From: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net (diesel-benz-digest) To: diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Subject: diesel-benz-digest V1 #1160 Reply-To: diesel-benz-at-digest.net Sender: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Errors-To: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Precedence: bulk diesel-benz-digest Monday, August 11 2003 Volume 01 : Number 1160 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: murphy's law...low compression Re: Where were you... (was: Re: Motor Oils) Re: yokohamas Re: tire opinions sought... Re: '99 TD... Re: EGT gauge install question Re: Where were you... (was: Re: Motor Oils) Re: yokohamas Re: murphy's law...low compression Re[2]: tire opinions sought... Re[2]: tire opinions sought... W123 vs W126?. Re: State of the W123 Union Re: Re[2]: tire opinions sought... Re: W123 vs W126?. Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 16:43:55 +1000 From: Guy Carpenter Subject: Re: murphy's law...low compression A few years ago my wife bought me an automotive stethoscope for this sort of job. http://www.griotsgarage.com/search.jsp?searchtext=stethoscope To be honest I haven't ever used it - I never seem to think of it when I'm scratching around trying to figure out where that sound is coming from... At 11:22 PM 10/08/2003 -0700, Kevin Pekarek wrote: >I do not know if the leakdown test that works on gassers works on diesels, but >you may want to try - AFTER adjusting the valves to spec, pressurize the >cylinder. You will hear hissing in one of three areas if there is a pressure >leak - at the exhaust means it's an exhaust valve, at the oil filler is >rings or piston. Can't exactly stick your ear near the carburetor to check >intake though :) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 10 Aug 2003 23:51:28 -0700 From: Kevin Pekarek Subject: Re: Where were you... (was: Re: Motor Oils) On Sat, Aug 09, 2003 at 06:25:19PM -0700, john wrote: > Ok, let's see how dated some of the members are: > 1) where were you when JFK was shot? uh. not born yet? > 2) do you remember the USS Pueblo? I thought colorado was landlocked... :) That was the navy sub that korea took prisoner, right? > 3) where were you when RFK was shot? see #1. can't really say he was shot to death though, he actually bled to death. (and don't ask me why, but I always thought those pistols were neat. not overly effective or accurate, but neat nonetheless) > 4) Did you watch Bullitt at a theatre when it came out? I'm guessing home theatre when the dvd was released doesn't count :) > 5) were you driving when they mandated 55 mph? the federal speed limit was still 55 when I got my license. So, it was mandated (still) :) > if your earliest recollection is of John Lennon and Regan > being shot then you're probably old enough to be > one of our kids... :) Don't remember hearing on the news when lennon was shot, vaguely remember reagan and brady. Chalk another shooting to the weird little eight shot revolver. Supposedly the would-be assassin actually selected the cadet because it was used to shoot RFK. I was around for the carter administration, but don't remember much from then. Let's add a couple to John's list though (neither of which I remember first hand) - 6) remember when the w120 came out? (there was a diesel, the 180D -- MLC ) 7) remember "you know in your heart, he's right" (followed of course, by "you know in your guts, he's nuts")? (yes, I know, this fits somewhere in the middle of what john already put up there) K - -- Kevin Pekarek Redwood City, CA (near San Francisco) and Los Osos, CA (near San Luis Obispo) 85 190D (601, 5spd) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 01:58:19 -0500 From: Jon Filina Subject: Re: yokohamas John wrote: > Yokohama AVS dB > S2 (Ultra High Performance All-Season) > Size:195/65-15 > VR Speed Rated Price: $69 > > Yokohama Avid > H4 (High Performance All-Season) > Size:195/65-15 > HR Speed Rated Price: $54 > > http://www.tirerack.com/tires/ The Avid Touring Tire is completely different from the H4's. From what I remember, the H4's were not rated as high in the ride quality and quietness categories. I don't know how your W124 is when it comes to changing tire sizes. My 240D came with 175/70-14's and I put 185's on it and liked the results. My 300SD had 205/70-14's, one size larger than stock. It was a bit mushy, not bad, but not as precise as my 240D. Putting stock sized Avids on it improved it noticeably. My mechanic suggested that I put on a taller tire with both of these MB's. Do you have the extra room in the wheel wells for the 70 series tires? Jon ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 00:21:40 -0700 From: Kevin Pekarek Subject: Re: tire opinions sought... On Sun, Aug 10, 2003 at 08:13:53PM -0700, john wrote: > I think I've mentioned my bias on tires (no pun intended), > but I want to hear what others would suggest for the PNW. > > This is going on my '91 300d, it has the wrong size tires on > it right now. It's unlikely I'd drive it in snow, > unless I got caught at work. Mostly wet road, cool climate. > top speed of car is 121mph, tire size is: 195/65-15 > seems like H rated is what's required. > http://wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/91-300d-2.5L/ > Looking for good handling, ride comfort, longevity and > good wet road characteristics. An acquaintance of mine runs yokohama's (believe they're h4s) in stock size on stock wheels on her 91 300E. They replaced MXV4s, and she likes them much better. I can only assume this means a smoother ride that isn't as noisy as michelins can be (anyone who doesn't think michelins squeal can ride in the crown vic). She doesn't lean on the car NEAR as much as I would if it were *MY* car, but she doesn't stick to the slow lane either. YMMV. K - -- Kevin Pekarek Redwood City, CA (near San Francisco) and Los Osos, CA (near San Luis Obispo) 85 190D (601, 5spd) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 00:23:42 -0700 From: Kevin Pekarek Subject: Re: '99 TD... On Sun, Aug 10, 2003 at 09:42:51PM -0500, Richard Arnold wrote: > What must also be considered is that for these people, the purchase of a > Maybach represents much less a percentage of their annual income than > the average Honda buyer who spends $28,000. That is to say, if I made > $1.5MM per year then a Maybach would be about like a Honda Accord. I'll > bet the average Maybach buyer makes more than $1.5MM/year. Think about > your average NBA Star or your better than average crack dealer. Robert, > keep your eyes open downtown, you are bound to see one of these in the > flesh ;) Okay, I think I need to start selling drugs, since I have no coordination and even though I'm 6'2, can't play basketball to save my life. And here I was thinking a 72 ambassador was a luxurious car. Well, at least nobody else around here has one :) K - -- Kevin Pekarek Redwood City, CA (near San Francisco) and Los Osos, CA (near San Luis Obispo) 85 190D (601, 5spd) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 00:33:18 -0700 From: Kevin Pekarek Subject: Re: EGT gauge install question On Sun, Aug 10, 2003 at 06:58:01PM -0700, john wrote: > why would one cylinder on an inline motor run hotter then > others? the 3.0L TD employs exhaust runners from each cylinder, > the intakes are separate... the cooling system might be the only > issue, but on an inline motor I don't see where that could be > an issue... the only other variable might be the oil system... where > does the oilpump live? water flow or oil flow would be my guesses. If you had one cylinder running richer than the other on a diesel, that cylinder would run warmer since the mixture was wrong, however. > on the 4.2/4.0L I-6's that Jeep makes #1 seems to have a few > issues with oiling... maybe because of the G forces on acceleration. ;) No, but on the carbed sixes, the outer two cylinders (especially #1) used to run leaner than the inside four. This MOSTLY went away with fuel injection. > See if you can get one of those infrared thermometers and take readings > and see if there are any differences. This would obviously be the best bet. > Would be cool to learn about your tuning this motor. I've known > some guys that have done this process with a Cummins TD. They used > a pyrometer by the turbo along with a boost gauge to dial things in. > I would think any Diesel shop that rebuilds pumps and injectors would > have some great insight on this process. The pyrometer on the perkins 4.154 in the pacer has the pyrometer in the center of the manifold near where the downspout to the exhaust pipe side (well, it goes into a turbo, but you know what I mean) is. My friend with the cummins pickup did the same thing. Yes, this isn't as accurate, but if you get used to what the normal reading is for the aggregate, you'll notice a problem with a cylinder not running right by the different temperature. The perkins in the pacer is very conservatively warmed up - the turbo only puts in about 10 lbs of boost, and boost is intercooled. When the engine was put back together, a thicker headgasket was used to add a little - calculations said the engine stock could take ten, but he threw a thick headgasket in anyways. One of these days I'll have to get it running. There's receipts for Amsoil 15w40 diesel marine oil in the boxes, so I figure the engine's in fine shape inside :) (boy, will it ever be an interesting car if I ever get it running) Or, you are like my friend with the cummins pickup who uses it to make sure EGT stays below the melting point of aluminum. :-/ K - -- Kevin Pekarek Redwood City, CA (near San Francisco) and Los Osos, CA (near San Luis Obispo) 85 190D (601, 5spd) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 03:12:00 -0700 From: "Paul Schwartz" Subject: Re: Where were you... (was: Re: Motor Oils) > On Sat, Aug 09, 2003 at 06:25:19PM -0700, john wrote: > > Ok, let's see how dated some of the members are: > > 1) where were you when JFK was shot? In the printshop at my Jr. Highscrewel 2) do you remember the USS Pueblo? Did we ever get it back? 3) where were you when RFK was shot? Asleep 4) Did you watch Bullitt at a theatre when it came out? Yep, cool mustang 5) were you driving when they mandated 55 mph? It pissed me off 6) remember when the w120 came out? (there was a diesel, the 180D No 7) remember "you know in your heart, he's right" (followed of course, by "you know in your guts, he's nuts")? (yes, I know, this fits somewhere in the middle of what john already put up there) I remember my father telling a neighbor that if he voted for Goldwater that we'd wind up with half a million troops in S. Vietnam. You know, that neighbor voted for Goldwater and son of a gun, we got a half million troops in S. Vietnam. Old dad was pretty smart. I have not voted for a Democrat because of LBJ, I know too many names on the wall. Can't say I always voted Republican either. Paul ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 08:27:45 -0400 From: Mike Frank Subject: Re: yokohamas I've been using Dunlop SP Sport A2's. They're just $58 at tirerack. Size for my 190D is 195-60-15. I've always used Dunlop tires, and they've always given me good service.The A2's are extremely QUIET tires. Mike Frank At 01:58 AM 8/11/2003 -0500, Jon Filina wrote: >John wrote: >>Yokohama AVS dB S2>All-Season)> Size:195/65-15 >>VR Speed Rated Price: $69 >>Yokohama Avid H4>All-Season)> Size:195/65-15 >>HR Speed Rated Price: $54 >>http://www.tirerack.com/tires/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 08:57:46 -0400 From: Mike Frank Subject: Re: murphy's law...low compression The only reason a leakdown test wouldn't work is that you need to find some way to keep the engine from turning...otherwise, the air pressure will cause the engine to start! Mike Frank At 11:22 PM 8/10/2003 -0700, you wrote: >On Sat, Aug 09, 2003 at 06:20:41PM -0700, john wrote: > > typical trick to determine if it's rings or valve seats > > is to put some oil in the cylinder and see if the compression > > comes up, if it does, it's the rings. > >Yikes! > >While you can get away with that trick on a gasser, on a diesel that >will allow the cylinder to fire, which will cause you to be looking for >a new compression gauge. > >Myself, I do not own a compression gauge. They don't tell you anything you >really want to know, and if you have a cylinder low enough on compression, >you'll hear it when you crank. > >I do not know if the leakdown test that works on gassers works on diesels, but >you may want to try - AFTER adjusting the valves to spec, pressurize the >cylinder. You will hear hissing in one of three areas if there is a pressure >leak - at the exhaust means it's an exhaust valve, at the oil filler is >rings or piston. Can't exactly stick your ear near the carburetor to check >intake though :) > >K > >-- >Kevin Pekarek >Redwood City, CA (near San Francisco) and >Los Osos, CA (near San Luis Obispo) >85 190D (601, 5spd) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 09:22:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Welty Subject: Re[2]: tire opinions sought... On Sun, 10 Aug 2003 23:57:10 -0500 Jon Filina wrote: > For $285 I got 4 Yokohama Avid Touring > tires (195/70-14, which is the correct size). > They ride smoother and quieter than the Michelins. They are excellent > on wet pavement. They are not supposed to be any great shakes on snow, > but they handled fine during our snowstorm this last winter. Ok...it > doesn't snow in Texas, but we got 4-6 inches of snow on top of ice that > night. That's catastrophic for Texas and shut us down a few days... i've used Yokos for many years, and always liked the old A509 as a wet-dry (no snow) tire. i have a set of yoko AVS-intermediates on one of my alfas right now, and like them a lot (again, no longer available, like the A509.) the Avid touring is probably a pretty good tire, and i may well look at it when i have to replace tires on some of my alfas. however, we're looking at pricing for the 215 wide 16s on my wife's 96 300D, though, and there are a couple of tires in the Kumho Escta series (see them on tire rack) that look like a fair amount of tire for the money, so we'll probably replace the Contis the previous owner put on with Kumhos and see how they go. richard - -- Richard Welty rwelty-at-suespammers.org Averill Park Networking rwelty-at-averillpark.net Unix, Linux, IP Network Engineering, Security rwelty-at-krusty-motorsports.com 518-573-7592 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 09:24:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Welty Subject: Re[2]: tire opinions sought... On Sun, 10 Aug 2003 22:31:57 -0700 john wrote: > I did notice that these Michelin mXV4 Plus's do squeal around > corners... whereas the 190D with the Goodyears did not! I > noticed it on the test drive and commented on it to the seller. pressed to its limits, any tire should squeal. it's just that the michelin's limits are easier to find. cheers, richard - -- Richard Welty rwelty-at-suespammers.org Averill Park Networking rwelty-at-averillpark.net Unix, Linux, IP Network Engineering, Security rwelty-at-krusty-motorsports.com 518-573-7592 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 09:53:46 -0400 From: Paul Brown Subject: W123 vs W126?. What goodies do I give up if I buy a 300D (W123), rather than a 300SD(W126)? Were there any improvements worth worrying about on the 126 chassis? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 08:31:12 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: State of the W123 Union On Mon, 11 Aug 2003, Renaud OLGIATI wrote: >-->My mailbox was recently graced by a missive from john : >--> >-->> oil change at 500mph >--> >-->How the hell do you do that ? well, I'd recommend a good set of goggles, a remote control drain plug and a safety strap. a stable cruise control is also recommended... and of course, timing is critical, don't want to let the oil level get too low or your engine could overheat or worse. ...helpful tips for the time impaired always available from Snohomish. :) john >--> >-->Cheers, >--> >-->Ron, on the banks of the Paraguay River >-->-- >--> It is not for me to attempt to fathom >--> the inscrutable workings of Providence. >--> -- The Earl of Birkenhead >--> >--> -- http://www.olgiati-in-paraguay.org -- >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. ...and remember, leaving life without Jesus just isn't recommended... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** john-at-wagoneers.com via PINE on Linux ** (plain text please!) The revolt is underway, you can not stop it. FEAR THE PENGUIN!!!! May the SOURCE be With GNU - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 08:32:16 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: Re[2]: tire opinions sought... On Mon, 11 Aug 2003, Richard Welty wrote: >-->On Sun, 10 Aug 2003 22:31:57 -0700 john wrote: >-->> I did notice that these Michelin mXV4 Plus's do squeal around >-->> corners... whereas the 190D with the Goodyears did not! I >-->> noticed it on the test drive and commented on it to the seller. >--> >-->pressed to its limits, any tire should squeal. >--> >-->it's just that the michelin's limits are easier to find. well, they didn't fell like they were at the limit, but they sure protested a lot. :) john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. ...and remember, leaving life without Jesus just isn't recommended... - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** john-at-wagoneers.com via PINE on Linux ** (plain text please!) The revolt is underway, you can not stop it. FEAR THE PENGUIN!!!! May the SOURCE be With GNU - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2003 11:28:00 -0400 From: Robert Chase Subject: Re: W123 vs W126?. More room Airbags (they started optional airbags in the 126 in 1981) Power Seat Higher Security Key Rear power seats Heated seats Rear heated seats Easier to access fuse box Better Ride More Modern Appearance I have an early 1982 model and I really like it. There are some of the issues with the 126 body but they are cheap to deal with and well worth the additional room and comfort. As well the 126 was made up to 1991 so you have access to almost pristine interior parts from wrecked or otherwise destroyed cars. Factoring in reliability rather than just technological innovation I think the 126 was the pinnacle of Mercedes Design technology. I used to think that the 140's deserved this title until I discovered how unreliable they are. Then again my eyes have been looking at a 116 chassis 300SD with european lights. Paul Brown wrote: > What goodies do I give up if I buy a 300D (W123), rather than a > 300SD(W126)? Were there any improvements worth worrying about on the > 126 chassis? ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1160 **********************************