From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Fri Apr 3 10:43:17 2009 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Friday, April 3 2009 Volume 01 : Number 3035 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: [db] Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels [db] '86 cj-10a [db] Re: fsj: RE: Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels Re: [db] Re: fsj: RE: Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels Re: [db] Re: fsj: RE: Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels [db] QUESTION: can I put a turbo from an SD33T on an SD33? Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 11:32:17 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: [db] Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels what years, and motors are the options, and which would be the best... I would think that an EOD could be swapped for the C6, right? kind of like a TH400 replacing a 700R4. This is just a thought... have an '83 J10 stepside, a Ford C6 and NP205... the tug is doing ok, but very underpowered, of course we all knew that... the key is economy, if it's economical, who cares about the power? traffic is the great leveler... ;) can't use power if you're bumper to bumper... :) john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 http://creationwiki.org http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Wed, 1 Apr 2009, Jim Blair wrote: # # Re: fsj: RE: [db] trans question # Posted by: "Jim Blair" carnuck-at-hotmail.com carnuck # Date: Tue Mar 31, 2009 10:07 pm ((PDT)) # # # # They are both great motors, but the starters can be a pain. The Mitsubishi one is better than the regular Ford one, but expen$ive to fix (-at-$200 for a 3 year version) # # # Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 # # # # # # # ---------------------------------------- # > Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:59:32 -0700 # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com # > To: jslash-at-sbcglobal.net # > CC: fsj-at-digest.net; diesel-benz-at-digest.net # > Subject: fsj: RE: [db] trans question # > # > that opens some options... what's your though on those Diesels? # > # > how heavy are they? # > # > john # _________________________________________________________________ # Rediscover Hotmail.: Now available on your iPhone or BlackBerry # http://windowslive.com/RediscoverHotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Rediscover_Mobi le1_042009 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 12:03:35 -0700 (PDT) From: diesel john Subject: [db] '86 cj-10a http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/1986-CJ10A/2009_Apr_01_Seats-Spacers-Battery-snow/ALL.html making progress... (was out for over a week with Alder pollen allergies, getting my energy back... :) - - power leather WJ driver's seat installed - ahhhhh, lumbar support... love it... (used passenger side base, in center front bent the tab to clear hump, used an L-bracket on door side front, used existing hole, in the rear had to add about 4 fender washers on door side) - - new battery - the PO used a les schwab group 24 (600CA), installed an interstate group 34 (800ca) - - added 1.5" spacers to rear axle to clear bed supports - was rubbing inside, pass side (used '89 GW rear springs, flipped toward the back for a 92" Wheelbase) (used '87 GW Dana 44 axles, 3.31 gears) - - added smittybilt security console and kenwood stereo, used jensen 3-way surface mounts behind the seats, and 5.25" in dash. - - swapped out the hour meter for an Autometer clock http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/1986-CJ10A/2009_Apr_01_Seats-Spacers-Battery-snow/ALL.html it was(is?) snowing this morning... April 1! not sticking because the tug is 4x4 capable now... ;) earlier had upgraded the wipers for a larger wiping range, also shows some of the seatup of the seats, stereo and console, and work on the dash: (still need three of those #58 lamp holders) http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/1986-CJ10A/2009_Mar_28-wiper-console-dash/ALL.html next on the project list: - - setup the CJ-2a tailgate - - finish receiver hitch support setup for barrel lift - - toolbox in bed - - aux lighting john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 http://creationwiki.org http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 12:05:23 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: [db] Re: fsj: RE: Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels thanx! like the picture of the "intellidog" as well... I have access to another 6.2L Diesel as well... what's the weight differences between the 6.2s and the 6.9/7.3? any advantage/disadvantages? the 4BT is also something to consider, along with a Mercedes 2.5 or 3.0L Turbo Diesel... john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 http://creationwiki.org http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Wed, 1 Apr 2009, Tesar Landon-R16884 wrote: # John, I liked this page... # # http://www.intellidog.com/dieselmann/idi.htm # # Seems somewhere in the middle, early 90's had a combination of early # simplicity, and working out the bugs. I've been told to stay away from # the early turbo versions, but don't expect much power from the NA # versions. # # - Landon # # -----Original Message----- # From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of # john # Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2009 1:32 PM # To: Jim Blair # Cc: full size jeep list; diesel-benz list # Subject: fsj: Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels # # what years, and motors are the options, and which would # be the best... # # I would think that an EOD could be swapped for the C6, right? # kind of like a TH400 replacing a 700R4. # # This is just a thought... have an '83 J10 stepside, a Ford C6 and # NP205... # # the tug is doing ok, but very underpowered, of course we all knew # that... # the key is economy, if it's economical, who cares about the power? # traffic # is the great leveler... ;) can't use power if you're bumper to # bumper... :) # # john # # ----- # ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 http://creationwiki.org # http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us # ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # # # On Wed, 1 Apr 2009, Jim Blair wrote: # # # # # Re: fsj: RE: [db] trans question # # Posted by: "Jim Blair" carnuck-at-hotmail.com carnuck # # Date: Tue Mar 31, 2009 10:07 pm ((PDT)) # # # # # # # # They are both great motors, but the starters can be a pain. The # Mitsubishi # one is better than the regular Ford one, but expen$ive to fix (-at-$200 for # a 3 # year version) # # # # # # Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 # # # # # # # # # # # # # # ---------------------------------------- # # > Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:59:32 -0700 # # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com # # > To: jslash-at-sbcglobal.net # # > CC: fsj-at-digest.net; diesel-benz-at-digest.net # # > Subject: fsj: RE: [db] trans question # # > # # > that opens some options... what's your though on those Diesels? # # > # # > how heavy are they? # # > # # > john # # _________________________________________________________________ # # Rediscover Hotmail.: Now available on your iPhone or BlackBerry # # # http://windowslive.com/RediscoverHotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Rediscover # _Mobi # le1_042009 # ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 13:10:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Hoffman Subject: Re: [db] Re: fsj: RE: Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels Well, I'm pretty sure the 6Bt Cummins is just over 1000lbs. I recently saw that the Navistar 6.0l PowerStroke replacement for the 7.3l is just over 1000lbs also. So my guess is that the 6.9 and 7.3 IDIs would be around the same weight. I've Googled for actual weights but have not come up with anything. But I think it's safe to say that the GM engine is quite a bit lighter. I think the 4Bt Cummins is around 700lbs. Jim - --- On Wed, 4/1/09, john wrote: > From: john > Subject: [db] Re: fsj: RE: Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels > To: "Tesar Landon-R16884" > Cc: "Jim Blair" , "full size jeep list" , "diesel-benz list" > Date: Wednesday, April 1, 2009, 2:05 PM > thanx! > > like the picture of the "intellidog" as well... > > I have access to another 6.2L Diesel as well... > > what's the weight differences between the 6.2s and the > 6.9/7.3? > > any advantage/disadvantages? > > the 4BT is also something to consider, along with a > Mercedes 2.5 or 3.0L Turbo Diesel... > > john > > ----- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't > rust, they mold > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 > http://creationwiki.org > http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com > http://fotomeister.us > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > On Wed, 1 Apr 2009, Tesar Landon-R16884 wrote: > > # John, I liked this page... > # > # http://www.intellidog.com/dieselmann/idi.htm > # > # Seems somewhere in the middle, early 90's had a > combination of early > # simplicity, and working out the bugs. I've been > told to stay away from > # the early turbo versions, but don't expect much > power from the NA > # versions. > # > # - Landon > # > # -----Original Message----- > # From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] > On Behalf Of > # john > # Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2009 1:32 PM > # To: Jim Blair > # Cc: full size jeep list; diesel-benz list > # Subject: fsj: Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels > # > # what years, and motors are the options, and which would > # be the best... > # > # I would think that an EOD could be swapped for the C6, > right? > # kind of like a TH400 replacing a 700R4. > # > # This is just a thought... have an '83 J10 stepside, > a Ford C6 and > # NP205... > # > # the tug is doing ok, but very underpowered, of course we > all knew > # that... > # the key is economy, if it's economical, who cares > about the power? > # traffic > # is the great leveler... ;) can't use power if > you're bumper to > # bumper... :) > # > # john > # > # ----- > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps > don't rust, they mold > # http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 > http://creationwiki.org > # http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com > http://fotomeister.us > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > # > # On Wed, 1 Apr 2009, Jim Blair wrote: > # > # # > # # Re: fsj: RE: [db] trans question > # # Posted by: "Jim Blair" > carnuck-at-hotmail.com carnuck > # # Date: Tue Mar 31, 2009 10:07 pm ((PDT)) > # # > # # > # # > # # They are both great motors, but the starters can be a > pain. The > # Mitsubishi > # one is better than the regular Ford one, but expen$ive > to fix (-at-$200 for > # a 3 > # year version) > # # > # # > # # Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 > Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 > # # > # # > # # > # # > # # > # # > # # ---------------------------------------- > # # > Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:59:32 -0700 > # # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com > # # > To: jslash-at-sbcglobal.net > # # > CC: fsj-at-digest.net; diesel-benz-at-digest.net > # # > Subject: fsj: RE: [db] trans question > # # > > # # > that opens some options... what's your > though on those Diesels? > # # > > # # > how heavy are they? > # # > > # # > john > # # > _________________________________________________________________ > # # Rediscover Hotmail.: Now available on your iPhone or > BlackBerry > # # > # > http://windowslive.com/RediscoverHotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Rediscover > # _Mobi > # le1_042009 > # ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Apr 2009 13:36:34 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] Re: fsj: RE: Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels the 6.2 is 650 lbs. interestingly enough, the 3.3L Nissan is 672 lbs... it's a dry sleeve engine... I'll have to listen to Joe's 4BT a few more times to decide if I want to go that way in my J10. :) Just bled the injectors (again) over at Startups in Everett, seemed to run better... man, bad fuel can make life miserable... I should have gotten that stuff out of the tank as soon as I saw it... john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 http://creationwiki.org http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Wed, 1 Apr 2009, Jim Hoffman wrote: # Well, I'm pretty sure the 6Bt Cummins is just over 1000lbs. I # recently saw that the Navistar 6.0l PowerStroke replacement for # the 7.3l is just over 1000lbs also. So my guess is that the 6.9 # and 7.3 IDIs would be around the same weight. I've Googled for # actual weights but have not come up with anything. But I think # it's safe to say that the GM engine is quite a bit lighter. I # think the 4Bt Cummins is around 700lbs. # # Jim # # --- On Wed, 4/1/09, john wrote: # # > From: john # > Subject: [db] Re: fsj: RE: Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels # > To: "Tesar Landon-R16884" # > Cc: "Jim Blair" , "full size jeep list" , "diesel-benz list" # > Date: Wednesday, April 1, 2009, 2:05 PM # > thanx! # > # > like the picture of the "intellidog" as well... # > # > I have access to another 6.2L Diesel as well... # > # > what's the weight differences between the 6.2s and the # > 6.9/7.3? # > # > any advantage/disadvantages? # > # > the 4BT is also something to consider, along with a # > Mercedes 2.5 or 3.0L Turbo Diesel... # > # > john # > # > ----- # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't # > rust, they mold # > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 # > http://creationwiki.org # > http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com # > http://fotomeister.us # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # > # > On Wed, 1 Apr 2009, Tesar Landon-R16884 wrote: # > # > # John, I liked this page... # > # # > # http://www.intellidog.com/dieselmann/idi.htm # > # # > # Seems somewhere in the middle, early 90's had a # > combination of early # > # simplicity, and working out the bugs. I've been # > told to stay away from # > # the early turbo versions, but don't expect much # > power from the NA # > # versions. # > # # > # - Landon # > # # > # -----Original Message----- # > # From: owner-fsj-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj-at-digest.net] # > On Behalf Of # > # john # > # Sent: Wednesday, April 01, 2009 1:32 PM # > # To: Jim Blair # > # Cc: full size jeep list; diesel-benz list # > # Subject: fsj: Ford 6.9 and 7.3 Diesels # > # # > # what years, and motors are the options, and which would # > # be the best... # > # # > # I would think that an EOD could be swapped for the C6, # > right? # > # kind of like a TH400 replacing a 700R4. # > # # > # This is just a thought... have an '83 J10 stepside, # > a Ford C6 and # > # NP205... # > # # > # the tug is doing ok, but very underpowered, of course we # > all knew # > # that... # > # the key is economy, if it's economical, who cares # > about the power? # > # traffic # > # is the great leveler... ;) can't use power if # > you're bumper to # > # bumper... :) # > # # > # john # > # # > # ----- # > # # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps # > don't rust, they mold # > # http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 # > http://creationwiki.org # > # http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com # > http://fotomeister.us # > # # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # # > # # > # On Wed, 1 Apr 2009, Jim Blair wrote: # > # # > # # # > # # Re: fsj: RE: [db] trans question # > # # Posted by: "Jim Blair" # > carnuck-at-hotmail.com carnuck # > # # Date: Tue Mar 31, 2009 10:07 pm ((PDT)) # > # # # > # # # > # # # > # # They are both great motors, but the starters can be a # > pain. The # > # Mitsubishi # > # one is better than the regular Ford one, but expen$ive # > to fix (-at-$200 for # > # a 3 # > # year version) # > # # # > # # # > # # Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 # > Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 # > # # # > # # # > # # # > # # # > # # # > # # # > # # ---------------------------------------- # > # # > Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:59:32 -0700 # > # # > From: john-at-wagoneers.com # > # # > To: jslash-at-sbcglobal.net # > # # > CC: fsj-at-digest.net; diesel-benz-at-digest.net # > # # > Subject: fsj: RE: [db] trans question # > # # > # > # # > that opens some options... what's your # > though on those Diesels? # > # # > # > # # > how heavy are they? # > # # > # > # # > john # > # # # > _________________________________________________________________ # > # # Rediscover Hotmail.: Now available on your iPhone or # > BlackBerry # > # # # > # # > http://windowslive.com/RediscoverHotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Rediscover # > # _Mobi # > # le1_042009 # > # # ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Apr 2009 10:42:21 -0700 (PDT) From: diesel john Subject: [db] QUESTION: can I put a turbo from an SD33T on an SD33? I've got a 1986 CJ-10A with the factory installed Nissan SD33 non-turbo... (link to current pictures below) I found a used SD33T out of an '80 Scout... Question is could I take the turbo setup off of the SD33T and put it on my SD33? It's a great deal on the used engine, but will need to take some time off work, hitch up the trailer to the WJ and head over the mountains to retrieve it... it's a long shot, the guy bought it as a package with a bunch of other Scout parts, but never ran it... I'm thinking fine, the engine is an unknown... will just swap the intake/exhaust/turbo and put it on my SD33. Will I need to swap the injectors/pump as well? I'm hoping I can simply put the turbo on my SD33... At least until after my daughter's wedding in August... or until my '83 J10 Stepside comes home... with all the running around we're doing for the wedding having the '91 300D and the '86 CJ-10A running about on bioDiesel saves us a lot more money than switching car insurance. ;) Anyway, I'm not planning on hauling heavy loads or towing so I won't really be putting the engine under extreme stress... I know with the Mercedes Diesels there are a number of differences in the engine between the turbo and non-turbo versions and it's not recommended to just slap one on them... but with the Nissan SD33 I'm not sure it's any where near its design limits in normal use and eeking another 20hp out of that engine would likely not overstress it... The engine is pretty industrial... it's like driving a fork lift on the freeway... :) With the 3.31's and 235s I can easily cruise at 60mph, at least on level road... :) If I put the turbo on my low mileage SD33 and it tanks, well, I'll swap that engine out for the one that came with the turbo... if it works, I save myself the trouble of an engine swap... if it fails, well, I will have an interesting story... and maybe some cool pictures... and possibly a tow bill... ;) thoughts? is putting the turbo setup on the SD33 a sure fire recipe for disaster, or will it give my tug a bit more oomph so I can get closer to the speed limit on some of the local hills? :) How much will I need to swap over? This works this will be a weekend upgrade... After my bad fuel episode I've bled the lines a few times and it's getting better... engine is still a little rough, indicating I still have a small amount of air in the system... or an injector that isn't happy with me for trying to make it run on water. I should have drained that fuel when I realized it looked more like chocolate milk than Diesel. :) Does anyone know what the differences are between the SD33 and SD33T regarding the injectors/pump? The air filters and oil filters are the same... this engine is elegant in its simplicity... in many ways it's like the Mercedes Diesels... and in some ways better... here's some info I've found on these engines: http://wagoneers.com/JEEPS/CJ-10A-misc/633graph.gif http://wagoneers.com/JEEPS/CJ-10A-misc/6NissanSD33T2.jpg thanx! john CURRENT PICTURES OF THE TUG PROJECT: http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/1986-CJ10A/2009_Apr_02_dreamlifter-n-tug/ http://wagoneers.com/FSJ/rigs/1986-CJ10A/2009_Apr_01_Seats-Spacers-Battery-snow/ALL.html ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 http://creationwiki.org http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Thu, 2 Apr 2009, Jim Blair wrote: # # The year of 7.3 I would go for would be pre '93 as they went computer controlled after that. (6.9 didn't get the computer) A turbo Nissan 3.3 would be a lot better # # Jim Blair, Lynnwood, WA '87 Comanche, '83 Jeep J10, '84 Jeep J10 # # # > the tug is doing ok, but very underpowered, of course we all knew that... # > the key is economy, if it's economical, who cares about the power? traffic # > is the great leveler... ;) can't use power if you're bumper to bumper... :) # > # > john ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #3035 **********************************