From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Tue Aug 16 13:28:41 2005 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Tuesday, August 16 2005 Volume 01 : Number 1924 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [db] warming up my 300d Re: [db] warming up my 300d Re: [db] 1980 240D Re: [db] warming up my 300d Re: [db] 1980 240D Re: [db] warming up my 300d Re: [db] warming up my 300d [db] start-up of 1984 300d Re: [db] start-up of 1984 300d Re: [db] start-up of 1984 300d Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 14:48:08 -0400 From: "J.B. Hebert" Subject: Re: [db] warming up my 300d Start driving GENTLY as soon as your oil pressure comes up. The motor will warm up quicker and be happier. As soon as the temp gauge is in the normal range, drive it like you stole it. Doing this will prevent carbon deposits from forming, making the engine run better, longer, and more efficiently. J.B. At 01:27 PM 8/16/2005, you wrote: >Sorry all, I forgot to change the subject on my first email... just to >keep things straight.... >c > > > >Hello all, > >As a new DB owner, and not very much a mechanic, I am loving this list >as I learn my way around my new (to me) 84 300d turbo running B99 >biodiesel here in Seattle. > >Question for you all: I read here the other day that it is important >to let the car warm up well, more so than a regular gas car. I've >found that if I let the car sit for a bit and get pretty warm, that it >runs smoother when I first start off. But in that same thread, I think >I read that as soon as the oil pressure guage is pinned at the top, >you should start driving because it's bad for the car to sit at that >point. > >Well, my oil pressure is right at the top as sooon as I start up and >rev it a bit to get the thing idling.... But there is no way I should >take off at that moment as, when I have, my car is so sluggish that I >know it is unhappy. > >So what is the general consensus of what I should do here? Am I >hurting the car by sitting for 2 minutes or so and what about when the >winter comes and it's cold out to begin with? > >Thanks for the advice! >Charlie ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 11:57:32 -0700 From: Charles Redell Subject: Re: [db] warming up my 300d Thanks.... but I have to ask because it seems so non-intuitive.... no matter how cold it is out? I mean, seriously, as soon as I rev it, the pressure is up. thanks! c On 8/16/05, J.B. Hebert wrote: > Start driving GENTLY as soon as your oil pressure comes up. The motor will > warm up quicker and be happier. As soon as the temp gauge is in the normal > range, drive it like you stole it. Doing this will prevent carbon deposits > from forming, making the engine run better, longer, and more efficiently. > > J.B. > > At 01:27 PM 8/16/2005, you wrote: > >Sorry all, I forgot to change the subject on my first email... just to > >keep things straight.... > >c > > > > > > > >Hello all, > > > >As a new DB owner, and not very much a mechanic, I am loving this list > >as I learn my way around my new (to me) 84 300d turbo running B99 > >biodiesel here in Seattle. > > > >Question for you all: I read here the other day that it is important > >to let the car warm up well, more so than a regular gas car. I've > >found that if I let the car sit for a bit and get pretty warm, that it > >runs smoother when I first start off. But in that same thread, I think > >I read that as soon as the oil pressure guage is pinned at the top, > >you should start driving because it's bad for the car to sit at that > >point. > > > >Well, my oil pressure is right at the top as sooon as I start up and > >rev it a bit to get the thing idling.... But there is no way I should > >take off at that moment as, when I have, my car is so sluggish that I > >know it is unhappy. > > > >So what is the general consensus of what I should do here? Am I > >hurting the car by sitting for 2 minutes or so and what about when the > >winter comes and it's cold out to begin with? > > > >Thanks for the advice! > >Charlie ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:04:00 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] 1980 240D Lots of ideas and opinions on this... you want to make sure that oil is up to pressure before moving, but that doesn't take very long usually... 30 seconds or so and then gentle driving until fully warmed up by the temp gauge is a good practive for gas or Diesel. john On Tue, 16 Aug 2005, Charles Redell wrote: >-->Hello all, >--> >-->As a new DB owner, and not very much a mechanic, I am loving this list >-->as I learn my way around my new (to me) 84 300d turbo running B99 >-->biodiesel here in Seattle. >--> >-->Question for you all: I read here the other day that it is important >-->to let the car warm up well, more so than a regular gas car. I've >-->found that if I let the car sit for a bit and get pretty warm, that it >-->runs smoother when I first start off. But in that same thread, I think >-->I read that as soon as the oil pressure guage is pinned at the top, >-->you should start driving because it's bad for the car to sit at that >-->point. >--> >-->Well, my oil pressure is right at the top as sooon as I start up and >-->rev it a bit to get the thing idling.... But there is no way I should >-->take off at that moment as, when I have, my car is so sluggish that I >-->know it is unhappy. >--> >-->So what is the general consensus of what I should do here? Am I >-->hurting the car by sitting for 2 minutes or so and what about when the >-->winter comes and it's cold out to begin with? >--> >-->Thanks for the advice! >-->Charlie >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:05:37 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] warming up my 300d btw, where are you in Seattle? :) I work down by South Lake Union, live up in Snohomish... I-5 is where I spent a lot of quality time these days... :) btween exits 167 and 186. :) john On Tue, 16 Aug 2005, Charles Redell wrote: >-->Sorry all, I forgot to change the subject on my first email... just to >-->keep things straight.... >-->c >--> >--> >--> >-->Hello all, >--> >-->As a new DB owner, and not very much a mechanic, I am loving this list >-->as I learn my way around my new (to me) 84 300d turbo running B99 >-->biodiesel here in Seattle. >--> >-->Question for you all: I read here the other day that it is important >-->to let the car warm up well, more so than a regular gas car. I've >-->found that if I let the car sit for a bit and get pretty warm, that it >-->runs smoother when I first start off. But in that same thread, I think >-->I read that as soon as the oil pressure guage is pinned at the top, >-->you should start driving because it's bad for the car to sit at that >-->point. >--> >-->Well, my oil pressure is right at the top as sooon as I start up and >-->rev it a bit to get the thing idling.... But there is no way I should >-->take off at that moment as, when I have, my car is so sluggish that I >-->know it is unhappy. >--> >-->So what is the general consensus of what I should do here? Am I >-->hurting the car by sitting for 2 minutes or so and what about when the >-->winter comes and it's cold out to begin with? >--> >-->Thanks for the advice! >-->Charlie >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:06:14 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] 1980 240D On Tue, 16 Aug 2005, Jim Hoffman wrote: >-->Not much!!... but that's for a different forum ;) be careful, first it's R12, then R134, then the Diesel... (mlc. ;) john >--> >-->Jim >--> >-->> On Tue, 16 Aug 2005, Jim Hoffman wrote: >-->> >-->> >-->Yes! Mine has a battery too! But it's in the same shape as >-->yours! ;) >-->> >-->No studs on the tires... It's illegal here in Wisc. >-->> >-->> what IS legal in Wisconson???? >-->> >-->> Is only the cheese "free"? ;) >-->> >-->> john >-->> >-->> >-->> >--> >-->> >-->Jim >-->> >--> >-->> >-->> and yours probably has a battery too, right? >-->> >-->> sheesh, competition is fierce... >-->> >-->> bet yours doesn't have studded snow tires in the rear. ;) >-->> >-->> john >-->> >-->> >-->> >-->> On Tue, 16 Aug 2005, Jim Hoffman wrote: >-->> >-->> >-->Ummmmm.... Well, I'm not THAT good at math but you said, >-->and I quote, >-->> >-->> >-->"a mere $499.00". Mine is $450.00. Is that not "cheaper"??? >-->> >-->> >-->;) >-->> >-->> >-->Then add in the transportation costs and it's even "cheaper"! >-->> >-->> >-->:) >-->> >-->> >-->Jim >--> >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:10:45 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] warming up my 300d On Tue, 16 Aug 2005, Charles Redell wrote: >-->Thanks.... but I have to ask because it seems so non-intuitive.... >-->no matter how cold it is out? I mean, seriously, as soon as I rev it, >-->the pressure is up. I know on the VW Diesels that the oil pressure was purposely set to go higher on startup, then drop down... how they did this I don't recall... not sure if Mercedes does this or not... But I usually give my rigs about 30 seconds or so to get juices flowing... then back out slowly... because within 100 feet of going forward my vehicles face a vertical climb out the drive... another 100 feet at almost 40 degrees... :) then another 150 feet at 30 degrees... and once I'm at highway elevation it's either downhill (rapidly) or up hill at full throttle into 55mph+ traffic after crossing three lanes... :) but I digress... 30 seconds is long enough... buckle up, get your seatbelt buckle on... find your sunglasses (rarely used up here, nonetheless), tune the radio and prepare for bumper to bumper with your latte in one hand, cell phone in the other... :) yee haw. john >--> >-->thanks! >-->c >--> >-->On 8/16/05, J.B. Hebert wrote: >-->> Start driving GENTLY as soon as your oil pressure comes up. The motor will >-->> warm up quicker and be happier. As soon as the temp gauge is in the normal >-->> range, drive it like you stole it. Doing this will prevent carbon deposits >-->> from forming, making the engine run better, longer, and more efficiently. >-->> >-->> J.B. >-->> >-->> At 01:27 PM 8/16/2005, you wrote: >-->> >Sorry all, I forgot to change the subject on my first email... just to >-->> >keep things straight.... >-->> >c >-->> > >-->> > >-->> > >-->> >Hello all, >-->> > >-->> >As a new DB owner, and not very much a mechanic, I am loving this list >-->> >as I learn my way around my new (to me) 84 300d turbo running B99 >-->> >biodiesel here in Seattle. >-->> > >-->> >Question for you all: I read here the other day that it is important >-->> >to let the car warm up well, more so than a regular gas car. I've >-->> >found that if I let the car sit for a bit and get pretty warm, that it >-->> >runs smoother when I first start off. But in that same thread, I think >-->> >I read that as soon as the oil pressure guage is pinned at the top, >-->> >you should start driving because it's bad for the car to sit at that >-->> >point. >-->> > >-->> >Well, my oil pressure is right at the top as sooon as I start up and >-->> >rev it a bit to get the thing idling.... But there is no way I should >-->> >take off at that moment as, when I have, my car is so sluggish that I >-->> >know it is unhappy. >-->> > >-->> >So what is the general consensus of what I should do here? Am I >-->> >hurting the car by sitting for 2 minutes or so and what about when the >-->> >winter comes and it's cold out to begin with? >-->> > >-->> >Thanks for the advice! >-->> >Charlie >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 14:12:29 -0500 From: acordova-at-texas.net Subject: Re: [db] warming up my 300d Then simply don't think about it. When I had my 85 300D, I would turn the key for preglow, fasten my seat belt while the glow plugs did their thing, start the car, fiddle with the radio and whatever worked that month of the climate control, then be on my way casually. Driving out of the neighborhood naturally meant not hitting the Go pedal too hard until I hit the main streets. This seemed to result in a nice sequencing and timing without my having to think too much about it. If it was really cold out (which doesn't happen often in central Texas), then I would take maybe an extra 15 seconds in the driveway, just to make sure that nice thick diesel oil had reached everywhere. The sooner you drive it, the sooner it can blow warm air at your feet. On a related note, be sure to let the turbo relax before you shut it down. Don't hot dog it all the way into the driveway. I hit the neighborhood 30mph speed limit about a mile from my house. If I stick near that, I figure it lets everything under the hood relax before oil and water stop circulating. Overall, it takes very little to adapt your driving habits to keep a diesel Benz happy, and they're probably more appropriate driving habits anyway: buckle up before you go, and don't speed through your own neighborhood. Alec Cordova Taylor, Texas 89 300CE, 191K Quoting Charles Redell : > Thanks.... but I have to ask because it seems so non-intuitive.... > no matter how cold it is out? I mean, seriously, as soon as I rev it, > the pressure is up. > > thanks! > c > > On 8/16/05, J.B. Hebert wrote: > > Start driving GENTLY as soon as your oil pressure comes up. The motor > will > > warm up quicker and be happier. As soon as the temp gauge is in the > normal > > range, drive it like you stole it. Doing this will prevent carbon > deposits > > from forming, making the engine run better, longer, and more > efficiently. > > > > J.B. > > > > At 01:27 PM 8/16/2005, you wrote: > > >Sorry all, I forgot to change the subject on my first email... just to > > >keep things straight.... > > >c > > > > > > > > > > > >Hello all, > > > > > >As a new DB owner, and not very much a mechanic, I am loving this list > > >as I learn my way around my new (to me) 84 300d turbo running B99 > > >biodiesel here in Seattle. > > > > > >Question for you all: I read here the other day that it is important > > >to let the car warm up well, more so than a regular gas car. I've > > >found that if I let the car sit for a bit and get pretty warm, that it > > >runs smoother when I first start off. But in that same thread, I think > > >I read that as soon as the oil pressure guage is pinned at the top, > > >you should start driving because it's bad for the car to sit at that > > >point. > > > > > >Well, my oil pressure is right at the top as sooon as I start up and > > >rev it a bit to get the thing idling.... But there is no way I should > > >take off at that moment as, when I have, my car is so sluggish that I > > >know it is unhappy. > > > > > >So what is the general consensus of what I should do here? Am I > > >hurting the car by sitting for 2 minutes or so and what about when the > > >winter comes and it's cold out to begin with? > > > > > >Thanks for the advice! > > >Charlie ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:15:07 -0700 From: "Nick Eckert" Subject: [db] start-up of 1984 300d Charlie, There is no reason for it to be sluggish when cold, especially in the middle of Summer. It is bad now, it will be horrendous in the Winter. I would suspect it is not firing on all 5 cylinders because a glow plug(s) is shot. Replace all the glow plugs and the glow plug relay. www.autohausaz.com has a kit that replaces it all. It's easy to do. While you're at it, replace those injectors, adjust the valves, and change out your air and fuel filters. I can almost guarantee you, this will make a huge difference in the vehicle from start-up to shut down. Oh, and BTW. As soon as oil pressure comes up, your should be driving. No reason for it to warm up. Cheers, Nick ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 12:46:53 -0700 From: Charles Redell Subject: Re: [db] start-up of 1984 300d Good suggestions. thanks. I have had the fuel filters and air filter changed since I got it but haven't done the glow plugs and injectors... nor have I done the valves. but I have plans and a book from mercedessource.com.... I'll try and update everyone as this goes on.... thanks! c On 8/16/05, Nick Eckert wrote: > Charlie, > > There is no reason for it to be sluggish when cold, especially > in the middle of Summer. It is bad now, it will be horrendous in the > Winter. > > I would suspect it is not firing on all 5 cylinders because a > glow plug(s) is shot. Replace all the glow plugs and the glow plug > relay. www.autohausaz.com has a kit that replaces it all. It's easy to > do. > > While you're at it, replace those injectors, adjust the valves, > and change out your air and fuel filters. > > I can almost guarantee you, this will make a huge difference in > the vehicle from start-up to shut down. > > Oh, and BTW. As soon as oil pressure comes up, your should be > driving. No reason for it to warm up. > > Cheers, > > Nick ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Aug 2005 15:27:14 -0500 From: acordova-at-texas.net Subject: Re: [db] start-up of 1984 300d I say do the valves before doing the glow plugs or injectors. The valves are supposed to be readjusted every 15,000 miles. I'd say it's much more likely that hard or rough starts are caused by valves out of adjustment than by bad glow plugs or injectors. And if you have decent wrenches and a feeler gauge, the valve adjustment only costs you a new valve cover gasket, so it's definitely worth trying just the valve work first. Alec Quoting Charles Redell : > Good suggestions. thanks. I have had the fuel filters and air filter > changed since I got it but haven't done the glow plugs and > injectors... nor have I done the valves. but I have plans and a book > from mercedessource.com.... > I'll try and update everyone as this goes on.... > thanks! > c ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1924 **********************************