From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Tue Mar 2 20:24:28 2004 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Wednesday, March 3 2004 Volume 01 : Number 1385 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [db] ahh lovely Re: [db] ahh lovely Re: [db] ahh lovely RE: [db] ahh lovely Re: [db] Re: fuel prices Re: [db] Re: fuel prices [db] Preglow weirdness Re: [db] ahh lovely [db] Re: Re: fuel prices RE: [db] Heat for SVO conversion [db] 350 SD engine M603.961 Re: [db] 350 SD engine M603.961 Re: [db] Re: Re: fuel prices Re: [db] 350 SD engine M603.961 [db] good engineering Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 13:08:39 -0800 From: Eric Ditwiler Subject: Re: [db] ahh lovely What is the ambient temperature where you are and how did you filter it? On Mar 2, 2004, at 11:08 AM, S.D.Byers wrote: > just drove to work on almost pure SVO, no heating required, a little > leftover diesel in the tank, life is good. Smells great. I fill from > jerry > cans stored in the basement. > > I am looking forward to the 3USD gallon, assuming I can keep up the > supply > of oil from the morrocan restaurant I get it from. > > SDB > Eric Ditwiler, Assistant Dean Harvey Mudd College 301 E. 12 Street, Claremont, CA 91711 909-607-3134 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:18:25 -0500 (EST) From: "S.D.Byers" Subject: Re: [db] ahh lovely ambient right now is around 5-10C. I have run a mix of 50-50 down below zero C. Around -10C this gells and clogs the filter, chaging the mix to 20-80 SVO-diesel fixed that, at least a little below -10C. I have some few micron filter bags I use and also I have an inline racor stainless disc filter. I also pre-wash the stuff a little to pull out hyrdophillic stuff like acids. I then just let it sit and decant the water out of the bottom. I have mostly soybean oil right now. There were two dead mice in the last batch..... SDB On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, Eric Ditwiler wrote: |What is the ambient temperature where you are and how did you filter it? | | |On Mar 2, 2004, at 11:08 AM, S.D.Byers wrote: | |> just drove to work on almost pure SVO, no heating required, a little |> leftover diesel in the tank, life is good. Smells great. I fill from |> jerry |> cans stored in the basement. |> |> I am looking forward to the 3USD gallon, assuming I can keep up the |> supply |> of oil from the morrocan restaurant I get it from. |> |> SDB |> |Eric Ditwiler, Assistant Dean |Harvey Mudd College |301 E. 12 Street, Claremont, CA 91711 | |909-607-3134 | ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:20:51 -0500 From: "Jim Hoffman" Subject: Re: [db] ahh lovely OK... When I worked in a restaraunt in a previous life, we *scooped* in a solid that would melt. When heat was removed, it would return to a solid. This can't be what you are using or it would be a little hard to *pour* out of a jerry can ;) So my question is this... Did you ask them what type of oil they were using and what form it was in when cold? I would imagine filtering would be using a standard resturaunt grease filter right? TIA! Jim/ > just drove to work on almost pure SVO, no heating required, a little > leftover diesel in the tank, life is good. Smells great. I fill from jerry > cans stored in the basement. > > I am looking forward to the 3USD gallon, assuming I can keep up the supply > of oil from the morrocan restaurant I get it from. > > SDB ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 14:27:39 -0700 From: "Jeremy Bowne" Subject: RE: [db] ahh lovely With dead mice in their oil, I have a feeling they don't care what's in the oil. Hope you don't eat there. - -----Original Message----- From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Jim Hoffman Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 2:21 PM To: Diesel-Benz List Subject: Re: [db] ahh lovely OK... When I worked in a restaraunt in a previous life, we *scooped* in a solid that would melt. When heat was removed, it would return to a solid. This can't be what you are using or it would be a little hard to *pour* out of a jerry can ;) So my question is this... Did you ask them what type of oil they were using and what form it was in when cold? I would imagine filtering would be using a standard resturaunt grease filter right? TIA! Jim/ > just drove to work on almost pure SVO, no heating required, a little > leftover diesel in the tank, life is good. Smells great. I fill from jerry > cans stored in the basement. > > I am looking forward to the 3USD gallon, assuming I can keep up the supply > of oil from the morrocan restaurant I get it from. > > SDB ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 16:27:47 -0500 From: Robert Chase Subject: Re: [db] Re: fuel prices Unfortunatly your plan involves "waking up" the American citizens that are in their trance of consumerism. The cheap shit that they buy that is made in china takes their minds away from the real issues at hand such as energy dependance and offshoring of jobs. As long as they are pacified by the purchase of cute junk that they dont need and are still able to get to the mall they don't care. And of course by the time they do start to care its allready too late to act. Robert Chase flash wrote: >>If we want to sock it to the oil companies we should be thinking about >>where we live and how we get to work. Going to work on public >>transportation can really help reduce the amount of fuel you use. When >>I worked for CNN (wow those old memories of being a productive member of >>society and having employment) we had a parking problem at CNN center. >>I rode the train to work because parking was $12/day at the parking deck >>there. It actually saved me a lot of money and wear and tear on my >>car. I drove my car 1 mile a day to the train station and sat and read >>books on the train when I would be sitting in traffic. CNN had a setup >>with our public transportation system MARTA and I actually was able to >>ride the train for free. >> >>But as Americans its our right to have huge cars and by god some of us >>are not going to learn until it hurts us in the pocket book. Such is >>life. Have fun filling up the tank when the bill comes to $80. >> >>Robert Chase >> >> > >I agree with what you say. >This proposal was not about buying gas on certain days. >This proposal was about not buying gas from one certain LARGE producer and forcing his prices >to drop thus forcing other prices to drop accross the board. Plausible, but we really gotta >git less gas tank dependent. Rambling subdivisions assist in our dependence on gas tanks, >sadly. I drive 50 minutes each way otherwise I would be on a bicycle again. I am trying to do >van/car pool - small improvements, but not enough really. >Dan ChicagoArea ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 16:29:30 -0500 From: Robert Chase Subject: Re: [db] Re: fuel prices Yep, A lot of fuel retailers take a loss on fuel in the hopes of selling $1.09 drinks and other grosly inflated items that people buy there. Robert Chase Mike Mangrum wrote: >Most gasoline comes from the same pool of suppliers. Each retail chain (Mobile, BP, etc.) put in their additives before it goes into our tanks. So I don't know if the proposed model would work since I doubt the profit margin is very large between wholesale and retail. Probably only a few cents is made on each gallon. > >A change in US attitude, and current political power, is needed. > >flash wrote: > > >>If we want to sock it to the oil companies we should be thinking about >>where we live and how we get to work. Going to work on public >>transportation can really help reduce the amount of fuel you use. When >>I worked for CNN (wow those old memories of being a productive member of >>society and having employment) we had a parking problem at CNN center. >>I rode the train to work because parking was $12/day at the parking deck >>there. It actually saved me a lot of money and wear and tear on my >>car. I drove my car 1 mile a day to the train station and sat and read >>books on the train when I would be sitting in traffic. CNN had a setup >>with our public transportation system MARTA and I actually was able to >>ride the train for free. >> >>But as Americans its our right to have huge cars and by god some of us >>are not going to learn until it hurts us in the pocket book. Such is >>life. Have fun filling up the tank when the bill comes to $80. >> >>Robert Chase >> >> > >I agree with what you say. >This proposal was not about buying gas on certain days. >This proposal was about not buying gas from one certain LARGE producer and forcing his prices >to drop thus forcing other prices to drop accross the board. Plausible, but we really gotta >git less gas tank dependent. Rambling subdivisions assist in our dependence on gas tanks, >sadly. I drive 50 minutes each way otherwise I would be on a bicycle again. I am trying to do >van/car pool - small improvements, but not enough really. >Dan ChicagoArea > >Mike M. in Ann Arbor, MI >'74 914 2.0, '75 914 1.8, '82 300D TurboDiesel >Oh lord won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz >My friends all drive Porsches, I must make amends >Yahoo! Search - Find what you^Rre looking for faster. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 16:37:45 -0500 From: Robert Chase Subject: [db] Preglow weirdness Atlanta is a city of tempature weirdness. Less than a week ago it snowed and now its 74 degrees out. Of course now my car is doing weird stuff as well. Most of the time my car will start without even preglowing as long as the temp is around 50 degrees. My preglow system has been a little "tired" due to the winter and its been a bit tempermental to start (have to preglow it for a longer time) when the tempature is in the 30's. Now that the tempature is going up my preglow system is acting up. When I turn the key to the preglow position the light does not come on. If you turn the key several times on and off the light will come on and go out quickly as if to say hey its warm enough to start you idiot. Its never done this before. Even in the middle of the 90 degree summers we had last year the car would ALWAYS preglow. Any ideas where to start? I think my preglow relay might be on its way out. Robert Chase ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 17:24:40 -0500 From: "S.D.Byers" Subject: Re: [db] ahh lovely This is soybean oil, comes in 5 gallon plastic barrels and leaves the restaurant in similar to my house. It is only slightly more viscous that diesel. SDB On Tue, 2 Mar 2004, Jim Hoffman wrote: |OK... When I worked in a restaraunt in a previous life, we |*scooped* in a solid that would melt. When heat was removed, it |would return to a solid. This can't be what you are using or it |would be a little hard to *pour* out of a jerry can ;) | |So my question is this... Did you ask them what type of oil they |were using and what form it was in when cold? | |I would imagine filtering would be using a standard resturaunt grease |filter right? | |TIA! | |Jim/ | |> just drove to work on almost pure SVO, no heating required, a little |> leftover diesel in the tank, life is good. Smells great. I fill from jerry |> cans stored in the basement. |> |> I am looking forward to the 3USD gallon, assuming I can keep up the supply |> of oil from the morrocan restaurant I get it from. |> |> SDB | ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 16:58:02 -0600 From: flash Subject: [db] Re: Re: fuel prices Oh, you wanna bring cheap china stuff into the mix? Great, carry on. What you say already makes me agree totally with your perspective. Carry on. Dan ChicagoArea > Unfortunatly your plan involves "waking up" the American citizens that > are in their trance of consumerism. The cheap shit that they buy that > is made in china takes their minds away from the real issues at hand > such as energy dependance and offshoring of jobs. As long as they are > pacified by the purchase of cute junk that they dont need and are still > able to get to the mall they don't care. And of course by the time they > do start to care its allready too late to act. > > Robert Chase ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:57:47 -0600 From: "Sam Williams" <1sam-at-io.com> Subject: RE: [db] Heat for SVO conversion Hi Vernon, Thanks. Not right now. I'm out of filters and we're just coming out of winter. Besides, I'm not hard-core about being veggie. In summer I filter and add about 5 gals at a time. Seldom run more than 50/50. Only been doing this a couple of years--want to make sure there is no down side before getting radical (haven't found a down side yet--beyond getting intimate with waste oil). I figure any step I take to save money, help the environment or (as if I make much difference) reduce our country's dependence..., is a plus. Sam - -----Original Message----- From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Vernon Tuck Sent: Tuesday, March 02, 2004 7:09 AM To: Sam Williams; 'Eric Ditwiler'; 'Diesel Benz' Subject: Re: [db] Heat for SVO conversion Sam, That was a stunning nugget of logic. Are you already running WVO??? VT ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:23:07 -0800 From: "Daniel F. Tilley" Subject: [db] 350 SD engine M603.961 Several of the members on this board have suggested staying away from the M603 engine - even the ones build for the W140 series - because is has weak piston rods. I have been told that It would be OK to buy on of these if it has had the engine replaced. I guess that the rods have been known to crack under the extra stress of this motor. My question is this; If Mercedes discovered this problem in 90 or 91, would they have continued to make this defective engine until 1994 without correcting the problem? And when one of these cars had its engine replaced under warrantee, what engine did they use to replace the original - the same old defective motor? It doesn't make sense to me. I would have assumed that by 94 the engines would be near perfect. Why am I wrong? Daniel F. Tilley ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 16:44:29 -0800 From: Kevin Pekarek Subject: Re: [db] 350 SD engine M603.961 On Tue, Mar 02, 2004 at 04:23:07PM -0800, Daniel F. Tilley wrote: > Several of the members on this board have suggested staying away from > the M603 engine - even the ones build for the W140 series - because is > has weak piston rods. I have been told that It would be OK to buy on of > these if it has had the engine replaced. I guess that the rods have been > known to crack under the extra stress of this motor. My question is > this; If Mercedes discovered this problem in 90 or 91, would they have > continued to make this defective engine until 1994 without correcting > the problem? And when one of these cars had its engine replaced under > warrantee, what engine did they use to replace the original - the same > old defective motor? It doesn't make sense to me. I would have assumed > that by 94 the engines would be near perfect. Why am I wrong? Until after the demise of the OM603, Mercedes vehemently denied there was anything wrong with the engines. They usually failed out of warranty, and Mercedes was more than happy to sell them a new crate engine, or rebuild theirs, at an extreme cost. Even if the car was under warranty, Mercedes fought hard to not replace the engine, blaming it on anything they possibly could. AFAIK, Mercedes didn't come out with the revised rods until after the demise of the OM603, so ANY factory-installed OM603 3.5L is suspect, and, theoretically, any engine installed before the end of the 3.5 is suspect as well. New rebuilts/crate engines are supposed to be okay. If you have one rebuilt, make sure it gets the updated connecting rods. If you're not completely sure whether a 3.5L OM603 has been correctly replaced, just remember that a replacement shortblock goes for somewhere around $8000, not installed. You *MAY* be able to find one cheaper or have yours rebuilt cheaper, but nonetheless, that's a lot of trips to the Dallas Can Academy, right? :) K - -- Kevin Pekarek Redwood City, CA (near San Francisco) and Los Osos, CA (near San Luis Obispo) 85 190D (601, 5spd) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 19:51:27 -0500 From: Edward Pomeroy Subject: Re: [db] Re: Re: fuel prices Folks, Off topic but had to put in $.02 - Lost my first job in consumer electronics to the Japanese, lost second job in railroad equipment to the Mexicans & Chinese, got smart, work for a defense contractor and may it be a cold day in hades before this one goes overseas! I agree that the US has to revise its open door policy to imports but tariffs are not the solution. Tit for tat, anyone blocking our products and services should be completely shut out of the US market, no wiggle room or third country stuff, closed 100% to their exports. Some US consumers will suffer in some areas, but just see how fast the other guys review their policies. We are still the #1 consumer nation. And while we are at it, lets develop our own oil resources while undertaking a Manhattan style project to perfect fusion reactors and other efficient energy sources and products. Edward Shores of Lake Michigan flash wrote: >Oh, you wanna bring cheap china stuff into the mix? >Great, carry on. What you say already makes me agree totally with your perspective. Carry on. >Dan ChicagoArea > > > >>Unfortunatly your plan involves "waking up" the American citizens that >>are in their trance of consumerism. The cheap shit that they buy that >>is made in china takes their minds away from the real issues at hand >>such as energy dependance and offshoring of jobs. As long as they are >>pacified by the purchase of cute junk that they dont need and are still >>able to get to the mall they don't care. And of course by the time they >>do start to care its allready too late to act. >> >>Robert Chase ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 18:52:27 -0600 From: "Vernon Tuck" Subject: Re: [db] 350 SD engine M603.961 Kevin, Thank you for jerking me back to reality thus motivating me to go outside and kiss the ground across which recently rolled my pokey old 240D. Vernon ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 03:56:33 +0000 From: dieseljohn-at-comcast.net Subject: [db] good engineering I figured out today why Mercedes cost so much. I'm down in Tucson teaching a Solaris class at Ft. Huachuca and decided to take a drive over to Tombstone after dinner. The little Cavilier rental car seemed pretty decent for what it was on the freeway... but let me tell you I was missing my 124 on that highway to Tombstone... I thought I might need one (tombstone)... I don't like cars that change direction without turning the wheel. The engineering that went into the Benz suspension is well worth the price difference. :) FWIW my opening joke for class was: "I'm perplexed why they'd bring me down from Seattle to teach you guys about Sun..." :) (we're in the middle of our annual rain festival and all... you know, the one that runs from the day before Labor day until the day after the fourth of July. ;) Hope my friend has had time to fix my 300d... he was going to come over and figure out what burned up and fix it while I was gone... john ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1385 **********************************