From owner-diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Sat Dec 3 17:18:00 2011 From: diesel-benz-digest To: diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Date: Sun, 04 Dec 2011 01:18:44 +0000 Subject: diesel-benz-digest V1 #3503 diesel-benz-digest Sunday, December 4 2011 Volume 01 : Number 3503 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: RE: [db] 124 suspension RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done Re: [db] 124 suspension RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done Re: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done Re: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request@digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 07:10:19 -0500 From: Michael Frank Subject: RE: [db] 124 suspension A minor point of interest...the rear axle "bones" are completely interchangeable between a 124 and a 201. Mike fran At 09:34 PM 12/2/2011, john wrote: >interesting... > >so it sounds like I'm on the right track... the differential bushings >are worn on mine as well, will tackle that later and replace the seals >at the same time. first thing is to get rid of the wobbles... > >all the bushings are in the links... looks like a simple unbolt/bolt job >for my 5 c notes... > >john > > > > ----- >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Dec 2011 15:50:33 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done I'll confirm that... ALL of the parts I'm dealing with right now are 201's. Heading back to the dealer right now... need ONE more bolt to do the driver's side rear... the tie rods were tight, going to return those once I'm sure it's ok. the camber strut (top) was a little loose, had some play. the Thrust strut (lower) was quite loose and the torque strut was loose... loose in that I could twist them with my hand or with a pair of pliers, when I pulled them out the rubber was pretty well shot... can't move the new parts... I had trouble getting the rotor off, made getting the camber and torque struts more difficult to remove... I pulled the screw, took the brake caliper off, but the rotor wouldn't come off... I'm missing something... any thoughts? will be out for about an hour getting a $12 bolt... pictures to follow. ;) john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Sat, 3 Dec 2011, Michael Frank wrote: # A minor point of interest...the rear axle "bones" are completely # interchangeable between a 124 and a 201. # # Mike fran # # At 09:34 PM 12/2/2011, john wrote: # > interesting... # > # > so it sounds like I'm on the right track... the differential bushings # > are worn on mine as well, will tackle that later and replace the seals # > at the same time. first thing is to get rid of the wobbles... # > # > all the bushings are in the links... looks like a simple unbolt/bolt job # > for my 5 c notes... # > # > john # > # > # > # > ----- # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all # ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 19:15:08 -0500 From: "FParker" Subject: RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done Here in the northeast, when a poop-off rotor won't come of it is due to rust... I just beat it into submission with a hammer. Hit the center area so you don't damage the braking surface. - -----Original Message----- From: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel-benz@digest.net] On Behalf Of john Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2011 6:51 PM To: Michael Frank Cc: diesel-benz list Subject: RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done I'll confirm that... ALL of the parts I'm dealing with right now are 201's. Heading back to the dealer right now... need ONE more bolt to do the driver's side rear... the tie rods were tight, going to return those once I'm sure it's ok. the camber strut (top) was a little loose, had some play. the Thrust strut (lower) was quite loose and the torque strut was loose... loose in that I could twist them with my hand or with a pair of pliers, when I pulled them out the rubber was pretty well shot... can't move the new parts... I had trouble getting the rotor off, made getting the camber and torque struts more difficult to remove... I pulled the screw, took the brake caliper off, but the rotor wouldn't come off... I'm missing something... any thoughts? will be out for about an hour getting a $12 bolt... pictures to follow. ;) john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Sat, 3 Dec 2011, Michael Frank wrote: # A minor point of interest...the rear axle "bones" are completely # interchangeable between a 124 and a 201. # # Mike fran # # At 09:34 PM 12/2/2011, john wrote: # > interesting... # > # > so it sounds like I'm on the right track... the differential bushings # > are worn on mine as well, will tackle that later and replace the seals # > at the same time. first thing is to get rid of the wobbles... # > # > all the bushings are in the links... looks like a simple unbolt/bolt job # > for my 5 c notes... # > # > john # > # > # > # > ----- # > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all # ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 19:19:10 -0500 From: "FParker" Subject: RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done Just proof-read my response :-) Try this instead: "Here in the northeast, when a pop-off rotor won't come off it is due to rust... I just beat it into submission with a hammer. Hit the center area so you don't damage the braking surface." By the way, maybe it is the Northwest mold holding it on ;-) - -----Original Message----- From: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel-benz@digest.net] On Behalf Of john Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2011 6:51 PM To: Michael Frank Cc: diesel-benz list Subject: RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done I'll confirm that... ALL of the parts I'm dealing with right now are 201's. Heading back to the dealer right now... need ONE more bolt to do the driver's side rear... the tie rods were tight, going to return those once I'm sure it's ok. the camber strut (top) was a little loose, had some play. the Thrust strut (lower) was quite loose and the torque strut was loose... loose in that I could twist them with my hand or with a pair of pliers, when I pulled them out the rubber was pretty well shot... can't move the new parts... I had trouble getting the rotor off, made getting the camber and torque struts more difficult to remove... I pulled the screw, took the brake caliper off, but the rotor wouldn't come off... I'm missing something... any thoughts? will be out for about an hour getting a $12 bolt... pictures to follow. ;) john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Sat, 3 Dec 2011, Michael Frank wrote: # A minor point of interest...the rear axle "bones" are completely # interchangeable between a 124 and a 201. # # Mike fran # # At 09:34 PM 12/2/2011, john wrote: # > interesting... # > # > so it sounds like I'm on the right track... the differential bushings # > are worn on mine as well, will tackle that later and replace the seals # > at the same time. first thing is to get rid of the wobbles... # > # > all the bushings are in the links... looks like a simple unbolt/bolt job # > for my 5 c notes... # > # > john # > # > # > # > ----- # > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all # ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 19:41:55 -0500 From: Edward Pomeroy Subject: Re: [db] 124 suspension Well - DIY note on failed front sway bar support on the 124 Benz 300D. 1) At about 226K miles one failed on the LH side of the vehicle. Clean fracture starting about 1/4" in (under the clamping support) to the corner opposite side of the part, I am going to guess that the corner had a nick or worked up a hairline crack which then let go completely across the flat metal. It is fairly tempered steel, pretty hard stuff. Symptoms are sudden wallowing and the feeling you are tipping over when cornering, front end feels spongy and the bumps cause the body to bounce much more than a Benz should, kinda like a 73 Chrysler Crown Imperial rode all the time. It also damaged the fibreglass cowling (kind of a flat sheet of plastic) that rides right over the sway bar on that side and was likely just a splash shield, I ended up cutting out a piece about 8" X 2" to remove what was flapping in the breeze. 2) MB uses blue (permanent) locktite on the one bolt holding the bracket to the crossmember below the radiator area, even with an impact hammer producing over 140 ft lb shocks it took a good 2 minutes to decide to start turning. 3) New bracket would not go in, fit fine to the bolt and peg hole that keeps it from turning, but the sway bar had worked it's way to the right as far as it could go, there was about 3/4 inch still inside the wheel side bushing, glad that did not let go completely. Found rub marks on the LH wheelwell where the tire actually hit the sheet metal and rubbed it bare of undercoating/dirt. Took a 10 lb sledge to gently tap the sway bar from right to left, after moving it about 1-1/4" everything lined up nice and went back together. No room to use the impact hammer on the bushing clamp, had to do that by hand, upside down in 45 degree weather, I guess I should be happy it was not snowing :-) Forensic photos of failed part attached. Add to the ones sent earlier. Now I am going to have to stay tuned to the RH one failing at some point:-( Keep up that wretched wrenching! Edward [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of SAM_0186.JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of SAM_0187.JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of SAM_0188.JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of SAM_0190.JPG] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 19:52:56 -0500 From: Michael Frank Subject: RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done Rear rotor incorporates the parking brake drum. First off, is the parking brake released? If it is, then whack the side of the drum with a big hammer while pulling on the rotor. Usually pops right out. The parking brake sometimes wears a groove in the drum, pounding with the hammer shifts it enough to pull out. Mike Frank At 06:50 PM 12/3/2011, you wrote: >I'll confirm that... ALL of the parts I'm dealing with right >now are 201's. > >Heading back to the dealer right now... need ONE more bolt to do the driver's >side rear... > >the tie rods were tight, going to return those once I'm sure it's ok. > >the camber strut (top) was a little loose, had some play. >the Thrust strut (lower) was quite loose >and the torque strut was loose... > >loose in that I could twist them with my hand or with a pair of pliers, >when I pulled them out the rubber was pretty well shot... > >can't move the new parts... > > >I had trouble getting the rotor off, made getting the camber and torque struts >more difficult to remove... > >I pulled the screw, took the brake caliper off, but the rotor wouldn't come >off... I'm missing something... > >any thoughts? > >will be out for about an hour getting a $12 bolt... > >pictures to follow. ;) > >john > > > > ----- >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all > Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS > http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > >On Sat, 3 Dec 2011, Michael Frank wrote: > > # A minor point of interest...the rear axle "bones" are completely > # interchangeable between a 124 and a 201. > # > # Mike fran > # > # At 09:34 PM 12/2/2011, john wrote: > # > interesting... > # > > # > so it sounds like I'm on the right track... the differential bushings > # > are worn on mine as well, will tackle that later and replace the seals > # > at the same time. first thing is to get rid of the wobbles... > # > > # > all the bushings are in the links... looks like a simple unbolt/bolt job > # > for my 5 c notes... > # > > # > john > # > > # > > # > > # > ----- > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all > # ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2011 01:15:02 +0000 From: john Subject: Re: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done Tried that. Went around the drum and also hit the center. No problem, was able to get the links off. Need to find one more bolt. __john_at_http://wagoneers.com__ - -----Original Message----- From: Michael Frank Sender: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 19:52:56 To: diesel-benz list Subject: RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done Rear rotor incorporates the parking brake drum. First off, is the parking brake released? If it is, then whack the side of the drum with a big hammer while pulling on the rotor. Usually pops right out. The parking brake sometimes wears a groove in the drum, pounding with the hammer shifts it enough to pull out. Mike Frank At 06:50 PM 12/3/2011, you wrote: >I'll confirm that... ALL of the parts I'm dealing with right >now are 201's. > >Heading back to the dealer right now... need ONE more bolt to do the driver's >side rear... > >the tie rods were tight, going to return those once I'm sure it's ok. > >the camber strut (top) was a little loose, had some play. >the Thrust strut (lower) was quite loose >and the torque strut was loose... > >loose in that I could twist them with my hand or with a pair of pliers, >when I pulled them out the rubber was pretty well shot... > >can't move the new parts... > > >I had trouble getting the rotor off, made getting the camber and torque struts >more difficult to remove... > >I pulled the screw, took the brake caliper off, but the rotor wouldn't come >off... I'm missing something... > >any thoughts? > >will be out for about an hour getting a $12 bolt... > >pictures to follow. ;) > >john > > > > ----- >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all > Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS > http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > >On Sat, 3 Dec 2011, Michael Frank wrote: > > # A minor point of interest...the rear axle "bones" are completely > # interchangeable between a 124 and a 201. > # > # Mike fran > # > # At 09:34 PM 12/2/2011, john wrote: > # > interesting... > # > > # > so it sounds like I'm on the right track... the differential bushings > # > are worn on mine as well, will tackle that later and replace the seals > # > at the same time. first thing is to get rid of the wobbles... > # > > # > all the bushings are in the links... looks like a simple unbolt/bolt job > # > for my 5 c notes... > # > > # > john > # > > # > > # > > # > ----- > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all > # ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2011 01:18:35 +0000 From: john Subject: Re: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done I could see where it is supposed to come off, but since there is a cv on the other side I ewally didn't want to get carried away with the hammer. No rust to speak of. __john_at_http://wagoneers.com__ - -----Original Message----- From: "FParker" Date: Sat, 03 Dec 2011 19:19:10 To: 'john'; 'Michael Frank' Cc: 'diesel-benz list' Subject: RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done Just proof-read my response :-) Try this instead: "Here in the northeast, when a pop-off rotor won't come off it is due to rust... I just beat it into submission with a hammer. Hit the center area so you don't damage the braking surface." By the way, maybe it is the Northwest mold holding it on ;-) - -----Original Message----- From: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net [mailto:owner-diesel-benz@digest.net] On Behalf Of john Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2011 6:51 PM To: Michael Frank Cc: diesel-benz list Subject: RE: [db] 124 suspension - 1/2way done I'll confirm that... ALL of the parts I'm dealing with right now are 201's. Heading back to the dealer right now... need ONE more bolt to do the driver's side rear... the tie rods were tight, going to return those once I'm sure it's ok. the camber strut (top) was a little loose, had some play. the Thrust strut (lower) was quite loose and the torque strut was loose... loose in that I could twist them with my hand or with a pair of pliers, when I pulled them out the rubber was pretty well shot... can't move the new parts... I had trouble getting the rotor off, made getting the camber and torque struts more difficult to remove... I pulled the screw, took the brake caliper off, but the rotor wouldn't come off... I'm missing something... any thoughts? will be out for about an hour getting a $12 bolt... pictures to follow. ;) john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ On Sat, 3 Dec 2011, Michael Frank wrote: # A minor point of interest...the rear axle "bones" are completely # interchangeable between a 124 and a 201. # # Mike fran # # At 09:34 PM 12/2/2011, john wrote: # > interesting... # > # > so it sounds like I'm on the right track... the differential bushings # > are worn on mine as well, will tackle that later and replace the seals # > at the same time. first thing is to get rid of the wobbles... # > # > all the bushings are in the links... looks like a simple unbolt/bolt job # > for my 5 c notes... # > # > john # > # > # > # > ----- # > - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ # > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all # ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #3503 **********************************