From: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net (diesel-benz-digest) To: diesel-benz-digest-at-krusty-motorsports.com Subject: diesel-benz-digest V1 #163 Reply-To: diesel-benz-at-digest.net Sender: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Errors-To: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Precedence: bulk diesel-benz-digest Thursday, July 1 1999 Volume 01 : Number 163 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles John Meister Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: can MY bumpers do that? Towing Re: Diesel Benz Reliability? RE: Diesel Benz Reliability? RE: Diesel Benz Reliability? RE: Diesel Benz Reliability? new link - Diesel Gelandewagen anyone? :) G-wagen follow up... Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 20:43:49 +0200 From: "Pieter Noorlander" Subject: Re: can MY bumpers do that? - ----- Oorspronkelijk bericht ----- Van: Matthew J. Mason Aan: Verzonden: maandag 28 juni 1999 6:44 Onderwerp: can MY bumpers do that? > My question then -- is there a safe spot to attach a trailer hitch on our > cars? I'm thinking that if it were attached directly to the bumper, > depending on the condition of the bolts holding the rear bumper shocks to > the sheet metal, the arrangement probably wouldn't last long... does anyone > have hauling experience with 123s and/or special hitches? > > Also, I don't imagine that under such a heavy load, even the most spry 300D > would make respectable mileage on the highway... (I can feel the flames > coming, on that one...) :) > > -- mjm > A hitch is one of the few luxury items on Hermann :) It was already there when I bought him. The hitch is welded to a very sturdy looking bar that is replacing the original bumper mount. This bar is bolted to the chassis with four big bolts. On each side of the bar is an extension thingy that goes through a hole into the rear of the chassis bar and is bolted there with two smaller bolts. Well this is very clear isn't it? :) I can send you a picture of it off list if you like. This is the setup on my T-model, but I suppose it's about the same on the sedan. Never hauled anything heavy yet, but the manual that came with the hitch states this construction can handle 1700 kg (3750 lbs.). I don't know how much MB allows, though. Pieter '83 300TD - Hermann ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 09:01:04 +0000 From: Tony Wirtel Subject: Towing Pieter wrote... > A hitch is one of the few luxury items on Hermann :) It was already there > when I bought him. > > Never towed anything heavy yet, but the manual that came with the hitch > states this construction can handle 1700 kg (3750 lbs.). I don't know how > much MB allows, though. > > Pieter > '83 300TD - Hermann With the hitch, that seems right, although on my '85 TD I think the number was closer to 3300 lbs. However, due to litigation, MB now says the only US-market vehicles made for towing are the ML series. Thank the lawyers for that one... Tony Wirtel "Where the lawyers are seen to meet surely the Devil is close behind..." ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 10:18:49 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: Diesel Benz Reliability? On Wed, 30 Jun 1999, Farnes_Quinn wrote: >-->Hi John, >--> >-->It's been a little quiet, so I thought I'd rattle your cage. I've been >-->reading the archives, and wondering. The amount of work you've done on your >-->car makes me wonder about the reliability of the Mercedes Diesel. As you >-->know, I'm thinking about getting a 300D or TD, which will require selling >-->one or both of our Toyotas (150,000 miles on each and the valve covers >-->haven't ever been off). My wife has a new Ford Expedition (I held my nose, >-->but she wanted it), and I'm still driving my '89 Toy pickup. But if I sell >-->both the Toys and buy a 300D, I'm wondering if I'm in for a maintenance >-->hassle. I don't mind maintaining a fine car, and the Benz is certainly >-->that, but we need reliability, too. Can't afford to have a car in the shop >-->or in my driveway half the time. Is the amount of work you've had to do >-->fairly typical, did you get a car that had been abused, or do you just like >-->to tinker? >-->Thanks for enlightening me, >-->Quinn Farnes >-->Irvine, CA The problems I've had with Fritz are all minor and a result of years of poor service by ignorant mechanics, and a few design quirks that don't affect the basic reliablity. Major hassles have been heating/air conditioning system, still working out bugs, cruise weirdness and of course the radio and window switches... NEVER was I unable to drive the vehicle. The water pump was normal wear and tear and was driving it without problem. I can't think of a better vehicle for reliablity, quality and excellent engineering. It's safe, comfortable, handles well and has parts availablity that will make you smile. The areas of marginal engineering relate primarily to the climate control, cruise control and radio. The primary design issue relates to too wide of a hysteresis. :) While Toyotas are good quality, I wouldn't have one on a bet. But then again, I'm waging a personal boycott against any Japanese vehicle in retailiation of the DRAM dumping in the mid-80's. :) john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-virtual-cafe.com **** Snohomish, Washington USA don't leave life without jesus, please... http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john http://wagoneers.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 10:39:42 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: RE: Diesel Benz Reliability? On Wed, 30 Jun 1999, Farnes_Quinn wrote: >-->Thanks, John, I'm reassured. Just reading through the Haynes manual, it >-->looks like everything's pretty well laid out, not crammed in to a too-small >-->space as is the case with most import compacts and subcompacts. I'm looking >-->forward to my Benz! Wonder where she is just now? It's awesome to work on. Very simple. Well engineered. I've worked on a lot of cars and trucks... these things are superb! john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-virtual-cafe.com **** Snohomish, Washington USA don't leave life without jesus, please... http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john http://wagoneers.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 11:51:47 -0700 From: Farnes_Quinn Subject: RE: Diesel Benz Reliability? Just got back from my lunch break. Went to the local Merc dealer in Newport Beach. Beautiful new place. Pure southern California stereotype. Sunny day, Barbie lookalikes sunning themselves outside waiting to pick up their (insert alphanumerics here) which have been serviced in bays that are cleaner than my kitchen floor . . .(that's really impressive). Talked to the parts guy and told him my plans (to acquire a 123-style Diesel which I will have to maintain myself), and asked him what parts generally cost. He soberly replied that he cannot think of a single car from any manufacturer that would be cheaper to maintain than a Mercedes. Example: water pump $28, with rebuildable Mercedes core, otherwise $70 core charge applies. He said that's typical. Manuals are no longer available for the 123s on paper. All CD at $115, so I guess that's the way I'll have to go. Hmmm, maybe I can relegate my laptop to the garage then, and lobby my wife to allow me to get a newer one for inside! It's nice to be able to verify from the dealer what y'all have been saying all along. Quinn > -----Original Message----- > From: john [SMTP:john-at-cafe.virtual-cafe.com] > Sent: Wednesday, June 30, 1999 10:40 AM > To: Farnes_Quinn > Cc: diesel-benz list > Subject: RE: Diesel Benz Reliability? > > On Wed, 30 Jun 1999, Farnes_Quinn wrote: > > >-->Thanks, John, I'm reassured. Just reading through the Haynes manual, > it > >-->looks like everything's pretty well laid out, not crammed in to a > too-small > >-->space as is the case with most import compacts and subcompacts. I'm > looking > >-->forward to my Benz! Wonder where she is just now? > > It's awesome to work on. Very simple. Well engineered. I've worked on a > lot of cars and trucks... these things are superb! > > john > > ---- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > john-at-virtual-cafe.com **** Snohomish, Washington USA > don't leave life without jesus, please... > http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john > http://wagoneers.com > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 11:56:01 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: RE: Diesel Benz Reliability? On Wed, 30 Jun 1999, Farnes_Quinn wrote: >-->Talked to the parts guy and told him my plans (to acquire a 123-style Diesel >-->which I will have to maintain myself), and asked him what parts generally >-->cost. He soberly replied that he cannot think of a single car from any >-->manufacturer that would be cheaper to maintain than a Mercedes. Example: >-->water pump $28, with rebuildable Mercedes core, otherwise $70 core charge >-->applies. He said that's typical. and there are sources like Rusty down in Atlanta, IMPCO and small shops like mine that can get those parts even for less... :) >--> >-->Manuals are no longer available for the 123s on paper. All CD at $115, so I >-->guess that's the way I'll have to go. Hmmm, maybe I can relegate my laptop >-->to the garage then, and lobby my wife to allow me to get a newer one for >-->inside! $100 is my cost at the local dealer, I think that's also retail. No price break on the CD he said... >--> >-->It's nice to be able to verify from the dealer what y'all have been saying >-->all along. >-->Quinn I was amazed at how easy, and inexpensive it was to do the water pump!!!! I've never seen a car as easy to work on! john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-virtual-cafe.com **** Snohomish, Washington USA don't leave life without jesus, please... http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john http://wagoneers.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 13:51:58 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: new link - Diesel Gelandewagen anyone? :) turns out one of the guys on the xj list has an 81 300D. :) anyway, he turned me on to a website for the Gelandewagen... I put a link on my server to it. :) (I would love to have a Diesel powered Gelandewagen... :) Shoot, I might even consider selling one of my Jeeps... :) http://www.wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/ john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- john-at-virtual-cafe.com **** Snohomish, Washington USA don't leave life without jesus, please... http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john http://wagoneers.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ====================================================================================== To subscribe to a list on digest.net, EMAIL majordomo-at-digest.net, no subject needed, in the body: subscribe [ fsj | xj | diesel-benz ] end (note: select only one of the options in the brackets) You will need to reply to an authentication message. Add a "-digest" to any of the lists to subscribe in the digest mode (messages are grouped, less traffic). Please do not send HTML, special characters, images, SPAM, attachments or stylized text to the lists. The "FOUR" List Rules: 1) NO flames. 2) NO foul language. 3) keep it Family oriented. 4) keep the subject list oriented. to post, email [xj | fsj | diesel-benz]-at-digest.net to unsubscribe, email majordomo-at-digest.net in the message: unsubscribe (list name) (your email) end ====================================================================================== john-at-wagoneers.com http://www.virtual-cafe.com/~john http://www.wagoneers.com http://www.wagoneers.com/book-info.html http://www.wagoneers.com/BIBLE ====================================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 01 Jul 1999 00:04:01 -0400 From: "Matthew J. Mason" Subject: G-wagen follow up... from the _Illustrated Buyer's Guide to Mercedes Benz,_ by Frank Barrett, published 1998 by MBI (Motorbooks International): "...A 280GE won the 6,000 mile 1983 Paris-Dakar rally...[awesome!] ...Most of those [G-Wagens] in the United States were imported through special importers and modified to meet US safety and emissions regulations. Most US Benz dealers don't know much about them [ha!] so you must rely on others for parts and service, which works well. ...By 1995, the G-Wagen's US price hit $120,000, but when the $35,000 ML320 appeared in 1997, sales hardly slowed." I'm blanking on the number, but someone said that not too many were imported to the US... Funny, but as a kid in NY suburbs (which of course means more affluence than in many other areas, granted) I can remember seeing these around quite a bit. Being six or seven and not knowing better, I used to just call them "Mercedes Jeeps..." So does anyone know how -- if at all -- the 300GD engine differs from the 300D of the era? I notice the dashboard in Doug's pictures looks suspiciously familiar... :) 120 grand? ouch... not this week... :) -- mjm ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #163 *********************************