From: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net (diesel-benz-digest) To: diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Subject: diesel-benz-digest V1 #988 Reply-To: diesel-benz-at-digest.net Sender: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Errors-To: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Precedence: bulk diesel-benz-digest Friday, April 25 2003 Volume 01 : Number 988 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: RE: Headlight control relay RE: Headlight control relay RE: Headlight control relay Cheap MB's (sorta a flame) RE: what is rare? Re: Cheap MB's (sorta a flame) RE: Cheap MB's (sorta a flame) Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 21:52:50 -0700 From: john Subject: RE: Headlight control relay try resoldering the circuit boards... carefully, use a good 60/40 rosin core solder and a 700 degree pencil tip. john At 10:45 PM 4/24/2003 -0600, JC Jones wrote: >Unfortunately, I did take it apart and discovered that it's an extremely >complicated solid state device - no contacts to clean :( I was thinking the >same thing about just cleaning/repairing it - it has about 30+ pins, it's >about 5" long and has 2 circuit boards inside, and 3 different plugs - 2 to >the harness and one hard mounted in the fuse box. Here's the strange part >about the whole thing, while I was wiggling it around just to see if it was >a contact issue, the front electric fans started turning on and off, then >finally just completely quit. I think I'm going to pull the fuse box and >see if there is any wiring harness damage under it. > >JC Jones :) > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net] On >Behalf Of Robert Chase >Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2003 2:50 PM >To: jcjones-at-ifsja.org >Cc: diesel-benz-at-digest.net >Subject: Re: Headlight control relay > > >Hmmm, > >Its under the hood im pretty sure and just a simple relay. I have never >messed around with mine but I would think you could probably open it and >try cleaning it to get some more life out of it. > >Robert. > > > >JC Jones wrote: > > >This is not exactly Diesel related, but it is w126 related. > > > >The car is a 1990 560SEL, and I am looking for the "headlight control > >relay". I put that in quotes because I'm not 100% that it is actually > >called that, but what I need is the relay that all the light circuits > >go through and it also sends the signal to the bulb out indicator on > >the dash. The price I was quoted was $240, so I was hoping somebody > >might be parting out a 126 with that relay in it. > > > >Thanks, > >JC Jones - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 23:44:32 -0600 From: "JC Jones" Subject: RE: Headlight control relay I'll give that a shot and see what happens. The symptom is that the right low beam and right fog light don't work, and the "bulb out" indicator on the dashboard is lit. The headlight bulb and the fog light bulb are both new and the harness/plugs appear to be in excellent condition. The right high-beam does work however, as well as all the other lights on the car. I am quickly learning that 560SEL parts are not nearly as cheap as parts for the 300D. I am also learning that buying a 560SEL for 2k under low book can quickly turn into having average book price into it by the time it is all fixed.. ;) JC Jones - -----Original Message----- From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2003 10:53 PM To: jcjones-at-ifsja.org; diesel-benz-at-digest.net Subject: RE: Headlight control relay try resoldering the circuit boards... carefully, use a good 60/40 rosin core solder and a 700 degree pencil tip. john At 10:45 PM 4/24/2003 -0600, JC Jones wrote: >Unfortunately, I did take it apart and discovered that it's an >extremely complicated solid state device - no contacts to clean :( I >was thinking the same thing about just cleaning/repairing it - it has >about 30+ pins, it's about 5" long and has 2 circuit boards inside, and >3 different plugs - 2 to the harness and one hard mounted in the fuse >box. Here's the strange part about the whole thing, while I was >wiggling it around just to see if it was a contact issue, the front >electric fans started turning on and off, then finally just completely >quit. I think I'm going to pull the fuse box and see if there is any >wiring harness damage under it. > >JC Jones :) > >-----Original Message----- >From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net >[mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Robert Chase >Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2003 2:50 PM >To: jcjones-at-ifsja.org >Cc: diesel-benz-at-digest.net >Subject: Re: Headlight control relay > > >Hmmm, > >Its under the hood im pretty sure and just a simple relay. I have >never messed around with mine but I would think you could probably open >it and try cleaning it to get some more life out of it. > >Robert. > > > >JC Jones wrote: > > >This is not exactly Diesel related, but it is w126 related. > > > >The car is a 1990 560SEL, and I am looking for the "headlight control > >relay". I put that in quotes because I'm not 100% that it is > >actually called that, but what I need is the relay that all the light > >circuits go through and it also sends the signal to the bulb out > >indicator on the dash. The price I was quoted was $240, so I was > >hoping somebody might be parting out a 126 with that relay in it. > > > >Thanks, > >JC Jones ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 22:51:37 -0700 From: john Subject: RE: Headlight control relay At 11:44 PM 4/24/2003 -0600, JC Jones wrote: >I'll give that a shot and see what happens. The symptom is that the right >low beam and right fog light don't work, and the "bulb out" indicator on the >dashboard is lit. The headlight bulb and the fog light bulb are both new >and the harness/plugs appear to be in excellent condition. The right >high-beam does work however, as well as all the other lights on the car. the german electronics don't hold up well... I was able to salvage much of my cruise control by reflowing the solder... >I am quickly learning that 560SEL parts are not nearly as cheap as parts for >the 300D. I am also learning that buying a 560SEL for 2k under low book can >quickly turn into having average book price into it by the time it is all >fixed.. ;) yeah, I know, I know, my 190D went the same way... got it for a couple hundred under book, now I'm probably well over a grand in it beyond book... :) john >JC Jones > >-----Original Message----- >From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] >Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2003 10:53 PM >To: jcjones-at-ifsja.org; diesel-benz-at-digest.net >Subject: RE: Headlight control relay > > > >try resoldering the circuit boards... carefully, use >a good 60/40 rosin core solder and a 700 degree pencil tip. > >john > >At 10:45 PM 4/24/2003 -0600, JC Jones wrote: > >Unfortunately, I did take it apart and discovered that it's an > >extremely complicated solid state device - no contacts to clean :( I > >was thinking the same thing about just cleaning/repairing it - it has > >about 30+ pins, it's about 5" long and has 2 circuit boards inside, and > >3 different plugs - 2 to the harness and one hard mounted in the fuse > >box. Here's the strange part about the whole thing, while I was > >wiggling it around just to see if it was a contact issue, the front > >electric fans started turning on and off, then finally just completely > >quit. I think I'm going to pull the fuse box and see if there is any > >wiring harness damage under it. > > > >JC Jones :) > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net > >[mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Robert Chase > >Sent: Thursday, April 24, 2003 2:50 PM > >To: jcjones-at-ifsja.org > >Cc: diesel-benz-at-digest.net > >Subject: Re: Headlight control relay > > > > > >Hmmm, > > > >Its under the hood im pretty sure and just a simple relay. I have > >never messed around with mine but I would think you could probably open > >it and try cleaning it to get some more life out of it. > > > >Robert. > > > > > > > >JC Jones wrote: > > > > >This is not exactly Diesel related, but it is w126 related. > > > > > >The car is a 1990 560SEL, and I am looking for the "headlight control > > >relay". I put that in quotes because I'm not 100% that it is > > >actually called that, but what I need is the relay that all the light > > >circuits go through and it also sends the signal to the bulb out > > >indicator on the dash. The price I was quoted was $240, so I was > > >hoping somebody might be parting out a 126 with that relay in it. > > > > > >Thanks, > > >JC Jones - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 05:01:48 -0400 From: Robert Chase Subject: Cheap MB's (sorta a flame) Come on guys... Gimme a break here..... Cars are machines. Machines break. No matter if you have a brand new machine or an old machine. This cheap Mercedes stuff is just a lot of superstition. There is no way that you can predict which machines will fail and which ones will last forever. The price you pay for the car has nothing to do with how much repair you will have to put into it. My 82 300SD was filled with water when I bought it and had a number of major issues that screamed "stay away" yet it has been the posterchild for reliability and has yet to give me major greif. My car was a super well maintained car that spent several years in a parking deck. Paying on the front end does not give you any additional reliability. If your transmission has a manafacturing defect in it that has taken 10 years or 2 years to surface having perfect maint records and paying full book does nothing to help you. Same thing goes with every other system on the car. The only way to be absolutely sure is to dissasemble the car and look at every part and put it back together. If it makes you feel better to pay more than you have to please feel free. I would rather get a good deal and absorb the costs of the repairs and know that they were done right and its unlikely I will have the same failure within a reasonable time frame (although one never knows cars have that fun way of suprising you). The Important thing to keep in mind is that all cars are unknowns until you get to know them. My dad had an interesting saying "the beast you know is sometimes better than the one you don't". I do see "some" logic to what your saying though. If your looking at a car with a LOT of stuff wrong with it its likely the owner was not forthcoming with you on other repairs that it probably needs as well. Thats just part of kicking the tires and doing the numbers. I have gotten plenty of good deals on great cars. I have been lucky in spotting major problems and avoiding bad cars. I have only been burned a couple of times and usually it was a "gray area" kind of issue and I did not check those issues thouroughly. A friend of mine drives me crazy though with his "used cars are used cars for a reason". He will only buy new cars and thinks that he is safe from issues. His First Volvo C70 Convertible bought brand new was returned under lemon law because it was such a horrid piece of junk. He is on his second one and is already counting the days before his lease ends :). I always look at a broken part as an chance to make that kind of failure unlikely in the future. Hopefully my karma will be good and my car won't completely unravel in front of my eyes like my S70 did because I dared to question the laws of the universe :). Enjoy your cars and keep in mind that every penny you put in maint and repairs is a penny you did not loose in a dealership profit or interest on a loan. You got something for what you spent. Robert. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:54:13 -0400 From: Renaud OLGIATI Subject: RE: what is rare? My mailbox was recently graced by a missive from Black, Waylon : > The exception would be something that was made in limited numbers, on > purpose. Or made in greater number, but a lot of them destroyed: like the 1941 VW Kubelwagen I had for 25 years. Cheers, Ron. - -- Asking a working writer what he thinks about critics is like asking a lamp-post how it feels about dogs. -- Christopher Hampton -- http://www.olgiati-in-paraguay.org -- ------------------------------ Date: 25 Apr 2003 09:14:04 -0400 From: gary Subject: Re: Cheap MB's (sorta a flame) Well said and right on! My sentiments exactly. However, my philosophy is bourne from a different background... As a young enlisted man, I could never afford a (st/d)ealer's rates. It was always cheaper to buy the tools and do it myself. And this was with VW diesels. Now, I take great pride in keeping my 'vintage' iron in good repair. Knowing that I did it myself. I hope my children will pick up on that as they grow. Though I could more afford it recently, I had a quote to do my front ball joints for $250. I've heard that they needed to be pressed out/in with a press, and that the front springs had to be compressed with a special "inner" spring compressor. Well, I got one of those 3-in-1 ball joint servicing sets (on sale) from Harbour Freight, the ball joints from Rusty, jacked up then set the car down on blocks under the control arms, and 3 hours later, new ball joints. Less than $100 total. - -Gary in Orlando 1986 MB 190D 2.5 On Fri, 2003-04-25 at 05:01, Robert Chase wrote: > Come on guys... Gimme a break here..... > > Cars are machines. Machines break. No matter if you have a brand new > machine or an old machine. This cheap Mercedes stuff is just a lot of > superstition. There is no way that you can predict which machines will > fail and which ones will last forever. The price you pay for the car > has nothing to do with how much repair you will have to put into it. > > My 82 300SD was filled with water when I bought it and had a number of > major issues that screamed "stay away" yet it has been the posterchild > for reliability and has yet to give me major greif. My car was a super > well maintained car that spent several years in a parking deck. > > Paying on the front end does not give you any additional reliability. > If your transmission has a manafacturing defect in it that has taken 10 > years or 2 years to surface having perfect maint records and paying full > book does nothing to help you. Same thing goes with every other system > on the car. The only way to be absolutely sure is to dissasemble the > car and look at every part and put it back together. > > If it makes you feel better to pay more than you have to please feel > free. I would rather get a good deal and absorb the costs of the > repairs and know that they were done right and its unlikely I will have > the same failure within a reasonable time frame (although one never > knows cars have that fun way of suprising you). The Important thing to > keep in mind is that all cars are unknowns until you get to know them. > My dad had an interesting saying "the beast you know is sometimes better > than the one you don't". > > I do see "some" logic to what your saying though. If your looking at a > car with a LOT of stuff wrong with it its likely the owner was not > forthcoming with you on other repairs that it probably needs as well. > Thats just part of kicking the tires and doing the numbers. I have > gotten plenty of good deals on great cars. I have been lucky in > spotting major problems and avoiding bad cars. I have only been burned > a couple of times and usually it was a "gray area" kind of issue and I > did not check those issues thouroughly. > > A friend of mine drives me crazy though with his "used cars are used > cars for a reason". He will only buy new cars and thinks that he is > safe from issues. His First Volvo C70 Convertible bought brand new was > returned under lemon law because it was such a horrid piece of junk. He > is on his second one and is already counting the days before his lease > ends :). > > I always look at a broken part as an chance to make that kind of failure > unlikely in the future. > > Hopefully my karma will be good and my car won't completely unravel in > front of my eyes like my S70 did because I dared to question the laws of > the universe :). > > Enjoy your cars and keep in mind that every penny you put in maint and > repairs is a penny you did not loose in a dealership profit or interest > on a loan. You got something for what you spent. > > Robert. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 09:39:15 -0400 From: "Aimino, Michael" Subject: RE: Cheap MB's (sorta a flame) And which 3-in-1 ball joint tool was that (Mike says while excitedly thumbing through his HF catalog)? I paid to rent a press from Performance Products. Still a lot cheaper than the shop price, but I'm always looking to pinch a penny. - -----Original Message----- From: gary [mailto:gbangs-at-cfl.rr.com] Sent: Friday, April 25, 2003 9:14 AM To: Robert Chase Cc: Diesel Benz Subject: Re: Cheap MB's (sorta a flame) Well said and right on! My sentiments exactly. However, my philosophy is bourne from a different background... As a young enlisted man, I could never afford a (st/d)ealer's rates. It was always cheaper to buy the tools and do it myself. And this was with VW diesels. Now, I take great pride in keeping my 'vintage' iron in good repair. Knowing that I did it myself. I hope my children will pick up on that as they grow. Though I could more afford it recently, I had a quote to do my front ball joints for $250. I've heard that they needed to be pressed out/in with a press, and that the front springs had to be compressed with a special "inner" spring compressor. Well, I got one of those 3-in-1 ball joint servicing sets (on sale) from Harbour Freight, the ball joints from Rusty, jacked up then set the car down on blocks under the control arms, and 3 hours later, new ball joints. Less than $100 total. - -Gary in Orlando 1986 MB 190D 2.5 On Fri, 2003-04-25 at 05:01, Robert Chase wrote: > Come on guys... Gimme a break here..... > > Cars are machines. Machines break. No matter if you have a brand new > machine or an old machine. This cheap Mercedes stuff is just a lot of > superstition. There is no way that you can predict which machines will > fail and which ones will last forever. The price you pay for the car > has nothing to do with how much repair you will have to put into it. > > My 82 300SD was filled with water when I bought it and had a number of > major issues that screamed "stay away" yet it has been the posterchild > for reliability and has yet to give me major greif. My car was a super > well maintained car that spent several years in a parking deck. > > Paying on the front end does not give you any additional reliability. > If your transmission has a manafacturing defect in it that has taken 10 > years or 2 years to surface having perfect maint records and paying full > book does nothing to help you. Same thing goes with every other system > on the car. The only way to be absolutely sure is to dissasemble the > car and look at every part and put it back together. > > If it makes you feel better to pay more than you have to please feel > free. I would rather get a good deal and absorb the costs of the > repairs and know that they were done right and its unlikely I will have > the same failure within a reasonable time frame (although one never > knows cars have that fun way of suprising you). The Important thing to > keep in mind is that all cars are unknowns until you get to know them. > My dad had an interesting saying "the beast you know is sometimes better > than the one you don't". > > I do see "some" logic to what your saying though. If your looking at a > car with a LOT of stuff wrong with it its likely the owner was not > forthcoming with you on other repairs that it probably needs as well. > Thats just part of kicking the tires and doing the numbers. I have > gotten plenty of good deals on great cars. I have been lucky in > spotting major problems and avoiding bad cars. I have only been burned > a couple of times and usually it was a "gray area" kind of issue and I > did not check those issues thouroughly. > > A friend of mine drives me crazy though with his "used cars are used > cars for a reason". He will only buy new cars and thinks that he is > safe from issues. His First Volvo C70 Convertible bought brand new was > returned under lemon law because it was such a horrid piece of junk. He > is on his second one and is already counting the days before his lease > ends :). > > I always look at a broken part as an chance to make that kind of failure > unlikely in the future. > > Hopefully my karma will be good and my car won't completely unravel in > front of my eyes like my S70 did because I dared to question the laws of > the universe :). > > Enjoy your cars and keep in mind that every penny you put in maint and > repairs is a penny you did not loose in a dealership profit or interest > on a loan. You got something for what you spent. > > Robert. ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #988 *********************************