From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Thu Nov 23 05:07:21 2006 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Thursday, November 23 2006 Volume 01 : Number 2311 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [db] Re: fsj: Turbo Diesel XJ Re: [db] Diesel Bike! Re: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? Re: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? RE: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? RE: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? Re: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? Re: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? [db] Chrysler 300C Diesel ... pity only in Europe? Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 17:22:48 -0300 From: "Renaud (Ron) Olgiati" Subject: Re: [db] Re: fsj: Turbo Diesel XJ On Monday 20 November 2006 17:08, my mailbox was graced by a missive from john who wrote: > there's the leading edge, the bleeding edge, and then the french designs... Like the all-hydraulic Citroens, whose suspension are also used in some lesser makes like Mercedes-Benz, or Rolls-Royce ;-3p Cheers, Ron. - -- You cannot achieve the impossible without attempting the absurd. -- http://www.olgiati-in-paraguay.org -- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 12:40:01 -0800 From: ernest breakfield Subject: Re: [db] Diesel Bike! john wrote: > don't see a price, is this the model we'll be able to get in the states? > http://www.dieselmotorcycles.com/PDF/D650A1_Bulldog_US.pdf allegedly, yes; if they ever get around to actually making them available. (they've been promising them for years already...) > 102 mpg sounds pretty decent... yep, 102 mpg *sounds* great; would love to see if it ever happens in real life. sadly, the performance specs i've seen made it look like your below-average 240D would out-accelerate it, and it wasn't going to quick enough or speedy enough be practical to ride at (California) highway speeds. aside from that, paying what they were suggesting for a machine that's not serviceable *anywhere* and has a single-source supply for parts just isn't attractive. when i pointed this out to them as gently as i possibly could, they got downright snippy. (i suspect they've been dealing with milking the military for too long, and are out of touch with the Real World.) > along with the smell of Diesel in the morning. :) or better yet, BioD made from oil used for cooking potato chips (like what we're burning in our lovely old 300D right now,...). just make sure you had breakfast before you go, or you're going to be getting hungry the first time you're stopped with the wind coming from behind you! ;-) cheers! e ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 12:41:13 -0800 From: chuck goolsbee Subject: Re: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? >$19K for a motorcycle???? I think they have been inhaling >too many Diesel fumes or something... Or looking around at Harley-Davidson showrooms. I'm not at all a biker, but like John I can recall when it was the "cheap" alternative. No more. - -- - --chuck goolsbee 02 Jetta TDi & 06 Liberty CRD arlington, wa, usa ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 12:56:14 -0800 From: ernest breakfield Subject: Re: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? i'm not a "biker" either, though i do ride bicycles and motorcycles,... not enough decorative fringed leather in the closet or chrome in the garage to be a "biker",... ;-) these days, the cost of keeping a highway-worthy motorcycle in the commute is rarely the "cheap" alternative; when it costs over $300 for a pair of tires that i can go through in less than 10K miles on the moto, the fuel savings (if any) don't make up for the difference in the cost of operation. (i rarely see 35 MPG or better while riding on the commute.) heck, i get about 60K miles out of a set of Mud tires on the J**p, and they only cost approx. twice as much for a set! considering it costs between $1-2K just to get properly dressed to ride motos safely on the highway, it's not something people do for economy. (contrary to what teenagers might say while trying to convince Mom and Dad to get them a motorcycle,..) cheers! e chuck goolsbee wrote: > >$19K for a motorcycle???? I think they have been inhaling > >too many Diesel fumes or something... > > Or looking around at Harley-Davidson showrooms. > > I'm not at all a biker, but like John I can recall when it was the > "cheap" alternative. No more. > > -- > --chuck goolsbee > 02 Jetta TDi & 06 Liberty CRD > arlington, wa, usa > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:47:23 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: RE: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? yikes, a 1,200 lb motorcycle!!! and it'll only to 165 klicks??? http://www.dieselkrad.info/index.php?main=dieselkrad&detail=high&id=59&bilder=neppl john On Mon, 20 Nov 2006, Michael Usher wrote: >-->[ first post ] >--> >-->The Hayes KLR was built for the US Army so that the army could stop shipping >-->gasoline all over the place. >--> >-->Hayes buys KLRs direct from Kawasaki and then modifies them -- new engine, >-->new suspension, and a few strengthened joints (subframe, and handlebar >-->particularly). >--> >-->It's rumoured that the US Army pays a lot more than $19k per bike, and the >-->$19k is supposedly subsidized! >--> >-->There have been many many diesel motorcycles built. Russian made Dnepr >-->motorcycles (a copy of the old BMW R60 design) are often retrofitted with >-->Hatz diesels. There's a registry I found here: >-->http://www.dieselkrad.info/index.php?main=dieselkrad >--> >-->I think it was Universitat Erlangen where they modified a BMW R1150 boxer >-->engine for diesel operation -- basically, they just strengthened the crank >-->and pistons, and fitted a diesel head. In mass production, that's a much >-->cheaper way to go than the Hayes KLR. >--> >-->Small engines from Kubota, Daihatsu, Hatz, Yanmar, etc. are very popular as >-->well. >--> >-->There are quite a few net resources -- search for "diesel motorcycle". >-->Here's another good launching point: >-->http://www.dieselbike.net/ >--> >--> >-->Michael >-->'82 300SD >-->Santa Cruz, CA >--> >-->> -----Original Message----- >-->> From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net >-->> [mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of john >-->> Sent: Monday, November 20, 2006 12:06 PM >-->> To: ernest breakfield >-->> Cc: diesel-benz-at-digest.net >-->> Subject: Re: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? >-->> >-->> found the price... I could buy a number of vehicles, >-->> engines and build a Diesel fleet >-->> for what they expect! $19K for a motorcycle???? I think >-->> they have been inhaling >-->> too many Diesel fumes or something... this is a far cry from >-->> the $850 NEW price I >-->> paid for my Elsinore in the '70s. :) >-->> >-->> http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2005/11/17/d650a1-bulldog-di >-->> esel-motorcycle-prices-set/ >-->> >-->> PRICE: The Manufacturer.s Suggested Retail Price for the >-->> D650-A1LE Bulldog will be $18,999.00 (the price is subject to >-->> change until the opening of our initial offer to sell and >-->> some restrictions may apply.) A non-refundable deposit of 10% >-->> of the purchase price will be required to hold your bike. The >-->> balance will be due on presentation of documentation and >-->> notice that the unit is ready for shipment. For our >-->> customer.s protection, deposits will be refunded if HDTUSA is >-->> unable to deliver their motorcycle. >-->> >-->> >-->> >-->> john >-->> >-->> On Mon, 20 Nov 2006, ernest breakfield wrote: >-->> >-->> >-->it'll be interesting to see if they ever actually get >-->> these out to where people can buy them (unlike the >-->> >-->folks at Hayes/F1), and what they might sell for... the >-->> prices Hayes/F1 suggested for theirs were absurd. >-->> >--> >-->> >-->www.dieselmotorcycles.com >-->> >-->www.f1engineering.com >-->> >--> >-->> >--> >-->> >-->cheers! >-->> >-->e >-->> >--> >-->> >--> >-->> >-->chuck goolsbee wrote: >-->> >--> >-->> >-->> >-->> -->> commercially-available-diesel-motorcycle/> >-->> >-->> >-->> >-->> For your oil-burning two-wheeled pleasure. >-->> >-->> >-->> >-->> -- >-->> >--> >-->> >-->> ---- >-->> >-->> -------------------------------------------------------------- >-->> ----------- >-->> ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** >-->> Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold >-->> ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** >-->> -------------------------------------------------------------- >-->> ----------- >-->> >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:49:17 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: RE: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? the ultimate harley: http://www.dieselkrad.info/index.php?main=dieselkrad&detail=high&id=118&bilder=begeman rofl... some where there is a Kubota tractor missing an engine... what a shame... john On Mon, 20 Nov 2006, Michael Usher wrote: >-->[ first post ] >--> >-->The Hayes KLR was built for the US Army so that the army could stop shipping >-->gasoline all over the place. >--> >-->Hayes buys KLRs direct from Kawasaki and then modifies them -- new engine, >-->new suspension, and a few strengthened joints (subframe, and handlebar >-->particularly). >--> >-->It's rumoured that the US Army pays a lot more than $19k per bike, and the >-->$19k is supposedly subsidized! >--> >-->There have been many many diesel motorcycles built. Russian made Dnepr >-->motorcycles (a copy of the old BMW R60 design) are often retrofitted with >-->Hatz diesels. There's a registry I found here: >-->http://www.dieselkrad.info/index.php?main=dieselkrad >--> >-->I think it was Universitat Erlangen where they modified a BMW R1150 boxer >-->engine for diesel operation -- basically, they just strengthened the crank >-->and pistons, and fitted a diesel head. In mass production, that's a much >-->cheaper way to go than the Hayes KLR. >--> >-->Small engines from Kubota, Daihatsu, Hatz, Yanmar, etc. are very popular as >-->well. >--> >-->There are quite a few net resources -- search for "diesel motorcycle". >-->Here's another good launching point: >-->http://www.dieselbike.net/ >--> >--> >-->Michael >-->'82 300SD >-->Santa Cruz, CA >--> >-->> -----Original Message----- >-->> From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net >-->> [mailto:owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of john >-->> Sent: Monday, November 20, 2006 12:06 PM >-->> To: ernest breakfield >-->> Cc: diesel-benz-at-digest.net >-->> Subject: Re: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? >-->> >-->> found the price... I could buy a number of vehicles, >-->> engines and build a Diesel fleet >-->> for what they expect! $19K for a motorcycle???? I think >-->> they have been inhaling >-->> too many Diesel fumes or something... this is a far cry from >-->> the $850 NEW price I >-->> paid for my Elsinore in the '70s. :) >-->> >-->> http://thekneeslider.com/archives/2005/11/17/d650a1-bulldog-di >-->> esel-motorcycle-prices-set/ >-->> >-->> PRICE: The Manufacturer.s Suggested Retail Price for the >-->> D650-A1LE Bulldog will be $18,999.00 (the price is subject to >-->> change until the opening of our initial offer to sell and >-->> some restrictions may apply.) A non-refundable deposit of 10% >-->> of the purchase price will be required to hold your bike. The >-->> balance will be due on presentation of documentation and >-->> notice that the unit is ready for shipment. For our >-->> customer.s protection, deposits will be refunded if HDTUSA is >-->> unable to deliver their motorcycle. >-->> >-->> >-->> >-->> john >-->> >-->> On Mon, 20 Nov 2006, ernest breakfield wrote: >-->> >-->> >-->it'll be interesting to see if they ever actually get >-->> these out to where people can buy them (unlike the >-->> >-->folks at Hayes/F1), and what they might sell for... the >-->> prices Hayes/F1 suggested for theirs were absurd. >-->> >--> >-->> >-->www.dieselmotorcycles.com >-->> >-->www.f1engineering.com >-->> >--> >-->> >--> >-->> >-->cheers! >-->> >-->e >-->> >--> >-->> >--> >-->> >-->chuck goolsbee wrote: >-->> >--> >-->> >-->> >-->> -->> commercially-available-diesel-motorcycle/> >-->> >-->> >-->> >-->> For your oil-burning two-wheeled pleasure. >-->> >-->> >-->> >-->> -- >-->> >--> >-->> >-->> ---- >-->> >-->> -------------------------------------------------------------- >-->> ----------- >-->> ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** >-->> Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold >-->> ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** >-->> -------------------------------------------------------------- >-->> ----------- >-->> >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 18:05:04 -0800 From: ernest breakfield Subject: Re: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? jeeze, i hope that weight at least includes the sidecar! and to think that people think my 580 lb. (dry) BMW GS Adventure is hefty! ;-* cheers! e john wrote: > yikes, a 1,200 lb motorcycle!!! and it'll only to 165 klicks??? > http://www.dieselkrad.info/index.php?main=dieselkrad&detail=high&id=59&bilder=neppl > > john [mega-snip] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Nov 2006 19:12:03 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: [db] Diesel Bike! $19k??? I think my KZ400 was around 380 to 400lbs... when that thing was on it's side it took quite a bit to put it back up... made a little goof going home one night in Georgia... decided to take the back road in... calling it a road is, shall we say, optimistic, anyway, I used to do a lot of dirt biking down in Georgia and would go blasting down these sandy, clay trails with the power on, rooster tail, front end light... well, I had a flashback... about the time I hit third gear on that KZ I got to thinking about how much different a street bike is related to things like balance and weight distribution... about that time the thought became a concern which of course became a sudden reality and I found the front tire went right and the rest of the bike went left... I went forward taking the windshield off the fairing as I assumed the tuck and roll position and came up on my feet... shook the sand off of my fatigues and field jacket and walked back to pick up the KJ... thankfully it had a tall sissy bar that allowed me to get the bike back up on two wheels... I think the clutch lever got bent and the turn signals broken... but otherwise it was ok... so when you look at any pictures of that bike you'll understand why the fairing looked that way... oh yeah, I purchased crash bars after that too... Sure wouldn't mind have a Diesel Daktar though... best of both worlds... enduro and Diesel. :) I'm not sure I should get back on a bike though... my brain is prone to write checks my body can't cash any more... :) hmmm... I wonder if my back troubles aren't related to what I used to do on a dirt bike... ah yes, the foolishness of my youth... it was a blast though... flying like that... landings were usually smooth... :) john On Mon, 20 Nov 2006, ernest breakfield wrote: >-->jeeze, i hope that weight at least includes the sidecar! >--> >--> and to think that people think my 580 lb. (dry) BMW GS Adventure is hefty! ;-* >--> >--> >-->cheers! >-->e >--> >--> >-->john wrote: >--> >-->> yikes, a 1,200 lb motorcycle!!! and it'll only to 165 klicks??? >-->> http://www.dieselkrad.info/index.php?main=dieselkrad&detail=high&id=59&bilder=neppl >-->> >-->> john >--> >-->[mega-snip] >--> ---- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ** http://JohnMeister.com **** http://wagoneers.com ** Snohomish, Washington USA - where Jeeps don't rust, they mold ** http://freegift.net *** http://greatcom.org/laws/languages.html ** - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2006 07:58:32 -0500 From: Edward Pomeroy Subject: [db] Chrysler 300C Diesel ... pity only in Europe? http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/autoexpressnews/203928/chrysler_300c.html Just popped up on my Auto Express online subscription. Seems to be only for Europe just now, unless anyone has heard different. If they keep the 300C at the same price level as the current 6 banger gas US vehicle and offer this diesel, I would consider switching to Chrysler again, something I swore I would never do back in 1983 after mypast experiences with the TC,. Horizon and Coronet. Edward ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #2311 **********************************