxing regular oxidized finishes. in that time the clear coat was applicated wet-in-wet with the color coat so it might be that some color went into the clear coat making it a bit colored. that could be the color you see on the applicator. > My concern now is that if I spend the time with this polish, which may take > DAYS, that I will rub through the paint where it's already exposed before I > get through all of the remaining patches of clear coat. This defeats my > purpose, which is to avoid having to get the car repainted. If I can just > get EVENLY past the clear coat, I will become as religious about waxing as I > currently am about oil changes. *if* you really could get evenly past the clear cat you'd have to reseal it - not with a wax but with a repair-clear-coat. the clear coat *does* have a dramatic effect on the color! > Any tricks to get through the patchy clear coat without removing all of the > paint? > Any tricks to revive the clear coat without removing it? > Any tricks to win the lottery? (I figured, while I'm asking...) > gruss, jochen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 13:40:58 -0700 From: "David Masinick" Subject: 300D dodges a bullet, er...collision Gentle listers, Watch your behinds. I went to Boston for an interview and seminar. Before leaving on Monday night, I decided to take the Passat instead of the MB, because I did not want the prospective employer to see the MB. Coming home, I was unlucky enough to be on Route 95 during the 3:00pm rush. While stopped in traffic, I was rear-ended by an Escort (glad it wasn't an Explorer). This ruined an otherwise nice day. Neither of us was hurt, but I gave the guy some "eye daggars" for being so careless. It did $4200 in damage to the rear of the Passat. I don't know if the MB would have been wrinkled as much, but for that amount of repair $$, it would probably have been a total loss. That would have made me cry. We'll be without the Passat for a week and a half, but really glad the 300D is still it's original length. Dave Masinick Hopkinton, NH '82 300D MBCA ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #136 *********************************