From owner-diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Thu Jan 12 06:26:00 2012 From: diesel-benz-digest To: diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Date: Thu, 12 Jan 2012 14:26:13 +0000 Subject: diesel-benz-digest V1 #3520 diesel-benz-digest Thursday, January 12 2012 Volume 01 : Number 3520 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: Re: [db] 1990 MB 300TDT [db] A frightening development ! [db] the growing problem of waste veggie oil theft... Re: [db] wiring - warning light for seat belts blinks with car off... Re: [db] wiring - warning light for seat belts blinks with car off... Re: [db] wiring - warning light for seat belts blinks with car off... Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request@digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 07:24:21 -0500 From: Michael Frank Subject: Re: [db] 1990 MB 300TDT Can you bring this car to the US? This particular combination of model and engine was never sold here. Are they missing a digit on the fuel economy? Something wrong if it's only getting 17 mpg. MIke Frank At 10:52 PM 1/10/2012, wmpless@primus.ca wrote: >Noticed this car for sale close by. Not too many people will like the >conversion to a manual transmission. Interior pictures do not >reflect this change and if car came from Japan mileage most like can not be >proven. Driverbs seat seems to be in good condition . >Engine has six cyl.? The 2.5 turbo was mainly sold in NA and Italy. With >four/five winters in Ontario car is getting rust soon. > > >http://ontario.kijiji.ca/c-ViewAdLargeImage?AdId=344715367&ImageIndex=5 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 14:35:41 -0300 From: "Renaud (Ron) Olgiati" Subject: [db] A frightening development ! < Cheers, Ron. - -- The problem with an honest day's work, is that you get an honest day's pay for it. -- Edward "Blackbeard" Teach -- http://www.olgiati-in-paraguay.org ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 11:02:31 -0800 (PST) From: john Subject: [db] the growing problem of waste veggie oil theft... it's not grease, it's oil... can't use grease..... ;) my sources call me when they're ready... stored in a secure location... in buckets or cubies... :) I have filtered, had it converted to biodiesel or sell it cheap to friends who do... I was able to pick up a sources years ago because the folks hauling it away before actually CHARGED folks... like thirty cents a gallon... so it was pretty easy for me to come in and haul it off for free... sometimes I'd provide a barrell, other times cubies or buckets... now they put it back in the original containers, nice and clean, easy to haul in the trunk of the Diesel Benz, Diesel Jetta or Diesel Jeep... :) ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: "Renaud (Ron) Olgiati" To: diesel-benz@digest.net Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 14:35:41 -0300 Subject: [db] A frightening development ! http://www.nytimes.com/2012/01/08/us/restaurants-used-fryer-oil-attracting-thieves.html?_r=3&hp Cheers, Ron. - -- The problem with an honest day's work, is that you get an honest day's pay for it. -- Edward "Blackbeard" Teach -- http://www.olgiati-in-paraguay.org ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 14:32:46 -0800 From: Bruce Caruthers Subject: Re: [db] wiring - warning light for seat belts blinks with car off... Took a little while to find the time to check things, what with my wife needing the car quite frequently... I couldn't find the "K" relay, but I did discover that one of the red fuses ("D" per the rack label) had blown but not obviously so. The lights turn off now, although it still doesn't seem to actually know whether the seat belts are in place or not (blinks for the period of time regardless). At least it should hopefully not drain the battery anymore, and we have our dome lights back now. Looking at the courtesy lamp diagram, it looks like "D" (assuming that matches the fusebox labeling) is a ground path, so I guess that makes sense, even if the listed function has nothing to do with the dome light/seat belt warning module. Would be nice to find the relays, though, so we might add that convenience module. It would be very, well, convenient. - -bkc Lynnwood, WA (his) '76 MB 240D [W115.117/616.916] (hers) '92 Toyota Celica GT (on loan to neighbors) (ours) '93 MB 300D 2.5 Turbo [W124.128/602.962] On Mon Jan 09, 2012, John Meister wrote: > > http://johnmeister.com/DieselBenz/TECH/124-series/PDFs/W124_300D_courtesy_lamps.pdf > > according to the e-series guide, there is a relay at the driver's footwell > that controls the seat belt warning system... however, in the schematic > above I do not see a relay (designated by K) associated with the warning > module. > > Bruce, you could try to pull that relay, if you can find it, and replace > the module by the sunroof and see if that stops it from blinking... > > if it does, that would indicate that the time delay cirucit is very suspect... > > Paul, > > there's an open ground on the left front door switch, I think the > convenience relay is providing that ground... check the switch contacts, > one appears to be brown/gray/red and will go to the warning module up > in the dash, the other wire is brown... see if it really goes to ground... > > that's the best I can do with what I have at this point... didn't have > time to hunt for the rest of the PDFs... > > I did find some free schematic capture packages though... :) > > john > > > > ----- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all > Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS > http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > On Sun, 8 Jan 2012, Paul Kershner wrote: > > # While you are troubleshooting, ponder this one, too. > # > # My seatbelt warning indicator lights work fine. They blink a few times after > # getting in the car, then go out. My dome light flashes with the seatbelt > # warning indicator continuously if the door is open. If the doors are open or > # closed and I turn on the map light or dome light (manually switched), they > # work fine. The phenomena only occurs when a front door is open and the dome > # light switch is in the door-switched mode. > # > # Also, does anyone have a heater blower fan ( MB# 0008308208 with squirrel > # cages) or know where to get one for less than $100 (found on eBay)? Mine > # squeals intermittently. > # > # Paul > # > # On 1/8/2012 12:21 AM, john wrote: > # > oh, one other thing... this is on a '92 or '93, > # > it's bruce's 300D, 2.5L TD... not mine... > # > > # > but in going through these schematics I would love to add the convenience > # > relay > # > to this thing to auto down/up the windows and close the sunroof... :) > # > > # > john > # > > # > > # > > # > ----- > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all > # > Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold > # > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS > # > http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > > # > > # > On Sun, 8 Jan 2012, john wrote: > # > > # > # symptom: > # > # seat belt warning light on roof panel blinks with car off.. > # > # drains the battery... > # > # all the dome lights and such work > # > # if the module is pulled off the battery is ok... > # > # > # > # I can't find the correct pdf or my cd, this is the closest I've come: > # > # > # > # > # > http://johnmeister.com/DieselBenz/TECH/124-series/PDFs/W124_300D_courtesy_lamps.pdf > # > # > # > # the PDF is on the 2nd CD, under chassis/programs or something like > # > that, it's > # > # 82-0012.pdf > # > # but I can't find it on my hard drive or find the cd's, it's late... > # > # > # > # anyway, from this schematic it appears that there could be two > # > # likely culprits - the module with the time delay circuit or the > # > # warning module for the seat belts... > # > # > # > # there are two fuses that control this thing... pin 3 of the time delay > # > # circuit has a hot fuse all the time.. goes down into a transistor, > # > # if that thing fried it would feed the warning model... > # > # > # > # the other possibility of influence is the anti-theft system if you have > # > # one... > # > # my 87 does... my '91 didn't.. > # > # > # > # > # > # So, with the module in place - do the vanity lights in the mirrors > # > work? > # > # > # > # if we could figure out where n2/4 warning module seat belts, keys, > # > lamps > # > # is located and disconnect it that might do it... > # > # > # > # anyone have any better wiring diagrams for a 124? :) > # > # > # > # john > # > # > # > # > # > # ----- > # > # > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > # -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all > # > # Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold > # > # http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS > # > # http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us > # > # > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > # > # > > # ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 22:50:06 +0000 From: john Subject: Re: [db] wiring - warning light for seat belts blinks with car off... You probably have the convenience module, it's quite cool. To test, roll a window down, maybe open the sunrood if you dare, then put the key in the driver's door, turn fully clockwise and hold. First the doors should lock, the the windows and sunroof will close, hold until the close as much as you like and return the key to it's full upright position and extract from the lock cylinder. The relay I think is in the back of the fuse panel under the hood over the driver's footwell. The other possibility is that it'll be under the dash by the parking brake area where there is a big power strip for accessories. If I recall correctly, my seatbelt thing flashes for a set time whether I buckled quickly or not. Will test. Glad you found a blown fuse. Interesting that such inverted logic was used that a blown fuse could result in a battery drain. :) Try to explain that one to some one unfamiliar with Rube Goldberg/Mercedes thinking. John __john_at_http://wagoneers.com__ - -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Caruthers Sender: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 14:32:46 To: diesel-benz list Reply-To: Bruce Caruthers Subject: Re: [db] wiring - warning light for seat belts blinks with car off... Took a little while to find the time to check things, what with my wife needing the car quite frequently... I couldn't find the "K" relay, but I did discover that one of the red fuses ("D" per the rack label) had blown but not obviously so. The lights turn off now, although it still doesn't seem to actually know whether the seat belts are in place or not (blinks for the period of time regardless). At least it should hopefully not drain the battery anymore, and we have our dome lights back now. Looking at the courtesy lamp diagram, it looks like "D" (assuming that matches the fusebox labeling) is a ground path, so I guess that makes sense, even if the listed function has nothing to do with the dome light/seat belt warning module. Would be nice to find the relays, though, so we might add that convenience module. It would be very, well, convenient. - -bkc Lynnwood, WA (his) '76 MB 240D [W115.117/616.916] (hers) '92 Toyota Celica GT (on loan to neighbors) (ours) '93 MB 300D 2.5 Turbo [W124.128/602.962] On Mon Jan 09, 2012, John Meister wrote: > > http://johnmeister.com/DieselBenz/TECH/124-series/PDFs/W124_300D_courtesy_lamps.pdf > > according to the e-series guide, there is a relay at the driver's footwell > that controls the seat belt warning system... however, in the schematic > above I do not see a relay (designated by K) associated with the warning > module. > > Bruce, you could try to pull that relay, if you can find it, and replace > the module by the sunroof and see if that stops it from blinking... > > if it does, that would indicate that the time delay cirucit is very suspect... > > Paul, > > there's an open ground on the left front door switch, I think the > convenience relay is providing that ground... check the switch contacts, > one appears to be brown/gray/red and will go to the warning module up > in the dash, the other wire is brown... see if it really goes to ground... > > that's the best I can do with what I have at this point... didn't have > time to hunt for the rest of the PDFs... > > I did find some free schematic capture packages though... :) > > john > > > > ----- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all > Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS > http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > On Sun, 8 Jan 2012, Paul Kershner wrote: > > # While you are troubleshooting, ponder this one, too. > # > # My seatbelt warning indicator lights work fine. They blink a few times after > # getting in the car, then go out. My dome light flashes with the seatbelt > # warning indicator continuously if the door is open. If the doors are open or > # closed and I turn on the map light or dome light (manually switched), they > # work fine. The phenomena only occurs when a front door is open and the dome > # light switch is in the door-switched mode. > # > # Also, does anyone have a heater blower fan ( MB# 0008308208 with squirrel > # cages) or know where to get one for less than $100 (found on eBay)? Mine > # squeals intermittently. > # > # Paul > # > # On 1/8/2012 12:21 AM, john wrote: > # > oh, one other thing... this is on a '92 or '93, > # > it's bruce's 300D, 2.5L TD... not mine... > # > > # > but in going through these schematics I would love to add the convenience > # > relay > # > to this thing to auto down/up the windows and close the sunroof... :) > # > > # > john > # > > # > > # > > # > ----- > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all > # > Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold > # > http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS > # > http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > > # > > # > On Sun, 8 Jan 2012, john wrote: > # > > # > # symptom: > # > # seat belt warning light on roof panel blinks with car off.. > # > # drains the battery... > # > # all the dome lights and such work > # > # if the module is pulled off the battery is ok... > # > # > # > # I can't find the correct pdf or my cd, this is the closest I've come: > # > # > # > # > # > http://johnmeister.com/DieselBenz/TECH/124-series/PDFs/W124_300D_courtesy_lamps.pdf > # > # > # > # the PDF is on the 2nd CD, under chassis/programs or something like > # > that, it's > # > # 82-0012.pdf > # > # but I can't find it on my hard drive or find the cd's, it's late... > # > # > # > # anyway, from this schematic it appears that there could be two > # > # likely culprits - the module with the time delay circuit or the > # > # warning module for the seat belts... > # > # > # > # there are two fuses that control this thing... pin 3 of the time delay > # > # circuit has a hot fuse all the time.. goes down into a transistor, > # > # if that thing fried it would feed the warning model... > # > # > # > # the other possibility of influence is the anti-theft system if you have > # > # one... > # > # my 87 does... my '91 didn't.. > # > # > # > # > # > # So, with the module in place - do the vanity lights in the mirrors > # > work? > # > # > # > # if we could figure out where n2/4 warning module seat belts, keys, > # > lamps > # > # is located and disconnect it that might do it... > # > # > # > # anyone have any better wiring diagrams for a 124? :) > # > # > # > # john > # > # > # > # > # > # ----- > # > # > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > # -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all > # > # Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold > # > # http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS > # > # http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us > # > # > # > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > # > # > # > > # ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 12 Jan 2012 06:25:49 -0800 From: Paul Kershner Subject: Re: [db] wiring - warning light for seat belts blinks with car off... According to a document I read some time ago, the seatbelt warning light is not connected to any sensor(s) - it just flashes for a pre-determined period. - -P On 1/11/2012 2:50 PM, john wrote: > You probably have the convenience module, it's quite cool. > > To test, roll a window down, maybe open the sunrood if you dare, then put the key in the driver's door, turn fully clockwise and hold. First the doors should lock, the the windows and sunroof will close, hold until the close as much as you like and return the key to it's full upright position and extract from the lock cylinder. > > The relay I think is in the back of the fuse panel under the hood over the driver's footwell. The other possibility is that it'll be under the dash by the parking brake area where there is a big power strip for accessories. > > If I recall correctly, my seatbelt thing flashes for a set time whether I buckled quickly or not. Will test. > > Glad you found a blown fuse. Interesting that such inverted logic was used that a blown fuse could result in a battery drain. :) > > Try to explain that one to some one unfamiliar with Rube Goldberg/Mercedes thinking. > > John > > > __john_at_http://wagoneers.com__ > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bruce Caruthers > Sender: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net > Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2012 14:32:46 > To: diesel-benz list > Reply-To: Bruce Caruthers > Subject: Re: [db] wiring - warning light for seat belts blinks with car > off... > > Took a little while to find the time to check things, what with my wife needing the car quite frequently... > > I couldn't find the "K" relay, but I did discover that one of the red fuses ("D" per the rack label) had blown but not obviously so. The lights turn off now, although it still doesn't seem to actually know whether the seat belts are in place or not (blinks for the period of time regardless). At least it should hopefully not drain the battery anymore, and we have our dome lights back now. > > Looking at the courtesy lamp diagram, it looks like "D" (assuming that matches the fusebox labeling) is a ground path, so I guess that makes sense, even if the listed function has nothing to do with the dome light/seat belt warning module. > > Would be nice to find the relays, though, so we might add that convenience module. It would be very, well, convenient. > > -bkc > Lynnwood, WA > (his) '76 MB 240D [W115.117/616.916] > (hers) '92 Toyota Celica GT (on loan to neighbors) > (ours) '93 MB 300D 2.5 Turbo [W124.128/602.962] > > > On Mon Jan 09, 2012, John Meister wrote: >> http://johnmeister.com/DieselBenz/TECH/124-series/PDFs/W124_300D_courtesy_lamps.pdf >> >> according to the e-series guide, there is a relay at the driver's footwell >> that controls the seat belt warning system... however, in the schematic >> above I do not see a relay (designated by K) associated with the warning >> module. >> >> Bruce, you could try to pull that relay, if you can find it, and replace >> the module by the sunroof and see if that stops it from blinking... >> >> if it does, that would indicate that the time delay cirucit is very suspect... >> >> Paul, >> >> there's an open ground on the left front door switch, I think the >> convenience relay is providing that ground... check the switch contacts, >> one appears to be brown/gray/red and will go to the warning module up >> in the dash, the other wire is brown... see if it really goes to ground... >> >> that's the best I can do with what I have at this point... didn't have >> time to hunt for the rest of the PDFs... >> >> I did find some free schematic capture packages though... :) >> >> john >> >> >> >> ----- >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all >> Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold >> http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS >> http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> >> On Sun, 8 Jan 2012, Paul Kershner wrote: >> >> # While you are troubleshooting, ponder this one, too. >> # >> # My seatbelt warning indicator lights work fine. They blink a few times after >> # getting in the car, then go out. My dome light flashes with the seatbelt >> # warning indicator continuously if the door is open. If the doors are open or >> # closed and I turn on the map light or dome light (manually switched), they >> # work fine. The phenomena only occurs when a front door is open and the dome >> # light switch is in the door-switched mode. >> # >> # Also, does anyone have a heater blower fan ( MB# 0008308208 with squirrel >> # cages) or know where to get one for less than $100 (found on eBay)? Mine >> # squeals intermittently. >> # >> # Paul >> # >> # On 1/8/2012 12:21 AM, john wrote: >> #> oh, one other thing... this is on a '92 or '93, >> #> it's bruce's 300D, 2.5L TD... not mine... >> #> >> #> but in going through these schematics I would love to add the convenience >> #> relay >> #> to this thing to auto down/up the windows and close the sunroof... :) >> #> >> #> john >> #> >> #> >> #> >> #> ----- >> #> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> #> -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all >> #> Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold >> #> http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS >> #> http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us >> #> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> #> >> #> >> #> On Sun, 8 Jan 2012, john wrote: >> #> >> #> # symptom: >> #> # seat belt warning light on roof panel blinks with car off.. >> #> # drains the battery... >> #> # all the dome lights and such work >> #> # if the module is pulled off the battery is ok... >> #> # >> #> # I can't find the correct pdf or my cd, this is the closest I've come: >> #> # >> #> # >> #> http://johnmeister.com/DieselBenz/TECH/124-series/PDFs/W124_300D_courtesy_lamps.pdf >> #> # >> #> # the PDF is on the 2nd CD, under chassis/programs or something like >> #> that, it's >> #> # 82-0012.pdf >> #> # but I can't find it on my hard drive or find the cd's, it's late... >> #> # >> #> # anyway, from this schematic it appears that there could be two >> #> # likely culprits - the module with the time delay circuit or the >> #> # warning module for the seat belts... >> #> # >> #> # there are two fuses that control this thing... pin 3 of the time delay >> #> # circuit has a hot fuse all the time.. goes down into a transistor, >> #> # if that thing fried it would feed the warning model... >> #> # >> #> # the other possibility of influence is the anti-theft system if you have >> #> # one... >> #> # my 87 does... my '91 didn't.. >> #> # >> #> # >> #> # So, with the module in place - do the vanity lights in the mirrors >> #> work? >> #> # >> #> # if we could figure out where n2/4 warning module seat belts, keys, >> #> lamps >> #> # is located and disconnect it that might do it... >> #> # >> #> # anyone have any better wiring diagrams for a 124? :) >> #> # >> #> # john >> #> # >> #> # >> #> # ----- >> #> # >> #> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> #> # -o|||||o- fahrvergnugen y'all >> #> # Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and VWs don't rust, they mold >> #> # http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 TRSTGZS >> #> # http://JohnMeister.com HTTP://WAGONEERS.COM http://fotomeister.us >> #> # >> #> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> #> # >> #> >> # ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #3520 **********************************