From: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net (diesel-benz-digest) To: diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Subject: diesel-benz-digest V1 #1006 Reply-To: diesel-benz-at-digest.net Sender: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Errors-To: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Precedence: bulk diesel-benz-digest Saturday, May 3 2003 Volume 01 : Number 1006 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Who's Dexter? Re: Who's Dexter? Re: Hot stuff Re: Hot stuff Re: Hot stuff Re: Hot stuff Re: Hot stuff Re: Hot stuff Re: Hot stuff Re: Hot stuff Re: Hot stuff Re: Hot stuff Re: Hot stuff Re: Hot stuff Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 16:41:57 US/Central From: acordova-at-texas.net Subject: Who's Dexter? > John: > > Can you find out the basic composition of the anti-corrosion > package? Is it OAT, Silicate, Phosphate, or other? I'm very leery of > long-life anti-freezes, especially OAT-based (Dexcool) stuff. > > Mike Frank > So who is this Dexter that gets all the automotive formulations named after himself? Dexron, Dexcool, not sure what else. Alec ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 14:44:41 -0700 From: john Subject: Re: Who's Dexter? sounds like a question for google... let us know. ;) john At 04:41 PM 5/2/2003 +0000, acordova-at-texas.net wrote: > > John: > > > > Can you find out the basic composition of the anti-corrosion > > package? Is it OAT, Silicate, Phosphate, or other? I'm very leery of > > long-life anti-freezes, especially OAT-based (Dexcool) stuff. > > > > Mike Frank > > > >So who is this Dexter that gets all the automotive formulations named after >himself? Dexron, Dexcool, not sure what else. > >Alec - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 18:17:04 -0700 From: "Paul Schwartz" Subject: Re: Hot stuff There is a Propylene Glycol Coolant available at Wally-World (Wal-Mart) for half that price. It's what I use in just about every vehicle I own. Near as I can tell it's the same thing as the Amsoil product. I don't remember the name but it has some eco-name like Serria or some such. I use it because I've heard from veterinarians about what ethylene glycol coolants do to the kidneys of animals that drink it. I have a soft spot for dogs, cats and children. Please don't tell anyone as it will destroy my image! Paul > I'm using the amsoil Propylene Glycol Antifreeze and Engine Coolant > here's a scan of the tech sheet... I think it said something > about meeting Mercedes tests or standards... > http://www.wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ANTI-FREEZE/antifreeze-1.jpg > http://www.wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ANTI-FREEZE/antifreeze-2.jpg > > suggested retail is $15.25/gallon... it's basically non-toxic > and is designed to prevent cavitation and corrosion... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 20:25:14 -0500 From: "Vernon Tuck" Subject: Re: Hot stuff We once had a puppy which wandered underneath a car on which I had just drained some coolant, and while my back was momentarily turned. In fact, my attention was drawn by the little lapping sounds. The pup only drank a few laps. But that was sufficient to cause a protracted and agonizing death. It haunts me to this day. VT - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Schwartz" To: "Diesel Benz" Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 8:17 PM Subject: Re: Hot stuff > There is a Propylene Glycol Coolant available at Wally-World (Wal-Mart) for > half that price. It's what I use in just about every vehicle I own. Near as > I can tell it's the same thing as the Amsoil product. I don't remember the > name but it has some eco-name like Serria or some such. > > I use it because I've heard from veterinarians about what ethylene glycol > coolants do to the kidneys of animals that drink it. I have a soft spot for > dogs, cats and children. Please don't tell anyone as it will destroy my > image! > > Paul > > > I'm using the amsoil Propylene Glycol Antifreeze and Engine Coolant > > here's a scan of the tech sheet... I think it said something > > about meeting Mercedes tests or standards... > > http://www.wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ANTI-FREEZE/antifreeze-1.jpg > > http://www.wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ANTI-FREEZE/antifreeze-2.jpg > > > > suggested retail is $15.25/gallon... it's basically non-toxic > > and is designed to prevent cavitation and corrosion... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 18:30:39 -0700 From: john Subject: Re: Hot stuff sad... :( If I ever have a spill I always try to hose it off and dilute it as quickly as I can... worried about my cat getting into it... I don't use the safe antifreeze as much as I should... :( john At 08:25 PM 5/2/2003 -0500, Vernon Tuck wrote: >We once had a puppy which wandered underneath a car on which I had just >drained some coolant, and while my back was momentarily turned. In fact, my >attention was drawn by the little lapping sounds. > >The pup only drank a few laps. But that was sufficient to cause a >protracted and agonizing death. > >It haunts me to this day. > >VT >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Paul Schwartz" >To: "Diesel Benz" >Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 8:17 PM >Subject: Re: Hot stuff > > > > There is a Propylene Glycol Coolant available at Wally-World (Wal-Mart) >for > > half that price. It's what I use in just about every vehicle I own. Near >as > > I can tell it's the same thing as the Amsoil product. I don't remember the > > name but it has some eco-name like Serria or some such. > > > > I use it because I've heard from veterinarians about what ethylene glycol > > coolants do to the kidneys of animals that drink it. I have a soft spot >for > > dogs, cats and children. Please don't tell anyone as it will destroy my > > image! > > > > Paul > > > > > I'm using the amsoil Propylene Glycol Antifreeze and Engine Coolant > > > here's a scan of the tech sheet... I think it said something > > > about meeting Mercedes tests or standards... > > > http://www.wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ANTI-FREEZE/antifreeze-1.jpg > > > http://www.wagoneers.com/AMSOIL/ANTI-FREEZE/antifreeze-2.jpg > > > > > > suggested retail is $15.25/gallon... it's basically non-toxic > > > and is designed to prevent cavitation and corrosion... - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 18:43:37 -0700 From: "Paul Schwartz" Subject: Re: Hot stuff I had to put down a cat that got into the coolant puddle under a neighbors car. It's not easy. I'm wondering if I should just go to a chemical supply house and buy a couple of gallons of propylene glycol and use that? Are any of the "additives' really worth much? Paul > sad... :( > > If I ever have a spill I always try to hose it off and dilute it > as quickly as I can... worried about my cat getting into it... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 20:47:29 -0500 From: Jan Guthrie Subject: Re: Hot stuff Paul, If you go to a marine store, or West Marine or Boat US online, you can buy a non-toxic engine antifreeze. They make two different non-toxic antifreezes. One is for water systems and one is for engines with anti-corrosive additives. I do not know if they meet any specific MB specifications, but many boaters use them. Jan Guthrie and her fleet Paul Schwartz wrote: > I had to put down a cat that got into the coolant puddle under a neighbors > car. It's not easy. > > I'm wondering if I should just go to a chemical supply house and buy a > couple of gallons of propylene glycol and use that? Are any of the > "additives' really worth much? > > Paul > > > sad... :( > > > > If I ever have a spill I always try to hose it off and dilute it > > as quickly as I can... worried about my cat getting into it... - -- $:0^0:$x,88,x$:0^0:$x,88,x$:0^0:$x,88,x$:0^0:$x$:0^0:$x,88,x$: Jan Jan Guthrie Yacht Brokerage jan-at-buy-a-boat.com 262-553-1998 http://www.buy-a-boat.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 19:23:46 -0700 From: john Subject: Re: Hot stuff I don't think straight propylene glycol is going to work... Wouldn't cost as much as it does for the stuff that works if it did. :) john At 06:43 PM 5/2/2003 -0700, Paul Schwartz wrote: >I had to put down a cat that got into the coolant puddle under a neighbors >car. It's not easy. > >I'm wondering if I should just go to a chemical supply house and buy a >couple of gallons of propylene glycol and use that? Are any of the >"additives' really worth much? > >Paul > > > sad... :( > > > > If I ever have a spill I always try to hose it off and dilute it > > as quickly as I can... worried about my cat getting into it... - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 21:30:57 -0500 From: "Vernon Tuck" Subject: Re: Hot stuff Since we're talking "antifreeze" and "diesels" (we ARE talkin' MB diesels, right???) y'all need to look into the UGLEE "C" word. CAVITATION. Do a Google search for "Ford 7.3 diesel cavitation". It's an eye-opener. If you want a TREATISE on the phenonemon let me know. The short version is: All diesel engines are vulnerable to it and require a SPECIAL DIESEL RATED ANTIFREEZ AND ANTICAVITATION ADDITIVE. All the big rig drivers know about this. Ain't that right, Dan? VT - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul Schwartz" To: "Diesel Benz" Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 8:43 PM Subject: Re: Hot stuff > I had to put down a cat that got into the coolant puddle under a neighbors > car. It's not easy. > > I'm wondering if I should just go to a chemical supply house and buy a > couple of gallons of propylene glycol and use that? Are any of the > "additives' really worth much? > > Paul > > > sad... :( > > > > If I ever have a spill I always try to hose it off and dilute it > > as quickly as I can... worried about my cat getting into it... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 19:40:39 -0700 From: john Subject: Re: Hot stuff the amsoil antifreeze is designed for Diesels... big ones, little ones... ;) I think that's what did my friend's big rig in... cavitation... because the sierra stuff broke down... john At 09:30 PM 5/2/2003 -0500, Vernon Tuck wrote: >Since we're talking "antifreeze" and "diesels" (we ARE talkin' MB diesels, >right???) y'all need to look into the UGLEE "C" word. > >CAVITATION. > >Do a Google search for "Ford 7.3 diesel cavitation". It's an eye-opener. >If you want a TREATISE on the phenonemon let me know. > >The short version is: All diesel engines are vulnerable to it and require a >SPECIAL DIESEL RATED ANTIFREEZ AND ANTICAVITATION ADDITIVE. All the big rig >drivers know about this. > >Ain't that right, Dan? >VT >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Paul Schwartz" >To: "Diesel Benz" >Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 8:43 PM >Subject: Re: Hot stuff > > > > I had to put down a cat that got into the coolant puddle under a neighbors > > car. It's not easy. > > > > I'm wondering if I should just go to a chemical supply house and buy a > > couple of gallons of propylene glycol and use that? Are any of the > > "additives' really worth much? > > > > Paul > > > > > sad... :( > > > > > > If I ever have a spill I always try to hose it off and dilute it > > > as quickly as I can... worried about my cat getting into it... - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 22:38:08 -0400 From: Michael Frank Subject: Re: Hot stuff Without the additives, you will corrode your system. It's the additive package, not the base antifreeze that prevents corrosion. Of course, you could also use pure propylene glycol without any water. Without the water, you don't get corrosion. Pure Pglycol is actually a much better coolant that 50/50 or even plain water. The only problem is, it's flammable.... Mike Frank At 10:23 PM 5/2/03, john wrote: >>I'm wondering if I should just go to a chemical supply house and buy a >>couple of gallons of propylene glycol and use that? Are any of the >>"additives' really worth much? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 19:45:03 -0700 From: john Subject: Re: Hot stuff At 10:38 PM 5/2/2003 -0400, Michael Frank wrote: >The only problem is, it's flammable.... minor problem... ;) - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 2 May 2003 22:05:35 -0500 From: "Vernon Tuck" Subject: Re: Hot stuff Welll... not to be a smarty pants... But the diesel rated antifreeze only gets you halfway home. The other binary is the caustic additive to the antifreeze. I've HEARD without having confirmed this that Caterpillar brand antifreeze has this built in. All others however require it as an additive. Look into it. It's serious business. VT - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john" To: "Vernon Tuck" ; "Paul Schwartz" ; "Diesel Benz" Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 9:40 PM Subject: Re: Hot stuff > the amsoil antifreeze is designed for Diesels... big ones, little ones... ;) > > I think that's what did my friend's big rig in... cavitation... because > the sierra stuff broke down... > > john > > At 09:30 PM 5/2/2003 -0500, Vernon Tuck wrote: > >Since we're talking "antifreeze" and "diesels" (we ARE talkin' MB diesels, > >right???) y'all need to look into the UGLEE "C" word. > > > >CAVITATION. > > > >Do a Google search for "Ford 7.3 diesel cavitation". It's an eye-opener. > >If you want a TREATISE on the phenonemon let me know. > > > >The short version is: All diesel engines are vulnerable to it and require a > >SPECIAL DIESEL RATED ANTIFREEZ AND ANTICAVITATION ADDITIVE. All the big rig > >drivers know about this. > > > >Ain't that right, Dan? > >VT > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Paul Schwartz" > >To: "Diesel Benz" > >Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 8:43 PM > >Subject: Re: Hot stuff > > > > > > > I had to put down a cat that got into the coolant puddle under a neighbors > > > car. It's not easy. > > > > > > I'm wondering if I should just go to a chemical supply house and buy a > > > couple of gallons of propylene glycol and use that? Are any of the > > > "additives' really worth much? > > > > > > Paul > > > > > > > sad... :( > > > > > > > > If I ever have a spill I always try to hose it off and dilute it > > > > as quickly as I can... worried about my cat getting into it... > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ > Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... > jesus, don't leave life without him, please! > ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 02 May 2003 20:12:12 -0700 From: john Subject: Re: Hot stuff it says right on the label - that it's got protection against both... one of amsoil's biggest customer is the over the road trucker... this stuff has been out since about '89 or so... NO PROBLEMS with it whatsoever... unlike sierra... I was using the amsoil stuff on my Jeep TD and my Olds 5.7L w/o trouble... not sure why I quit using it... probably just being the cheapskate that I usually am... ;) Not sure why I decided to run it in Ludwig, probably because I was at the warehouse and needed antifreeze anyway... my friend/upline praised the stuff, he sells to a lot of truckers... so I did it... ;) so far temp gauge holds rock steady, but it did that once I cleaned the contacts with the green stuff too... ;) sometimes this stuff just doesn't produce dramatic results and you never really give much thought to the real benefit... ;) john At 10:05 PM 5/2/2003 -0500, Vernon Tuck wrote: >Welll... not to be a smarty pants... But the diesel rated antifreeze only >gets you halfway home. The other binary is the caustic additive to the >antifreeze. I've HEARD without having confirmed this that Caterpillar brand >antifreeze has this built in. All others however require it as an additive. > >Look into it. It's serious business. > >VT >----- Original Message ----- >From: "john" >To: "Vernon Tuck" ; "Paul Schwartz" >; "Diesel Benz" >Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 9:40 PM >Subject: Re: Hot stuff > > > > the amsoil antifreeze is designed for Diesels... big ones, little ones... >;) > > > > I think that's what did my friend's big rig in... cavitation... because > > the sierra stuff broke down... > > > > john > > > > At 09:30 PM 5/2/2003 -0500, Vernon Tuck wrote: > > >Since we're talking "antifreeze" and "diesels" (we ARE talkin' MB >diesels, > > >right???) y'all need to look into the UGLEE "C" word. > > > > > >CAVITATION. > > > > > >Do a Google search for "Ford 7.3 diesel cavitation". It's an eye-opener. > > >If you want a TREATISE on the phenonemon let me know. > > > > > >The short version is: All diesel engines are vulnerable to it and >require a > > >SPECIAL DIESEL RATED ANTIFREEZ AND ANTICAVITATION ADDITIVE. All the big >rig > > >drivers know about this. > > > > > >Ain't that right, Dan? > > >VT > > >----- Original Message ----- > > >From: "Paul Schwartz" > > >To: "Diesel Benz" > > >Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 8:43 PM > > >Subject: Re: Hot stuff > > > > > > > > > > I had to put down a cat that got into the coolant puddle under a >neighbors > > > > car. It's not easy. > > > > > > > > I'm wondering if I should just go to a chemical supply house and buy a > > > > couple of gallons of propylene glycol and use that? Are any of the > > > > "additives' really worth much? > > > > > > > > Paul > > > > > > > > > sad... :( > > > > > > > > > > If I ever have a spill I always try to hose it off and dilute it > > > > > as quickly as I can... worried about my cat getting into it... > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > > http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ > > Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... > > jesus, don't leave life without him, please! > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > - ------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1006 **********************************