From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Thu Nov 25 10:52:13 2004 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Thursday, November 25 2004 Volume 01 : Number 1625 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: RE: [db] Oh brother.... Re: [db] Oh brother.... RE: [db] Oh brother.... [db] crazy ideas for parts Re: [db] Oh brother.... Re: [db] A few questions about my new E300D (long) Re: [db] Oh brother.... Re: [db] prepare popcorn... 300CD, Jimmy, XJ, J10, WJ update... :) Re: [db] prepare popcorn... 300CD, Jimmy, XJ, J10, WJ update... :) Re: [db] prepare popcorn... 300CD, Jimmy, XJ, J10, WJ update... :) RE: [db] Oh brother.... Re: [db] prepare popcorn... 300CD, Jimmy, XJ, J10, WJ update... :) Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 19:26:26 -0500 From: "Michael Aimino" Subject: RE: [db] Oh brother.... > My 1985 2.2L 190D has a noisy rear end too...it kind of hums when I > let off the petal to coast... Under power, it doesn't seem to make any Q. Why does my mercedes differential hum? A. It doesn't know the words. With profound apologies, Mike ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 16:16:49 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: [db] Oh brother.... On Wed, 24 Nov 2004, Kevin Pekarek wrote: >-->On Wed, Nov 24, 2004 at 10:25:48AM -0700, scott_haaland-at-agilent.com wrote: >-->> My 1985 2.2L 190D has a noisy rear end too...it kind of hums when I let off >-->Yours COULD be the gears or a bearing inside, but you might also want to >-->have a lookie at the center bearing (what us american car wrenches call a >-->universal joint) in the driveshaft. John liked to use Amsoil lube in things, >-->so I doubt there's odd wear on the gears unless it was there before he got it. >-->Then again, he likes jeeps, so maybe he is deaf to gear noise? :) I didn't get around to doing the rear axle or joints with amsoil on that one... just the engine/trans and front end stuff... I haven't done anything to a Benz differential ever... the gains of the synthetic gear lube over the regular stuff isn't significant enough for me to do it unless it needs to be done. :) john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 16:24:03 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: RE: [db] Oh brother.... On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 scott_haaland-at-agilent.com wrote: >-->John, >--> >-->It had this same noise when you had it...probably didn't notice due to the >-->Jeep factor that Kevin mentioned? could be... or the fact that I rarely drive without the radio... if the vehicle doesn't feel right, then I listen... ;) >-->I remember pointing it out on the test drive to you, but you didn't seem >-->to hear it....I've pretty much ignored it since, and it hasn't caused any >-->problems yet....I'll probably continue to ignore it until I have to do >-->something about it. I need to get my suburban running again first. Don't >-->get me started on that off topic conversation... good luck on the 'burb. >-->Have a happy Thanksgiving everyone!! you too. :) john >--> >-->R, >-->Scott >--> >--> >-->-----Original Message----- >-->From: john [mailto:john-at-wagoneers.com] >-->Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 2:43 PM >-->To: scott_haaland-at-agilent.com >-->Cc: kevin-at-mordred.punk.net; jasonbassett-at-juno.com; >-->diesel-benz-at-digest.net >-->Subject: RE: [db] Oh brother.... >--> >--> >-->On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 scott_haaland-at-agilent.com wrote: >--> >-->>-->Kevin, >-->>--> >-->>-->My 1985 2.2L 190D has a noisy rear end too...it kind of hums when I let off >-->>-->the petal to coast... >--> >-->you sure that's the rear end and not just the engine? try putting it in neutral >-->and see if you still hear it... or turning the car off... (be careful) >--> >-->>-->Under power, it doesn't seem to make any noise, or it's drowned out by the >-->>-->engine... >-->>-->I wonder..... >--> >-->hard to tell about rear end noise in any vehicle... could be u-joints/cv's >-->even... R&P's are usually quite durable... especially in cars like this. >--> >-->You might want to check your fluid level and consider changing the gear lube, >-->would also give you a chance to check the wear. >--> >-->john >--> >-->>--> >-->>-->R, >-->>-->Scott >-->>--> >-->>-->-----Original Message----- >-->>-->From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net >-->>-->[mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net]On Behalf Of Kevin Pekarek >-->>-->Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 4:46 PM >-->>-->To: Jason R Bassett >-->>-->Cc: diesel-benz-at-digest.net >-->>-->Subject: Re: [db] Oh brother.... >-->>--> >-->>--> >-->>-->On Sat, Nov 20, 2004 at 11:45:26PM -0500, Jason R Bassett wrote: >-->>-->> Turns out that the problem with my steering was that I had moved the >-->>-->> alignment way too much, going from slightly out to severely in. This >-->>-->> caused the odd handling, and made it just plain dangerous when the road >-->>-->> was wet. (So I went very slowly back to Grandpa's garage and adjusted it. >-->>-->> 8<3) >-->>--> >-->>-->I remember hearing something about the front end on a mercedes (123/116/126) >-->>-->being set up with the steering behind the axle, which would require the use >-->>-->of a spreader bar to simulate the separating force on the front wheels from >-->>-->driving down the road. I already was looking under the one 300D in the >-->>-->parking lot here a bit today, I have a feeling if I go look under it again >-->>-->the security guard might want to talk to me. Other than that, I don't >-->>-->have a car like yours to compare against. >-->>--> >-->>-->> Now with the alignment just a hairsbreadth toed in (I measured it this >-->>-->> time) and the slack in the steering taken up as tight as I dared, (the >-->>-->> parts underneath were all excellent) the thing steers like it's brand >-->>-->> new. Very fun! >-->>--> >-->>-->Well, a teense toed in might be spot on, in light of the above. There is a >-->>-->spec for how much slack is supposed to be in the steering box, in case you >-->>-->tightened it up. I don't have a 123 manual handy, so hopefully someone else >-->>-->knows if you need the figure. >-->>--> >-->>-->> Now, I have a major concern that came to my attention Weds when I rotated >-->>-->> the tires. The rear end has some slop in it; I had hoped it was a CV >-->>-->> joint going. When I had it up I ruled that out; it's the diff. >-->>-->> 1. Is this normal? >-->>-->> 2. Is this going to leave me stuck with no warning, or get obscenely >-->>-->> noisy about 10,000 miles before? >-->>-->> 3. Can I rebuild it without a machine shop? >-->>-->> 4. Can I replace it reasonably inexpensively? >-->>--> >-->>-->What do you mean slop, as in play in the gears when you turn the wheel, >-->>-->being able to shake the wheel, or being able to push the tire in towards >-->>-->the diff and pull it out a bit? >-->>--> >-->>-->Replacing the diff itself is easy if you find another car with one and swap >-->>-->it in. the 300D turbo had the same rear end in all years of the turbo 617 >-->>-->in a 123 EXCEPT 85, when they put taller gears in back and a higher stall >-->>-->converter in. If you didn't want to rebuild the rear end, you could probably >-->>-->get one from a junkyard. As long as it wasn't run dry, it shouldn't really >-->>-->wear out. This will be your cheapest alternative. >-->>--> >-->>-->That said, my 190D has a noisy rear end, and disassembly showed an obtuse >-->>-->wear pattern on the ring gear. Well, duh. It sounded like it did. Since my >-->>-->190D is a five speed 2.2L, the gear ratio it had is specific to that engine/ >-->>-->trans combo, so that isn't an option. If it makes you feel any better, it >-->>-->has been noisy for over ten thousand miles, and hasn't gotten any worse. >-->>-->It did lose a pinion bearing and BOY was that loud (and supposedly had a >-->>-->bunch of slop in it). That was relatively cheap to deal with - I don't like >-->>-->playing with diffs, and had a shop replace the bearing. Parts are obtainable, >-->>-->just need a shop that is familiar with mercedes rear ends - they're a little >-->>-->different than pretty much everything else american in how they are set up. >-->>--> >-->>-->K >-->>--> >--> >--> ---- >--> >-->------------------------------------------------------------------------- >--> ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** >--> Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. >-->------------------------------------------------------------------------- >--> >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 16:31:12 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: [db] crazy ideas for parts On Wed, 24 Nov 2004, Nelson wrote: >-->Crazy idea: >-->Could you take the grill and headlights off one of the Mercedes and put it on the J-10? It would be like a german rhino grill! People would start thinking you have a Mercedes pick-up; that'll throw'em for a loop! Come on, you can't tell me you haven't thought about it before... ;^) >--> >-->Nelson You know I've never thought about that... primarily since I like the Jeep grille... :) When I was at the FSJ gathering in Ouray in 2002 with my WJ I did put an FSJ grille on the front to blend in a bit... :) I wonder if I could do that to the Jimmy... hmmm... :) I actually have a rhino chaser grille setup... maybe I could make the Jimmy into a Jeep. :) john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 14:23:17 -0800 (PST) From: Jerome Kaidor Subject: Re: [db] Oh brother.... Michael Aimino wrote: > > > My 1985 2.2L 190D has a noisy rear end too...it kind of hums when I > > let off the petal to coast... Under power, it doesn't seem to make any > > Q. Why does my mercedes differential hum? > A. It doesn't know the words. > *** Why do the British drink warm beer? - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 17:24:42 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: [db] A few questions about my new E300D (long) On Mon, 22 Nov 2004, J.B. Hebert wrote: >-->I just bought a 1995 E300D to replace my 1982 300CD that was totalled a few >-->weeks ago. I am only really familiar with the OM617 motors, so this is a >-->bit of a new experience for me. Not only is this my first non-OM617 >-->Mercedes, it's also my first non-123 chassis car. Yes, I know... it's >-->about time. I just like the older iron... Anyway, I have a few questions. seems this is happening to more and more of us... :) >-->As mentioned frequently on this list, I used to benchmark the state of tune >-->on my 123 chassis cars by doing a couple of 0-60 runs. Something in the 12 >-->second range usually indicated that the car was making appropriate >-->power. What is the expected 0-60 time on the E300D? I have to assume that >-->since it makes similar power and weighs almost the same as my 300CD, it >-->should be similar. I'll test mine with a stop watch next time I find a level area... not sure how long that will be... level ground is a lot harder to find in these parts than liberals (as they head for the border)... :) >-->This brings me to my second question. I picked up the car from NC and >-->drove it back to MA, a little over 800 miles. The car drove GREAT but >-->seems to be down a little on power. I will time it at lunch, but it seems remember, it's NOT a turbo... it's the same size as your 300CD, but without the turbo... >-->to be in the 15 second range for 0-60. It is smooth as heck, and got over >-->30 MPG doing about 85 MPH for a full tank. It has also been completely >-->dealer maintained, with recent fuel and air filters installed, so I doubt >-->it's a plugged filter. (On a side note, do these cars have a pre-filter >-->for the fuel like on the 617, or just the main filter?) I have read that >-->on these motors the LOOOOOOOOOOOONG intake can get clogged with soot from >-->the EGR, which can effect performance. Should I pull the intake and give >-->it a good cleaning? The car has 162,000 miles on it and I'm sure it's >-->never been done. I was hoping to find a dirty intake on my 2.5LTD... guess if you drive it hard enough it won't get dirty... :) >-->Next question, also related: Is there a Diesel Purge procedure similar to >-->the OM617 motors, where I can run some directly into the motor instead of >-->pouring it into the tank? The intake seems to block easy access to the IP >-->and associated plumbing. DANGER WILL ROGERS... this is a different fuel injection system... I ran amsoil diesel fuel modifier through this and noticed that some of the seals were leaking... I quit using it, and it quit leaking... since the fuel modifier does pretty much the same as what the purge does you may end up causing problems... the manual says NO additives... >-->Are there other items that could also affect performance adversely that I >-->should know about? Are there any "sensitive" parts on this motor (read: It might even be that this engine is worn a bit... hard to say... each benz I've owned or driven has a different feel to it... a non-turbo model regardless of the displacement feels really dead to me any more... that '80 300CD I had felt really slow after driving an 83 300SD... the 190D felt slow after driving the 300d with a turbo... I wonder if a turbo could be safely fitted to your engine... >-->someone in the know would be most appreciated. I am planning on switching >-->to Mobil 1 Truck & SUV (5W-40) or 0-40 (depending on availability) at my >-->next oil change. This is what I ran in my 300CD and I see no reason why it >-->won't work in this car. synthetic is good, regardless of the brand... ;) you know my feelings on this topic. ;) john >--> >-->Thanks in advance, >--> >-->J.B. Hebert >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://wagoneers.com ** ** http://freegift.net ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2004 20:36:03 -0500 From: "Jim Steere" Subject: Re: [db] Oh brother.... > *** Why do the British drink warm beer? > > - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) > Lucas refrigerators.... Jim ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 00:28:46 -0600 From: Jon Filina Subject: Re: [db] prepare popcorn... 300CD, Jimmy, XJ, J10, WJ update... :) John, the demented, reported: > ok, I finally talked to my wife about the 300CD on the Jimmy chassis. > > As expected her answer was an emphatic NO. Pleading, whining and offering > chocolate didn't help either... :) Seeing as how much work would be > involved I'm sort of happy to have had help making up my mind. ;) It's a good thing that my new popcorn popper is plugged into a surge protector.... I think I need the protection... > It's amazing after 30 years just how easily I can predict her answers. ;) That's a two edged sword... The running joke at the office is that I'll volunteer to work on my day off just so I won't have to spend the day with the "old lady". 34 years of marriage will do that to you.... I can say that 'cuz the old "ball and chain" doesn't read my email. If you don't hear from me for a while, it's a good possibility that she's discovered my password... In which case, I'm toast... Jon '84 300SD "Bruno" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 07:31:16 -0500 From: Jason R Bassett Subject: Re: [db] prepare popcorn... 300CD, Jimmy, XJ, J10, WJ update... :) > That's a two edged sword... The running joke at the office is that > I'll > volunteer to work on my day off just so I won't have to spend the > day > with the "old lady". 34 years of marriage will do that to you.... > > I can say that 'cuz the old "ball and chain" doesn't read my email. > If > you don't hear from me for a while, it's a good possibility that > she's > discovered my password... In which case, I'm toast... > Well, maybe it would break the monotony if she did. 8<3) Remember, you picked her! (Well, I guess I can't say that quite for sure......) ________________________________________________________________ Juno Platinum $9.95. Juno SpeedBand $14.95. Sign up for Juno Today at http://www.juno.com! Look for special offers at Best Buy stores. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 12:13:31 -0600 From: Jon Filina Subject: Re: [db] prepare popcorn... 300CD, Jimmy, XJ, J10, WJ update... :) Jason commented: >>I can say that 'cuz the old "ball and chain" doesn't read my email. >>If you don't hear from me for a while, it's a good possibility that >>she's discovered my password... In which case, I'm toast... > Well, maybe it would break the monotony if she did. 8<3) Remember, you > picked her! (Well, I guess I can't say that quite for sure......) I was minding my own business one day when this red head walks up to me and asks "do you like this ring?". I answered "I do" and that red headed gal has followed me around ever since.... I was framed, I tell ya'! ;-) Jon '84 300SD "Bruno" ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 12:27:34 -0600 From: "Alec Cordova" Subject: RE: [db] Oh brother.... Oh, if we're giving thanks that our cars aren't British, here are a few more reminders: http://www.brit.ca/~tboicey/comics.html although this one in particular (http://www.brit.ca/~tboicey/comics/calling.html) comes a little close to home. ;-) Alec > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net > [mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net]On Behalf Of Jim Steere > Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 7:36 PM > Cc: diesel-benz-at-digest.net > Subject: Re: [db] Oh brother.... > > > > *** Why do the British drink warm beer? > > > > - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) > > > > Lucas refrigerators.... > > Jim ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2004 12:36:45 -0600 From: Jon Filina Subject: Re: [db] prepare popcorn... 300CD, Jimmy, XJ, J10, WJ update... :) John's thoughts of things diesel were sidetracked and he chuckled: > rofl... I referred to my wife a few years ago as the warden... > you know, being a prisoner of love and all that... she didn't > think the term was proper... ;) oh well... I thought it > was funny... but don't do it any more... :) Oh...the adjustments we make after after uttering those two little words "I do"... That sweet young red head, who used to have such a great sense of humor, one day disappears and her mother shows up in her place. I don't know when or how it happened, but it did. There oughta be a law, I tell ya! Happy Thanksgiving to all, Jon '84 300SD "Bruno" ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1625 **********************************