From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Fri Oct 17 11:21:30 2003 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Friday, October 17 2003 Volume 01 : Number 1252 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [db] Questions [db] amg videos Re[2]: [db] 1990's E300D Reviews / Advice [db] Hmmmmm Re: [db] filter follies RE: Re[2]: [db] Parts sources, Was: filter follies Re: [db] Parts sources, Was: filter follies Re: [db] Looking for 300D/CD spoiler [db] overlooked preventive mantainence? Re: [db] overlooked preventive mantainence? [db] Thoughts on Price Re: [db] overlooked preventive mantainence? Re: [db] Thoughts on Price Re: [db] overlooked preventive mantainence? Re: [db] overlooked preventive mantainence? Re[2]: [db] Thoughts on Price Re: [db] Looking for 300D/CD spoiler Re: [db] Thoughts on Price Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 17:50:19 -0400 From: "S.D.Byers" Subject: Re: [db] Questions The high output 4cyl is sold in europe as a power plant for all sorts of things and was used much later t5han the regulat W123 240Ds were sold. Look at MB 100 vans for example. I am not sure what exactly makes it high output though. SDB On Thu, 16 Oct 2003, Paul Schwartz wrote: |Reading over the MBZ engine service manual, it lists two 616.912 engines, |one with 44kW and one with 53kW of power. The only difference I can |determine is that the camshafts are different; that is the valve timing is |different and 53kW engine's camshaft has a different stamping on the end. | |From reading the specs, it seem that most 616.912 engines in the US are the |44kW version. At least all other specs I have read conform to the valve |timing of the 43kW engine. | |Does anyone know anything about this mysterious 53 kW engine? Is the |difference only the cam/valve timing? The real question is, could I replace |the camshaft in my engine with a different one and get a little more |horsepower? | |Paul | ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 16:22:07 -0700 From: john meister Subject: [db] amg videos http://www.mbusa.com/amg/experience/challenge.jsp?movie=born_to_perform http://www.mbusa.com/amg/experience - -- - ----------------------------- Oh well, I'm a man, but I can change, if I have to, I guess -Red Green http://www.redgreen.com/ - ------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... Jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:35:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Welty Subject: Re[2]: [db] 1990's E300D Reviews / Advice On Thu, 16 Oct 2003 16:09:28 -0500 wguess wrote: > Just curious, since I'm currently shopping for one of these also, would > anyone care to pick the "one", or maybe a couple of the best diesel > models 1980 to present? i will always have a soft spot for the W123s, the 300Ds through 1985. these are very sound cars unfortunately are now tending to get more than a bit rusty in places where they use lots of salt. our 1996 E300D is a very nice car, quite a bit more modern and refined than our two old W123s were, but also a bit more expensive to maintain. we're not really repairing it any more frequently than the 123s, but the repairs are more expensive due to the complexity of the car[1]. my mother has had one of these since new; we got ours a little over a year ago with 96,000 miles and it's just approaching 120,000 miles now. richard [1] and of course, tires in 215/55R16 are rather more expensive than tires in 195/70R14 - -- Richard Welty rwelty-at-suespammers.org Averill Park Networking rwelty-at-averillpark.net Unix, Linux, IP Network Engineering, Security rwelty-at-krusty-motorsports.com 518-573-7592 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 23:00:27 -0400 From: Robert Chase Subject: [db] Hmmmmm This is quite a strange car http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=6331&item=2436940311 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:51:52 -0700 From: Greg Fiorentino Subject: Re: [db] filter follies At 07:31 AM 10/16/03 , Robert Chase wrote: >Lately I have been spoiled with the ability to walk up and get parts from >a parts dealer with a retail counter. Prices end up cheaper than Rusty >because there is no shipping charges. They have pretty much anything new >or used I could ever want. Its like being in a candy store :) > >As well I was suprised by a visit to the dealership. I went in for >coolant because I had a last minute need for some and found the parts >department reasonably priced and the parts guy rather knowledgeable. > >I avoid NAPA at all costs. Once I got into an argument with one of the >parts guys over german style fuses. I was buying german style glass fuses >and he swore up one side and down the other that they were lightbulbs. I >said ok give me some of your 10amp lightbulbs and the guy sold them to me >and then followed me in the parking lot to see my fuse box light up. He >was very dissapointed when it did not light up. Having a knowledgeable parts guy is critical. I used to have a parts guy when I lived on the other coast who was great. I needed an electric cooling fan thermostatic switch for my SAAB 99EMS. It was priced at about $100, and out-of-stock. He sold me a fiat switch for less than $20 which was identical in every way (except for the price). Greg Greg Fiorentino Vancouver USA gfior-at-dslnorthwest.net '84 300D Turbo '79 300TD '85 F-350 6.9 crew cab ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 00:28:43 -0500 From: "Sam Williams" <1sam-at-io.com> Subject: RE: Re[2]: [db] Parts sources, Was: filter follies Richard, Maybe they can't yank the franchise but for several months one year all new cars going to the Austin dealer were that beautiful pea soup green. Sam - -----Original Message----- > i'm not sure MBUSA actually can do that. the laws are heavily biased > towards protecting the small franchise holder against the big bad national > business. i don't know what MBUSA thinks of Keeler, but i am given to > understand that BMW NA really doesn't like Keeler at all but is powerless > when it comes to yanking Keeler's BMW franchise. > > richard ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 03:36:03 -0400 From: Robert Chase Subject: Re: [db] Parts sources, Was: filter follies Heh heh, Or they get a load of bottom of the line C classes :). Robert Sam Williams wrote: > Richard, > > Maybe they can't yank the franchise but for several months one year all > new cars going to the Austin dealer were that beautiful pea soup green. > > Sam > > -----Original Message----- > >>i'm not sure MBUSA actually can do that. the laws are heavily biased >>towards protecting the small franchise holder against the big bad national >>business. i don't know what MBUSA thinks of Keeler, but i am given to >>understand that BMW NA really doesn't like Keeler at all but is powerless >>when it comes to yanking Keeler's BMW franchise. >> >>richard ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 12:36:26 -0400 From: "Jim Hoffman" Subject: Re: [db] Looking for 300D/CD spoiler J.B., Did you happen to get a picture of that car? I'd like to see what that looked like. Jim/ > Back when I was looking for a good 300D/CD, I came across an '84 300CD that > was too expensive, rusty, and slow, but had a nice rubber trunk lid spoiler > that looked really sharp. It's the fitted style that wraps slightly over > the sides, and flips up a little at the rear. Does anyone know where I > might be able to acquire such a spoiler? Also, does anyone know if there > is a more aggressive front valance/air dam/spoiler available for this > car? I'm pretty sure AMG made a body kit, but I can't find anything on > eBay and the like. I'd like a larger air space under the bumper for the > FMIC I'm installing. > > Thanks in advance. > > J.B. > - -- Jim Hoffman Oconomowoc WI '39 Allis Model B '53 Ford Golden Jubilee '?? Bolens Huskie Gardener ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 09:37:36 -0700 (PDT) From: hue wong Subject: [db] overlooked preventive mantainence? Culling the expertise on the list. In wake of the "rock the fuses" feasco I just went through (I went through six head lamps thinking my lights were blowing out!!) What are some of the "other" little steps that one should take to keep the systems running well. I know about the sunroof lube and rocker switch clean and now know about the fuse rocker trick. Are there other "undocumented" little tricks that I should do ever few months, besides oil and tire roatation, that will keep the car running smooth? curiously. - -hue- __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 11:50:06 CDT From: acordova-at-texas.net Subject: Re: [db] overlooked preventive mantainence? The 616 and 617 diesels in particular definitely appreciate good "blow out the cobwebs" drives occasionally. It's been referred to before as an Italian tuneup as well. If your regular commute is at least 20 miles, and you get to really move along the way, your motor will be day-to-day happier. If your regular routine is not like that, either with much shorter distances or with snarled traffic, you should take the car out for a good drive every weekend or two. You regularly encounter people who acquire examples that were driven too softly, and for the first few months, the engine gets happier and smoother and peppier just by being regularly driven fairly hard. Just another example of the personality of these cars. They clearly prefer to work for a living, rather than to just be babied along. Alec > Culling the expertise on the list. > > In wake of the "rock the fuses" feasco I just went > through (I went through six head lamps thinking my > lights were blowing out!!) > > What are some of the "other" little steps that one > should take to keep the systems running well. > > I know about the sunroof lube and rocker switch clean > and now know about the fuse rocker trick. Are there > other "undocumented" little tricks that I should do > ever few months, besides oil and tire roatation, that > will keep the car running smooth? > > curiously. > -hue- > > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search > http://shopping.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 13:29:07 -0400 From: "John Peterson" Subject: [db] Thoughts on Price Hello again, I posted two days ago about looking for a used Diesel Benz. Helpful tips from members send me to this listing which I open for opinions-- does this look like a good deal? My first thought is that 200k might mean a transmission is coming... http://www.autotrader.com/findacar/vdetail.jtmpl?car_id=145460412&dealer_id=& car_year=1993&make=MB&distance=25&max_price=7900&model=&advcd_on=n&end_year=2 004&min_price=7900&certified=n&address=02881&search_type=used&advanced=n&star t_year=1983&color=&cardist=11 thanks friends, john peterson ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 10:31:27 -0700 From: "Paul Schwartz" Subject: Re: [db] overlooked preventive mantainence? > You regularly encounter people who acquire examples that were driven too > softly, and for the first few months, the engine gets happier and smoother and > peppier just by being regularly driven fairly hard. This was definatly true for my 240D. Ran much better after I ran it hard for a while. Paul ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 13:42:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Welty Subject: Re: [db] Thoughts on Price On Fri, 17 Oct 2003 13:29:07 -0400 John Peterson wrote: > Hello again, I posted two days ago about looking for a used Diesel Benz. > Helpful tips from members send me to this listing which I open for opinions-- > does this look like a good deal? My first thought is that 200k might mean a > transmission is coming... with that kind of mileage on a northeastern car, it might be on the high side. i took the liberty of going through the used car appraiser at edmunds.com, and checking off all options and listing the car as "outstanding". if the car really has all options and it's a very clean creampuff, then edmunds gives the following valuations: Trade In $4,851 Private Party $5,891 Dealer $7,752 so they seem to agree with me to some degree. note that i don't know any rhode island zip codes, so i used my NY zip code, which shouldn't be all that different. richard - -- Richard Welty rwelty-at-suespammers.org Averill Park Networking rwelty-at-averillpark.net Unix, Linux, IP Network Engineering, Security rwelty-at-krusty-motorsports.com 518-573-7592 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 12:53:53 CDT From: acordova-at-texas.net Subject: Re: [db] overlooked preventive mantainence? > > You regularly encounter people who acquire examples that were driven too > > softly, and for the first few months, the engine gets happier and smoother > and > > peppier just by being regularly driven fairly hard. > > > This was definatly true for my 240D. Ran much better after I ran it hard > for a while. > > Paul > And doesn't it make you enjoy and adore the car that much more? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 10:52:59 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: [db] overlooked preventive mantainence? agree with Alec on this point... drive a car hard every now and then... mainly straightline full throttle stuff... don't hit and and back off and hit it again though, that's hard on them... make the committment and let it wind up a bit... these cars do love to be used... letting them sit is just plain wrong. :) Same with the old full size Jeeps... the more you use them the better they do (but it takes longer to work out all of the bugs on them, they have so many usually. ;) as far as "undocumented tips", hey, if we documented them they wouldn't be undocumented any more would they? ;) john acordova-at-texas.net wrote: >The 616 and 617 diesels in particular definitely appreciate good "blow out the >cobwebs" drives occasionally. It's been referred to before as an Italian tuneup >as well. > >If your regular commute is at least 20 miles, and you get to really move along >the way, your motor will be day-to-day happier. If your regular routine is not >like that, either with much shorter distances or with snarled traffic, you >should take the car out for a good drive every weekend or two. > >You regularly encounter people who acquire examples that were driven too >softly, and for the first few months, the engine gets happier and smoother and >peppier just by being regularly driven fairly hard. > >Just another example of the personality of these cars. They clearly prefer to >work for a living, rather than to just be babied along. > >Alec > > > >>Culling the expertise on the list. >> >>In wake of the "rock the fuses" feasco I just went >>through (I went through six head lamps thinking my >>lights were blowing out!!) >> >>What are some of the "other" little steps that one >>should take to keep the systems running well. >> >>I know about the sunroof lube and rocker switch clean >>and now know about the fuse rocker trick. Are there >>other "undocumented" little tricks that I should do >>ever few months, besides oil and tire roatation, that >>will keep the car running smooth? >> >>curiously. >>-hue- >> >> >> >>__________________________________ >>Do you Yahoo!? >>The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search >>http://shopping.yahoo.com >> >> > > > - -- - ----------------------------- Oh well, I'm a man, but I can change, if I have to, I guess -Red Green http://www.redgreen.com/ - ------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... Jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 13:54:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Richard Welty Subject: Re[2]: [db] Thoughts on Price On Fri, 17 Oct 2003 13:42:06 -0400 (EDT) Richard Welty wrote: > On Fri, 17 Oct 2003 13:29:07 -0400 John Peterson wrote: > > Hello again, I posted two days ago about looking for a used Diesel Benz. > > Helpful tips from members send me to this listing which I open for opinions-- > > does this look like a good deal? My first thought is that 200k might mean a > > transmission is coming... > with that kind of mileage on a northeastern car, it might be on the high side. having said this, i think i should follow myself up with a comment about our experience when we bought the 96 a year ago. what we found at the time was that it was a seller's market, there weren't that many cars around and we did end up going a little on the high side to get the one we purchased. you probably want to spend a little time to get a sense of the market place where you are. richard - -- Richard Welty rwelty-at-suespammers.org Averill Park Networking rwelty-at-averillpark.net Unix, Linux, IP Network Engineering, Security rwelty-at-krusty-motorsports.com 518-573-7592 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 14:00:08 -0400 From: "J.B. Hebert" Subject: Re: [db] Looking for 300D/CD spoiler I don't have a pic, but it looks like I might have tracked one down. If I get it, I'll post a pic with it on my car. :) J.B. At 12:36 PM 10/17/2003 -0400, you wrote: >J.B., > > Did you happen to get a picture of that car? I'd like to see what >that looked like. > >Jim/ > > > Back when I was looking for a good 300D/CD, I came across an '84 300CD >that > > was too expensive, rusty, and slow, but had a nice rubber trunk lid >spoiler > > that looked really sharp. It's the fitted style that wraps slightly over > > the sides, and flips up a little at the rear. Does anyone know where I > > might be able to acquire such a spoiler? Also, does anyone know if there > > is a more aggressive front valance/air dam/spoiler available for this > > car? I'm pretty sure AMG made a body kit, but I can't find anything on > > eBay and the like. I'd like a larger air space under the bumper for the > > FMIC I'm installing. > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > J.B. > > > >-- >Jim Hoffman >Oconomowoc WI >'39 Allis Model B >'53 Ford Golden Jubilee >'?? Bolens Huskie Gardener ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 11:06:55 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: [db] Thoughts on Price looks great... price looks good too... I think blue book on the '91 300d is higher then that! (high book on my '91 is $8,500, kbb?) they use salt on the roads up there though... might not be a big problem, hard to say... but these are great cars, and it has the 2.5L TD from the intake vent on the pass side, did they do that with any other engine? I don't think you have to plan on a transmission, especially if those really were highway miles... these things are rare out here on the west coast... maybe more common back east, but I'd go for that one if it's rust free and drives out nicely.... two thumbs up from this view john John Peterson wrote: >Hello again, I posted two days ago about looking for a used Diesel Benz. >Helpful tips from members send me to this listing which I open for opinions-- >does this look like a good deal? My first thought is that 200k might mean a >transmission is coming... > >http://www.autotrader.com/findacar/vdetail.jtmpl?car_id=145460412&dealer_id=& >car_year=1993&make=MB&distance=25&max_price=7900&model=&advcd_on=n&end_year=2 >004&min_price=7900&certified=n&address=02881&search_type=used&advanced=n&star >t_year=1983&color=&cardist=11 > >thanks friends, > >john peterson > > > - -- - ----------------------------- Oh well, I'm a man, but I can change, if I have to, I guess -Red Green http://www.redgreen.com/ - ------------------------------ http://www.WAGONEERS.com/ Snohomish, WA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... Jesus, don't leave life without him, please! - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1252 **********************************