From: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net (diesel-benz-digest) To: diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Subject: diesel-benz-digest V1 #949 Reply-To: diesel-benz-at-digest.net Sender: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Errors-To: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Precedence: bulk diesel-benz-digest Sunday, March 30 2003 Volume 01 : Number 949 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: 32 mpg Re: 32 mpg Re: temperature sensors Timing Belts (Was300 D Q's) Re: Timing Belts (Was300 D Q's) Fwd: Re: 32 mpg Re: 300 D Q's Re: 32 mpg Rear diff going out????? Re: 32 mpg Re: 32 mpg Re: Fwd: Re: 32 mpg Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 12:37:46 -0800 From: john Subject: Re: 32 mpg At 03:27 PM 3/29/2003 -0500, Gary, Orlando wrote: >Concerning cost of fuel... > >Federal tax on diesel is $0.06 more than gas, at $0.24/gal. I think state taxes here in Washington are higher on the Diesel as well... >This is something that we "personal" i.e. non-commercial diesel users >need to bitch at the government about... Why a higher tax on diesel? >At first glance, one would think..."ok, since most of any industry is >powered by diesel, let's tax them more." But don't they have a special >"dyed" diesel for commercial users, not counting over-the-road truckers? >I imagine most truckers will write this tax off as a business expense. there is a dyed version for OFF_ROAD use only... you get caught with that in an on-the-road Diesel and the fine is about $2,500. My farmer neighbor has some and that's what he said yesterday... :) >So, in essence, the feds are actually taxing the 'private' consumer more >than gas users. What is the proportion of 'private' gas users to >'private' diesel users. It has to be a HUGE number. So, what real >benefit do the federallies have by a higher diesel tax? hard to say... they'll take money any way they can get it... ;) john >Something to think about. > >-Gary in Orlando >1986 MB 190D 2.5 > >$1.79/ gal at 434 & Colonial Chevron > > > >On Sat, 2003-03-29 at 14:33, john wrote: > > At 10:57 AM 3/29/2003 -0800, Paul Schwartz pschw-at-earthlink.net wrote: > > > > Drove up I-5 to Mt.Vernon, down to Seattle and back home, > > > > 80% of this last tank was freeway mileage... rated at 33/44. > > > > Monday we install the new timing chain, hoses, etc. Have > > > > all the parts and ready to go... > > > > > >Timing chain is first on my list is major upgrades. Any thoughts on > swedging > > >vs. a clip style master link? > > >Where would I get one of those swedging tools? > > >Paul > > > > I'd start with a search on Google.com :) > > > > I'm hoping the timing chain will improve the economy, but even at 32mpg > > it's a winner. > > > > My wife noticed that Diesel costs 11 cents more then unleaded... gears > > started turning (she's trying to justify keeping the WJ obviously) and > > said it costs more for Diesel. > > > > So, I did the math. > > > > 1.88 1.88 1.97 1.97 cost / gallon > > 17 14 32 40 mpg > > 10 10 10 10 gallons > > 170 140 320 400 miles driven > > 18.8 18.8 19.7 19.7 cost for 10gal > > 0.111 0.134 0.062 0.049 cost per mile > > > > So, the WJ costs about 13.4 cents per mile in town > > versus about 6.2 cents per mile in town for the 190D. > > The XJ runs about 11.1 cents per mile in town (the WJ > > gets almost 20 on the freeway). Ultimately when the > > 190D is dialed in, if it gets close to it's official > > EPA rating, it'll cost less then a nickel a mile to fuel. > > > > So, despite the increased costs of Diesel fuel the Diesel > > still offers better economy. > > > > john > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > > http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ > > Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... > > jesus, don't leave life without him, please! > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 15:41:13 -0500 From: Michael Frank Subject: Re: 32 mpg A few flawed assumptions here. - - Business will write off ALL their fuel costs, not just road use taxes. It's an expense item. - - You have to spend money to write it off, nothing comes free. - - The overwhelming majority of over the road Diesel users are truckers. Trucks tear up the highways more than cars do, so truckers pay more tax. What you are really asking for is a separate pump and tax rate for automotive users. Don't worry about convincing the gov't. Worry about convincing your service station. - - Stationary Diesels and farm Diesels don't have to pay road use tax, their fuel is dyed red. They still get to write off their fuel costs. Mike Frank At 03:27 PM 3/29/03, Gary, Orlando wrote: >Concerning cost of fuel... > >So, in essence, the feds are actually taxing the 'private' consumer more >than gas users. What is the proportion of 'private' gas users to >'private' diesel users. It has to be a HUGE number. So, what real >benefit do the federallies have by a higher diesel tax? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 14:58:26 -0600 From: Jon Filina Subject: Re: temperature sensors Steve offered: > I have a '84 300D and there are 2 coolant temperature sensors that I > know of: > (1) in the engine coolant exit (thremo housing) for cabin heater > lockout (for temp < 40 deg C.) > (1) for temperature guage..located in the driver's side of the > cylinder head between 2 of the glow plugs OK, now I'm going to have check the manual. I just assumed there was only one sensor. Last weekend I repaired the wire from sensor on the thermstat housing, replaced all the fuses and swapped out the bypass hoses to stop a leak at the no. 1 injector. The fuses were the first step in troubleshooting the automatic climate control and the wire from the sensor was an attempt to eliminate minor erratic fluctuations of the temperature gauge. The climate control now works much better. It still thinks I'm comfortable with the temperature setting I've dialed, and lowers the fan speed accordinly, even though I'm not. But that's probably by design or temp sensor above the dome light is dirty. The temp gauge is still erratic. I'll have to check for that second sensor. If fuel has been leaking on it, that could be the source of my gauge problem. Thanks for the tip, Jon > >> From: Jon Filina >> To: Paul Schwartz >> CC: diesel-benz-at-digest.net >> Subject: Re: What is it? >> Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 01:46:32 -0600 >> >> Paul scratched his head and wrote: >> >>> BTW--on the top of the thermostat housing is some kind of sensor and >>> the >>> wire fell off (broke). What is this sensor, is it the temperature >>> sensor? >>> I suppose I'll know tomorrow when the gauge doesn't work. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 16:35:26 -0800 From: Dan J Subject: Timing Belts (Was300 D Q's) At 11:36 AM 3/29/2003 -0800, you wrote: >>Belts are cheaper, quieter, and take far less energy to turn. They really >>aren't bad expect for the idiots who decided to turn the water pump with the >>cam belt. Water pump goes, engine goes. Planned obsolescence > >actually, no, it's designed to make sure that folks raised on american >iron realize they have to replace the timing belt. I actually prefer that >setup. It ensures that the timing belt is replaced, they're also easier >to change then the ones embedded behind a cover and hidden from view. I have a motorcycle that has two camshaft belts. I remove a cover, they are right there to inspect and check for excess stretch, and can be easily replaced in about 30 minutes. Mucho better than a deeply almost hidden chain. Just remember, if the manual says 50K miles between belt changes, stick to it. Modern engines are higher compression, and therefore are not "clearance" engines. dieseldan, your "Watch what happens when the cam belt goes on that fellers gold wing and the rear wheel locks up!" man in Washougal, WA ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 18:48:10 -0800 (PST) From: Jerome Kaidor Subject: Re: Timing Belts (Was300 D Q's) Dan J wrote: > > I have a motorcycle that has two camshaft belts. I remove a cover, they > are right there to inspect and check for excess stretch, and can be easily > replaced in about 30 minutes. Mucho better than a deeply almost hidden chain. > *** Sounds like a Gold Wing. I bought one of those once. On the way home, one of the -at-#$#$ belts broke, and left me stranded by the side of the road. Cost me $250 to have the thing towed, and another $400 or so for one head rebuild and some obscenely expensive Honda exhaust valves. Those belts are great as long as you change'm every XX,000 miles. - Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 10:04:18 -0800 From: Greg Fiorentino Subject: Fwd: Re: 32 mpg >>Timing chain is first on my list is major upgrades. Any thoughts on swedging >>vs. a clip style master link? Is such a thing (clip style) available for the OM 617 engine? It would certainly make the job simpler. I understand the swaging tool is $pendy. Greg Fiorentino Vancouver USA gfior-at-dslnorthwest.net '84 300D Turbo '79 300TD '85 F-350 6.9 crew cab ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 11:29:43 -0800 From: "Paul Schwartz" Subject: Re: 300 D Q's - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john" behind a cover and hidden from view. > > I still prefer the timing chain and make it a point to keep my fleet > in chains. ;) Kinky! Paul ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 11:35:36 -0800 From: "Paul Schwartz" Subject: Re: 32 mpg > Federal tax on diesel is $0.06 more than gas, at $0.24/gal. With the "clean air fuel" with have in Kalifornia, diesel is way cheaper than unleaded regular. I've seen, and filled up on, 1.75 for D2, RUL (Regular UnLeaded) is about 2.10 at the cheap spots. D2 can be found for about 1.80-1.90. Actually, since all motor fuel is unleaded now it is redundant to say regular unleaded. Until the war is over I suspect diesels are gonna be way cheaper here. I noticed a local VW dealer advertising a TDI Bug. Paul ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 12:19:16 -0800 (PST) From: hue wong Subject: Rear diff going out????? Hey all got a question. For the last 300 miles or so I've been getting a noticably louder grinding in the rear end of my '71 280sel. It comes and goes around 40 or so. Finally yesterday I was driving and went to put it into reverse and the linkage between something and the automatic stick on the coloum broke. I can still put it into gear and it seems to drive just fine, but the gear indicator on the coloum won't work any longer. And on top of it all, the strange grinding noise has almost gone away entirely. I'm thinking that the grinding was the linkage cable grinding through something and it finally did. My fear is that the worst is yet to come. The grinding sound seems to come from the right rear centertransaxle/differental area. Anyone know how hard this is to fix and how much it may cost? I'm in seattle and have to take it into a shop (majaraja motors on lake city way???) as this type of repair is beyond me! zoiks! (the car did have 235k miles on it on it so I guess that's not to bad...) Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 12:21:22 -0800 (PST) From: hue wong Subject: Re: 32 mpg Don't they tax diesel higher becuase it pollutes more? - --- Michael Frank wrote: > A few flawed assumptions here. > - Business will write off ALL their fuel costs, not > just road use taxes. > It's an expense item. > > - You have to spend money to write it off, nothing > comes free. > > - The overwhelming majority of over the road Diesel > users are truckers. > Trucks tear up the highways more than cars do, so > truckers pay more tax. > What you are really asking for is a separate pump > and tax rate for > automotive users. Don't worry about convincing the > gov't. Worry about > convincing your service station. > > - Stationary Diesels and farm Diesels don't have to > pay road use tax, their > fuel is dyed red. They still get to write off their > fuel costs. > > Mike Frank > > > > > > At 03:27 PM 3/29/03, Gary, Orlando wrote: > >Concerning cost of fuel... > > > >So, in essence, the feds are actually taxing the > 'private' consumer more > >than gas users. What is the proportion of 'private' > gas users to > >'private' diesel users. It has to be a HUGE number. > So, what real > >benefit do the federallies have by a higher diesel tax? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 15:31:52 -0500 From: Michael Frank Subject: Re: 32 mpg I don't think so, it's really got to do with wear and tear to highways....the tax goes into the highway trust fund. I think that in the future, they may tax Diesel more because of perceived pollution issues. But Diesel really DOESN'T pollute more. HC, CO, and CO2 are all lower in a Diesel than a comparable gas engine...NOx and particulates are higher. It all depends on what you count. Mike Frank At 03:21 PM 3/30/03, you wrote >Don't they tax diesel higher becuase it pollutes more? ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2003 14:31:18 -0800 From: john Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: 32 mpg the new timing chain was purchased with a new master link... clip style... getting installed tomorrow... john At 10:04 AM 3/30/2003 -0800, Greg Fiorentino wrote: >>>Timing chain is first on my list is major upgrades. Any thoughts on swedging >>>vs. a clip style master link? > >Is such a thing (clip style) available for the OM 617 engine? It would >certainly make the job simpler. I understand the swaging tool is $pendy. > > >Greg Fiorentino >Vancouver USA >gfior-at-dslnorthwest.net > >'84 300D Turbo >'79 300TD >'85 F-350 6.9 crew cab - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #949 *********************************