From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Sat Aug 7 17:29:56 2004 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Sunday, August 8 2004 Volume 01 : Number 1525 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [db] Good Choice? '95 E300 Re: [db] need measurements from 6.2 and 6.5L GM Diesels [db] Tire Noise RE: [db] Tire Noise [db] Diesel dreams can come true... :) for sale: '96 XJ 4.0L HO/AW4... Re: [db] Tire Noise [db] Re: fsj: Diesel dreams can come true... :) DUDE it's got the TURBO KIT!!!! [db] Diesel 6.2L links /specs vs. MB 3.0L & 4.0L Re: [db] Diesel dreams can come true... :) for sale: '96 XJ 4.0L HO/AW4... RE: [db] Diesel dreams can come true... :) for sale: '96 XJ 4.0L HO/AW4... Re: [db] Diesel dreams can come true... :) for sale: '96 XJ 4.0L HO/AW4... Re: [db] Diesel dreams can come true... :) for sale: '96 XJ 4.0L HO/AW4... Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2004 17:51:02 -0700 From: Kevin Pekarek Subject: Re: [db] Good Choice? '95 E300 On Fri, Aug 06, 2004 at 08:27:02PM -0400, John Peterson wrote: > I've been trying and trying to find a 300D in decent shape that isn't rotted > out here in Rhode Island for 5 months on and off. I found an 95 E300 with > 105k miles. It is what is called a "Special Edition". What does this mean > and are these good diesels? Looks like it has room under the hood to work in- > and no rust. While the 95 E300D is the last of the somewhat easily serviced E-class (in 96, they got a bit more complicated), the 95 had the new engine. It's a pretty potent little critter for a normally aspirated diesel, but you'll probably notice the difference between it and a turbo if you try to climb a steep hill with the A/C on. The engine is controlled by a computer, and has a bunch of electrogizmos and sensors that attempt to keep it happy. There's a check engine light, complicated glow plug setup... Nothing unconquerable, but it's not the simplest engine out there. The chassis itself isn't too complicated, but the A/C will drive you bonkers if it isn't up to snuff. I don't know what the special edition is, but didn't know that they came with them. Being the last year of the body style, it will be fairly decked out with options. Most of the annoying features that appeared early on in the w124 chassis were dealt with by 95. > Advice, please. Would this make a first 1st MB diesel? Is 14k a good price > for a 95 with 105k? I think so, but that's me. Price seems a teense high, you might want to check out nada.com or kbb.com to verify that. 95 E300Ds around here go for around 10k, maybe a teense more with that kind of mileage. Something like that, I'd talk the owner into letting you take the car to a Mercedes dealer for a pre-purchase inspection. There's a few things on that car that will suck your wallet dry and melt your credit cards, so you'll want to make sure that a good mechanic has given the car a once-over. The other advantage to a PPI is that you'll have a list to follow as you own the car of things it's going to need. If you like that body style but want a turbo, your options are either an 87 with a 3.0L six cylinder (which is a beast under the hood, but there is a known problem with some heads cracking) or a 90-93 with a 2.5L five cylinder. Obviously the five gets a little better mileage than the six in the 87, but doesn't have quite the power. K - -- Kevin Pekarek Redwood City, CA (near San Francisco) and Los Osos, CA (near San Luis Obispo) 85 190D (601, 5spd) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Aug 2004 20:54:27 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: [db] need measurements from 6.2 and 6.5L GM Diesels I think I found an '84 'burb 4x4 with a good 6.2L. It's out in the boonies... waiting for pictures... but it sounds like a winner... I've heard good things about the 6.5L, but I've had a 6.2L and know them... I've also heard some bad things about the 6.5L. So going with a 6.2L and adding a Banks seems like a good plan to me. :) thanx all for the input... standby for confirmation of engine donor in the next few days. :) john scott_haaland-at-agilent.com wrote: > I have a 96 6.5L TD in my Suburban. I've been fairly disappointed with the > mileage. I'm only getting about 16 mpg on the highway, and 13-14 mpg around > town. I've installed new injectors, new FSD (Fuel solenoid Driver) and FSD > Cooler mod, but it didn't help much. Haven't investigated further, but I > understand that 18-19 mpg is about as good as they get for others. Maybe I'm > wrong....and maybe something is wrong with my engine, but it runs good, has > good power, and is consistent :) It has quite good power compared to a 6.2L, > but you may get better mileage with the 6.2. > > R, > Scott > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net > [mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net]On Behalf Of john meister > Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 9:14 PM > To: 'dbl'; xj; fsj list; curtis > Subject: [db] need measurements from 6.2 and 6.5L GM Diesels > > > I'm looking at using a GM 6.5L Turbo Diesel in my '83 J10 stepside. > > We need some measurements: > > - top of valve covers - widest part. > - from bottom of oil pan to top of intake/air cleaner > - from back of engine block (nearest the firewall) to the front of the fan. > > - which side is the oil sump on? > any pictures of one? > > thanx, > john ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 12:27:37 -0700 From: "Thomas J. Harais" Subject: [db] Tire Noise I have Michelin MXV4+ Energy tires on my W126. This is the second set (well, partially anyway) that I have used on the MB. They have many excellent qualities. But one thing I've noted, they make a whine, especially at higher speeds. It's a low, rumbling whine, not unlike the noise that off-road tires make on a 4X4 on the freeway. Has anyone else experienced this? Changing pressure does not seem to quiet them, although at higher pressures, the noise seems to decrease slightly. Tom H. Antioch, CA '87 300 SDL ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 14:38:27 -0500 From: "Alec Cordova" Subject: RE: [db] Tire Noise > I have Michelin MXV4+ Energy tires on my W126. This is the second set > (well, partially anyway) that I have used on the MB. They have many > excellent qualities. But one thing I've noted, they make a whine, > especially at higher speeds. It's a low, rumbling whine, not unlike the > noise that off-road tires make on a 4X4 on the freeway. > > Has anyone else experienced this? > > Changing pressure does not seem to quiet them, although at higher > pressures, the noise seems to decrease slightly. > > Tom H. > Antioch, CA > '87 300 SDL > If they have some miles on them, it could be that alignment problems, probably caused by worn rubber suspension parts, have caused uneven wear. If the tires are pretty new and you're confident their not defective, it may be bearings or some other driveline parts. My nickel's on incorrect alignment. While not the quietest available, MXV4+'s, like most Michelins, tend to be fairly quiet. Not as quiet as the Yokohama AVS DB S2's I just put on my CE about a week ago, but definitely nothing that should annoy you. Alec Cordova Taylor, Texas 89 300CE, 173K, with fresh suspension rubber and alignment - --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.734 / Virus Database: 488 - Release Date: 8/4/2004 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 12:54:29 -0700 From: john meister Subject: [db] Diesel dreams can come true... :) for sale: '96 XJ 4.0L HO/AW4... Found a 6.2L Diesel 4x4, AT, AC... even comes with a portable storage shed... ;) (i.e. the '84 suburban it comes in ;)... It's on the other side of the mountains, at a dealership... they will even deliver it! cool. I'm excited... a Diesel in SuperDawg!!! I've had a 6.2L Diesel before... they are fine with me. I got around 20mpg in a big old black GMC Jimmy so I'd expect at least that or better in my lightweight J10 stepside. I might even see if I can find a Banks kit for the 6.2L, that should give me a few more mpg and a bit more oomph. This will be so nice as I'll actually be able to tow something with it too. The original 4.0L idea was fine, but it was just a tad bit underpowered and would have been straining to push the J10 let alone a trailer. I'm wondering if the 4.10 gears with 235's will be tall enough for the 6.2L... I'll either have to get bigger tires or swap the gears... ideas? suggestions? What's also nice about this is that this will allow me to make SuperDawg my daily driver on my "new" commute down into Seattle (finally got a real day job, PTL!). So that means I'll be selling shadowfox (the '91 300d 2.5L TD) as soon as SuperDawg is done... estimate March or so. we'll see... It's a great car, but with a Diesel FSJ setup the way I want... So, I'm selling the '96 4.0L engine, has about 120,000 miles or so on it. Will sell it with the wiring harness, computers and other parts. Also have a '96 AW4 that can go with it. Asking $1,500 for the 4.0L - can deliver it within a couple hundred miles of Seattle... it's in Centralia right now. I can't remember what I paid for the AW4... came out of a wrecking yard up in BC, I'm thinking I paid about $450 canadian for it... comes with the computer. I'm going to wait and see if the Suburban transmission will accept the NP219... Anyone know what the spline count is for an '84 'burb? I have a feeling it won't mate up... If that's the case then I have two good NP219's (New Process Quadratracs) for sale as well. I guess I'll stick with the NP208 that's most likely in the 'burb driveline. So, it looks like I'll be selling the custom adapter to mate an AW4 to the SJ NP208/219 xfr cases... spent a bloody fortune on it. $65 for the hunk of metal and another $300 getting it machined... If you're thinking of doing a 4.0L conversion on your FSJ I'll make you a package deal on the 4.0L/harness/AW4/NP219 and all that... get in touch with me. I still think it's a great way of going in an FSJ. The 4.0L is an awesome motor. My '87 has 250,000 miles on it... gets 17mpg in town and 21 mpg on the road... I've thought about using this engine in my '87 XJ, but the work involved to convert it to the newer electronics is just more work then it's worth. I thought about using it in Rambo, but my wife won't let me bring it home... besides, it'll be cooler with the 4.2L and T-5. Or maybe I should sell the original 4.2L and T-5/NP208 to help pay for this conversion... It looks like my son is planning on dropping a 289 in his '82 300D down in Tucson as soon as he gets the Comanche down there. He'll ship his old 3.0L (275,000+ miles) up here for me and I'll rebuild it and use it in the '87 after SuperDawg is up and running and I've replaced the '87 with another WJ for my wife... dieseljohn ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 13:05:47 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: [db] Tire Noise I had the same issue on my W124, '91 300d. The previous owner had installed tires one size too small so I had a reason to replace them... I went with the BFG Traction T/A's instead of the Michelin MXV4's. I had a set of those on my 123 and 126 and liked them, I don't know if they changed the design/composition or what... but I'm not going back to them... The BFG's are great... a lot quieter then the MXV4s were... john Thomas J. Harais wrote: > I have Michelin MXV4+ Energy tires on my W126. This is the second set > (well, partially anyway) that I have used on the MB. They have many > excellent qualities. But one thing I've noted, they make a whine, > especially at higher speeds. It's a low, rumbling whine, not unlike the > noise that off-road tires make on a 4X4 on the freeway. > > Has anyone else experienced this? > > Changing pressure does not seem to quiet them, although at higher > pressures, the noise seems to decrease slightly. > > Tom H. > Antioch, CA > '87 300 SDL ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 13:38:50 -0700 From: john meister Subject: [db] Re: fsj: Diesel dreams can come true... :) DUDE it's got the TURBO KIT!!!! Just got the pictures!!!! It has the BANKS KIT ALREADY!!! and HYDROBOOST!!! http://www.wagoneers.com/SuperDawg/DawgYear2004/BurbDiesel/ Going to be a tight fit with that turbo, but we're relocating the battery to behind the cab under the floor so it should fit... might have to buy a larger sledge hammer... :) john john meister wrote: > Found a 6.2L Diesel 4x4, AT, AC... even comes with a portable > storage shed... ;) (i.e. the '84 suburban it comes in ;)... ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 15:25:36 -0700 From: john meister Subject: [db] Diesel 6.2L links /specs vs. MB 3.0L & 4.0L the stock '84 6.2L is rated at 135 hp-at- 3,600 rpm vs. 125 hp-at-4,000 rpm for the MB 3.0L the 6.2L torque is 240 ftlbs -at- 2,000 rpm vs. 170 ftlbs -at- 2,400 rpm for the MB 3.0L. The Banks Kit adds gains of +60 hp and +115 lb-ft torque, plus 10% better fuel economy... http://www.4wheelerssupply.com/Products_01819/ so net would be: 195 hp and 355 ft lbs of torque!!! :) Stump Pulling oomph. :) I can hardly wait... :) =========================================== 6.2/6.5 pages: http://www.62-65-dieselpage.com/feature.htm http://www.thedieselpage.com/trouble.htm 700r4 buildup: http://www.thedieselpage.com/reviews/lee700r4-2.htm http://www.thedieselpage.com/reviews/lee700r4-1.htm ================================================= http://www.wagoneers.com/SuperDawg/DawgYear2004/Thoughts-of-Diesels.txt LH6 - 6.2L V-8 Diesel produced by GM-Detroit Diesel Allison Divison 3.98 x 3.80 inches 21.3:1 - 379.4 inches (6.2L) HP 135 -at- 3600 rpm Torque 240 ftlbs -at- 2000 rpm 7 qt capacity. ================================= 83-4.2L - 115 hp-at-3,200 -210 ftlb -at-1800 96-4.0L - 185 hp-at-4,600 -220 ftlb -at-2400 83-3.0LTD- 125 hp-at-4,350 -170 ftlb -at-2400 year model cyl engine: bore/stroke hp torque '83 300D: 5 3.0L TD 3.58x3.64 in 120 hp-at-4,350 -170 ftlb -at-2400 OM617A - 91x92.4 mm '87 300D: 6 3.0L TD 3.43x3.31 in 143 hp-at-4,600 -195 ftlb -at-2400 OM603A - 87x84 mm '91 300D: 5 2.5L TD 3.43x3.31 in 121 hp-at-4,600 -165 ftlb -at-2400 OM602 - 87x84 mm (NOTE '91: fuel injection high pressure, mechanical Garrett T3 turbo) Cubic Inch displacement for the metric impaired '91 2.5L - 152.4 cu in '87 3.0L - 182.8 cu in '83 3.0L - 183 cu in '96 4.0L - 241.6 cu in '83 4.2L - 258 cu in note: JEEP '91: 4.0L is 3.88x3.14 in john ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 16:43:01 -0700 From: Kevin Pekarek Subject: Re: [db] Diesel dreams can come true... :) for sale: '96 XJ 4.0L HO/AW4... On Sat, Aug 07, 2004 at 12:54:29PM -0700, john meister wrote: > Found a 6.2L Diesel 4x4, AT, AC... even comes with a portable > storage shed... ;) (i.e. the '84 suburban it comes in ;)... Well, if it gets in the way, your son has that sawzall... > This will be so nice as I'll actually be able to tow something > with it too. The original 4.0L idea was fine, but it was > just a tad bit underpowered and would have been straining to > push the J10 let alone a trailer. I'm wondering if the 4.10 > gears with 235's will be tall enough for the 6.2L... I'll either > have to get bigger tires or swap the gears... ideas? suggestions? Well, Blackie has 4.10s in it, and 235 85R16s. No problems with obscene amounts of weight (except for it being normally aspirated, so some hills are a little slow going). The only downside is the TH400 isn't lockup, so you're not going too fast on the freeway and mileage suffers. > What's also nice about this is that this will allow me to > make SuperDawg my daily driver on my "new" commute down into > Seattle (finally got a real day job, PTL!). So that means > I'll be selling shadowfox (the '91 300d 2.5L TD) as soon > as SuperDawg is done... estimate March or so. we'll see... > It's a great car, but with a Diesel FSJ setup the way I want... Heh. You think curtis will be done by march? heheheh. > I'm going to wait and see if the Suburban transmission will accept > the NP219... Anyone know what the spline count is for an '84 'burb? > I have a feeling it won't mate up... If that's the case then I have > two good NP219's (New Process Quadratracs) for sale as well. I > guess I'll stick with the NP208 that's most likely in the 'burb > driveline. The burbinator will have a 208, but if it has a 700R4, it will be tilted a bit to clear the transmission pan, which seriously screws with breakover angle. I think the suburban has the wrong side drop to reuse its transfercase on your jeep. > It looks like my son is planning on dropping a 289 in his '82 300D down > in Tucson as soon as he gets the Comanche down there. He'll ship > his old 3.0L (275,000+ miles) up here for me and I'll rebuild it and > use it in the '87 after SuperDawg is up and running and I've replaced > the '87 with another WJ for my wife... A 289 in the 300D? I guess finding a fairlane or comet or falcon or something to put the 289 in, and keeping the 300D whole is asking too much. I'd say your son needs adult supervision, but you're licking your chops for the OM617, so you probably wouldn't be much help :) Hey Alec - can I have some of that popcorn? :) K - -- Kevin Pekarek Redwood City, CA (near San Francisco) and Los Osos, CA (near San Luis Obispo) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 18:57:23 -0500 From: "Alec Cordova" Subject: RE: [db] Diesel dreams can come true... :) for sale: '96 XJ 4.0L HO/AW4... > Hey Alec - can I have some of that popcorn? :) > > K > Man, I'm challenged just to keep the popcorn from burning while I fix drinks. This family-wide, cross-country master plan would be way too much for me to keep on top of. Guess we'll just sit back and enjoy the show. Alec - --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.734 / Virus Database: 488 - Release Date: 8/4/2004 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 07 Aug 2004 17:08:20 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: [db] Diesel dreams can come true... :) for sale: '96 XJ 4.0L HO/AW4... It just keeps getting better... my son is planning a 289 into his '82 300d, he'll ship that motor back up here (or bring it up in his Comanche) and then I'll swap the 4.0L out of the '87 xj and put it in there... :) john Alec Cordova wrote: >>Hey Alec - can I have some of that popcorn? :) >> >>K >> > > > Man, I'm challenged just to keep the popcorn from burning while I fix > drinks. This family-wide, cross-country master plan would be way too much > for me to keep on top of. Guess we'll just sit back and enjoy the show. > > Alec > --- > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). > Version: 6.0.734 / Virus Database: 488 - Release Date: 8/4/2004 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Aug 2004 17:10:01 -0700 From: Kevin Pekarek Subject: Re: [db] Diesel dreams can come true... :) for sale: '96 XJ 4.0L HO/AW4... On Sat, Aug 07, 2004 at 06:57:23PM -0500, Alec Cordova wrote: > > Hey Alec - can I have some of that popcorn? :) > > Man, I'm challenged just to keep the popcorn from burning while I fix > drinks. This family-wide, cross-country master plan would be way too much > for me to keep on top of. Guess we'll just sit back and enjoy the show. Heh. Wonder if his son will drive the 300D back to Monster Garage in WA for the exchange. Even though I'm a ford guy, when John said 289, I was thinking R-2 Avanti engine, and was wondering where he got his hands on one of those. I still think a [ford] 289 makes a nice match in a falcon sport, but wouldn't offer the challenge that I think he's looking for. K - -- Kevin Pekarek Redwood City, CA (near San Francisco) and Los Osos, CA (near San Luis Obispo) ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1525 **********************************