From owner-diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Sat Jul 4 12:51:18 2009 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Saturday, July 4 2009 Volume 01 : Number 3104 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [db] ABS light on RE: [db] ABS light on Re: [db] ABS light on Re: [db] ABS light on Re: [db] ABS light on Re: [db] ABS light on [db] overvoltage info [db] Diesel generator! Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest-at-digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request-at-digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 18:43:57 -0400 From: Edward Pomeroy Subject: Re: [db] ABS light on Thanks to all who chimed in. I have since driven 70 miles and had the following interesting adventures which I chalk up to Rube Goldberg and not chance. 1) The Cruise control now works as it did before. The ABS light is on. 2) The Tach does not work when ABS light is on. 3) On one startup, the ABS light stayed off, the tach worked and engine RPM was at what I considered more normal, about 700 rpm. Light came on, engine made that popping noise once, and RPM dropped by about 100. 4) The darned transmission seems to shift better when the ABS light is ON!? 5) Investigating all the Benz boards, this seems to be a common problem with many models, all use the same gadget called the OVP relay, over voltage protection. The fuse on the top of mine is OK, so the consensus on the boards is that the relay is bad. Relays have known cold solder joint problems or broken trace problems. New one runs about 60 bucks. I captured a schematic from the web, can't attach it to this message but will send it to John as a direct e-mail. Quality not good, but enough to convince me that I have a bad relay and it is sitting in the middle of a lot of stuff that can affect the transmission shifting, the tach and the hot/cold weather control on the engine. I plan to remove the battery, gain access to the compartment behind it and extract the offending relay. Will open the can and check the traces and solder joints first. If that fixes it great, if not, looks like I may be out another 70 bucks or so. That be it for today, heading to dinner with SWMBO as son has decided hanging with friends and watching the fireworks is more hip. Edward john wrote: > my abs light has come on a few times... but > when it the car has been turned off and back on > it goes off. > > check the abs fuse. sounds like something > failed.... if you have diagrams or > circuits please share, it is certain > other 124 owners await the same fate. > > I can look at the e-series book when I > get home. > > > > ----- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 http://creationwiki.org > http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > On Fri, 3 Jul 2009, Edward Pomeroy wrote: > > # Fellow listers - may I pick your combined > # knowledge on the 300D and on the ABS light. > # > # I was stopped at a light, there was a light thump, > # almost like a backfire, then the engine RPM > # dropped ever so slightly and the ABS light came > # on. > # > # Got home, can't find anything visually wrong with > # the beast, all fluids OK, no leaks, no visible > # disconnected lines. Car idles normal as far as I > # can tell. > # > # ABS light comes back on and stays on after > # shutdown and restart. Am going to look at the > # circuit that triggers this warning, but want to > # know if anyone has had this issue. > # > # Totally dry pavement and on a straight road up to > # that stoplight. > # > # Thanks, > # Edward > # ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 17:54:18 -0500 From: "Alec Cordova" Subject: RE: [db] ABS light on Be sure to double check the fuse when you have better access to the OVP. It's easy for all these Benz fuses to hide a break. Alec > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel- > benz-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Edward Pomeroy > Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 5:44 PM > To: john > Cc: Benz List > Subject: Re: [db] ABS light on > > Thanks to all who chimed in. I have since driven 70 miles and had the > following interesting adventures which I chalk up to Rube Goldberg and > not chance. > 1) The Cruise control now works as it did before. The ABS light is on. > 2) The Tach does not work when ABS light is on. > 3) On one startup, the ABS light stayed off, the tach worked and engine > RPM was at what I considered more normal, about 700 rpm. Light came > on, > engine made that popping noise once, and RPM dropped by about 100. > 4) The darned transmission seems to shift better when the ABS light is > ON!? > 5) Investigating all the Benz boards, this seems to be a common problem > with many models, all use the same gadget called the OVP relay, over > voltage protection. > The fuse on the top of mine is OK, so the consensus on the boards > is > that the relay is bad. > Relays have known cold solder joint problems or broken trace > problems. > New one runs about 60 bucks. > > I captured a schematic from the web, can't attach it to this message > but > will send it to John as a direct e-mail. Quality not good, but enough > to > convince me that I have a bad relay and it is sitting in the middle of > a > lot of stuff that can affect the transmission shifting, the tach and > the > hot/cold weather control on the engine. > > I plan to remove the battery, gain access to the compartment behind it > and extract the offending relay. Will open the can and check the traces > and solder joints first. If that fixes it great, if not, looks like I > may be out another 70 bucks or so. > > That be it for today, heading to dinner with SWMBO as son has decided > hanging with friends and watching the fireworks is more hip. > > Edward > > john wrote: > > my abs light has come on a few times... but > > when it the car has been turned off and back on > > it goes off. > > > > check the abs fuse. sounds like something > > failed.... if you have diagrams or > > circuits please share, it is certain > > other 124 owners await the same fate. > > > > I can look at the e-series book when I > > get home. > > > > > > > > ----- > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- > > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 http://creationwiki.org > > http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- > > > > > > On Fri, 3 Jul 2009, Edward Pomeroy wrote: > > > > # Fellow listers - may I pick your combined > > # knowledge on the 300D and on the ABS light. > > # > > # I was stopped at a light, there was a light thump, > > # almost like a backfire, then the engine RPM > > # dropped ever so slightly and the ABS light came > > # on. > > # > > # Got home, can't find anything visually wrong with > > # the beast, all fluids OK, no leaks, no visible > > # disconnected lines. Car idles normal as far as I > > # can tell. > > # > > # ABS light comes back on and stays on after > > # shutdown and restart. Am going to look at the > > # circuit that triggers this warning, but want to > > # know if anyone has had this issue. > > # > > # Totally dry pavement and on a straight road up to > > # that stoplight. > > # > > # Thanks, > > # Edward > > # ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 20:18:02 -0400 From: Edward Pomeroy Subject: Re: [db] ABS light on Thanks Alec. Believe it or not, this silly OVP relay uses a standard US/GM type knife fuse and it is solid visually. I have noticed that VW now uses them as well and Volvo has for a long time as well. If Benz had used these for all circuits their shop workload would drop, which is why I think they don't or maybe they do now, have not looked at any Benz more modern than 1993 ;-) I will check it again with a meter, but I think either the connector under the relay is loose or I have a bad relay, it is now working intermittently. Spotted a guy running around town in a bright green Unimog, 2 seater with canvas cab covers, if I had to guess, 60's vintage. If I spot him again I will try to get some photos. Edward Alec Cordova wrote: > Be sure to double check the fuse when you have better access to the OVP. > It's easy for all these Benz fuses to hide a break. > > Alec > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: owner-diesel-benz-at-digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel- >> benz-at-digest.net] On Behalf Of Edward Pomeroy >> Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 5:44 PM >> To: john >> Cc: Benz List >> Subject: Re: [db] ABS light on >> >> Thanks to all who chimed in. I have since driven 70 miles and had the >> following interesting adventures which I chalk up to Rube Goldberg and >> not chance. >> 1) The Cruise control now works as it did before. The ABS light is on. >> 2) The Tach does not work when ABS light is on. >> 3) On one startup, the ABS light stayed off, the tach worked and engine >> RPM was at what I considered more normal, about 700 rpm. Light came >> on, >> engine made that popping noise once, and RPM dropped by about 100. >> 4) The darned transmission seems to shift better when the ABS light is >> ON!? >> 5) Investigating all the Benz boards, this seems to be a common problem >> with many models, all use the same gadget called the OVP relay, over >> voltage protection. >> The fuse on the top of mine is OK, so the consensus on the boards >> is >> that the relay is bad. >> Relays have known cold solder joint problems or broken trace >> problems. >> New one runs about 60 bucks. >> >> I captured a schematic from the web, can't attach it to this message >> but >> will send it to John as a direct e-mail. Quality not good, but enough >> to >> convince me that I have a bad relay and it is sitting in the middle of >> a >> lot of stuff that can affect the transmission shifting, the tach and >> the >> hot/cold weather control on the engine. >> >> I plan to remove the battery, gain access to the compartment behind it >> and extract the offending relay. Will open the can and check the traces >> and solder joints first. If that fixes it great, if not, looks like I >> may be out another 70 bucks or so. >> >> That be it for today, heading to dinner with SWMBO as son has decided >> hanging with friends and watching the fireworks is more hip. >> >> Edward >> >> john wrote: >> >>> my abs light has come on a few times... but >>> when it the car has been turned off and back on >>> it goes off. >>> >>> check the abs fuse. sounds like something >>> failed.... if you have diagrams or >>> circuits please share, it is certain >>> other 124 owners await the same fate. >>> >>> I can look at the e-series book when I >>> get home. >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >> --- >> >>> Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold >>> http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 http://creationwiki.org >>> http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us >>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >> --- >> >>> On Fri, 3 Jul 2009, Edward Pomeroy wrote: >>> >>> # Fellow listers - may I pick your combined >>> # knowledge on the 300D and on the ABS light. >>> # >>> # I was stopped at a light, there was a light thump, >>> # almost like a backfire, then the engine RPM >>> # dropped ever so slightly and the ABS light came >>> # on. >>> # >>> # Got home, can't find anything visually wrong with >>> # the beast, all fluids OK, no leaks, no visible >>> # disconnected lines. Car idles normal as far as I >>> # can tell. >>> # >>> # ABS light comes back on and stays on after >>> # shutdown and restart. Am going to look at the >>> # circuit that triggers this warning, but want to >>> # know if anyone has had this issue. >>> # >>> # Totally dry pavement and on a straight road up to >>> # that stoplight. >>> # >>> # Thanks, >>> # Edward >>> # ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 20:55:34 -0400 From: Edward Pomeroy Subject: Re: [db] ABS light on http://www.partsgeek.com Vehicle: 1988 Mercedes 420SEL Overload Relay Aluminum cover with bracket : contains (2) 10 amp ATC fuses on top . APA W0133-1618613 $52.95 $52.95 Fits these Vehicles * 1988-1989 Mercedes Benz 190D * 1987-1993 Mercedes Benz 190E * 1988-1989 Mercedes Benz 260E * 1988-1992 Mercedes Benz 300CE * 1990-1993 Mercedes Benz 300D * 1988-1993 Mercedes Benz 300E * 1988-1991 Mercedes Benz 300SE * 1988-1991 Mercedes Benz 300SEL * 1990-1993 Mercedes Benz 300SL * 1988-1993 Mercedes Benz 300TE * 1991-1991 Mercedes Benz 350SD * 1990-1991 Mercedes Benz 350SDL * 1988-1991 Mercedes Benz 420SEL * 1990-1993 Mercedes Benz 500SL * 1988-1991 Mercedes Benz 560SEC * 1988-1991 Mercedes Benz 560SEL * 1988-1989 Mercedes Benz 560SL * 1995-1995 Mercedes Benz E300 * 1994-1995 Mercedes Benz SL500 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 19:45:13 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] ABS light on I hope that fixes it, I replaced mine with no change, different problem though. ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 http://creationwiki.org http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Fri, 3 Jul 2009, Edward Pomeroy wrote: # Thanks to all who chimed in. I have since driven # 70 miles and had the following interesting # adventures which I chalk up to Rube Goldberg and # not chance. # 1) The Cruise control now works as it did before. # The ABS light is on. # 2) The Tach does not work when ABS light is on. # 3) On one startup, the ABS light stayed off, the # tach worked and engine RPM was at what I # considered more normal, about 700 rpm. Light came # on, engine made that popping noise once, and RPM # dropped by about 100. # 4) The darned transmission seems to shift better # when the ABS light is ON!? # 5) Investigating all the Benz boards, this seems # to be a common problem with many models, all use # the same gadget called the OVP relay, over voltage # protection. # The fuse on the top of mine is OK, so the # consensus on the boards is that the relay is bad. # Relays have known cold solder joint problems or # broken trace problems. # New one runs about 60 bucks. # # I captured a schematic from the web, can't attach # it to this message but will send it to John as a # direct e-mail. Quality not good, but enough to # convince me that I have a bad relay and it is # sitting in the middle of a lot of stuff that can # affect the transmission shifting, the tach and the # hot/cold weather control on the engine. # # I plan to remove the battery, gain access to the # compartment behind it and extract the offending # relay. Will open the can and check the traces and # solder joints first. If that fixes it great, if # not, looks like I may be out another 70 bucks or # so. # # That be it for today, heading to dinner with SWMBO # as son has decided hanging with friends and # watching the fireworks is more hip. # # Edward # # john wrote: # > my abs light has come on a few times... but # > when it the car has been turned off and back on # > it goes off. # > # > check the abs fuse. sounds like something # > failed.... if you have diagrams or # > circuits please share, it is certain # > other 124 owners await the same fate. # > # > I can look at the e-series book when I # > get home. # > # > # > # > ----- # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps # > don't rust, they mold # > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 # > http:http://creationwiki.org # > http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com # > http:http://fotomeister.us # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # > # > On Fri, 3 Jul 2009, Edward Pomeroy wrote: # > # > # Fellow listers - may I pick your combined # > # knowledge on the 300D and on the ABS light. # > # # > # I was stopped at a light, there was a light # > # thump, # > # almost like a backfire, then the engine RPM # > # dropped ever so slightly and the ABS light # > # came # > # on. # > # # > # Got home, can't find anything visually wrong # > # with # > # the beast, all fluids OK, no leaks, no visible # > # disconnected lines. Car idles normal as far as # > # I # > # can tell. # > # # > # ABS light comes back on and stays on after # > # shutdown and restart. Am going to look at the # > # circuit that triggers this warning, but want # > # to # > # know if anyone has had this issue. # > # # > # Totally dry pavement and on a straight road up # > # to # > # that stoplight. # > # # > # Thanks, # > # Edward # > # # > # > # # ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 03 Jul 2009 22:59:44 -0400 From: Mike Frank Subject: Re: [db] ABS light on I had all the same symptoms, intermittently, until I replaced my overvoltage relay. I disassembled the old one, and could find no obvious damage. I guess the diode just gets weak. Mike Frank ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 23:20:09 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: [db] overvoltage info http://wagoneers.com/DieselBenz/TECH/Overvoltage-Relay/ stuck a couple pdf's up there that might help as well, shows relay locations and a few other electrical items... john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 http://creationwiki.org http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2009 12:50:51 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: [db] Diesel generator! thanx jim blair... grabbed that Diesel generator you sent me the link to. the guy is a commercial electrician, out of work, needed the space in his garage and money for fireworks... whoo hooo... :) It's about the same output as that gas one I have, but Diesel is way cooler... :) john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 http://creationwiki.org http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #3104 **********************************