From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Fri Oct 10 09:46:06 2003 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Friday, October 10 2003 Volume 01 : Number 1242 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: [db] Topsider Disaster Re: [db] Topsider Disaster Re: [db] Topsider Disaster Re: [db] Topsider Disaster Re: [db] Topsider Disaster Re: [db] Topsider Disaster RE: [db] Topsider Disaster [db] Uncommon car [db] W123 Gearshift indications ? Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2003 20:35:26 -0700 (PDT) From: Jerome Kaidor Subject: [db] Topsider Disaster Hi guys, Well, this has nothing to do with diesel-benzes, but who else do I ask? This afternoon I went out to change the oil in my '99 Chevy Astro cargo van. The van has a long slinky dipstick tube that passes VERY CLOSE TO AN EXHAUST MANIFOLD. Having warmed up the engine, I stuck the topsider hose in the dipstick tube. I pumped it up. No oil came forth. Not thinking, I pulled out the topsider hose, noting that the end was melted. That's not so bad, but then I noted that the hose was much shorter than it used to be! The end was down in the dipstick tube. I pushed in the dipstick, and it reluctantly bottomed out. After draining the oil the normal way, I stuck an endoscope in the oil drain hole. Sure enough, that hose was down there in the sump. I tried to fish for it with a hooked wire - no luck. What to do? That Chevy 4.3L engine is like a motorcycle engine - cast aluminum sump. The instructions for removing the sump start with "Remove the engine" One friend suggested just leaving the hose in there - if it won't melt and send bits of itself through the system.... Any ideas? - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2003 20:47:24 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: [db] Topsider Disaster does the dipstick return to the oil level as it should? how easily melted is that hose? if it's not then it should not be a problem to leave in the engine. I doubt it could get into the oil pump itself as there is a screen that will block it. can you remove the oil pan in the vehicle? the 4.3 should be able to drop the pan with the engine in the rig... you might have to remove some steering components, jack up the body as high as you can, perhaps even loosen the engine mounts... I've dropped the oil pan on a number of Jeeps... but then again 4x4's are a bit different then mini vans... I reinstalled an engine into one of the pontiac lumina looking minivans once... tight fit... my guess is this will not be a problem... watch your oil pressure, if it's normal, you'll be fine... I'm really surprised that hose melted... fwiw, one of the big headaches on the jeep engines is breaking off the dipstick tube... that's a royal pain to replace... :) john Jerome Kaidor wrote: >Hi guys, > > Well, this has nothing to do with diesel-benzes, but who else do I >ask? > > This afternoon I went out to change the oil in my '99 Chevy Astro cargo >van. The van has a long slinky dipstick tube that passes VERY CLOSE TO AN >EXHAUST MANIFOLD. Having warmed up the engine, I stuck the topsider hose >in the dipstick tube. I pumped it up. No oil came forth. Not thinking, >I pulled out the topsider hose, noting that the end was melted. > > That's not so bad, but then I noted that the hose was much shorter than >it used to be! The end was down in the dipstick tube. I pushed in the >dipstick, and it reluctantly bottomed out. > > After draining the oil the normal way, I stuck an endoscope in the >oil drain hole. Sure enough, that hose was down there in the sump. I tried >to fish for it with a hooked wire - no luck. > > What to do? That Chevy 4.3L engine is like a motorcycle engine - cast >aluminum sump. The instructions for removing the sump start with > > "Remove the engine" > > One friend suggested just leaving the hose in there - if it won't melt >and send bits of itself through the system.... > > Any ideas? > > - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) > > > - -- - ----------------------------- Oh well, I'm a man, but I can change, if I have to, I guess -Red Green http://www.redgreen.com/ - ------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... Jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 08 Oct 2003 23:48:57 -0400 From: Robert Chase Subject: Re: [db] Topsider Disaster EEK! Sounds like a not so fun experience. I don't think the plastic would do much damage if it melted. Some people have metal bits floating in their engines the worst thing that could happen is the plastic bits would clog some oil passages and perhaps prematurely wear out a part of the engine. You could get a bit on the "aggressive" side and heat the bottom of the sump with a blow torch and suck out the melted plastic and oil mixture with a copper plumbing tube. Being aluminum this might not be a good idea. You could also heat a stainless steel tube and place it in the bottom of the sump and allow the stainless steel to heat the plastic and melt it. But both of these solutions are "risky" and the second of the two might take longer than pulling out the engine. Sorry to hear you had bad luck with that.... Hopefully it will be an easy thing to fix..... Robert Chase Jerome Kaidor wrote: > Hi guys, > > Well, this has nothing to do with diesel-benzes, but who else do I > ask? > > This afternoon I went out to change the oil in my '99 Chevy Astro cargo > van. The van has a long slinky dipstick tube that passes VERY CLOSE TO AN > EXHAUST MANIFOLD. Having warmed up the engine, I stuck the topsider hose > in the dipstick tube. I pumped it up. No oil came forth. Not thinking, > I pulled out the topsider hose, noting that the end was melted. > > That's not so bad, but then I noted that the hose was much shorter than > it used to be! The end was down in the dipstick tube. I pushed in the > dipstick, and it reluctantly bottomed out. > > After draining the oil the normal way, I stuck an endoscope in the > oil drain hole. Sure enough, that hose was down there in the sump. I tried > to fish for it with a hooked wire - no luck. > > What to do? That Chevy 4.3L engine is like a motorcycle engine - cast > aluminum sump. The instructions for removing the sump start with > > "Remove the engine" > > One friend suggested just leaving the hose in there - if it won't melt > and send bits of itself through the system.... > > Any ideas? > > - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 08:00:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Jerome Kaidor Subject: Re: [db] Topsider Disaster Mike Frank wrote: > > In the odd parts bin at the hardware store, they always sell those > thingamagigs which consist of a long flex steel tube with a button on one > end. You push the button, and wire claws extend from the other end. *** Tried it. Mine didn't quite fit through the hole. > Home Depot sells a kit that allows your shop vac to fit to a small hose. *** Hmm, that's an idea. I already have that kit. > Perhaps you could draw the broken piece right out of the tube. > > Endoscope? I hope you don't use that for your patients! > *** Don't have patients. The endoscope was a gift from a friend who works at a scientific equipment distributor. He had cobbled it up out of pieces of broken ones. - Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 08:10:28 -0700 (PDT) From: Jerome Kaidor Subject: Re: [db] Topsider Disaster Robert Chase wrote: > > engines the worst thing that could happen is the plastic bits would clog > some oil passages and perhaps prematurely wear out a part of the engine. > **** Mondo prematurely. As in "instantly". The van only has 30K miles on it.... > You could get a bit on the "aggressive" side and heat the bottom of the > sump with a blow torch and suck out the melted plastic and oil mixture > with a copper plumbing tube. Being aluminum this might not be a good > idea. *** Indeed. You can melt aluminum with a propane torch. Ask me how I know.... You could also heat a stainless steel tube and place it in the > bottom of the sump and allow the stainless steel to heat the plastic and > melt it. But both of these solutions are "risky" and the second of the > two might take longer than pulling out the engine. > *** I had a less violent idea. The ole' "chewing gum on the end of a stick" trick. Can't use a magnet because the offending item's not steel. Oh, but it's all oily in there, the chewing gum won't stick! OK, I squirt some lacquer thinner in through the oil drain hole, to degrease the area. Then I make up a tool that consists of a plastic tube, slightly larger in diameter than the tube I want to get out. I grind the end of the tool with a pair of half-moon depressions. The remaining "spikes" on each end of the half-moons will prevent the tool from sticking to other items. Then fill the tool with the chewing gum - or with something even more agressive - say the stuff they use in glue traps for mice. Then go fishing. - Jerry ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 09 Oct 2003 12:18:29 -0400 From: Mike Frank Subject: Re: [db] Topsider Disaster A few more thoughts: How good is your aim? Try a thin piece of wire with a hook on the end. If you can get it into the plastic tube, you're golden. If you really get desperate, calculate approximately where the dipstick would touch the bottom of the pan. Drill a 1/2 inch hole in the pan, fish out the end. Seal the hole with a self tapping drain plug, or an expanding rubber plug. Any chance of pulling out the dipstick tube? What sort of plastic tube was this? What brand of topsider? I use an "Oilboy" from Tempo products. It has a heavy nylon tube, that I would think would stand up to high temps, but maybe I should switch to a copper tube. Mike Frank ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 13:29:26 -0500 From: "Sam Williams" <1sam-at-io.com> Subject: RE: [db] Topsider Disaster Yet another approach... Maybe GM bean-counters have determined that an oil drain plug would raise the cost of manufacture excessively. If not, what about getting under the car and removing the drain plug? Try fishing with a fingers- on-the-end-of-a-flexible-rod or a coat-hanger-wire with a hook bent in the end. It's not as elegant as fishing through a long narrow tube while still wearing the tuxedo you don for Topsider oil changes but just might work. Sam ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 14:29:57 -0700 From: "Paul Schwartz" Subject: [db] Uncommon car I'm taking a class and I guy in that class drives a W123 TD (station wagon) 300D engine (no turbo) and with a standard tranny. He says he brought it over from Europe (he's Austrian) and they are common over there. Is this true? Also, it doesn't have a auto level rear suspension. I'd love to find one. Paul ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2003 23:05:24 +0000 From: ron Subject: [db] W123 Gearshift indications ? On my w123 automatic there is by the side of the gearstick a window, lit up at night, with the letters "PRNDSL". Should there be something there to show me at night which gear is engaged ? TIA, Curious, on the banks of the Paraguay River. - -- Hiroshima 45, Chernobyl 86, Windows 95. -- http://www.olgiati-in-paraguay.org -- ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1242 **********************************