From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Thu Nov 27 20:27:17 2003 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Friday, November 28 2003 Volume 01 : Number 1302 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [db] Jump Start or name change? [db] ok, what is it? Re: [db] Jump Start or name change? Re: [db] Jump Start or name change? [db] jump start procedure on 'newer' Benzes Re: [db] jump start procedure on 'newer' Benzes [db] 240D question Re: [db] 240D question Re: [db] 240D question Re: [db] 240D question Re: [db] 240D question Re: [db] 240D question Re: [db] 240D question Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2003 22:03:27 -0800 From: john meister Subject: Re: [db] Jump Start or name change? If I couldn't laugh about it all I'd really be in trouble... I'm trusting in the Lord, He'll provide, always has... justice doesn't always happen in this life so there isn't a one-to-one relationship, aka karma. I'll just continue doing what I can to help, and keep fixin' stuff as it flames out, sparks to pieces, falls apart or disappears from view in a cloud of smoke, flames or rust... :) No worries... No fears... have tools, duct tape and a fire extinguisher standing by... (figured the recent adventures might give folks a few chuckles... ;) with all this jumpstarting stuff I got inspired me to take this picture while my son was doing some grinder work: http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2003/sparks.jpg later, john Robert Chase wrote: > John, > > Im sorry to hear about your misfortune but thank you greatly for > sharing it with us. Its nice to know that I am not the only person in > the world with complicated annoying problems. Hang in there though > while I don't believe in God the same way you do I do believe in Karma > and good things happen to good people. > > Robert Chase > > - -- - ------------------------------------------------------------------ john at http://wagoneers.com from Snohomish,WA- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... reminding you not to leave life w/o Jesus! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Nov 2003 23:47:02 -0800 From: john meister Subject: [db] ok, what is it? I'm hazarding a guess that this is the 'heat valve', the equivalent of the monovalve in the 123 series. This is on a 1991 300d 2.5L Turbo Diesel - the symptom I'm trying to resolve is no heat at an idle. Climate control / AC works as Rube designed it at speed. Previous posts to the list indicated that the auxillary water pump was inoperative. I went to my friendly Seattle Benz dealer and bought said part and went to install it and found no such critter abiding in my conveyance... which brings me to my question, WHAT IS THIS and if I replace it will my heat work at an idle again? http://wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/TECH/124-series/what-is-it-1.jpg http://wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/TECH/124-series/what-is-it-2.jpg If replacing this unit won't fix the heat at idle, what will? If replacing it will, then will one out of a '92 300E work in my 300D? thanx all for the assistance... and if you ever need a jump start... call someone else. john - -- - ------------------------------------------------------------------ john at http://wagoneers.com from Snohomish,WA- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... reminding you not to leave life w/o Jesus! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 10:26:50 -0800 From: Greg Fiorentino Subject: Re: [db] Jump Start or name change? At 10:03 PM 11/26/03 , john meister wrote: >If I couldn't laugh about it all I'd really be in trouble... > >I'm trusting in the Lord, He'll provide, always has... justice doesn't >always happen >in this life so there isn't a one-to-one relationship, aka karma. I'll >just continue >doing what I can to help, and keep fixin' stuff as it flames out, sparks to >pieces, falls apart or disappears from view in a cloud of smoke, flames or >rust... :) No worries... No fears... have tools, duct tape and a fire >extinguisher standing by... > >(figured the recent adventures might give folks a few chuckles... ;) > >with all this jumpstarting stuff I got inspired me to take this picture >while my son >was doing some grinder work: >http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2003/sparks.jpg > >later, >john > >Robert Chase wrote: > >>John, >> >>Im sorry to hear about your misfortune but thank you greatly for sharing >>it with us. Its nice to know that I am not the only person in the world >>with complicated annoying problems. Hang in there though while I don't >>believe in God the same way you do I do believe in Karma and good things >>happen to good people. >> >>Robert Chase >> > >-- >------------------------------------------------------------------ john at >http://wagoneers.com from Snohomish,WA- where Jeeps don't >rust, they mold... reminding you not to leave life w/o Jesus! >------------------------------------------------------------------- Nice pic John. One of the things I can be thankful for is having listfriends like you who help point the way when I encounter Benz speedbumps. Unfortunately I have no magic wand solutions to your oven and car problems. If it helps any, I have been through a near loss of career a few years back. I toughed it out and things have turned around incredibly for me. Hopefully your perseverance will provide you with a similar reward. Greg Greg Fiorentino Vancouver USA gfior-at-dslnorthwest.net '86 300SDL Turbo '84 300D Turbo '79 300TD '85 F-350 6.9 crew cab ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 11:14:03 -0800 From: john meister Subject: Re: [db] Jump Start or name change? Thanx Greg.... I appreciate the friends I have on these lists as well. It's amazing the friendships that have developed via these lists. Not to mention the technical problems resolved. :) If it weren't for lists like these I'm convinced that spam would kill the usefulness of email completely. Very thankful that the lists are set up to block spammers, bravo list providers! john Greg Fiorentino wrote: >> http://wagoneers.com/fotos/2003/sparks.jpg > > Nice pic John. One of the things I can be thankful for is having > listfriends like you who help point the way when I encounter Benz > speedbumps. Unfortunately I have no magic wand solutions to your oven > and car problems. > > If it helps any, I have been through a near loss of career a few years > back. I toughed it out and things have turned around incredibly for > me. Hopefully your perseverance will provide you with a similar reward. > > Greg - -- - ------------------------------------------------------------------ john at http://wagoneers.com from Snohomish,WA- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... reminding you not to leave life w/o Jesus! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 14:50:22 -0600 From: "Alec Cordova" Subject: [db] jump start procedure on 'newer' Benzes I think I remember reading somewhere, perhaps in the owner's manual, that the "correct" procedure for jump starting another car using a heavily computerized Benz (probably applies to other cars new enough to be heavily computerized) is to shut your car off before hooking anything up. Just let them share your battery, not your whole electrical and charging system. Alec ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 12:53:56 -0800 From: john meister Subject: Re: [db] jump start procedure on 'newer' Benzes interesting... maybe I should read that book sometime... my concern with doing that is that they'll drain my battery and leave me stranded... :) guess I won't be jump starting anyone when I'm in my benz... I think I'm going to design a transient suppression system using tranzorbs for my J10 so I don't damage the computers... john Alec Cordova wrote: >I think I remember reading somewhere, perhaps in the owner's manual, that >the "correct" procedure for jump starting another car using a heavily >computerized Benz (probably applies to other cars new enough to be heavily >computerized) is to shut your car off before hooking anything up. Just let >them share your battery, not your whole electrical and charging system. > >Alec > > > - -- - ------------------------------------------------------------------ john at http://wagoneers.com from Snohomish,WA- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... reminding you not to leave life w/o Jesus! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 16:29:51 -0600 From: "B. K. Darnell" Subject: [db] 240D question Dear Listers: I have an '83 240D with 160K miles on it. When I went out to get in the car, I had a lot of trouble getting it into Reverse. Then I noticed that the clutch has little tension and 'pops'/engages just slightly from the floor. We had a twenty degree drop in temperatures, so I wonder if that's an issue. Someone suggested that I check the 'clutch' fluid level. I did sit in the car with the clutch depressed while I took a call on my mobile. Is it possible that I stretched a cable or something came loose? OR could it be a fluid level issue? Help! And thanks in advance! Happy Thanksgiving! B. Klaus - ----- Original Message ----- From: "john meister" To: "Alec Cordova" Cc: "Diesel-Benz List" Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2003 2:53 PM Subject: Re: [db] jump start procedure on 'newer' Benzes > interesting... maybe I should read that book sometime... > > my concern with doing that is that they'll drain my battery and leave me > stranded... :) > > guess I won't be jump starting anyone when I'm in my benz... I think > I'm going > to design a transient suppression system using tranzorbs for my J10 so I > don't > damage the computers... > > john > > Alec Cordova wrote: > > >I think I remember reading somewhere, perhaps in the owner's manual, that > >the "correct" procedure for jump starting another car using a heavily > >computerized Benz (probably applies to other cars new enough to be heavily > >computerized) is to shut your car off before hooking anything up. Just let > >them share your battery, not your whole electrical and charging system. > > > >Alec > > > > > > > > -- > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > john at http://wagoneers.com from Snohomish,WA- where Jeeps don't > rust, they mold... reminding you not to leave life w/o Jesus! > ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 17:17:14 -0600 From: Jon Filina Subject: Re: [db] 240D question Mista Klaus wrote: > I have an '83 240D with 160K miles on it. When I went out to get in the > car, I had a lot of trouble getting it into Reverse. Then I noticed that > the clutch has little tension and 'pops'/engages just slightly from the > floor. We had a twenty degree drop in temperatures, so I wonder if that's > an issue. Someone suggested that I check the 'clutch' fluid level. There is no cable linkage on the clutch, it's hydraulic. Check the brake fluid reservoir on the firewall. The back portion is probably low. Top it off, pump the clutch and brakes to even the levels out, and see how the transmission works. Chances are that either the clutch master cylinder, located under the dash near the pedal, or the slave cylinder, on the transmission, are going south. The parts are not overly expensive. If you have a good independent mechanic do the work, you'll get by for around $100-400. If you have the typical dealer do it, it could be up to a grand... On the other hand, and Alec, wipe that grin off your face, you could donate the car to me and I'll deal with the problems..... ;-) Jon '84 300SD "Bruno" I sure wish it was a stick... '81 240D "Mathilde" May she rest in peace... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 17:28:43 -0600 From: "Vernon Tuck" Subject: Re: [db] 240D question Jon baby! Several days ago I posted an inquiry about how to bleed the hydraulic clutch system. But, since I've not received a single reply, and since surely, SOMEBODY would have responded, metinks I addressed it incorrectly. Hmmm... could it have gone to the VOLKSWAGEN list??? Anyway, here it is again. I will be eternally grateful for any insight you can hurl in my direction. Tanks! Vernon ******* The contents of my previous post, to-wit, ergo sum, magna cum laude: "I'm attempting to bleed the hydraulic clutch system on my 240D after replacing the brake master cylinder, clutch master and clutch slave cylinders. The Haynes manual calls for forcing fluid from the front passenger wheel cylinder through a hose connected to the clutch slave cylinder, .to the clutch master cylinder, and back to the brake master cylinder. I'm following the routine from a Haynes manual with little apparent success. Has anybody done this successfully? How many chickens did you have to sacrifice to make it work?? Thanks! Vernon" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 18:52:32 -0600 From: "B. K. Darnell" Subject: Re: [db] 240D question Jon: I've re-read your reply. Is that brake fluid?? Also, will it hurt to drive the car with the clutch 'low' like this? B. Klaus **By the way, I was on and off the list years ago with a 300SD (W-140) crisis. I miss the fun! Thanks for the quick replies and fun! - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jon Filina" To: "B. K. Darnell" Cc: "john meister" ; "Alec Cordova" ; "Diesel-Benz List" Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2003 5:17 PM Subject: Re: [db] 240D question > Mista Klaus wrote: > > > I have an '83 240D with 160K miles on it. When I went out to get in the > > car, I had a lot of trouble getting it into Reverse. Then I noticed that > > the clutch has little tension and 'pops'/engages just slightly from the > > floor. We had a twenty degree drop in temperatures, so I wonder if that's > > an issue. Someone suggested that I check the 'clutch' fluid level. > > There is no cable linkage on the clutch, it's hydraulic. Check the > brake fluid reservoir on the firewall. The back portion is probably > low. Top it off, pump the clutch and brakes to even the levels out, and > see how the transmission works. > > Chances are that either the clutch master cylinder, located under the > dash near the pedal, or the slave cylinder, on the transmission, are > going south. The parts are not overly expensive. If you have a good > independent mechanic do the work, you'll get by for around $100-400. If > you have the typical dealer do it, it could be up to a grand... > > On the other hand, and Alec, wipe that grin off your face, you could > donate the car to me and I'll deal with the problems..... ;-) > > Jon > '84 300SD "Bruno" I sure wish it was a stick... > '81 240D "Mathilde" May she rest in peace... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 17:15:52 -0800 From: john meister Subject: Re: [db] 240D question Vern, I'll pass this on to the other Mercedes list to see if anyone will respond, will extract it from the digest and pass it along... john Vernon Tuck wrote: > Jon baby! > > Several days ago I posted an inquiry about how to bleed the hydraulic > clutch system. But, since I've not received a single reply, and since > surely, SOMEBODY would have responded, metinks I addressed it > incorrectly. Hmmm... could it have gone to the VOLKSWAGEN list??? > > Anyway, here it is again. I will be eternally grateful for any > insight you can hurl in my direction. > > Tanks! > Vernon > ******* > The contents of my previous post, to-wit, ergo sum, magna cum laude: > > "I'm attempting to bleed the hydraulic clutch system on my 240D after > replacing the brake master cylinder, clutch master and clutch slave > cylinders. > > The Haynes manual calls for forcing fluid from the front passenger > wheel cylinder through a hose connected to the clutch slave cylinder, > .to the clutch master cylinder, and back to the brake master cylinder. > > I'm following the routine from a Haynes manual with little apparent > success. > > Has anybody done this successfully? How many chickens did you have to > sacrifice to make it work?? > > Thanks! > Vernon" - -- - ------------------------------------------------------------------ john at http://wagoneers.com from Snohomish,WA- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold... reminding you not to leave life w/o Jesus! - ------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 19:34:57 -0600 From: Jon Filina Subject: Re: [db] 240D question Big Vern yelled: > Jon baby! Yo!! > Several days ago I posted an inquiry about how to bleed the hydraulic clutch > system. But, since I've not received a single reply, and since surely, > SOMEBODY would have responded, metinks I addressed it incorrectly. Hmmm... > could it have gone to the VOLKSWAGEN list??? I thought I saw a reply to your question, but I've since deleted the message. I, too, have the Hayne's manual and have never bled the clutch myself, so I would be even less help than I normally am... If you copied in the Volkswagen list on your request, unless things have changed, they probably thought you were crazy. All three of my VW's ('76, '81 and '90) had cable linkage. > Anyway, here it is again. I will be eternally grateful for any insight you > can hurl in my direction. Since we just got back from Thanksgiving dinner at the Cracker Barrel (don't ask....), I may just be able to "hurl" something in your direction... > Tanks! That's what we drive! And, I for one, and glad they are! Jon '84 300SD "Bruno" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2003 19:46:44 -0600 From: Jon Filina Subject: Re: [db] 240D question Klaus posed the question: > I've re-read your reply. Is that brake fluid?? Yes. The clutch hydraulics share the brake system reservoir. If you look at the reservoir on the brake master cylinder, you'll see a front and back compartment. If I remember correctly, the front portion is for the brakes, and the back is the clutch. I may have it reversed, though. > Also, will it hurt to drive the car with the clutch 'low' like this? Other than grinding gears and clutch slippage, there shouldn't be much additional wear if you get the problem fixed shortly down the road. I drove Mathilde, my '81 240D, for two weeks with a clutch master cylinder out. That involved some careful double clutching and an occasional engine shutdown at stoplights, but it was driveable. I did replace the clutch at the same time the hydraulics were fixed, but I think the dealer pulled a fast one on me. I switched to an independent mechanic after that... Good luck! Jon '84 300SD "Bruno" A W126 and proud of it. If everything I've heard about the W140's is true, I'd just as soon stick with the relative simplicities of the W126's. If the W123 240D's were quieter, I go back to the lack of power. My old 240D was probably the best built car I've ever owned. ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1302 **********************************