From: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net (diesel-benz-digest) To: diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Subject: diesel-benz-digest V1 #976 Reply-To: diesel-benz-at-digest.net Sender: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Errors-To: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Precedence: bulk diesel-benz-digest Friday, April 18 2003 Volume 01 : Number 976 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: RE: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! 300 CD value Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:13:57 -0500 From: "Black, Waylon" Subject: RE: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! It's not just Euro cars, either. Manufacturers have realized that they cannot make cars that last 30 years. It would bankrupt them. They have it down to a science - 10 years/150,000 max, maybe. Perfect example - Honda. Remember the CVCC models that lasted FOREVER. Once established in the US, with a good rep, their longevity has reduced considerably. You could look at just about any manufacture and see the trend. MB and Volvo had a rep for cars that last for ever - not anymore. As US cars increased their quality, imports just had to reduce their quality. Think about MB and Volvo - they used the same bodies for years. Why buy a new model when a 5+ year old model looks/performs identical. That's why I love the 300 SDs. - I have no desire for a new anything. WB - -----Original Message----- From: Eurowerks [mailto:eurowerks-at-qx.net] Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2003 6:02 AM To: mercedes-at-mercedesmailinglist.com; diesel-benz-at-digest.net; Robert Chase Subject: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! You are right on the mark with the 95' model year. You may even want to back up a few years to about 92' when the 140 body was introduced Buy a good old 123 or even a 126 body and maintain it properly, and you will still see it on the road in 30 years. Not so of the newer models. Most of these will be scrap by that time! I am not guessing, I am positive...I have thousands of service records to prove it! Kirk A. Gilchrist EURO-WERKS / Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Volvo Service and Repair 8 South Highland St. / Winchester, KY 40391 / 859-745-0125 eurowerks-at-qx.net / 888-522-0271 toll free Ouch, Reminds me of my 1998 Volvo S70 Nightmare (if it could break it did and usually more than once). So are you noticing the quality drop drasticly on post 1995 european cars across the board? I ask that because I notice you work on most of them :) Robert. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 17:44:37 -0400 From: Robert Chase Subject: Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! Yeah, How about doing something legitimate for your money instead of misleading people and lying? Every car I have ever bought has been sold to me on the premise of quality construction and workmanship. Back in the "old days" when you could actually buy a car that would last longer than 100k miles manafacturers used performance and features to lure new buyers into the showrooms. The Salesman that sold me my Volvo was quick to end our conversation when I confronted him about the "pile of junk" he sold me pretending to be a car (I had 4 serious mechanical failures within the first few weeks of owning my "Quality Certified Preowned Vehicle"). MB ad Volvo could easily sell more cars by increasing their saftey ratings. There are lots of people who value their neck enough to spend the money for a new car. BMW has no problems moving cars either. They continually increase their features and most new BMW folks are lease mongers anyway turning their cars in and getting new ones continually. Mercedes "new market" or at least the market we seem to have here in Atlanta dumps a car the SECOND the body style changes. Within moments of a body change the dealers here are flooded with purchases and the chrome wheel shops have blow out sales on tacky chromium plated resale value killers. I remember a article from a car mag with Nissan mentioning something like the following "why build a doorhandle to last 20 years when now the estimated life of a car is 10 years". Its almost like admiting that you are cheapening your car. Even if I planned on keeping a car for 2 years I would never consider purchacing a car that was built to only last 10 years. That kills the resale value. I don't want to send my car to the crusher after driving it or loose my shirt paying for a car thats worthless when Im done with it. Whell now time to go deal with a lovely neighbor issue :). The guy next door seems to think its ok to steal my lawnmower, use it in front of me and then have the gall to complain to the county that I have not mowed my lawn and its unsightly. Wonder how one should start a conversation with someone like that :). Robert. Black, Waylon wrote: >It's not just Euro cars, either. Manufacturers have realized that they >cannot make cars that last 30 years. It would bankrupt them. They have it >down to a science - 10 years/150,000 max, maybe. Perfect example - Honda. >Remember the CVCC models that lasted FOREVER. Once established in the US, >with a good rep, their longevity has reduced considerably. You could look at >just about any manufacture and see the trend. MB and Volvo had a rep for >cars that last for ever - not anymore. As US cars increased their quality, >imports just had to reduce their quality. Think about MB and Volvo - they >used the same bodies for years. Why buy a new model when a 5+ year old model >looks/performs identical. > >That's why I love the 300 SDs. - I have no desire for a new anything. > > >WB > >-----Original Message----- >From: Eurowerks [mailto:eurowerks-at-qx.net] >Sent: Thursday, April 17, 2003 6:02 AM >To: mercedes-at-mercedesmailinglist.com; diesel-benz-at-digest.net; Robert Chase >Subject: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! > >You are right on the mark with the 95' model year. You may even want to >back up a few years to about 92' when the 140 body was introduced > > >Buy a good old 123 or even a 126 body and maintain it properly, and you will >still see it on the road in 30 years. Not so of the newer models. Most of >these will be scrap by that time! I am not guessing, I am positive...I have >thousands of service records to prove it! > >Kirk A. Gilchrist >EURO-WERKS / Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Volvo Service and Repair >8 South Highland St. / Winchester, KY 40391 / 859-745-0125 >eurowerks-at-qx.net / 888-522-0271 toll free > >Ouch, > >Reminds me of my 1998 Volvo S70 Nightmare (if it could break it did and >usually more than once). So are you noticing the quality drop drasticly >on post 1995 european cars across the board? I ask that because I >notice you work on most of them :) > >Robert. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 14:49:14 -0700 From: Kevin Pekarek Subject: Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! On Thu, Apr 17, 2003 at 05:44:37PM -0400, Robert Chase wrote: > I remember a article from a car mag with Nissan mentioning something > like the following "why build a doorhandle to last 20 years when now the > estimated life of a car is 10 years". Its almost like admiting that you > are cheapening your car. Even if I planned on keeping a car for 2 years > I would never consider purchacing a car that was built to only last 10 > years. That kills the resale value. I don't want to send my car to the > crusher after driving it or loose my shirt paying for a car thats > worthless when Im done with it. I certainly agree. > Whell now time to go deal with a lovely neighbor issue :). The guy next > door seems to think its ok to steal my lawnmower, use it in front of me > and then have the gall to complain to the county that I have not mowed > my lawn and its unsightly. Wonder how one should start a conversation > with someone like that :). Call the police to report it stolen, then later today or tomorrow tell them that you've found it and want to press charges. :) He obviously doesn't mind playing hardball. K - -- Kevin Pekarek Redwood City, CA (near San Francisco) and Los Osos, CA (near San Luis Obispo) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 12 Apr 2003 15:15:37 -0400 From: Renaud OLGIATI Subject: Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! My mailbox was recently graced by a missive from Robert Chase : > I remember a article from a car mag with Nissan mentioning something > like the following "why build a doorhandle to last 20 years when now the > estimated life of a car is 10 years". But can we really build a car like the proverbial one-hoss shay, with every part lasting as long an no more than the rest ? Ron. - -- A poet who reads his verse in public may have other nasty habits. -- http://www.olgiati-in-paraguay.org -- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 17:36:29 -0500 From: "Vernon Tuck" Subject: Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! In my opinion, this is PRECISELY the genius of the Japanese automakers. Their cars are designed to be trouble free for X years. Then, every part ON 'em wears out the same week! Of course I'm exaggerating.. but not by much. VT - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Renaud OLGIATI" To: Sent: Saturday, April 12, 2003 2:15 PM Subject: Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! > My mailbox was recently graced by a missive from Robert Chase : > > > I remember a article from a car mag with Nissan mentioning something > > like the following "why build a doorhandle to last 20 years when now the > > estimated life of a car is 10 years". > > But can we really build a car like the proverbial one-hoss shay, with every > part lasting as long an no more than the rest ? > > Ron. > -- > A poet who reads his verse in public > may have other nasty habits. > > -- http://www.olgiati-in-paraguay.org -- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 20:11:00 -0400 From: Robert Chase Subject: Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! Heh heh, Went over and tried to talk to him and he got defensive and started yelling at me. I kindly thanked him for his time grabbed my paperwork that I showed him and said "ill just call the police to handle this" on the way out the door. Needless to say while I was dialing 911 on my cellphone on the way back to my house he rolled up with my lawnmower. Im tempted to make a report just in case as I think he probably has more stuff over there that belongs to us. I was "hoping" that he would make some kind of excuse like "oh sorry I ours broke and we borrowed yours I hope you did not think I was trying to steal it". But instead he decided to be an arsewhore :). Got the mower back and I can take care of my lawn and some of these cars I inherited. Dad god rest his soul had horrible taste in cars. I have a 1992 Plymouth Sundance and a 1989 Chevy S10 pickup for sale if anybody's interested :) R. Kevin Pekarek wrote: >On Thu, Apr 17, 2003 at 05:44:37PM -0400, Robert Chase wrote: > > >>I remember a article from a car mag with Nissan mentioning something >>like the following "why build a doorhandle to last 20 years when now the >>estimated life of a car is 10 years". Its almost like admiting that you >>are cheapening your car. Even if I planned on keeping a car for 2 years >>I would never consider purchacing a car that was built to only last 10 >>years. That kills the resale value. I don't want to send my car to the >>crusher after driving it or loose my shirt paying for a car thats >>worthless when Im done with it. >> >> > >I certainly agree. > > > >>Whell now time to go deal with a lovely neighbor issue :). The guy next >>door seems to think its ok to steal my lawnmower, use it in front of me >>and then have the gall to complain to the county that I have not mowed >>my lawn and its unsightly. Wonder how one should start a conversation >>with someone like that :). >> >> > >Call the police to report it stolen, then later today or tomorrow tell them >that you've found it and want to press charges. :) > >He obviously doesn't mind playing hardball. > >K ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 10:55:22 +1000 From: Guy Carpenter Subject: Re: New model MB, BMW, Volvo garbage! I was thinking about your situation as I was out mowing my own place this morning. Sounds like a great neighbor! I live in a small rural community (sounds like maybe you do too?) and sorting this stuff out is complicated when your idiot neighbor may also be the local cop's dad or the post mistresses brother. Picking a fight can turn out badly, even if you are in the right. Sounds to me like you did an excellent job of finessing it; giving him an easy way out, but with a solid contingency plan when he turned nasty. Full points! Well done. Cheers, Guy. At 08:11 PM 17/04/2003 -0400, Robert Chase wrote: >Heh heh, > >Went over and tried to talk to him and he got defensive and started >yelling at me. I kindly thanked him for his time grabbed my paperwork >that I showed him and said "ill just call the police to handle this" on >the way out the door. Needless to say while I was dialing 911 on my >cellphone on the way back to my house he rolled up with my lawnmower. >Im tempted to make a report just in case as I think he probably has more >stuff over there that belongs to us. >I was "hoping" that he would make some kind of excuse like "oh sorry I >ours broke and we borrowed yours I hope you did not think I was trying to >steal it". But instead he decided to be an arsewhore :). Got the mower >back and I can take care of my lawn and some of these cars I >inherited. Dad god rest his soul had horrible taste in cars. I have a >1992 Plymouth Sundance and a 1989 Chevy S10 pickup for sale if anybody's >interested :) > >R. > > > >Kevin Pekarek wrote: > >>On Thu, Apr 17, 2003 at 05:44:37PM -0400, Robert Chase wrote: >> >> >>>I remember a article from a car mag with Nissan mentioning something >>>like the following "why build a doorhandle to last 20 years when now the >>>estimated life of a car is 10 years". Its almost like admiting that you >>>are cheapening your car. Even if I planned on keeping a car for 2 years >>>I would never consider purchacing a car that was built to only last 10 >>>years. That kills the resale value. I don't want to send my car to the >>>crusher after driving it or loose my shirt paying for a car thats >>>worthless when Im done with it. >> >>I certainly agree. >> >> >> >>>Whell now time to go deal with a lovely neighbor issue :). The guy next >>>door seems to think its ok to steal my lawnmower, use it in front of me >>>and then have the gall to complain to the county that I have not mowed >>>my lawn and its unsightly. Wonder how one should start a conversation >>>with someone like that :). >>> >> >>Call the police to report it stolen, then later today or tomorrow tell >>them that you've found it and want to press charges. :) >> >>He obviously doesn't mind playing hardball. >> >>K ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 11:24:31 -0500 From: "Black, Waylon" Subject: 300 CD value Saw a 300 CD near the house. Asking 2750. Car is a little rough but all there. Odo shows 126K but has not been working for a while. Wheels have been replaced with some chrome wire wheels. It looks like a 2 seater disguised as a 4 seater. Not much leg room in the back. I may try to get it. Any comments? What chassis is it? 1985 model with Euro lights. Waylon ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #976 *********************************