From owner-diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Fri Apr 6 12:05:00 2012 From: diesel-benz-digest To: diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 19:05:26 +0000 Subject: diesel-benz-digest V1 #3564 diesel-benz-digest Friday, April 6 2012 Volume 01 : Number 3564 Forum for Discussion of Diesel Mercedes Benz Automobiles Derick Amburgey Digest Coordinator Contents: [db] fyi- fuel taxes [db] 88 Grand Wag OM617 Mercedes Diesel Build - Page 3 - International Full Size Jeep Association (fwd) [db] 1987 300D in Brier Re: [db] 1987 300D in Brier Re: [db] 1987 300D in Brier Re: [db] 1987 300D in Brier [db] used car pricing sites and ideas for valuation Diesel Benz Digest Home Page: http://www.digest.net/diesel-benz/ Send submissions to diesel-benz-digest@digest.net Send administrative requests to diesel-benz-digest-request@digest.net To unsubscribe, include the word unsubscribe by itself in the body of the message, unless you are sending the request from a different address than the one that appears on the list. Include the word help in a message to stag-digest-request to get a list of other majordomo commands. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2012 09:52:37 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: [db] fyi- fuel taxes not sure if these show all the taxes, anyone? GAS taxes: http://www.api.org/Oil-and-Natural-Gas-Overview/Industry-Economics/~/media/21 EBD0B62EBA42B1965EE82EFFB6585D.ashx Diesel taxes: http://www.api.org/Oil-and-Natural-Gas-Overview/Industry-Economics/~/media/A3 75B82CC4184656A093C6168A1DD08E.ashx ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -o|||||o- john-at- http://wagoneers.com TRSTGZS Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and Diesels don't rust, they mold buy direct: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- b^\A thorough knowledge of the Bible is worth more than a college educationb^] Theodore Roosevelt (American 26th US President (1901-09), 1858-1919) - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2012 10:07:40 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: [db] 88 Grand Wag OM617 Mercedes Diesel Build - Page 3 - International Full Size Jeep Association (fwd) fyi ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -o|||||o- john-at- http://wagoneers.com TRSTGZS Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and Diesels don't rust, they mold buy direct: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- b^\A thorough knowledge of the Bible is worth more than a college educationb^] Theodore Roosevelt (American 26th US President (1901-09), 1858-1919) - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Jim Blair To: "john@wagoneers.com" Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2012 09:13:00 -0700 Subject: 88 Grand Wag OM617 Mercedes Diesel Build - Page 3 - International Full Size Jeep Association Did I send you this link already? http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?p=1425413 - -- Using Opera's revolutionary email client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2012 22:32:32 -0700 From: Bruce Caruthers Subject: [db] 1987 300D in Brier I went to see the 1987 300D near my home this evening. Amusingly, we realized we had met a couple of years ago at the local Discount Tire, and then discovered that his buddy is the one who bought John's '91 that blew its chain, fixed it up, then sold it for $10,000. Small world! Definitely a big difference in performance. The '87 with the I6 (and a rebuilt tranny) had a smooth, effortless ride to highway speed. My '93 performed fine, but you could always tell it was working hard. (The '93 tranny had some issues and was the one remaining noteworthy thing needing repair when the car got wrecked.) The lowering did actually seem to improve the stance and road handling, without overly firming the ride. On another interesting note, according to NADA: * '87 300D-T (232k miles): $8,550 * '95 E300D: $5,300 * '93 300D: only $2,700 ??? * '92 300D: $9,100 * '91 300D: $8,950 * '91 300D: $8,850 * '76 240D: "high retail" of $6,600; "low" value is still $3,050!!! Why is the '93 so poorly valued? Seems like it must be an error? (The NADA wizard keeps asking about SL hardtops under options, though, so I wonder if something is cross-linked on the 300D's?) - -bkc Lynnwood, WA (his) '76 MB 240D [W115.117/616.916] (hers) '92 Toyota Celica GT (long overdue to be retired or sold) (ours) '93 MB 300D 2.5 Turbo [W124.128/602.962] (wrecked, 28Mar12) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2012 22:52:29 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: Re: [db] 1987 300D in Brier try Kbb.com and edmunds.com that value for the '87 is the same one I've seen before... but couldn't get it. :) so it sounds like Chris helped fix up this '87 too. He got the parts from the same guy I got my '94 leather interior from probably... yep, small world... :) that 3.0L is impressive. when I first got mine it didn't feel that way, but once I got the pennzoil out of the crankcase it came back to life... love it now. my jetta is doing better with amsoil as well... doesn't smoke nearly as bad as it first did... unfortunately my Jetta has no where near the power of either the 2.5 or the 3.0... in fact, your 2.4 in your old green car might give it a good run for the money. :) john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -o|||||o- john-at- http://wagoneers.com TRSTGZS Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and Diesels don't rust, they mold buy direct: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- b^\A thorough knowledge of the Bible is worth more than a college educationb^] Theodore Roosevelt (American 26th US President (1901-09), 1858-1919) - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- On Thu, 5 Apr 2012, Bruce Caruthers wrote: # I went to see the 1987 300D near my home this evening. Amusingly, we # realized we had met a couple of years ago at the local Discount Tire, # and then discovered that his buddy is the one who bought John's '91 that # blew its chain, fixed it up, then sold it for $10,000. Small world! # # Definitely a big difference in performance. The '87 with the I6 (and a # rebuilt tranny) had a smooth, effortless ride to highway speed. My '93 # performed fine, but you could always tell it was working hard. (The '93 # tranny had some issues and was the one remaining noteworthy thing needing # repair when the car got wrecked.) The lowering did actually seem to # improve the stance and road handling, without overly firming the ride. # # On another interesting note, according to NADA: # * '87 300D-T (232k miles): $8,550 # * '95 E300D: $5,300 # * '93 300D: only $2,700 ??? # * '92 300D: $9,100 # * '91 300D: $8,950 # * '91 300D: $8,850 # * '76 240D: "high retail" of $6,600; "low" value is still $3,050!!! # # Why is the '93 so poorly valued? Seems like it must be an error? # # (The NADA wizard keeps asking about SL hardtops under options, though, so # I wonder if something is cross-linked on the 300D's?) # # -bkc # Lynnwood, WA # (his) '76 MB 240D [W115.117/616.916] # (hers) '92 Toyota Celica GT (long overdue to be retired or sold) # (ours) '93 MB 300D 2.5 Turbo [W124.128/602.962] (wrecked, 28Mar12) # ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 06 Apr 2012 07:01:28 -0400 From: Michael Frank Subject: Re: [db] 1987 300D in Brier I think NADA works from auction results. Given the low population of these cars, no surprises. Mike Frank At 01:32 AM 4/6/2012, Bruce Caruthers wrote: >On another interesting note, according to NADA: >* '87 300D-T (232k miles): $8,550 >* '95 E300D: $5,300 >* '93 300D: only $2,700 ??? >* '92 300D: $9,100 >* '91 300D: $8,950 >* '91 300D: $8,850 >* '76 240D: "high retail" of $6,600; "low" value is still $3,050!!! > >Why is the '93 so poorly valued? Seems like it must be an error? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2012 15:16:09 +0000 From: john Subject: Re: [db] 1987 300D in Brier I could believe that for edmunds, but nada, it has been used by car dealers and banks for decades and is based on depreciation tables. Same as kelly blue book. That is weird though. There wasn't any problem with that year... Was there? Even if there were wouldn't it show as a deduction? Wait, didn't he say there wasn't an entry for it? How many were made? The websites have changed a bit, making it harder to find retail prices, car dealers are likely pressuring them. I won't pay more at a lot for the same car from a private party. From the owner I get history, receipts, background, all the bits and pieces that may have fallen off and the floor mats, not so on a lot, they often chuck anything not bolted down and get rid of any evidence. ;) - ------Original Message------ From: Michael Frank Sender: owner-diesel-benz@digest.net To: dbl Subject: Re: [db] 1987 300D in Brier Sent: Apr 6, 2012 04:01 I think NADA works from auction results. Given the low population of these cars, no surprises. Mike Frank At 01:32 AM 4/6/2012, Bruce Caruthers wrote: >On another interesting note, according to NADA: >* '87 300D-T (232k miles): $8,550 >* '95 E300D: $5,300 >* '93 300D: only $2,700 ??? >* '92 300D: $9,100 >* '91 300D: $8,950 >* '91 300D: $8,850 >* '76 240D: "high retail" of $6,600; "low" value is still $3,050!!! > >Why is the '93 so poorly valued? Seems like it must be an error? __john_at_http://wagoneers.com__ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Apr 2012 12:05:12 -0700 (PDT) From: john Subject: [db] used car pricing sites and ideas for valuation always good to have all the details about a car you're buying. :) There are three major sites offering used car values: http://kbb.com - http://www.kbb.com/used-cars/ http://nada.com - http://www.nadaguides.com/Cars/Research-Center http://edmunds.com - http://www.edmunds.com/appraisal/ all three of these sites have changed their presentations and information, skewed to private sale value, which is less than the "dealer" price... values vary greatly by region because of rust or popularity... you can pop in zip codes to get rough ideas... 98200 would be in the Seattle area 10100 would likely be in the NY or east coast area or 60000 for the Chicage area, give or take a couple hundred miles. some of the sites will list retail, private owner and trade in values. best to check all three sites, but one problem is some of them only go back so far, then you need to use the "classic car" section... pre-90's likely... of course another way to determine value is to search ebay for the model and display completed auctions... also to look at craigslists, or some of the craigslist search tools - tempest and others, haven't kept up... of course you'll only see the asking prices, but it'll give you a range... factor in condition on these ads... once a car gets to be around 10 years old it's really up to the condition of the car, options, and how it drives and looks that will determine the real value... john ----- - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -o|||||o- john-at- http://wagoneers.com TRSTGZS Snohomish, Washington - where Jeeps and Diesels don't rust, they mold buy direct: http://AMSOIL.com/redirect.cgi?zo=283461 - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- b^\A thorough knowledge of the Bible is worth more than a college educationb^] Theodore Roosevelt (American 26th US President (1901-09), 1858-1919) - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- On Fri, 6 Apr 2012, Renaud (Ron) Olgiati wrote: # On Friday 06 Apr 2012 12:16 my mailbox was graced by a message from john who # wrote: # > I won't pay more at a lot for the same car from a private party. From the # > owner I get history, receipts, background, all the bits and pieces that # > may have fallen off and the floor mats, not so on a lot, they often chuck # > anything not bolted down and get rid of any evidence. ;) # # Reminds me of a car I bought, supposedly 147000 km, and the owner helpfully # gave me all the maintenance bills, including those covering 148000 to 247000 ! # # He agreed to revise his selling price down by a few hundred Francs when # confronted with the evidence ! # # Cheers, # # Ron. # # PS 6 figure odomoter of course, not a MB ! # # PPS I need to find a value for a 1994 Mazda; I have a website in France # www.lacentrale.fr/lacote_origine.php that gives second hand value, according # to make, model, mileage, etc. Is there any similar website in North America ? # ------------------------------ End of diesel-benz-digest V1 #3564 **********************************