From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Tue Oct 11 11:56:39 2005 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Tuesday, October 11 2005 Volume 01 : Number 1983 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: [db] diesel-benz-digest V1 #1982 Re: [db] the saga of the 124 Re: [db] the saga of the 124 Re: [db] the saga of the 124 [db] 20 inches of snow? [db] NOW: I-912 Re: [db] NOW: I-912 Re: [db] NOW: I-912 Re: [db] NOW: I-912 [db] Re: manifold question to split or not to split? :) Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 23:35:11 +0000 From: owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net (diesel-benz-digest) Subject: [db] diesel-benz-digest V1 #1982 diesel-benz-digest Monday, October 10 2005 Volume 01 : Number 1982 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [db] Urgent Transmission question Re: [db] Urgent Transmission question RE: [db] Urgent Transmission question Re: [db] Urgent Transmission question Re: [db] Urgent Transmission question Re: [db] Year of MB diesels for best milage? RE: [db] Urgent Transmission question [db] this just in... Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 09 Oct 2005 15:40:01 -0700 From: Greg Fiorentino Subject: Re: [db] Urgent Transmission question Edward Pomeroy wrote: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MERCEDES-BENZ-300SD-TURBO-DIESEL_W0QQitemZ4579813423QQcategoryZ6330QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Guys, any likely diagnosis for this kind of problem with the transmission?? The item on e-bay expires in about 2.5 hours. Thanks, Edward Edward: On my '84 300D Turbo I had the same problem. If it is the same trans, it is likely the B-2 piston. Mine was repaired by my (outstanding) local indy shop for about $300. YMMV. If this were near me I would take the risk. Greg Fiorentino Vancouver USA '86 300 SDL '84 300D Turbo '79 300TD '85 6.9L F350 Crew Cab - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Oct 2005 17:08:04 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] Urgent Transmission question hard to say... could be something as simple as a bad vacuum line or an oil change... these trannies are susceptible to "misrouted" vacuum lines... and this one has cancer, not the fenders... this would be a GOOD donor for a Jeep Cherokee conversion though... too bad Illinois is so far away.. :( I wonder where Bruce is with his 124... suspect he's somewhere out near Yellowstone right now... john On Sun, 9 Oct 2005, Edward Pomeroy wrote: > -->http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MERCEDES-BENZ-300SD-TURBO-DIESEL_W0QQitemZ4579813423QQcategoryZ6330QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem > --> > --> > -->Guys, any likely diagnosis for this kind of problem with the transmission?? > -->The item on e-bay expires in about 2.5 hours. > --> > -->Thanks, > -->Edward > --> > --> ---- - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** Date: Sun, 9 Oct 2005 20:42:40 -0500 From: "Alec Cordova" Subject: RE: [db] Urgent Transmission question Yup. That would be the same basic 4 speed auto as an 85 300D. My recollection is that if all you have is reverse and one forward gear (I thought it might have been 2nd you were stuck with, but it could have been 1st), then it is most likely a blown B2 piston inside the tranny. Definitely not your average AAMCO job, but a Benz specialist familiar with this era should be able to fix it for a reasonable price. Alec Cordova Taylor, Texas 89 300CE, 194K > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net > [mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net]On Behalf Of Greg Fiorentino > Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 5:40 PM > To: ejpomeroy-at-qtm.net > Cc: diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net > Subject: Re: [db] Urgent Transmission question > > > Edward Pomeroy wrote: > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MERCEDES-BENZ-300SD-TURBO-DIESEL_W0 QQitemZ4579813423QQcategoryZ6330QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem Guys, any likely diagnosis for this kind of problem with the transmission?? The item on e-bay expires in about 2.5 hours. Thanks, Edward Edward: On my '84 300D Turbo I had the same problem. If it is the same trans, it is likely the B-2 piston. Mine was repaired by my (outstanding) local indy shop for about $300. YMMV. If this were near me I would take the risk. Greg Fiorentino Vancouver USA '86 300 SDL '84 300D Turbo '79 300TD '85 6.9L F350 Crew Cab - ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 Oct 2005 22:53:32 -0500 From: richard Subject: Re: [db] Urgent Transmission question i had that problem on a 1969 220 d, the problem was the rear pump, the nut holding the cam [eccentric lobe , slides over the out put shaft and runs the rear pump] had slacked off just enough to let it slip, resulting in no rear pressure... i have no idea if the 80's 90's 4 speed auto boxes have the same or simular set up, i.e., rear pump richard, lake texoma texas 82 300-sd 80 300-sd 80 300-sd* 75 240d 4 speed 75 240d auto* 69 220 auto* 71 250c 61 190sl other brit/euro cars and m/cycles *- parts cars, some running and complete.... - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 07:20:47 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jerry Kaidor" Subject: Re: [db] Urgent Transmission question > hard to say... could be something as simple as a bad vacuum line *** This is something I have to look at on my '85 300D. It has been showing signs of vacuum distress for the last few days. Shifts are choppy, and the engine is slow to turn off. "Honey, could you pass the Mityvac?" - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 14:36:00 -0700 From: Kevin Subject: Re: [db] Year of MB diesels for best milage? On Sat, Oct 08, 2005 at 07:31:42PM -0400, Michael Frank wrote: > My '79 300CD (normally aspirated) would regularly give 26mpg. My '87 190D > has the 2.5 turbo. With a light foot, it gets 33 mpg city, up to 39 mpg on > the highway. The 190D was one year only in the US, but I think the 2.5 was > available with 300D's into the 90's. If you don't have to have a turbo, there are other 190Ds out there that get mileage up there too. I think the 2.5 300D is the one to go for, unless you want the smaller car. If fuel economy is your goal outright, and you don't live in a salty climate, I'd probably consider one of the W210 diesels or a VW passat (salt not as much of a problem, but timing belt engine). > On the subject of AC, the 190 has been converted to 134a, and has a much > better climate control system than the older car. The engine does tend to > run hot in city traffic, and I'm wondering if the problem is fixable. Plenty of reasons for this that have bitten me: - lazy fan clutch - dead switch on the electric fan (that is supposed to turn the fan on if the refrigerant pressure passes X) - note that this could also be fuses and relays (of course) - low transmission fluid (radiator is a trans cooler, after all. stupid wagon) - tired coolant - time to bust out the pressure washer and spray the fins of the radiator clean with some simple green - something causing a rich condition in the engine (fuel adds heat in a diesel, unlike a gasser) - sticky thermostat - lazy water pump (which the stupid wagon might be doing to me) Remember, the most that it will cost you to solve a running warm condition is just shy of ten grand. New engine and all the cooling stuff will probably solve the problem quite well :) K - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 15:23:29 -0700 (PDT) From: Gene H Subject: RE: [db] Urgent Transmission question I did a B4 piston on my W123's tranny recently. The main symptom was that the car would NOT shift into first gear when cold, felt like a worn clutch slipping. The more gas you give it, the more it slips. If it's slipping between 1st and 2nd, then it may be a vacuum problem. - ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 16:39:57 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: [db] this just in... bruce and his "new" 124 made it back! he's on I-405 heading home, made it over the passes and everything... hit 35mpg part of the way, possible fuel leak now, dropped to 29... will take a look at it later this week with him. :) john ---- - - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1982 ********************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 04:26:08 +0000 From: Bruce Caruthers Subject: Re: [db] the saga of the 124 On Wed Oct 05, 2005, john wrote: > > amazing place... couldn't imagine living anywhere else despite the lack > of sunshine, horrific traffic, outrageous taxes, liberals coming out of the > closet and woodwork and the general soggy nature of things. :) If you think the taxes here in WA are bad, try living in California or NY (both places I've lived and paid taxes). And of course, there are the high taxes in Europe, Canada, et al, but it seems you actually get something for the taxes you pay there (not so sure about that here in WA, definitely didn't get anywhere near my taxes' worth in California). :/ - -bkc Lynnwood, WA '76 MB 240D/W115.117 '00 MB ML320/W163.154 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 21:39:07 -0700 From: Kevin Subject: Re: [db] the saga of the 124 On Tue, Oct 11, 2005 at 04:26:08AM +0000, Bruce Caruthers wrote: > If you think the taxes here in WA are bad, try > living in California or NY (both places I've > lived and paid taxes). And of course, there are > the high taxes in Europe, Canada, et al, but it > seems you actually get something for the taxes > you pay there (not so sure about that here in > WA, definitely didn't get anywhere near my taxes' > worth in California). :/ Sure we do. We have the best roads in the country, the best schools in the world, and we have an efficient, trim government to make sure the state doesn't go to hell in a hand basket. Someone remind me why I shouldn't move... K ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 22:26:44 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] the saga of the 124 K, I have to agree, you DO have the best roads in the country. as far as the rest of it, can't speak to it... believe it or not, CalTran really does do a great job. I've driven in 19 countries and 48 states... can't think of better roads any where, well, except maybe Germany... or Switzerland... or... oh, you get the idea. ;) john On Mon, 10 Oct 2005, Kevin wrote: >-->On Tue, Oct 11, 2005 at 04:26:08AM +0000, Bruce Caruthers wrote: >-->> If you think the taxes here in WA are bad, try >-->> living in California or NY (both places I've >-->> lived and paid taxes). And of course, there are >-->> the high taxes in Europe, Canada, et al, but it >-->> seems you actually get something for the taxes >-->> you pay there (not so sure about that here in >-->> WA, definitely didn't get anywhere near my taxes' >-->> worth in California). :/ >--> >-->Sure we do. We have the best roads in the country, the best schools in the >-->world, and we have an efficient, trim government to make sure the state doesn't >-->go to hell in a hand basket. >--> >-->Someone remind me why I shouldn't move... >--> >-->K >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 23:04:44 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: [db] 20 inches of snow? looks like Colorado is getting dumped on... a friend just made it back from Illinois with a "new" car too... perfect timing. :) funny piece in netscape news though: ``We've got people out trying out the four-wheel-drive vehicles, and they're finding out they don't work very well,'' spokesman Steve Sperry said. it's the driver... not the vehicle... :) (of course if it's a Jeep it's both. ;) john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 11:31:41 -0400 From: "Black, Waylon" Subject: [db] NOW: I-912 I enjoy these debates - no matter how off-topic it may be. If knowledge is truly power - more power to the people. Good info for those contemplating a move. Waylon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 10:23:41 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] NOW: I-912 On Tue, 11 Oct 2005, Black, Waylon wrote: >-->I enjoy these debates - no matter how off-topic it may be. If knowledge >-->is truly power - more power to the people. >-->Good info for those contemplating a move. >-->Waylon yes, I agree, it's nice to know what is going on in other parts of the world. problem is getting good, current and accurate info. as chuck pointed out the info I had was, oh, about two weeks old, and all that changed with $3 / gallon. ;) Our politicians raise our taxes and say it's going to be used for such and such but it never is... all I know is we need a better transportation infrastructure here... more general purpose traffic lanes because for many of us mass transit just doesn't work, we're spread too far out and the time it takes to use what we have is often inconvenient. alternate fuels like ethanol and biodiesel seem to be a very, very good prospect... john ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 18:29:10 +0000 From: briankk-at-att.net Subject: Re: [db] NOW: I-912 From: john Save Address Reminder To: "Black, Waylon" Cc: diesel-benz-at-digest.net Subject: Re: [db] NOW: I-912 Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 17:19:23 +0000 [View Source] On Tue, 11 Oct 2005, Black, Waylon wrote: >-->I enjoy these debates - no matter how off-topic it may be. If knowledge >-->is truly power - more power to the people. >-->Good info for those contemplating a move. >-->Waylon yes, I agree, it's nice to know what is going on in other parts of the world. problem is getting good, current and accurate info. as chuck pointed out the info I had was, oh, about two weeks old, and all that changed with $3 / gallon. ;) Our politicians raise our taxes and say it's going to be used for such and such but it never is... all I know is we need a better transportation infrastructure here... more general purpose traffic lanes because for many of us mass transit just doesn't work, we're spread too far out and the time it takes to use what we have is often inconvenient. alternate fuels like ethanol and biodiesel seem to be a very, very good prospect... john Diesel still $3.15/ga on Willow Road in Menlo park. Biodiesel is holding at $3.25 at Western States Fuel on 10th in San Jose, which is interesting because "regular" diesel is $3.30 at the next pump over, and is $3.35-40 at most stations in SJ.. bk ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 11:48:48 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] NOW: I-912 Diesel has been hovering at $3.14 at the shell stations I frequent... lowest I've seen was $3.06 at some minimart type place... near I-5 on 128th it's 3.17 on the north, 3.19 on the south... drive two miles "inland" and see 3.14. :) haven't seen diesel in seattle, I usually get on I-5 right at mercer only two blocks off the freeway... still haven't located biodiesel, there is one or two in ballard and one in the u district, both are off the freeway a ways... john On Tue, 11 Oct 2005 briankk-at-att.net wrote: >-->From: >-->john Save Address Reminder >-->To: "Black, Waylon" >-->Cc: diesel-benz-at-digest.net >-->Subject: Re: [db] NOW: I-912 >-->Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 17:19:23 +0000 [View Source] >--> >--> >-->On Tue, 11 Oct 2005, Black, Waylon wrote: >-->>-->I enjoy these debates - no matter how off-topic it may be. If knowledge >-->>-->is truly power - more power to the people. >-->>-->Good info for those contemplating a move. >-->>-->Waylon >--> >-->yes, I agree, it's nice to know what is going on in other parts of the world. >-->problem >--> >-->Diesel still $3.15/ga on Willow Road in Menlo park. Biodiesel is holding at $3.25 at Western States Fuel on 10th in San Jose, which is interesting because "regular" diesel is $3.30 at the next pump over, and is $3.35-40 at most stations in SJ.. >--> >-->bk ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 11:55:42 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: [db] Re: manifold question to split or not to split? :) Curtis, yes, it does help, thanx... but I think with Diesels having copius amounts of air is what is important... having the divider in the middle would seem to me to create a restriction. I know it's useful for low end torque on a gas engine, but I'm not convinced that it applies to a Diesel... I could be wrong. I don't think turbulence is an issue with a Diesel, they have higher compression so they draw more air and do so with more gusto... I will put this to the lists as well and see if the idea of air induction for gas is the same as for a Diesel. I'm undecided, I know it makes a big difference on a gas engine to get the flow just right, important for vaporization and smooth "pulses"... but on a Diesel it's like a big vacuum pump and I'm thinking that divider offers too much restriction... On american Diesels I've seen significant performance and economy gains by opening things up... and since 6.2 is american... ;) hey guys, what's better the split manifold or one big opening? :) john On Tue, 11 Oct 2005, Curtis wrote: > -->Hi John, > --> > -->I would go with the one with the divider (Dual plane) in it as it should > -->have better/wider torque band. Being a street diesel that could be > -->important. ;) > -->The other one is a single plane. Good for high rpm use. Maybe even turbo > -->use, but your economy and low end torque would suffer either way. > --> > -->If I remember correctly, the dynamics of air induction are similar > -->regardless whether gas or diesel. The idea is to fill the chamber as > -->efficiently as possible without causing undue restriction. The small intake > -->runners create better low end torque, while the big runners create lots of > -->flow, good for the top end of the rpm range, and they create > -->unusable/unwanted turbulance at low rpm's too. That is the reason for dual > -->plane manifolds. A compromise. Half the runners are smaller and half > -->bigger. In essence fooling the motor into thinking it is two motors. Half > -->boosting low end torque and half adding to the top end. > --> > -->Hope this helps. > --> > -->Curtis > --> > --> > -->john wrote: > -->> trying to figure out which manifold will allow the 6.2L to breath > -->> better, > -->> check these out and email asap: > -->> > -->> smooth opening: > -->> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6566296905&category=588 > -->> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6566297231&fromMakeTrack=true > -->> > -->> > -->> split in middle: > -->> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6519806633&category=588 > -->> > -->> > -->> misc article, shows the split setup... (Non-egr) > -->> http://www.fourwheeler.com/projectbuild/7914/ > -->> > -->> > -->> I'm thinking that the smooth opening one will flow better... they're > -->> also > -->> cheaper... > -->> thoughts? > -->> > -->> john > -->> > -->> ---- > -->> > -->> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -->> ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** > -->> Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > -->> ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** > -->> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -->> > -->> > --> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #1983 **********************************