From owner-diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Sun Feb 27 12:53:51 2011 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Sunday, February 27 2011 Volume 01 : Number 3403 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: [db] TWO - diesel-benz-digest V1 #3403 - ERROR Re: [db] TWO - diesel-benz-digest V1 #3403 - ERROR Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? [db] 1959 190D Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? [db] 190DT Vacuum hose hunting [db] Re: 190DT Vacuum hose hunting Re: [db] 190DT Vacuum hose hunting Re: [db] 190DT Vacuum hose hunting Re: [db] 190DT Vacuum hose hunting [db] sunday afternoon adventure Re: [db] 1959 190D Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request@digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2011 19:53:44 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: [db] TWO - diesel-benz-digest V1 #3403 - ERROR error... two DIFFERENT digests with the same number!!! saved the second one as dbl-3403A.txt... oh richard... your counter is stuck... does the cable need some lubrication? ;) john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para bellum http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ diesel-benz-digest Sunday, February 27 2011 Volume 01 : Number 3403 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Contents: Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? >From owner-diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Sat Feb 26 13:09:51 2011 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Saturday, February 26 2011 Volume 01 : Number 3403 Contents: Re: [db] Mileage Challenge Re: [db] Mileage Challenge Re: [db] Mileage Challenge Re: [db] Mileage Challenge Re: [db] Mileage Challenge [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2011 19:59:41 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: [db] TWO - diesel-benz-digest V1 #3403 - ERROR just noticed your computer thinks it's Sunday too... it's only 7:50 here, so it should still be Saturday there... right? 7, 8, 9, 10... or am I counting wrong... 3 hrs difference... 8pm = 2000hrs, plus 3, 2300hrs, 11pm Saturday... don't make me resort to excel... :) I know my server was losing time, I finally pointed it to a NTP server... seems ok now... john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para bellum http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Sat, 26 Feb 2011, john wrote: # error... two DIFFERENT digests with the same number!!! # # saved the second one as dbl-3403A.txt... # # oh richard... your counter is stuck... does the cable need some lubrication? ;) # # john # # ----- # ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para bellum # http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us # ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # diesel-benz-digest Sunday, February 27 2011 Volume 01 : Number 3403 # Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles # Contents: # Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? # Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? # Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? # Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? # Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? # # # # >From owner-diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Sat Feb 26 13:09:51 2011 # From: diesel-benz-digest # diesel-benz-digest Saturday, February 26 2011 Volume 01 : Number 3403 # Contents: # Re: [db] Mileage Challenge # Re: [db] Mileage Challenge # Re: [db] Mileage Challenge # Re: [db] Mileage Challenge # Re: [db] Mileage Challenge # [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? # ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2011 23:00:38 -0500 From: Michael Frank Subject: Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? Having owned a 123, a 124, a 201 and a 210, I have to say that the 124 was the best of the best. The little 190D turbo is a rugged, fun car. But there's a certain, shall we say, "economy" to the design that puts it a cut below it's bigger brothers. Mike Frank At 10:49 PM 2/26/2011, john wrote: >or should W201 be listed also as good, maybe better than 123 or >126... I'd have to say so, >at least for economy... thoughts? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2011 20:03:11 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: [db] 1959 190D I'm giving some thought to a mild restoration project... a 1959 190D... it was reupholstered, but needs paint and mechanical help... hasn't run for a while, 4 on the tree... and tires... one bumper is dented, but the body is straight, but needs paint... only $500... book value according to nada is around $3k in fair shape if restored... might be a fun little project to tinker with for a bit... what I could find indicates it'll get around 28 mpg with it's little 4 banger... thoughts? thoughts on finding it a home after I get it back together? I don't think it'll be permitted to stay very long here... :) my wife has strict rules to keep me from becoming a blight upon the neighborhood... :) I respect that... because I have little or no self-control... if it were up to me there'd be stray cats, dogs and vehicles following me home on a regular basis. :) ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para bellum http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2011 20:11:01 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? agreed the 124 is likely the best, at least within most of our budget ranges... there's things I really like about the 201. it's nimbleness, it's size... it's feel... but the 124 is so much more refined, professional, better quality, better ride and maybe the same handling capability... in the right hands... but you're right about the economy feel... it's not up to snuff with the 124. which kind of leads me to the idea of a 124, but they get 30... the 201 should get 32-34... while the jetta mk IV gets 38+ my son came up with an interesting thought... is there any way I can operate the clutch with a hand lever? That would solve the problem... anyone familiar with handicap aids? I know they have them for the brake and the go pedal, but why not the clutch? I recall seeing something with a clutch on the gear shift... don't recall where it was... despite the rubber band and "economy" feel of the jetta, it is a decent car... if I had a hand lever for the clutch that could be used when my back is acting up that would work great... who does one see about such things? I wonder if the VA would know? I'm a disabled viet nam era vet, but make too much money to receive any benefits... but they may know of a supplier... not sure why I didn't think of that before... guess I could design something to engage the clutch, servo motor, linkage... the clutch is easy to operate... would like to have it both ways though... that way when I'm talking on my cell and drinking a latte and eating a big mac I won't have as much trouble as jim is going to give me for even suggesting such a thing... ;) google time... key words??? ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para bellum http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Sat, 26 Feb 2011, Michael Frank wrote: # Having owned a 123, a 124, a 201 and a 210, I have to say that the 124 was # the best of the best. The little 190D turbo is a rugged, fun car. But there's # a certain, shall we say, "economy" to the design that puts it a cut below # it's bigger brothers. # # Mike Frank # # At 10:49 PM 2/26/2011, john wrote: # # # >or should W201 be listed also as good, maybe better than 123 or 126... I'd # >have to say so, # >at least for economy... thoughts? # ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 26 Feb 2011 21:00:35 -0800 From: john Subject: Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? I am careful of this transmission... if it's abused it won't hold up... if used properly it should be fine for a long time... my mechanic was concerned about putting the 11mm pump in this thing, he was not off target at all... hooking up in 1st gear is a challenge, I really have to go easy off the line... afraid that if the tires spin too much and grab that something could snap... it is kind of fun though... even when driven hard in the cold 34 mpg isn't too bad... 41 is better though, so I'll go back to keeping it from jumping up over 2 grand on upshifts... On 02/26/2011 08:53 PM, Eric Ditwiler wrote: > That is true of the slushbox they used with the ALH engine. > The 09A used with the BEW (PD '04-'05-'06) engine is robust--hell it is used in a small Land Rover. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "john" > To: "Eric Ditwiler" > Sent: Saturday, February 26, 2011 8:23:55 PM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific > Subject: Re: [db] mercedes Diesels - years to avoid? > > the automatics in the jettas are portable grenades... > > 90% of the time I can use the clutch... but in heavy traffic it really starts > messing with my 5th lumbar... > > also, I couldn't afford to sell/buy a TDI with an automatic... well, maybe > I could, but the autos are so horrible that everyone I talk to says don't do it... > > kind of like the advice here about 210s. :) > > if I could rig up some kind of switch on the stick that would operate it, that would > be perfect... that way my left hand can be on the wheel... > > will have to look at the amount of travel required... don't want to alter the > car, just add on the control > > john > > > > ----- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para bellum > http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > On Sat, 26 Feb 2011, Eric Ditwiler wrote: > > # How about an electromagnetic clutch? Hook up some sort of solenoid? Or maybe a cable to the clutch pedal, and a couple of idler wheels to route the cable to a hand lever? The problem is it would be in the way of getting in and out of the car. Just sell the car and buy an automatic--they get 20% less MPG though. > # > # Eric > # ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2011 11:29:35 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: jjs3rd@ix.netcom.com Subject: [db] 190DT Vacuum hose hunting John et al, Starting to chase done some vacuum issues. Lots of usual suspect door locks etc that I don't care to much about. Two items hard shifting and no or infrequent turbo boost the later being most annoying needs a fix. Noticed that the circled connection is very loose in picture. Can any eagled eye individual(s) know what this connection is for. Rather attack the problem not just fix everything that looks or feels loose willy nilly. Thanks all John P.S. John, still owe you full detailed pics of 87 190D 2.5 turbo engine / bay ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2011 11:31:10 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: jjs3rd@ix.netcom.com Subject: [db] Re: 190DT Vacuum hose hunting ooop forgot the picture - -----Original Message----- >From: jjs3rd@ix.netcom.com >Sent: Feb 27, 2011 11:29 AM >To: diesel-benz list >Subject: 190DT Vacuum hose hunting > >John et al, > >Starting to chase done some vacuum issues. Lots of usual suspect door locks etc that I don't care to much about. Two items hard shifting and no or infrequent turbo boost the later being most annoying needs a fix. > >Noticed that the circled connection is very loose in picture. Can any eagled eye individual(s) know what this connection is for. Rather attack the problem not just fix everything that looks or feels loose willy nilly. > >Thanks all > > >John > >P.S. John, still owe you full detailed pics of 87 190D 2.5 turbo engine / bay [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of 190DT_vacuum_junction.jpg] ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2011 09:48:28 -0800 From: john Subject: Re: [db] 190DT Vacuum hose hunting peformance products had detailed vacuum drawings in their catalogs... but you know the dealer isn't a bad place to go for these things... if you talk nicely to the parts manager he may give you things at jobber rates, if not, do your research there, get all the parts numbers, diagrams and all... and I'll go to mine and see if they can't work with your dealership to deliver the parts via my business to there... dealerships often work together, and since we're talking mercedes I think we have a better chance of something like that happening. I've done things like this with GM and Jeep dealerships... the parts guys are a different breed than the sales and service folks... I've met only a few decent service guys who cut a small shop/hobbyist a break, but it's a rare parts guy who isn't a decent guy... anyway, ask for a discount after you do the research and get the data... :) john On 02/27/2011 08:29 AM, jjs3rd@ix.netcom.com wrote: > John et al, > > Starting to chase done some vacuum issues. Lots of usual suspect door locks etc that I don't care to much about. Two items hard shifting and no or infrequent turbo boost the later being most annoying needs a fix. > > Noticed that the circled connection is very loose in picture. Can any eagled eye individual(s) know what this connection is for. Rather attack the problem not just fix everything that looks or feels loose willy nilly. > > Thanks all > > > John > > P.S. John, still owe you full detailed pics of 87 190D 2.5 turbo engine / bay ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2011 14:52:58 -0500 From: Michael Frank Subject: Re: [db] 190DT Vacuum hose hunting FWIW, I've always found that hard shifts were the result of a vacuum leak literally anywhere in the engine compartment. Best way to locate the leak is to start at the vacuum pump. There is a three way right after the pump. Remove a line, plug the connector. See if the problem goes away. If it does, the problem is on that line. Etc. The doors are controlled by an electric vacuum pump under the rear seat, not the engine vacuum pump. So you are hunting for two problems, not one. For some reason, I'm not getting your jpg. Mike Frank ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2011 20:13:43 +0000 From: john Subject: Re: [db] 190DT Vacuum hose hunting The list doesn't allow attachments. They'll have to be posted some where and shared as links. I can post it in my dieselbenz tech section. Send directly to john at wagoneers dot com. I've move the dieselbenz stuff to johnmeister dot com but there are links from wagoneers over. Just different directories and virtual apache servers on the same box. :) - ------Original Message------ From: Michael Frank Sender: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net To: dbl Subject: Re: [db] 190DT Vacuum hose hunting Sent: Feb 27, 2011 11:52 FWIW, I've always found that hard shifts were the result of a vacuum leak literally anywhere in the engine compartment. Best way to locate the leak is to start at the vacuum pump. There is a three way right after the pump. Remove a line, plug the connector. See if the problem goes away. If it does, the problem is on that line. Etc. The doors are controlled by an electric vacuum pump under the rear seat, not the engine vacuum pump. So you are hunting for two problems, not one. For some reason, I'm not getting your jpg. Mike Frank john at http://wagoneers.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2011 12:52:41 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: [db] sunday afternoon adventure heading down to south seattle to look at a 1959 190D. pictures to follow... :) john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para bellum http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2011 12:53:19 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: Re: [db] 1959 190D not sure I'll be interested in it, even at $500. talked to the lady, guess someone noticed the subframe is rusted... we'll see. john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para bellum http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Sun, 27 Feb 2011, Edward Pomeroy wrote: # Very fun car, when I was a kid all the taxis in Montevideo were 190D and # later uprated to 220D, the 4 banger with manual shift handled by an expert # taxi driver actually did get up and move but then the speed limits back then # were low so it may just have been the impression on a young brain :-) # # They habitually went over 600K miles (1 million KM) And as I have a 64 # 220Sb gasser to restore, we can trade notes, they are similar inside, just # not in the engine area8-) # # Edward # # On 2/26/2011 11:03 PM, john wrote: # > I'm giving some thought to a mild restoration project... # > a 1959 190D... it was reupholstered, but needs paint and mechanical # > help... hasn't run for a while, 4 on the tree... and tires... one # > bumper is dented, but the body is straight, but needs paint... # > # > only $500... book value according to nada is around $3k in fair shape if # > restored... # > # > might be a fun little project to tinker with for a bit... what I could # > find indicates it'll get around 28 mpg with it's little 4 banger... # > # > thoughts? thoughts on finding it a home after I get it back together? I # > don't # > think it'll be permitted to stay very long here... :) # > # > my wife has strict rules to keep me from becoming a blight upon the # > neighborhood... :) # > I respect that... because I have little or no self-control... if it were # > up # > to me there'd be stray cats, dogs and vehicles following me home on a # > regular basis. # > # > :) # > # > # > # > ----- # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they mold # > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para bellum # > http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com http://fotomeister.us # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > # ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #3403 **********************************