From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Fri Aug 13 20:05:56 2004 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Saturday, August 14 2004 Volume 01 : Number 1531 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [db] 300TD saga [db] 190D coolant leak [db] Question regarding R134 refrigerant in 83 300D? Re: [db] Question regarding R134 refrigerant in 83 300D? Re: [db] Question regarding R134 refrigerant in 83 300D? Re: [db] the last wagoneer... Re: [db] Question regarding R134 refrigerant in 83 300D? Re: [db] the last wagoneer... RE: [db] Army uses used motor oil as fuel Re: [db] Question regarding R134 refrigerant in 83 300D? [db] waste oil discussion [db] Diesel project update... Re: Subject: Re: [db] Army uses used motor oil as fuel Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 22:14:04 -0400 From: "Marc" Subject: Re: [db] 300TD saga > Wow. Consider yourself lucky... The timing chains I've heard of going out > on OM617s like to take a lobe off the cam too while they're at it. I guess > it's more fun that way. Well, it did. The cam shaft ended up being 3 pieces. As the pistons came up, the valves didn't quite have enough room. As they were pushed up, the cast iron cam shaft couldn't take it. The parts list included the 3 timing chain gears (end of camshaft, end of crankshaft, end of injection pump), the cam shaft, all of the cam bearings, etc. Marc '83 300D Turbo, 322,000 miles '83 300TD, 204,000 miles ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 19:26:31 -0700 From: "Justin H" Subject: [db] 190D coolant leak Hope everyone's enjoying the sun. I am unfamiliar with a particular fitting on one of heater core lines. It is coming from the back of the right side of my motor, The fitting is leaking some coolant. Does anyone know what this part is, or where I can find one? Thanks everyone, -Justin _________________________________________________________________ Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 07:31:46 -0500 From: "Richard F Dillon" Subject: [db] Question regarding R134 refrigerant in 83 300D? Friends, I'm having some work done on the 1983 300D, and am considering having the AC repaired. The compressor locked up a couple of years ago, and I haven't fixed it. Being in Houston,TX, it would really be nice to have it working. My question is, what is the feasability of converting this old system to R134A? My previous mechanic used a hybrid refrigerant, I believe Freeze12. Will the rest of the system be able to accomodate a change in refrigerant, or is this not recommended? Thanks in advance for all your help and advice, Richard "Watch your thoughts, for they become words. Choose your words, for they become actions. Understand your actions, for they become habits. Study your habits, they will become your character. Develop your character for it becomes your destiny." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 08:58:38 -0400 From: Mike Frank Subject: Re: [db] Question regarding R134 refrigerant in 83 300D? My 1987 190D was converted to R134 before I bought it, works fine. Since you're replacing the compressor and drier, this would be a good time to do it. The system needs to be chemically flushed, and new schraeder valves installed. All new o-rings need to be installed. I know there's a specific R134 expansion valve available for the 123, although I think it will still work with the R12 valve. The expansion valve has to be removed in any event, to flush the system and install new o-rings. It's a good idea to replace all the hoses with new barrier hoses as well, to avoid problems later. Freeze12 also works well. The only downside is that you can't top it off, you would need to evacuate and refill if there's any leakage. Mike Frank At 08:31 AM 8/12/2004, you wrote: >My question is, what is the feasability of converting this old system to >R134A? My previous mechanic used a hybrid refrigerant, I believe Freeze12. >Will the rest of the system be able to accomodate a change in refrigerant, >or is this not recommended? Thanks in advance for all your help and >advice, Richard ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 04:15:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Jerome Kaidor Subject: Re: [db] Question regarding R134 refrigerant in 83 300D? Richard F Dillon wrote: > > Friends, I'm having some work done on the 1983 300D, and am > considering having the AC repaired. The compressor locked up a couple > of years ago, and I haven't fixed it. Being in Houston,TX, it would > really be nice to have it working. > My question is, what is the feasability of converting this old system > to R134A? *** Works fine with R134A. He'll need to change out the receiver/drier and flush out the rest of the system. Maybe change out all the O rings. Me, I just changed out the O-rings that were easy to get to. - Jerry Kaidor ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 11:12:08 -0400 From: "J.B. Hebert" Subject: Re: [db] the last wagoneer... One of my neighbors has a sweet '84 big Cherokee (last year?) that he brought from Arizona with him. 33" BFG's, bright orange with white stripes, zero rust, real nice. I'm totally jealous. :) I still like the big Jeeps from that vintage. J.B. At 05:11 PM 8/11/2004 -0700, you wrote: >I can't find my pictures of it from my visit to Reno... but I'm wondering >if they'll sell the Jerrari next... :) >http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/TheJerrari/thejerrari.jpg >http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/TheJerrari > >Anyway, the Last Wagoneer (one of only 4 made in the '92 model year) > sold for US $36,875.00 > >http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2485975797 > >Vehicle Description > >This is a special historical vehicle. This is the last Jeep Grand >Wagoneer produced by the Chrysler Corporation. The car rolled off the >Toledo, Ohio production line on June 21, 1991 and was donated by the >Chrysler Corporation to the National Automobile Museum (The Harrah >Collection) in Reno, Nevada. The car has been a part of the Museum >collection since November, 1991. Documentation included. > >Willys Motors, Inc. originally introduced the Grand Wagoneer in October >1962. It was the first station wagon to provide automatic transmission >and complete passenger car styling, comfort and convenience with >four-wheel drive capabilities. The combination of 4WD and automatic >transmission was an automotive first. It was the first luxury sport >utility vehicle. > > This Wagoneer comes with a 5.9 Litre V-8 engine with an automatic > transmission with a Selec-Trac full-time transfer case. The system > features shift-on-the-fly capability from > >2WD to 4WD, 2.62:1 low-range gearing, and a viscous-coupling limited slip >center differential. > >Some of the standard features include cruise control, power door locks >with wireless remote key fob, power remote side mirrors, power windows, >air conditioning, electronic AM/FM cassette, and an additional equipment >sunroof and towing package.ehicle Description ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 10:00:16 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: [db] Question regarding R134 refrigerant in 83 300D? I've sucessfully converted about three Benz systems and a Jeep system to the R134. All the systems were empty... dry... one I had to replace a compressor. Went down to the local parts store picked up an R134 kit, came with a thing of r12 compatible r134 oil. You add that first, then two or three cans of the r134. Never changed anything else and never had any troubles with it. The first one I did was running around after I sold it for at least 4 years without trouble. One thing I've found is that 134 is not as good as r12, but it's ok. When I've been in the high 90's to 100 deg F the blower was going full blast... r12 units I've had before were much better... but it does work and it's cheap. Unlike R12, don't breath R134 at all... not that I was sniffing r12 or anything, but 134 is nasty stuff... a step backward in automotive chemical theory as far as I'm concerned. don't get me started on the junk science associated with how an inert gas heavier than air can get into the stratosphere... ;) john Richard F Dillon wrote: > Friends, I'm having some work done on the 1983 300D, and am considering > having the AC repaired. The compressor locked up a couple of years ago, > and I haven't fixed it. Being in Houston,TX, it would really be nice to > have it working. > My question is, what is the feasability of converting this old system to > R134A? My previous mechanic used a hybrid refrigerant, I believe > Freeze12. Will the rest of the system be able to accomodate a change in > refrigerant, or is this not recommended? Thanks in advance for all your > help and advice, Richard > > "Watch your thoughts, for they become words. Choose your words, for they > become actions. Understand your actions, for they become habits. Study > your habits, they will become your character. Develop your character for > it becomes your destiny." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 10:34:03 -0700 From: john meister Subject: Re: [db] the last wagoneer... actually it would have to be an '83. That was the last year. The FSJ's had a lot of nice things going for them, but a whole lot more against them. Best mileage I ever got with an AMC V8 was about 13. Every year you'd have to replace vacuum lines and spark plug cables. I found one with a 4.2L I-6, worked a lot better but #2 cylinder went bad so I was going to swap in a newer 4.0L... well the project has been delayed so long I'm going for a 6.2L V8 Diesel now. :) Love my FSJ, great view, great ride, great handling... unique... later, john J.B. Hebert wrote: > One of my neighbors has a sweet '84 big Cherokee (last year?) that he > brought from Arizona with him. 33" BFG's, bright orange with white > stripes, zero rust, real nice. I'm totally jealous. :) > > I still like the big Jeeps from that vintage. > > J.B. > > At 05:11 PM 8/11/2004 -0700, you wrote: > >> I can't find my pictures of it from my visit to Reno... but I'm wondering >> if they'll sell the Jerrari next... :) >> http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/TheJerrari/thejerrari.jpg >> http://www.wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/TheJerrari >> >> Anyway, the Last Wagoneer (one of only 4 made in the '92 model year) >> sold for US $36,875.00 >> >> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=2485975797 >> >> >> Vehicle Description >> >> This is a special historical vehicle. This is the last Jeep Grand >> Wagoneer produced by the Chrysler Corporation. The car rolled off the >> Toledo, Ohio production line on June 21, 1991 and was donated by the >> Chrysler Corporation to the National Automobile Museum (The Harrah >> Collection) in Reno, Nevada. The car has been a part of the Museum >> collection since November, 1991. Documentation included. >> >> Willys Motors, Inc. originally introduced the Grand Wagoneer in >> October 1962. It was the first station wagon to provide automatic >> transmission and complete passenger car styling, comfort and >> convenience with four-wheel drive capabilities. The combination of >> 4WD and automatic transmission was an automotive first. It was the >> first luxury sport utility vehicle. >> >> This Wagoneer comes with a 5.9 Litre V-8 engine with an automatic >> transmission with a Selec-Trac full-time transfer case. The system >> features shift-on-the-fly capability from >> >> 2WD to 4WD, 2.62:1 low-range gearing, and a viscous-coupling limited >> slip center differential. >> >> Some of the standard features include cruise control, power door locks >> with wireless remote key fob, power remote side mirrors, power >> windows, air conditioning, electronic AM/FM cassette, and an >> additional equipment sunroof and towing package.ehicle Description ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 12:38:53 -0500 From: "Sam Williams" <1sam-at-io.com> Subject: RE: [db] Army uses used motor oil as fuel John, Right. Question everything! Question my statements about waste oil heaters and pollution from burning old motor oil. I don't have the data on those; I'm just repeating claims of people I respect. I enjoy this list. We have people with sharp minds, lots of experience. There's much junk science (often tied to effective advertising) but lots of good info available too. My 64 Ford wagon with 390 could average perhaps 16 miles on a gallon of gas. A 2004 Excursion weighs about the same, goes about as far. 'Science' proves that the Excursion is much better for the environment. My 60s MB got 20+ miles per gal, wasn't very fast. Your 190 gets 30+, is peppy. Diesels seem to have come a long way since the 60s--even if those with hidden agendas don't seem to admit it often. People working to preserve forests, reduce auto pollution are often accused of having hidden agendas and employing junk science. I think it's fair to blame them for ignorance at times but environmental science is pretty good and can't imagine what hidden agenda they might have. People who promote driving HumVees to express ones' love of country seem immune to such complaints. I think it's a case of mis-labeling or mis-libeling. To the extent smoking harms non-smokers, I approve of no smoking laws. Mostly I enjoy not sitting in a cloud of cigar smoke while trying to enjoy my food--don't mind it so much later, over brandy. I'm not sure that actual science proves involving the justice system to control second hand smoke is the best course. Resources might better be spent curing adults' addiction, preventing children from becoming addicted and killing government subsidies to tobacco industry than by causing already overworked police to enforce such matters. Keep questioning everything. Sam - -----Original Message----- From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of john meister Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 2004 12:52 AM To: Sam Williams Cc: mjmason-at-juno.com; diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Subject: Re: [db] Army uses used motor oil as fuel I've run across "epa" approved waste oil burners for shops... seemed to be a clean flame w/out smoke or irritants... I have a lot of problems with allergies and have a very sensitive sense of smell and reaction to things... It's amazing how we accept what is "legal" and "harmful" to our environment. The byproduct of a gasoline engine are far more toxic then some of the worst Diesels out there, yet you don't hear about that. And the only reason it's "illegal" to run heating oil is because it's not taxed... Like the heating oil wasn't taxed along the way anyway... funny how stuff like this works... what is truly right is irrelevant at times... I wouldn't feel so bad about some of these things if there wasn't so much junk science with hidden agendas out there. I will admit freely that much of the cleanup of our environment since the '60's has been good. The burn bans when we have a thermal inversion have helped my health greatly... the no smoking resturants and workplaces are fantastic... but what have we given up in exchange for these things? Not that we shouldn't do most of these things, but we seem to accept all of it without question... question everything... :) john ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 13:28:38 -0400 From: Mike Frank Subject: Re: [db] Question regarding R134 refrigerant in 83 300D? It's not junk. Lots of stuff heavier than air gets as high as the stratosphere....water, pollen, soot.... After the two hurricanes hit Florida today; roofs, plumbing, and grandma's false teeth. Cyclonic storms last for months in the area of the South Pole, and keep things well mixed. If the earth stopped spinning, everything might find it's level. Until then, don't assume the atmosphere is a test tube. Mike Frank At 01:00 PM 8/12/2004, john meister wrote: >don't get me started on >the junk science associated with how an inert gas heavier than air >can get into the stratosphere... ;) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 17:57:53 GMT From: "mjmason-at-juno.com" Subject: [db] waste oil discussion Thanks, Jerry, Sam, John and others for your replies on waste oil burners. Very informative - disposal/recycling of waste oil something I've never known much about but have long been curious (i.e. where DO they take the 50-gallon drums once Quicky-Lube joints fill 'em up?) Thanks. Matt in IL ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2004 14:18:36 -0700 From: john meister Subject: [db] Diesel project update... Turns out the salesman in Wenatchee that never returned my calls let the '84 Suburan slip away... it sold yesterday... :( So, I'm digging into the piggy bank to buy the '83 GMC Jimmy I test drove last weekend... managed to talk the owner down another $200 to let her keep the brand new tires and rims... I hope the 35's I have in the driveway will fit ok. ;) The 6.2L worked splendidly... no smoke, plenty of power, nice idle... she's the 2nd owner... even has the window sticker... rig needs some TLC, paint, interior work, but the driveline is in good shape. john ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2004 23:01:50 -0400 From: Jason R Bassett Subject: Re: Subject: Re: [db] Army uses used motor oil as fuel writes: > Seems pointless to me. > > WVO would be a better deal. Less hassle, less mess, and exhaust that > sells like French Fries. Less hassle? What could be less hassle than sticking a "straw" into a dumpster and slurping up free fuel? Same in both cases.Only difference is, the WVO has many much larger particles in it that will clog up your Racor with sheer bulk if you don't pre-filter it. (Pin in the drain......) Less hassle? Sure....... Less mess? Used motor oil (UMO) smells like a cross between motor oil and exhaust. WVO smells like a cross between french fries and a rotting corpse. Even if WVO is a lighter color, the consequences of a WVO spill are much nastier IMHO than anything with UMO ever could be. Unless of course, you happen to spill it in the living room........ Exhaust that smells like french fries. This is a BIG selling point too, since the only one who (normally) smells your exhaust is the people behind you. So either they think it stinks (which most people do already) or they get hungry and Burger King sponsors you as advertizing.......(I wish) I don't normally smell my exhaust, only occasionally during startup if the wind is just right or if I am analyzing it. I'm not really concerned about the people behind me, but if I were, UMO would be my choice because WVO could be contributing to the obesity problem in this country and be badgering them into wasting their money on food that costs about 5 times as much as it would to make it themselves. BTW, please pardon my cynicism. I am very sleep-deprived, and tend to be a bit cynical anyhow. I am not upset at anyone, least of all Waylon. I just think it's fun to point out illogicalities, and it's usually got comic potential. Just laugh at my estimations; it's good to laugh. I love this "club" and hope that it is getting as many chuckles out of this whole UMO (WVO) discussion as I am. Happy unbirthday and many returns of the laundry......... Jason ________________________________________________________________ The best thing to hit the Internet in years - Juno SpeedBand! Surf the Web up to FIVE TIMES FASTER! Only $14.95/ month - visit www.juno.com to sign up today! ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1531 **********************************