From owner-diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Sat Apr 2 11:56:11 2011 From: diesel-benz-digest diesel-benz-digest Saturday, April 2 2011 Volume 01 : Number 3429 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: RE: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping Re: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping RE: Re: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request@digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2011 09:55:28 -0500 From: "Alec Cordova" Subject: RE: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping MB gassers demand premium at least as far back as the M103 straight six introduced to the US in 1986, and probably in earlier engines, too. In my 89 300CE, if it had any kind of knock sensor to retard the timing, it would crank them all back, not like modern systems that treat each cylinder individually. There was also some kind of resistory thing near the battery that you could adjust to deal with varying fuel quality and octane around the world, but that device was not well described, and I don't think it was intended to be repeatedly adjusted. Moral: if you get an MB gasser, just use premium. Think of it like using oil that meets MB specs. Alec > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel- > benz@digest.net] On Behalf Of john > Sent: Friday, April 01, 2011 9:43 PM > To: Bruce Caruthers; dbl > Subject: Re: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping > > Maybe a better word would be pampered. ;) > > Just talked to the guy with the 92 300D, it has 265,000 miles on it. > :). He wants 4500. Called MB in lynnwood, easily 2K wholesale in parts > to rebuild. > > Should I rebuild, wait for a used engine, sell it as is and shop for > another or buy something else. > > What happens if you run 87 octane in the newer engines? On the WJs > with HO motors you got worse mileage and had less power, big deal, you > don't gain enough mpg to pay for the better mileage. > john at http://wagoneers.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bruce Caruthers > Sender: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net > Date: Fri, 1 Apr 2011 19:32:46 > To: > Reply-To: Bruce Caruthers > Subject: Re: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping > > Not surprised at the "spoiled" part. :) > > By the way, one thing I don't think has been mentioned about newer MB > gassers (and maybe other brand newer cars) is that they require 91 > octane gas. Kind of starts to compress the current gas v. diesel fuel > cost difference. > > -bkc > Lynnwood, WA > (his) '76 MB 240D [W115.117/616.916] > (hers) '92 Toyota Celica GT > (ours) '93 MB 300D 2.5 Turbo [W124.128/602.962] > > > On Sat Apr 02, 2011, john wrote: > > > > I think we're going to try to find another Milton Bradley. :). The 95 > xj was pretty nice, however the drivers door was very, very hard to > open by me from the inside and impossible for my wife. And it was too > truck like with small mirrors. Another MB Diesel is in our future. She > is totally spoiled by the wj and then the 124. If we can't find a > suitable benz the next in line will be a passat. > > john at http://wagoneers.com > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Colucci B > > Date: Fri, 01 Apr 2011 19:56:49 > > To: john > > Subject: Re: OT: more questions on car shopping > > > > Greetings John! > > > > Why not just get another milton bradly 300D? You really like the > car, > > and now you have a complete parts car. > > > > The Admiral > > > > On 03/31/2011 11:35 PM, john wrote: > > > we're looking for a reliable car that looks nice, has an automatic, > and four doors. > > > all wheel drive would be nice but not required. 20 mpg or better > makes sense. > > > spending less is the plan... but saving money when buying and > spending it later fixing isn't good either. > > > > > > The possibility of departing from a Jeep, Mercedes, or VW is a new, > and some what intimidating experience... > > > I don't have an immediate interest in GM, Nissan, Hyuandi, Dodge, > Chrysler, Ford... or many of the cars below... :) > > > > > > But, anything to be concerned about with any of these: > > > > > > Volvo ??? > > > > > > Audi? Quattro? Allroad? > > > > > > VW (automatics prior to 2005) > > > > > > Mercedes (avoiding 96-03) > > > > > > (have a problem with Japanese cars in general, need help to be > convinced...) > > > Subaru (2002 and up H6 has been recommended) - a good friend is > recommending these, but I'm having trouble here... > > > Toyota Rav 4? - I like these... not a jeep, but might be > economical > > > Honda CRV - I could see one of these too... have heard good > things... > > > Honda - having a real problem seeing myself piloting one of these > things... > > > Toyota? this one will really take some work to get me into.. > > > Lexus - my skin is crawling, but I need to give them a try, maybe > it'll work... > > > > > > > > > recommendations? (with explanations) > > > > > > Right now Audi and Volvos are popping up on my radar... thoughts? > > > > > > > > > we'll go through all this and likely end up with a nice clean > Cherokee again... > > > trying not to go back into debt... this vehicle won't be driven > much after all... > > > > > > thanx > > > john > > > > > > > > > ----- > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they > mold > > > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para > bellum > > > tunc aperuit illis sensum ut intellegerent scripturas > > > http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com > http://fotomeister.us > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ----- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2011 18:38:16 +0000 From: john Subject: Re: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping This is turning out to be quite the challenge. Something that looks good, is reliable, has comfortable seats, an automatic and what we can afford to buy and drive is just not out there. We're both turning our noses up at american and asian iron, and of course the german cars have horrible seats or automatic issues or priced out of reach. So many friends are passionately for or against some models. Almost all are highly respected for their technical knowledge and they are at opposite ends of the love-hate scale on a car. I know there are good models and good years and good engines among all brands. Finding the right one is a challenge. Any kind of consumer information surveys are flawed by the overwhelming ignorance of most people. And the troubled vehicles are so noted because of what may be a simple fix with aftermarket parts. The xj was nice but didn't "grab" us, and some freakin' incompetent moron attempted to fix a bad door hinge adjustment by welding it to the jeep, so the door sagged and my wife could not open it from inside. I had to drop my shoulder and hit it with enough force that if I did it to someone standing next to me they'd likely be knocked over. What a shame. We find cars we could live with and some massive issue exists. Sure that was a lovely car, but the engine didn't work, or it was missing an interior or whatever. This is not fun. We have figured out we can spend about 9-10k without taking out a car loan, we just retrieve what we paid down on the roof loan, raid piggy banks, tax return and change from the sofa... But even that isn't turning up something that both of us want. My jetta wagon would be great for both of us if it had an automatic, no body damage and comfy seats. And we know that only one of those is possible and pointless. Spending 2K to fix the body damage removes a very nice anti-theft and traffic merging enhancement. :). If you saw a car trying to merge with the side caved in you'd let them in too. And you wouldn't want to steal it. My j10 still starts hard and there is no way my wife should be expected to drive it. Well, once again thank you all for your advice, suggestions, wisdom, recommendations, insight, passions and warnings, all, even when contradictory, are appreciated and considered and if I don't reply, comment or even go against what someone recommended please understand that it wasn't an easy decision and you'll likely have "I told you so" rights. Champaign tastes, beer budget, the story of our lives. However, through it all we do amazingly well, the Lord always provides and we dodge a lot of bullets and disasters. Having owned two good olds 5.7 Diesels, 4 pintos I seem to beat the odds on lemons. Looks like I may be able to trade the dead 300d for some siding work on my carport. The adventure continues. Thanx all. In the meantime I just saved $305 on my car insurance. :) (dropped the benz). john at http://wagoneers.com - -----Original Message----- From: "Alec Cordova" Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2011 09:55:28 To: ; 'Bruce Caruthers'; 'dbl' Subject: RE: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping MB gassers demand premium at least as far back as the M103 straight six introduced to the US in 1986, and probably in earlier engines, too. In my 89 300CE, if it had any kind of knock sensor to retard the timing, it would crank them all back, not like modern systems that treat each cylinder individually. There was also some kind of resistory thing near the battery that you could adjust to deal with varying fuel quality and octane around the world, but that device was not well described, and I don't think it was intended to be repeatedly adjusted. Moral: if you get an MB gasser, just use premium. Think of it like using oil that meets MB specs. Alec > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel- > benz@digest.net] On Behalf Of john > Sent: Friday, April 01, 2011 9:43 PM > To: Bruce Caruthers; dbl > Subject: Re: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping > > Maybe a better word would be pampered. ;) > > Just talked to the guy with the 92 300D, it has 265,000 miles on it. > :). He wants 4500. Called MB in lynnwood, easily 2K wholesale in parts > to rebuild. > > Should I rebuild, wait for a used engine, sell it as is and shop for > another or buy something else. > > What happens if you run 87 octane in the newer engines? On the WJs > with HO motors you got worse mileage and had less power, big deal, you > don't gain enough mpg to pay for the better mileage. > john at http://wagoneers.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bruce Caruthers > Sender: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net > Date: Fri, 1 Apr 2011 19:32:46 > To: > Reply-To: Bruce Caruthers > Subject: Re: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping > > Not surprised at the "spoiled" part. :) > > By the way, one thing I don't think has been mentioned about newer MB > gassers (and maybe other brand newer cars) is that they require 91 > octane gas. Kind of starts to compress the current gas v. diesel fuel > cost difference. > > -bkc > Lynnwood, WA > (his) '76 MB 240D [W115.117/616.916] > (hers) '92 Toyota Celica GT > (ours) '93 MB 300D 2.5 Turbo [W124.128/602.962] > > > On Sat Apr 02, 2011, john wrote: > > > > I think we're going to try to find another Milton Bradley. :). The 95 > xj was pretty nice, however the drivers door was very, very hard to > open by me from the inside and impossible for my wife. And it was too > truck like with small mirrors. Another MB Diesel is in our future. She > is totally spoiled by the wj and then the 124. If we can't find a > suitable benz the next in line will be a passat. > > john at http://wagoneers.com > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Colucci B > > Date: Fri, 01 Apr 2011 19:56:49 > > To: john > > Subject: Re: OT: more questions on car shopping > > > > Greetings John! > > > > Why not just get another milton bradly 300D? You really like the > car, > > and now you have a complete parts car. > > > > The Admiral > > > > On 03/31/2011 11:35 PM, john wrote: > > > we're looking for a reliable car that looks nice, has an automatic, > and four doors. > > > all wheel drive would be nice but not required. 20 mpg or better > makes sense. > > > spending less is the plan... but saving money when buying and > spending it later fixing isn't good either. > > > > > > The possibility of departing from a Jeep, Mercedes, or VW is a new, > and some what intimidating experience... > > > I don't have an immediate interest in GM, Nissan, Hyuandi, Dodge, > Chrysler, Ford... or many of the cars below... :) > > > > > > But, anything to be concerned about with any of these: > > > > > > Volvo ??? > > > > > > Audi? Quattro? Allroad? > > > > > > VW (automatics prior to 2005) > > > > > > Mercedes (avoiding 96-03) > > > > > > (have a problem with Japanese cars in general, need help to be > convinced...) > > > Subaru (2002 and up H6 has been recommended) - a good friend is > recommending these, but I'm having trouble here... > > > Toyota Rav 4? - I like these... not a jeep, but might be > economical > > > Honda CRV - I could see one of these too... have heard good > things... > > > Honda - having a real problem seeing myself piloting one of these > things... > > > Toyota? this one will really take some work to get me into.. > > > Lexus - my skin is crawling, but I need to give them a try, maybe > it'll work... > > > > > > > > > recommendations? (with explanations) > > > > > > Right now Audi and Volvos are popping up on my radar... thoughts? > > > > > > > > > we'll go through all this and likely end up with a nice clean > Cherokee again... > > > trying not to go back into debt... this vehicle won't be driven > much after all... > > > > > > thanx > > > john > > > > > > > > > ----- > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they > mold > > > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para > bellum > > > tunc aperuit illis sensum ut intellegerent scripturas > > > http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com > http://fotomeister.us > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ----- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2011 11:55:51 -0700 From: "Paul Kershner" Subject: RE: Re: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping Pull the motor on the Benz, put an electric motor in it and fill the trunk with batteries... I know someone who could help you. He did it in a VW Vanagon. pk - -----Original Message----- From: owner-fsj@digest.net [mailto:owner-fsj@digest.net] On Behalf Of john Sent: Saturday, April 02, 2011 11:38 AM To: Alec Cordova; 'Bruce Caruthers' Subject: fsj: Re: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping This is turning out to be quite the challenge. Something that looks good, is reliable, has comfortable seats, an automatic and what we can afford to buy and drive is just not out there. We're both turning our noses up at american and asian iron, and of course the german cars have horrible seats or automatic issues or priced out of reach. So many friends are passionately for or against some models. Almost all are highly respected for their technical knowledge and they are at opposite ends of the love-hate scale on a car. I know there are good models and good years and good engines among all brands. Finding the right one is a challenge. Any kind of consumer information surveys are flawed by the overwhelming ignorance of most people. And the troubled vehicles are so noted because of what may be a simple fix with aftermarket parts. The xj was nice but didn't "grab" us, and some freakin' incompetent moron attempted to fix a bad door hinge adjustment by welding it to the jeep, so the door sagged and my wife could not open it from inside. I had to drop my shoulder and hit it with enough force that if I did it to someone standing next to me they'd likely be knocked over. What a shame. We find cars we could live with and some massive issue exists. Sure that was a lovely car, but the engine didn't work, or it was missing an interior or whatever. This is not fun. We have figured out we can spend about 9-10k without taking out a car loan, we just retrieve what we paid down on the roof loan, raid piggy banks, tax return and change from the sofa... But even that isn't turning up something that both of us want. My jetta wagon would be great for both of us if it had an automatic, no body damage and comfy seats. And we know that only one of those is possible and pointless. Spending 2K to fix the body damage removes a very nice anti-theft and traffic merging enhancement. :). If you saw a car trying to merge with the side caved in you'd let them in too. And you wouldn't want to steal it. My j10 still starts hard and there is no way my wife should be expected to drive it. Well, once again thank you all for your advice, suggestions, wisdom, recommendations, insight, passions and warnings, all, even when contradictory, are appreciated and considered and if I don't reply, comment or even go against what someone recommended please understand that it wasn't an easy decision and you'll likely have "I told you so" rights. Champaign tastes, beer budget, the story of our lives. However, through it all we do amazingly well, the Lord always provides and we dodge a lot of bullets and disasters. Having owned two good olds 5.7 Diesels, 4 pintos I seem to beat the odds on lemons. Looks like I may be able to trade the dead 300d for some siding work on my carport. The adventure continues. Thanx all. In the meantime I just saved $305 on my car insurance. :) (dropped the benz). john at http://wagoneers.com - -----Original Message----- From: "Alec Cordova" Date: Sat, 2 Apr 2011 09:55:28 To: ; 'Bruce Caruthers'; 'dbl' Subject: RE: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping MB gassers demand premium at least as far back as the M103 straight six introduced to the US in 1986, and probably in earlier engines, too. In my 89 300CE, if it had any kind of knock sensor to retard the timing, it would crank them all back, not like modern systems that treat each cylinder individually. There was also some kind of resistory thing near the battery that you could adjust to deal with varying fuel quality and octane around the world, but that device was not well described, and I don't think it was intended to be repeatedly adjusted. Moral: if you get an MB gasser, just use premium. Think of it like using oil that meets MB specs. Alec > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel- > benz@digest.net] On Behalf Of john > Sent: Friday, April 01, 2011 9:43 PM > To: Bruce Caruthers; dbl > Subject: Re: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping > > Maybe a better word would be pampered. ;) > > Just talked to the guy with the 92 300D, it has 265,000 miles on it. > :). He wants 4500. Called MB in lynnwood, easily 2K wholesale in parts > to rebuild. > > Should I rebuild, wait for a used engine, sell it as is and shop for > another or buy something else. > > What happens if you run 87 octane in the newer engines? On the WJs > with HO motors you got worse mileage and had less power, big deal, you > don't gain enough mpg to pay for the better mileage. > john at http://wagoneers.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bruce Caruthers > Sender: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net > Date: Fri, 1 Apr 2011 19:32:46 > To: > Reply-To: Bruce Caruthers > Subject: Re: [db] Re: OT: more questions on car shopping > > Not surprised at the "spoiled" part. :) > > By the way, one thing I don't think has been mentioned about newer MB > gassers (and maybe other brand newer cars) is that they require 91 > octane gas. Kind of starts to compress the current gas v. diesel fuel > cost difference. > > -bkc > Lynnwood, WA > (his) '76 MB 240D [W115.117/616.916] > (hers) '92 Toyota Celica GT > (ours) '93 MB 300D 2.5 Turbo [W124.128/602.962] > > > On Sat Apr 02, 2011, john wrote: > > > > I think we're going to try to find another Milton Bradley. :). The 95 > xj was pretty nice, however the drivers door was very, very hard to > open by me from the inside and impossible for my wife. And it was too > truck like with small mirrors. Another MB Diesel is in our future. She > is totally spoiled by the wj and then the 124. If we can't find a > suitable benz the next in line will be a passat. > > john at http://wagoneers.com > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Colucci B > > Date: Fri, 01 Apr 2011 19:56:49 > > To: john > > Subject: Re: OT: more questions on car shopping > > > > Greetings John! > > > > Why not just get another milton bradly 300D? You really like the > car, > > and now you have a complete parts car. > > > > The Admiral > > > > On 03/31/2011 11:35 PM, john wrote: > > > we're looking for a reliable car that looks nice, has an automatic, > and four doors. > > > all wheel drive would be nice but not required. 20 mpg or better > makes sense. > > > spending less is the plan... but saving money when buying and > spending it later fixing isn't good either. > > > > > > The possibility of departing from a Jeep, Mercedes, or VW is a new, > and some what intimidating experience... > > > I don't have an immediate interest in GM, Nissan, Hyuandi, Dodge, > Chrysler, Ford... or many of the cars below... :) > > > > > > But, anything to be concerned about with any of these: > > > > > > Volvo ??? > > > > > > Audi? Quattro? Allroad? > > > > > > VW (automatics prior to 2005) > > > > > > Mercedes (avoiding 96-03) > > > > > > (have a problem with Japanese cars in general, need help to be > convinced...) > > > Subaru (2002 and up H6 has been recommended) - a good friend is > recommending these, but I'm having trouble here... > > > Toyota Rav 4? - I like these... not a jeep, but might be > economical > > > Honda CRV - I could see one of these too... have heard good > things... > > > Honda - having a real problem seeing myself piloting one of these > things... > > > Toyota? this one will really take some work to get me into.. > > > Lexus - my skin is crawling, but I need to give them a try, maybe > it'll work... > > > > > > > > > recommendations? (with explanations) > > > > > > Right now Audi and Volvos are popping up on my radar... thoughts? > > > > > > > > > we'll go through all this and likely end up with a nice clean > Cherokee again... > > > trying not to go back into debt... this vehicle won't be driven > much after all... > > > > > > thanx > > > john > > > > > > > > > ----- > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > > Snohomish, Washington -o|||||o- where Jeeps don't rust, they > mold > > > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 si vis pacem, para > bellum > > > tunc aperuit illis sensum ut intellegerent scripturas > > > http://johnmeister.com http://wagoneers.com > http://fotomeister.us > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ----- ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #3429 **********************************