From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Wed Jul 12 17:43:51 2006 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Thursday, July 13 2006 Volume 01 : Number 2194 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless Re: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless Re: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless Re: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless Re: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless [db] Pictures of my WVO Benz conversion. [db] Non starting Benz (no diesel content... but I'm a bit stuck) RE: [db] Non starting Benz (no diesel content... but I'm a bit stuck) Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2006 08:36:18 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jerry Kaidor" Subject: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless Hi guys, Got up bright & early this morning and turned my ALDA adjustment screw out 3/4 of a turn. Night & Day. The turtle is now a hare. Much faster off the line, and don't have to mash the pedal to the metal all the time. Car made it up the car test hill accellerating all the way. Not shoving me back in the seat by any means, but the needle continued to creep up. Just past 70MPH, we ran out of hill. Transmission shifts smoother too. Very few things left before taking the car to Stockton. Actually, I really hate to leave it out there. They say they have 24hour video security in that parking lot, but there's no sun protection. The paint will get absolutely thrashed at a minimum. Well, it's already pretty thrashed. Maybe I can get a cheap(er) paint job out there in the Valley. - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2006 09:39:19 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless got a picture of this mythical ALDA thing? I'll put it in the tech section on my server: http://wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/TECH john On Wed, 12 Jul 2006, Jerry Kaidor wrote: >-->Hi guys, >--> >--> Got up bright & early this morning and turned my ALDA adjustment >-->screw out 3/4 of a turn. Night & Day. The turtle is now a hare. Much >-->faster off the line, and don't have to mash the pedal to the metal all >-->the time. Car made it up the car test hill accellerating all the way. >-->Not shoving me back in the seat by any means, but the needle continued >-->to creep up. Just past 70MPH, we ran out of hill. Transmission shifts >-->smoother too. >--> >--> Very few things left before taking the car to Stockton. Actually, >-->I really hate to leave it out there. They say they have 24hour video >-->security in that parking lot, but there's no sun protection. The paint >-->will get absolutely thrashed at a minimum. Well, it's already pretty >-->thrashed. Maybe I can get a cheap(er) paint job out there in the Valley. >--> >--> - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2006 11:51:06 -0500 From: "Allen Zylstra" Subject: Re: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless I would like to know what the ALDA is too. My car is not necessarioy slow, but improvements can be made. Allen -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: john To: Jerry Kaidor CC: diesel-benz-at-digest.net Subject: Re: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2006 09:39:19 -0700 (PDT) >got a picture of this mythical ALDA thing? I'll put it in the >tech section on my server: http://wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/TECH > >john > >On Wed, 12 Jul 2006, Jerry Kaidor wrote: > > >-->Hi guys, > >--> > >--> Got up bright & early this morning and turned my ALDA adjustment > >-->screw out 3/4 of a turn. Night & Day. The turtle is now a hare. Much > >-->faster off the line, and don't have to mash the pedal to the metal all > >-->the time. Car made it up the car test hill accellerating all the way. > >-->Not shoving me back in the seat by any means, but the needle continued > >-->to creep up. Just past 70MPH, we ran out of hill. Transmission shifts > >-->smoother too. > >--> > >--> Very few things left before taking the car to Stockton. Actually, > >-->I really hate to leave it out there. They say they have 24hour video > >-->security in that parking lot, but there's no sun protection. The paint > >-->will get absolutely thrashed at a minimum. Well, it's already pretty > >-->thrashed. Maybe I can get a cheap(er) paint job out there in the Valley. > >--> > >--> - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) > >--> > > ---- > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** > Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** >------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2006 10:06:45 -0700 (PDT) From: "Jerry Kaidor" Subject: Re: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless > I would like to know what the ALDA is too. My car is not necessarioy > slow, but improvements can be made. *** It's a sort of "Altitude Compensator". It looks at the boost from the turbo, and when the turbo is boosting, it tells the injection pump to pump more fuel to match the increased air. AFAIK, even the non-turbo engines have them, to compensate for thinner air at high altitude ( or thicker air at low altitude ). The turbo makes even thicker air, and needs more compensation. The ALDA has a pressure input that comes from the intake manifold, through a "switchover valve" that disables it if the turbo wastegate fails. Because if the wastegate fails, the turbo can put out up to 40PSI, which would fry the engine pretty quick if the ALDA boosted the fuel along with it. Do a google search for "mercedes ALDA" for a mountain of information. I especially like this one: http://articles.mbz.org/engine/diesel/alda/. Be aware that it's possible to break an ALDA by adjusting it. It's never happened to me, but I've heard of it happening to other folks. Something will just go "sproing" inside, and your ALDA is then garbage. I'm not sure what would cause this: maybe the adjustment screw catches on the aneroid and twists it apart? Whatever, just don't adjust it any more than you need to. A quarter turn at a time is about right. CCW to enrich ( the usual direction for improvement ). The adjustment has an especially large effect at low throttle positions, before the turbo kicks in. - Jerry Kaidor > > Allen > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > From: john > To: Jerry Kaidor > CC: diesel-benz-at-digest.net > Subject: Re: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless > Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2006 09:39:19 -0700 (PDT) > >got a picture of this mythical ALDA thing? I'll put it in the > >tech section on my server: http://wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/TECH > > > >john > > > >On Wed, 12 Jul 2006, Jerry Kaidor wrote: > > > > >-->Hi guys, > > >--> > > >--> Got up bright & early this morning and turned my ALDA > adjustment > > >-->screw out 3/4 of a turn. Night & Day. The turtle is now a > hare. Much > > >-->faster off the line, and don't have to mash the pedal to the > metal all > > >-->the time. Car made it up the car test hill accellerating all > the way. > > >-->Not shoving me back in the seat by any means, but the needle > continued > > >-->to creep up. Just past 70MPH, we ran out of > hill. Transmission shifts > > >-->smoother too. > > >--> > > >--> Very few things left before taking the car to > Stockton. Actually, > > >-->I really hate to leave it out there. They say they have 24hour > video > > >-->security in that parking lot, but there's no sun > protection. The paint > > >-->will get absolutely thrashed at a minimum. Well, it's already > pretty > > >-->thrashed. Maybe I can get a cheap(er) paint job out there in > the Valley. > > >--> > > >--> - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) > > >--> > > > > ---- > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** > > Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > > ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html > ** > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2006 17:31:33 -0500 From: "Allen Zylstra" Subject: Re: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless Thanks, I heard many refer to it. It is a fuel management system. Allen -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Jerry Kaidor" To: "Allen Zylstra" CC: diesel-benz-at-digest.net Subject: Re: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2006 10:06:45 -0700 (PDT) > > I would like to know what the ALDA is too. My car is not necessarioy > > slow, but improvements can be made. > >*** It's a sort of "Altitude Compensator". It looks at the boost from the >turbo, and when the turbo is boosting, it tells the injection pump to >pump more fuel to match the increased air. AFAIK, even the non-turbo >engines have them, to compensate for thinner air at high altitude ( or >thicker air at low altitude ). The turbo makes even thicker air, and >needs more compensation. > > The ALDA has a pressure input that comes from the intake manifold, >through a "switchover valve" that disables it if the turbo wastegate fails. >Because if the wastegate fails, the turbo can put out up to 40PSI, which >would fry the engine pretty quick if the ALDA boosted the fuel along with >it. > > Do a google search for "mercedes ALDA" for a mountain of information. >I especially like this one: http://articles.mbz.org/engine/diesel/alda/. > > Be aware that it's possible to break an ALDA by adjusting it. It's >never happened to me, but I've heard of it happening to other folks. >Something will just go "sproing" inside, and your ALDA is then garbage. >I'm not sure what would cause this: maybe the adjustment screw catches on >the aneroid and twists it apart? Whatever, just don't adjust it any more >than you need to. A quarter turn at a time is about right. CCW to enrich >( the usual direction for improvement ). The adjustment has an especially >large effect at low throttle positions, before the turbo kicks in. > > > - Jerry Kaidor > > > > > > > > > > > > Allen > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > From: john > > To: Jerry Kaidor > > CC: diesel-benz-at-digest.net > > Subject: Re: [db] 300SD No Longer Gutless > > Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2006 09:39:19 -0700 (PDT) > > >got a picture of this mythical ALDA thing? I'll put it in the > > >tech section on my server: http://wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/TECH > > > > > >john > > > > > >On Wed, 12 Jul 2006, Jerry Kaidor wrote: > > > > > > >-->Hi guys, > > > >--> > > > >--> Got up bright & early this morning and turned my ALDA > > adjustment > > > >-->screw out 3/4 of a turn. Night & Day. The turtle is now a > > hare. Much > > > >-->faster off the line, and don't have to mash the pedal to the > > metal all > > > >-->the time. Car made it up the car test hill accellerating all > > the way. > > > >-->Not shoving me back in the seat by any means, but the needle > > continued > > > >-->to creep up. Just past 70MPH, we ran out of > > hill. Transmission shifts > > > >-->smoother too. > > > >--> > > > >--> Very few things left before taking the car to > > Stockton. Actually, > > > >-->I really hate to leave it out there. They say they have 24hour > > video > > > >-->security in that parking lot, but there's no sun > > protection. The paint > > > >-->will get absolutely thrashed at a minimum. Well, it's already > > pretty > > > >-->thrashed. Maybe I can get a cheap(er) paint job out there in > > the Valley. > > > >--> > > > >--> - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) > > > >--> > > > > > > ---- > > > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** > > > Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > > > ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html > > ** > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2006 17:52:55 -0500 From: "Allen Zylstra" Subject: [db] Pictures of my WVO Benz conversion. This is the pictures I promised of my recently finished WVO conversion. I used a two tank system with twin valves for the fuel input and returns. System costs roughly $300 to assemble. Project car $600 with additional $200 parts car. Currently about 350 miles on WVO. http://s39.photobucket.com/albums/e166/katoranger/W123%20WVO/ Allen -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: john To: Scott Williams CC: diesel-benz-at-digest.net Subject: Re: [db] Inaccurate fuel gauge Date: Sat, 8 Jul 2006 20:31:46 -0700 (PDT) >that's right! I went through this with my '83 300SD... if I recall >correctly, what I did was pull that unit out and spray it down with amsoil MP and >carb cleaner... then dried it off and put it back in... > >john > >On Sat, 8 Jul 2006, Scott Williams wrote: > > > -->There isn't any "arm" to bend. Our cars us a VDO tube-type gauge > > -->sender. It's a tube with a float that slides up and down inside on some > > -->fine wires, and sometimes the wires can get crudded up with fungus or > > -->rust or whatever, so maybe the float stopped at a point above the bottom > > -->of the tube? There's a description online about how to work on the > > -->sender. I did it to clean mine out, as it was working erratically. I > > -->opened it up and it was full of black gunk. > > --> > > -->http://www.diymbrepair.com/Sender/ > > --> > > -->Scott in Penfield NY > > --> > > -->Jerry Kaidor wrote: > > -->> The other day, I was driving my 300SD around. At a quarter of a tank, > > -->> I wasn't worried. Then the engine died and we coasted to a stop. No > > -->> gas. I ran down the hill, bought a gas can and two gallons of diesel, > > -->> went back to the car, poured, primed, started, and went back to the gas > > -->> station to fill-er-up. > > -->> > > -->> Should I go in and bend up the float arm? > > -->> > > -->> I had a half gallon of Delvac 1500 in the trunk. Could I have poured > > -->> that in to go to the gas station? Non issue now, because now I have a > > -->> 2 > > -->> gallon gas can full of diesel in the trunk. How long does diesel fuel > > -->> last in storage anyway? > > -->> > > -->> The new filter at the Mercedes dealer is not see-through. That > > -->> sucks. > > -->> I love those see-through filters. You can really see what's going on. > > -->> > > -->> - Jerry Kaidor ( jerry-at-tr2.com ) > > --> > > --> > > ---- > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** > Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** >------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2006 00:34:18 +0100 From: "Stephen Rigley" Subject: [db] Non starting Benz (no diesel content... but I'm a bit stuck) Hi folks, So I took the train 3hrs to Dublin this eve to pick up my "new" w123 1982 230CE, drove it to my parents house (30 miles) and parked it. An hour later I took it out to get petrol 2 mins away, then started it up and drove a further 2 mins to get some fuses (they had none), again it started fine (can ya see where this is headin?) and drove 5 mins home. I parked the car outside and went in. I was back out again 2 mins later to show my sister the car and it wouldn't start... fuel pump runs and I get a "click" but no starter turning... any ideas? Things I'm thinking... Neutral safety shut off thingy in shifter (I've NO experience working on Automatics).. I was fiddling with it on the drive home and stopped, put it in S about 100 yards from the house "just to see" .. would this have dislodged something? (bushings?) When I have the key turned to "start" and I move the shifter I can hear the fuel pump going on and off as I move from D -> P ... so is there another one I can jumper or something? Is there a ground cable going from Trans to chassis that might be causing it? Problem is... I'm due to leave here at 6:00am to get back for work at 9:30am.. Any help appreciated! Steve ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Jul 2006 19:40:14 -0500 From: "Alec Cordova" Subject: RE: [db] Non starting Benz (no diesel content... but I'm a bit stuck) The Neutral Safety Switch allows you to start an automatic only when it is in either Park or Neutral. Try the other, but if you hear the fuel pump starting and stopping, that's probably not your issue. Could be battery, possibly as a symptom of a weak or bad charging system, which can often be fixed with a brush/regulator pack replacement, rather than replacing the whole alternator. I think these run 40 or 50 bucks on this side of the pond. And yes, I believe there is a ground from the rear of the transmission to the chassis. If putting it in neutral instead of park doesn't fix it, my guess would be alternator and/or battery. Good luck, Alec Cordova Taylor, Texas 89 300CE, 207K > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net > [mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net]On Behalf Of Stephen Rigley > Sent: Wednesday, July 12, 2006 6:34 PM > To: diesel-benz-at-digest.net > Subject: [db] Non starting Benz (no diesel content... but I'm a bit > stuck) > > > Hi folks, > > So I took the train 3hrs to Dublin this eve to pick up my "new" w123 > 1982 230CE, drove it to my parents house (30 miles) and parked it. An > hour later I took it out to get petrol 2 mins away, then started it up > and drove a further 2 mins to get some fuses (they had none), again it > started fine (can ya see where this is headin?) and drove 5 mins home. > I parked the car outside and went in. I was back out again 2 mins > later to show my sister the car and it wouldn't start... fuel pump > runs and I get a "click" but no starter turning... any ideas? > > Things I'm thinking... > Neutral safety shut off thingy in shifter (I've NO experience working > on Automatics).. I was fiddling with it on the drive home and stopped, > put it in S about 100 yards from the house "just to see" .. would this > have dislodged something? (bushings?) > When I have the key turned to "start" and I move the shifter I can > hear the fuel pump going on and off as I move from D -> P ... so is > there another one I can jumper or something? > > Is there a ground cable going from Trans to chassis that might be > causing it? > > Problem is... I'm due to leave here at 6:00am to get back for > work at 9:30am.. > Any help appreciated! > > Steve ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #2194 **********************************