From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Thu Feb 12 08:34:11 2004 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Thursday, February 12 2004 Volume 01 : Number 1365 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [db] Methinks...... Re: [db] Methinks...... RE: [db] Methinks...... Re: [db] Methinks...... RE: [db] Methinks...... RE: [db] Methinks...... RE: [db] Methinks...... RE: [db] Methinks...... RE: [db] Methinks...... Re: [db] Methinks...... [db] OT: Wiring harness schematics [db] 240D Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:30:58 -0500 From: "Black, Waylon" Subject: Re: [db] Methinks...... The real issue is what are YOU looking for and where you live/work. The 240D does the job it was intended to do. It is the BASE model MB. It is good, reliable, transportation. HOWEVER, If you drive above 55-60 mph - you may not like the 240D(62 hp). I believe the ring gear is 3.69 or 3.46. Assuming a 185/70/14 equals a diameter of 24.2 inches. 70 mph equals 3586 rpm(3.69) or 3363(3.46) A 300 SD has a 3.07 ratio(and about 120 hp). 70 mph becomes a friendlier 2984. Since I own 3 240Ds, a 300D, 2 300 SDs and a 190D I'll share what I've learned. 240Ds get about 26-27 mpg -at- 70 - good if you do lots of highway driving. 300SDs get 25-27 mpg -at- 70. Much nicer, almost twice the power, better ride, more complex. 300Ds(non turbo) fill the gap between the 240Ds and the 300SDs The 190Ds are the natural evolution of the 123s - more modern, features, power. I like the 'simpleness' of the 123 series(240D/300D) I like the luxury of the 126 series(300SD) The mpg king is the 190Ds - better overall ratios. Waylon Black Little Elm, Texas Rock solid car. Problem is, it accelerates like a rock. Downhill it's pretty good, on flat ground it's unimpressive, going uphill, you'll feel like you want to get out and push. But, you aren't in a hurry to get anywhere. The difference between 65 and 75 over a 200 mile trip is somewhere around ten to fifteen minutes. You'll probably complain that it can't pull a greased string out of a cat's rear for the first week or so, then the car will grow on you and you'll wonder how you got on without it for so long. K - - -- Kevin Pekarek Redwood City, CA (near San Francisco) and Los Osos, CA (near San Luis Obispo) 85 190D (601, 5spd) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 17:38:49 -0600 From: "Vernon Tuck" Subject: Re: [db] Methinks...... I respectfully disagree as to the top speed. Mine will peg the speedo. Just takes forever to get there. VT ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:54:24 -0500 From: "Black, Waylon" Subject: RE: [db] Methinks...... LOL Oh, the 240D will top out at 80/85(maybe 90) but the mpg will drop significanly. I'll defend the 240Ds any time. They do EXACTLY what MB designed them for. No different than comparing the Diesel Rabbit to the Diesel Jetta. Which is the better car? Depends on what your looking for or trying to accomplish. Waylon Black Little Elm, Texas Your too sensitive about the 240s. ;) - -----Original Message----- From: Vernon Tuck [mailto:vtuck-at-tucklings.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2004 5:39 PM To: Black, Waylon; diesel-benz-at-digest.net Subject: Re: [db] Methinks...... I respectfully disagree as to the top speed. Mine will peg the speedo. Just takes forever to get there. VT ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 18:03:14 -0600 From: "Vernon Tuck" Subject: Re: [db] Methinks...... What???!!! Me???? Sensitive??? HARUMPH!!! Ha ha... seriously.. I just wanted the guy to know he can go faster than the law allows provided he takes forever to get there... VT ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 20:21:02 -0600 From: "Alec Cordova" Subject: RE: [db] Methinks...... Having owned a 1980 240D automatic, I feel the need to chime in here. "Cream Puff" would definitely achieve solid roadtrip speeds on the highway, it just took her a little while to get there. This engine was designed to be run pretty hard, and it's quite happy when you keep your foot in it. Transmission is definitely four speed, and I'm pretty sure the W123 diesels were NOT configured to start in second gear. They would start in first. These are some of the most mechanically reliable cars ever built, and as has already been mentioned, this motor works quite well with alternative fuels. Finally (for now), in contrast to Waylon's respected opinion, I think the turbo W123 300D of 81 to 85 vintage is the premier choice for a daily driver, and one that he omitted from his list. He likes the turbodiesel OM617 motor, but I think he just hasn't had the pleasure of that drivetrain in the W123 chassis. Alec Cordova Taylor, Texas 89 300CE, 167K > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net > [mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net]On Behalf Of Vernon Tuck > Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2004 6:03 PM > To: Black, Waylon; diesel-benz-at-digest.net > Subject: Re: [db] Methinks...... > > > What???!!! Me???? Sensitive??? > > HARUMPH!!! > > Ha ha... seriously.. I just wanted the guy to know he can go > faster than the > law allows provided he takes forever to get there... > > VT ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:27:27 +0800 From: "Carballo, Rico A." Subject: RE: [db] Methinks...... 3-speed? I know they always came in 4-speed trannys. The tranny starts in 2nd in D or S. If you kick the pedal down, it will downshift to 1st. Rico > > > I am looking into purchasing a 1981 Mercedes 240D with > 237638 miles on it for $1000. This car has a 2.4l diesel > with a 3-speed automatic transmission. Is this a good value? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2004 23:49:56 -0600 From: "Sam Williams" <1sam-at-io.com> Subject: RE: [db] Methinks...... Jason, If the car is has been well maintained, does not have rust, and you like it, it could prove a great value. Lacking any of the 3, it is not. 1. The transmissions are pretty sturdy and not overly stressed by the 2.4l engine. It's old though. Worst case, you will have to pop in one from a recycler some day. Factory rebuilt xmsns with good warranty are available, too. Plastic parts get brittle and break but overall the car is very well designed to be a safe, comfortable, sturdy work-horse and can remain in fine shape, seemingly forever, if you maintain it well. Maintaining, of course, means rebuilding or replacing things that wear or break. If well cared for, the engine is only now approaching middle age. "There's no free lunch" but a 240D is a brilliantly engineered machine designed to reward good care with long-term good service. 2. What's to convert? If you live in a cold climate, you must process the WVO or heat the fuel. In warm weather, just filter and go. 3. It's a great vehicle. It is not, however, suitable for drag-racing. It will encourage wise driving practices, providing plenty of time to plan future moves. If you plan to keep a car for decades, there are few, if any, candidates better than a 240D. Have fun, Sam - -----Original Message----- From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Jason R Bassett Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2004 9:25 AM To: diesel-benz-at-digest.net Subject: [db] Methinks...... I am looking into purchasing a 1981 Mercedes 240D with 237638 miles on it for $1000. This car has a 2.4l diesel with a 3-speed automatic transmission. Is this a good value? My concerns: 1. I have not had good experiences with any automatic transmission that got old. Do the Mercedes autos hold up as well as their engines, or can I expect it to need rebuilding soon? 2. I want to convert it for WVO, and I am wondering if the engine is well suited to this. 3. Is this a good vehicle period? Thanks! ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 12:08:16 -0500 From: "Black, Waylon" Subject: RE: [db] Methinks...... DARN! Copy that base - need immediate extraction. Cover has been blown, I repeat, cover has been blown. Send 240D immediately, for quick getaway.(poke) Any MB dieselers offer a safe house?. WB - -----Original Message----- From: Vernon Tuck [mailto:vtuck-at-tucklings.com] Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2004 10:42 AM To: Black, Waylon; diesel-benz-at-digest.net Subject: Re: [db] Methinks...... Pssst list! WB is an agent provocateur! VT ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 11:41:32 -0500 From: "Black, Waylon" Subject: RE: [db] Methinks...... Yea, I know - but the mail volume has dropped off. Poking an animal with a stick usually generates some kind of response. :P Waylon Black Little Elm, Texas - -----Original Message----- From: Vernon Tuck [mailto:vtuck-at-tucklings.com] Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2004 6:03 PM To: Black, Waylon; diesel-benz-at-digest.net Subject: Re: [db] Methinks...... What???!!! Me???? Sensitive??? HARUMPH!!! Ha ha... seriously.. I just wanted the guy to know he can go faster than the law allows provided he takes forever to get there... VT ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:41:33 -0600 From: "Vernon Tuck" Subject: Re: [db] Methinks...... Pssst list! WB is an agent provocateur! VT ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2004 15:56:52 -0500 From: "J.B. Hebert" Subject: [db] OT: Wiring harness schematics This is OT, but I figured someone might know. I'm looking for a web site that has a generic wiring harness schematic. Just the basics is all I need. I'm getting ready to redo all the wiring on my '76 Bronco, and I figured that would help me out a little. I have most of the stuff ready, but I wanted something to go by for blinker systems and the like. I figure there must be something like this out there for the custom/rod crowd. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, J.B. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2004 10:57:49 -0500 From: Jason R Bassett Subject: [db] 240D OK, you have all been superbly helpful. Now, one or two more questions. Remember the vehicle: 1981 240D 237638Mi Auto 1. The oil is very dirty^WI know that diesels do get it pretty nasty, but since the air filter is also nasty, I suspect that it may have been slightly neglected. On a 30s-F day, I had trouble starting it, HOWEVER, it started fairly easily on a 45-F day, and runs nicely. Probably the glow plugs are weak. SO.....I'm inclined to just pamper it and not worry about what the PO did too much. I heard a story about a survey MB did for longevity. They contacted all the MB owners they could find, and asked them how many miles their MB had, and how they treated it. One had ~200000 miles on it, and when they asked him how often he changed the oil he replied, "I have to change the oil?" So I'm not really too worried about it. It sounds good, and the seller (not the owner) drove it some, and he didn't even think it was slow. (So there!) 2. This car hit a deer. The seller is a mechanicy type who has fixed it up so that you really can't tell. Is there anything I should check for before I sink money into a potential problem? I don't think it was hit badly^Wit seems straight still. Comments please. (Maybe I can use this to talk him down a little?) Jason ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1365 **********************************