From owner-diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Sat May 15 22:48:00 2010 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Sunday, May 16 2010 Volume 01 : Number 3283 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: [db] Re: ComputerWorld - Car hackers can kill brakes, engine, and more (fwd) Re: [db] ComputerWorld - Car hackers can kill brakes, engine, and more (fwd) [db] administrivia: notes on using this list [db] No..nuts...I couldn't do it.... [db] Mercedes Benz 170 SD 1955 Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request@digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 14 May 2010 11:35:15 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: [db] Re: ComputerWorld - Car hackers can kill brakes, engine, and more (fwd) I recall reading about the bus/brake issues... this is the same kind of problem that microsoft faces... they don't optimize their code when compiling, if it is ever compiled... they leave the functions in place for future changes and convenience... and there is a trade-off between convenience and security... http://johnmeister.com/CS/LINUX/Linux_philosophy.html aerospace has had to deal with these issues for years... the auto industry should look at the solutions required by the FAA... of course scarebus has the same philosophy as microsoft with their controls... the computer has the last say, and not the pilot, which is absolutely wrong and dangerous... toyota is making the same mistake... let the driver decide if he wants to shut the car off or shift into neutral when driving... give warnings, but give the driver the option... better to blame an accident on driver error than to do the "correct" thing and have the driver become a dark spot on the road... ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para bellum http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Fri, 14 May 2010, Ed Kummel wrote: I remember several years ago, reading an article where Toyota was celebrating their new "Drive-by-wire" system and was testing it in Tokyo with several transit buses. Several weeks after reading this article, I saw another article where a Tokyo city bus ran out of control and crashed into a bus stop injuring many people. They investigated and found that the control systems in the buses drive-by-wire were being interfered with by a person with an illegal CB radio. The Radio had a power booster on it so Toyota claimed that this was the main reason why it was affecting their systems. They remedied it by using fiber-optics to connect critical systems to the computer and increased the RF shielding around the sensors and computers. This just goes to show, no matter how much you plan, there is *always* something you didn't catch and that will invariably be the cause of whatever troubles you have. Hence the Toyota issues they are having now. I don't doubt for a minute that these Toyota vehicles are exhibiting issue. It's inevitable! (there was another issue with Lexus's in Japan locking people out of their vehicles. Turns out that Nokia didn't lock down their BlueTooth transmitters on their cellphones and a hacker used the Nokia as a delivery vehicle for a virus targeted specifically at vehicles using Java as the onboard OS. Of course, this included the Lexus. Once a person with a Nokia phone carrying the virus got in range of a Lexus, the virus would connect to the vehicle via bluetooth and drop it's payload into the Java OS. The virus would then reprogram all the customizations that the vehicle owner had set up, including the the remote key system...that caused a bunch of trouble!) Then, just recently, a disgruntled car sales employee acquired the password for the Onstar styled vehicle control system at the dealership and proceeded to make dozens of cars horns honk and lights flash. Imagine if one of these vehicles were traveling down the interstate at 70mph driven by a soccer mom and a half a dozen children! The fright alone would cause an accident. Ed web/gadget guru ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --- On Fri, 5/14/10, john wrote: From: john Subject: xj: ComputerWorld - Car hackers can kill brakes, engine, and more Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 1:58 PM http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9176778/Car_hackers_can_kill_brakes_engine_and_more?source=CTWNLE_nlt_dailyam_2010-05-14 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 14 May 2010 13:54:08 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] ComputerWorld - Car hackers can kill brakes, engine, and more (fwd) well, we also had that big blackout on the east coast when msblaster hit... ...those nuclear power plants were controlled by windows... or at least the network they were on was impacted... either way, windows caused the lights to go out. ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para bellum http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Fri, 14 May 2010, Renaud (Ron) OLGIATI wrote: # On Friday 14 May 2010, my mailbox was graced by a missive # from john who wrote: # # > ...not exactly a likely scenario, but still makes me happy to drive an # > older vehicle... :) # # Nothing new; remember how in 1991 or thereabout the USN Yorktown's main # engines went down for nearly three hours because Windows NT (used against the # wishes of Navy top brass for engine control) choked on a "divide by zero" # instruction ? # # Cheers, # # Ron. # ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 May 2010 05:45:01 +0000 From: Richard Welty Subject: [db] administrivia: notes on using this list Digest.Net mailing list "Meta FAQ" These general notes on using Digest.Net mailing lists are posted on the 1st and 15th of each month. This file may be found on the web at http://www.digest.net/general-notes.txt [last revised 5/1/02; removed list of spam strings, as i'm not the only one filtering on them -- rpw] Additional information on Digest.Net's spam policies may be found at http://www.digest.net/email-policy.html and http://www.digest.net/blocked.html Table of Contents 1. Why don't my postings go through? 2. Why can't I unsubscribe? 3. How do I post to the list? 4. Where are the archives? 5. What other lists are on digest.net? 6. Is there a web subscription form? 7. Why not move the lists to someplace like (egroups, topica,...)? 8. How do I contact the server adminstrator in an emergency? 9. What is Krusty Motorsports, anyway? The Meta-FAQ 1. Why don't my postings go through? There are several things that may interfere with postings making it to the list. a) Are you a member? Some read the ftp archives rather than receiving the list in email. Persons who read the list via email are automatically members, but readers of the FTP archive are not, and need to contact me (rwelty@krusty-motorsports.com) and get your name added to the list of "permitted senders". b) has your email address changed? some of you have had changes in your email address. your old address still works, and is still on the list, but your From: line shows a new address. this can happen for various reasons; you may have changed jobs or ISPs, and left a forward in place, or your IT staff may have fiddled with the email system. you will need to unsubscribe your old email address and subscribe the new one. this may require my involvement, if you can't figure out a way to get your old address off the list using the conventional majordomo commands. you can use the majordomo "which" command to probe for old addresses. send a message to majordomo@digest.net with one or more which commands in the body, one per line. to check for potential addresses for Fred Flinstone, formerly of bedrock.org, the following commands can be sent: which flintstone which bedrock note that the matches above might return any of the following addresses, if they appear in the list (in other words, you can use vagueness and incompleteness in your recollection as a tool): Fred.Flinstone@bedrock.org fflinstone@wilma.bedrock.org flintstonef@bedrock.com c) do you have more than one email address? if so, only the subscribed addresses can post, unless you contact me (see 1.a) above for relevant information) d) are you using (intentionally or accidentially) special "features" of your mail client? [this section is no longer operative, as the demime software now strips html, attachments, rich text format, etc. from postings automatically.] e) are your posts too large? there is a 10,000 character limit on posting sizes; this is done for various reasons. you can always split up large postings to get mail through. f) are you including majordomo commands at the start of your message? administrivia control is turned on; this is a trap for things like "unsubscribe" at the start of a message. try to avoid obvious majordomo commands in the subject and the first 10 lines, or misspell them in obvious ways (e.g. unzubscribe, 1ndex, h3lp, g3t, etc.) g) are you triggering spam traps? some things are red flags; for example, many phrases found commonly in spam are automatically blocked. h) are you using "funky" character sets? [7 bit restriction lifted experimentally on 8/2/00 -- film at 11] unfortunately, there are "issues" if i permit any character set other than old fashioned 7 level ASCII; therefore, you need to avoid national character sets that include various accents, umlauts, national currency characters such as the British pound symbol, etc. i) are you unintentionally including complete digests in your reply? You need to check and make sure you cut down replys to the minimal size; digests are between 20,000 and 25,000 characters in length, and if you include a complete digest in your reply, it clearly won't make the 10,000 character limit. By the way, this feature is intentional. j) Are you using a "bad" ISP or mail relay? See http://www.digest.net/email-policy.html for more information about Digest.Net policies about email. k) Is the error message you get back "User Unknown"? If so, you may be running afoul of spam control severices (again, see http://www.digest.net/email-policy.html) When these services register a hit, the error code 550 is returned. 550 is a generic code that many broken mail systems report as "user unknown". The "rejectlog" entries for the previous day's mail traffic on digest.net may be viewed at http://www.digest.net/rejectlog.01 Some of you may find it useful or instructive to use the telnet program to connect directly to port 25 on krusty-motorsports.com and see what kind of reply you get; this requires some technical knowledge and is not for everyone (you can get out of this at anytime after the initial banner simply by typing quit and hitting enter.) l) Is SMTP over TLS involved? This is a bit esoteric, but as of 8/8/01 the digest.net mail server will attempt to use "TLS" (Transport Layer Security) for outbound mail if the destination mail server offers it. SMTP over TLS is fairly new technology, and a bit buggy. I am monitoring the logs on the server, and when I see TLS related problems, I manually place the problem destinations on a special exception list; however, this may delay email to the destination host until I make the exception. 2. Why can't I unsubscribe? a) are you using the right address? send to majordomo@digest.net, and the command format is unsubscribe list-name my-email-address b) has your email address changed? majordomo has no way of knowing that Fred.Flinstone@BarneyCo.com was once fflintstone@bedrock.org. you can check this with the which command (see 1.b) above for details) 3. How do I post to the list? You may use either one of two addresses: for example, the bmw-digest may be reached using either bmw@digest.net or bmw-digest@digest.net If you are using the correct addresses and your posts don't show up, check out the stuff in 1. above. 4. Where are the archives? see ftp://ftp.digest.net/ for digest archives. the web archives have proven problematic, and are awaiting time for a systematic attack on the problems they've been having. 5. What other lists are on digest.net? see http://www.digest.net/ for more information. 6. Is there a web subscription form? Yes, recently added. go to http://www.digest.net/bin/digest-subs.cgi 7. Why not move the lists to someplace like (egroups, topica,...)? The Krusty Motorsports server (aka, digest.net) was explicitly to provide for efficient management of the various automotive mailing lists, done the way that the owner of the server wanted it done. Any migration off of the server (which is already bought, paid for, and configured) would create any number of issues. 8. How do i contact the Server Administrator in an emergency? If my regular email address (rwelty@krusty-motorsports.com) isn't working for you, you can fall back on rwelty@suespammers.org 9. What is Krusty Motorsports, anyway? Krusty Motorsports (http:/www.krusty-motorsports.com/) is a business which is owned and operated by Richard Welty (rwelty@krusty-motorsports.com). Krusty is an S-Corporation in the State of New York. Krusty provides a number of Internet related services, such as mailing list, web sites, pop3/telnet accounts, and consulting on internet related issues. For more information, see the web site. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 May 2010 08:08:43 -0400 From: Mike Frank Subject: [db] No..nuts...I couldn't do it.... http://www.arcar.org/mercedes-benz-170-sd-1955-8843 But I so want it. Mike Frank ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 15 May 2010 22:47:23 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: [db] Mercedes Benz 170 SD 1955 wow... it's down in Argeninta? if here were a '56 I'd give it some serious thought... especially if it was a Diesel... ;) john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para bellum http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Sat, 15 May 2010, Mike Frank wrote: # http://www.arcar.org/mercedes-benz-170-sd-1955-8843 # # But I so want it. # # Mike Frank # ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #3283 **********************************